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Michael Pachter on Mass effect 3 and "Whiny fans"


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#226
Reorte

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arthurhallam wrote...

Reorte wrote...

Give the pro-enders a break. If they stopped calling anti-enders and Retakers names they'd have to attack their arguments instead (to be fair there have been some doing that but the fact that their usual approach is to simply insult anti-enders speaks volumes about the type of people on that side of the fence).


oh get over yourself. there is no frigging fence. it's a game. & you people are behaving like you've had your world smashed by an oppressive government. 

debates about the endless are pointless when you have a group of people who simply do not wish to engage with any other position than "the end sucks - change it". 

Thank you for proving my point.

There have been a few cases where they have engaged, and those have been where pro-enders have made informed points and / or polite opinions. Unfortunately there haven't been too many of those. Have you tried engagement instead of insult?

Of course there's a fence. It's a commonly metaphor whenever there's a difference of opinion amongst a group of people about anything, no matter how serious or trivial.

Also, think about context. People are complaining about Mass Effect on a Mass Effect forum so that's the biggest issue in their lives? No, it's just the biggest issue in Mass Effect. You see me talking about nothing else simply because you don't see me anywhere else and non-ME conversations are off-topