184 réponses à ce sujet

[leapingmonkeys]

EA/Bioware clearly believes that they are not losing any significant number of customers by stone walling on this issue. They clearly believe that the customers will go off and pout for a while and then come back to buy the next shiny new product from them.

I suspect that they are wrong. Sadly, by the time they realize they are wrong, it is probably too late to go back and fix ME3 so that it makes good on the pre-release promises for the game.

[Asclepus]

Hexley UK wrote...

GBJ13 wrote...

Nassegris wrote...

I think the adoration some of us had for Bioware can only be equalled to the disappointment we feel now.

This is a great post. I have sung Bioware’s praises for years. I’ve even bought copies of games for friends that couldn’t afford them. I dragged an entire guild into Star Wars: The Old Republic, convinced it would be the best of all games. I’ve written many, happy, cheerful reviews, sent links, shared stories, done my best to encourage my friends to buy their products.

The last month or so I’ve felt the need to apologise to quite a few people for getting them into Mass Effect, as they all ended up calling me and jokingly blaming me for ever luring them into the series.

I can’t see myself ever recommending the games to anyone. I’ve gone from being an advocate and admirer to feeling numb and distrustful.

Maybe some day, Bioware will come out with a new, awesome game, and someone else can recommend it to me. Maybe, maybe, if I know them well enough and trust their taste, I’ll trust them and I’ll try again – but no more blindly leaping off a cliff towards every new release.

I don’t want it to be this way I want to be back in that happy, innocent state, because I loved praising them to the skies.

That's pretty similar to my story.  I talked people into buying ME3 and DA2.   My friends are ribbing me like I recommended "From Justin to Kelly."

LOL same it's getting so bad I might as well have recommended Twilight to them the way they're going on about it.

You hear me Bioware! Twilight is better than your ending to ME3.....yea I went there....deal with it.

Ouch, that's harsh...way harsh, but probably no more than they deserve at this point. I've gone from being an advocate to an anti advocate. I've personally stopped the sales of at least eight friends by relating my experience. My brother called me up today to tell me he wished he had listened to me and to say he wasn't buying BW's stuff again, not after this fiasco. Between DA 2, SWTOR and ME3 I've seen three failures. Them's not good odds and I refuse to be a part of a fourth. I won't touch a Boware game again unless it's been thoroughly vetted by people I trust implicitly.

[alkeiser]

This is so true.
I played all three games.
I used to recommend the games to friends/coworkers.
But then I beat the third game and saw the incoherent, illogical crap they thought could pass as an ending for this epic storyline.
I no longer recommend the games, because I would not wish the disappointment I felt at the end of the series on anyone else.

[wheelierdan]

this is an interesting way to look at the noncommittal way they talked about indoctrination theory, they dont want to lose those evangelists. Because as far as those people are concerned theres nothing wrong with the game save for some masterful finish.

theyd rather let them believe a lie rather than lose those word of mouth sales.

Modifié par wheelierdan, 08 avril 2012 - 12:38 .

[Agiyosi]

Very interesting post, OP. Props.

[LuckySe7enty]

The bit about Apple fans is so true. Bioware just looked at the short term

[Kadayi]

Excellent explanation. I think the comparison with Apple is a good one. By not meeting and addressing the core issues people have with the endings but instead going with the 'clarify' and 'closure' stance, they're not going to win over hearts and minds as they seem to think. Their half measure approach is just going to backfire on them even more.

I must admit I'm hard pressed to recommend the game to anyone at this point, simply because in it's present state I'm not sure the commitment is presently worth the conclusion. I had a friend whose played the first 2 asking me about it all and I told him to hold out for The Witcher 2 enhanced edition which is coming out in a week and hold off on ME3 until the 'extended cut' has been released.  

Modifié par Kadayi, 08 avril 2012 - 01:10 .

[McAllyster]

 Forbes quoting Michael Pachter who calls the members of Retake movement "whiners".

I think he should have ask a professional opinion from a marketing guy.

However a commenter shared a great link:

Customer Service Facts

Some good data:


- 91% of unhappy customers will not willingly do business with you again. Source: Lee Resource Inc

- 70% of complaining customers will do business with you again if you resolve the complaint in their favour. Source: Lee Resource Inc- 95% of complaining customers will do business with you again if you resolve the complaint instantly. Source: Lee Resource Inc

- It costs five to six times as much to get a new (first time) customer as it does to keep a current one. Source: the White House Office of Consumer Affairs, Washington, DC. 

- Customer loyalty can be worth up to 10 times as much as a single purchase. Source: the White House Office of Consumer Affairs, Washington, DC. 

- It costs 6 times more to attract a new customer than it does to keep an old one. Source: “Understanding Customers” by Ruby Newell-Legner 

- Customer loyalty is, in most cases worth 10 times the price of a single purchase. Source: “Understanding Customers” by Ruby Newell-Legner

- A typical business hears from only about 4% of its dissatisfied customers. 96% just go away and 91% will never come back. Source: “Understanding Customers” by Ruby Newell-Legner

- 7 out of 10 customers will do business with you again if you resolve the complaint in their favor. Source: “Understanding Customers” by Ruby Newell-Legner 

Edit: formatting

Modifié par McAllyster, 08 avril 2012 - 01:21 .

[Darthlawsuit]

I became an evangelical for the battlefield series ever since 1942. They have never let me down and I always bash MW3 whenever possible and promote battlefield series. So for over 10 years I have been promoting DICE. I started doing that with ME 1 & 2...... Now I am telling people to never buy bioware and do not trust them EA has corrupted them.

Sad they lost a walking promotion.

[Lanay]

McAllyster wrote...

 Forbes quoting Michael Pachter who calls the members of Retake movement "whiners".

I think he should have ask a professional opinion from a marketing guy.

However a commenter shared a great link:

Customer Service Facts

Some good data:


- 91% of unhappy customers will not willingly do business with you again. Source: Lee Resource Inc

- 70% of complaining customers will do business with you again if you resolve the complaint in their favour. Source: Lee Resource Inc- 95% of complaining customers will do business with you again if you resolve the complaint instantly. Source: Lee Resource Inc

- It costs five to six times as much to get a new (first time) customer as it does to keep a current one. Source: the White House Office of Consumer Affairs, Washington, DC. 

- Customer loyalty can be worth up to 10 times as much as a single purchase. Source: the White House Office of Consumer Affairs, Washington, DC. 

- It costs 6 times more to attract a new customer than it does to keep an old one. Source: “Understanding Customers” by Ruby Newell-Legner 

- Customer loyalty is, in most cases worth 10 times the price of a single purchase. Source: “Understanding Customers” by Ruby Newell-Legner

- A typical business hears from only about 4% of its dissatisfied customers. 96% just go away and 91% will never come back. Source: “Understanding Customers” by Ruby Newell-Legner

- 7 out of 10 customers will do business with you again if you resolve the complaint in their favor. Source: “Understanding Customers” by Ruby Newell-Legner 

Edit: formatting

Wow.  Those stats really paint a nightmare of this situation, don't they?  Especially the 'a typical business hears from only about 4% of its dissatisfied customers' one, in light of all the 'vocal minority' arguments.

As for the original post, very astute stuff.  I personally would have probably considered myself an advocate, very nearly evangelical before all this.  I recommended the ME series to pretty much everyone who I knew played video games, was extremely excited for the release, and tended to buy BioWare games just on the principal that they were BioWare games.

A month ago, the idea that I would be filled with so much vitriol towards BioWare would have been unthinkable.  A friend of mine jokingly pointed out once that it was like I'd been jilted at the altar or something, the way I'd flipped from love to hate.  He had a good point.  Feelings of betrayal can do a lot of damage, and the stronger your affection for something, the worse it is when you feel like that affection has been discarded.  Or - worse yet - like you've been duped.

[The Divine Avenger]

sistersafetypin wrote...

Really thought provoking post. I agree, they are definitely losing evangelists over this. Myself being one of them.

Myself being another one

[Neverwinter_Knight77]

Mark me down as a former evangelist (as you can see in my username and little icons under my avatar).

One who has been betrayed and is very upset about it.

Modifié par Neverwinter_Knight77, 08 avril 2012 - 03:20 .

[Vermilionone]

I'm an anti-evangelist too, it seems. I'm a Master's candidate and do research in a lab. In our sparse free time, the other people in the lab and I play multiplayer games. I had put ME up as something to do, twenty minutes on a silver mission in multiplayer is a perfect chunk of time for most procedures, but now we're all going to play Diablo 3.

Modifié par Vermilionone, 08 avril 2012 - 03:30 .

[DanteImprimis]

Former advocate/evangelist-lite reporting in. Thanks for taking the time to share this idea with us, OP. It's mind-boggling that apparently no one in BioWare or EA leadership gets this. Given how much I enjoyed KOTOR, KOTOR II, ME, ME2, and 98% of ME3, it's really quite sad.

[recentio]

Interesting. Though, if the EC is of reasonable quality, I think it will usher quite a few evangelists back into the fold, even if they may have been downgraded to advocate or even just repeat customer. And if it blows people's socks off, more than a few evangelists I think might pick up their advocacy again. Only if the EC is *good.* They've done well to offer it and for free.

[Sc2mashimaro]

While I think you are approaching the subject correctly and this is, indeed the situation Bioware finds itself in now, I think this gives them all the more reason to do a great job on the Extended Cut. As a communication major I can fill in on the PR side of your analysis. What you have seen are mixed good and bad PR. Some things have been communicated well and others poorly. One of the things Bioware has failed to communicate well is that what fans are perceiving as snobbery is actually an internal conflict of Bioware's core values. Good PR would be to come out right away and apologize for coming off as dismissing fan's feelings and explain the internal values conflict more clearly (they tried once, but the message was not clear). Bioware can still save this, and I think they will - by the end of this - find a way for them and us to all walk away happy.

But you are right about the stakes. So, to Bioware, as Ed Murrow famously would sign off: Good night and good luck.

[Arasaka_aus]

Fascinating information. Marketing is a massive beast the likes of which I was completely ignorant of until this fiasco. Thanks for posting, from an ex-evangelist.

Modifié par Arasaka_aus, 08 avril 2012 - 04:39 .

[Legendaryred]

EA wants to make you believe that you have no power at all, but truth be told even 1 tinsy little customer has power.

[evisneffo]

Great analysis. People should read this.

[Vorodill]

Great. Let's bump.

[Baronesa]

I wonder how others feel about this...

Hope Sc2mashimaro is right about the EC... really hope they pull something really good.

[heathxxx]

How EA sees it's customers...



How EA's customers are increasingly seeing EA...



On the other hand though, both may view one another as this...

[afie]

Really interesting post, just learnt something new
I guess i am an evangelist... And it's true that i have gone from declaring my love for ME to all who'll listen to spewing disappointment, frustration and dislike over ME3 and bioware in particular, mostly because how they handled the situation.

[McAllyster]

Lanay wrote...


Wow.  Those stats really paint a nightmare of this situation, don't they?  Especially the 'a typical business hears from only about 4% of its dissatisfied customers' one, in light of all the 'vocal minority' arguments.

These stats are very general. I suppose the gaming community are more vocal than "average" customers. Higher percentage of gamers using internet I suppose, more of them using social media, etc.

So maybe this 4% is 10% or 20% in reality. But this is a bigger problem too - because if gamers more vocal, they generating bigger negative feedback. And we saw this: Forbes, BBC, national newspapers picked the story.

Plus... if I know correctly, in the US the average gamer more than 30 years old. Most of the gamers are not the "young geek in their parent's basement"-type , but a valuable target group with steady income. Kill a target group like this... baaaaaad idea.

[Joccaren]

sistersafetypin wrote...

Really thought provoking post. I agree, they are definitely losing evangelists over this. Myself being one of them.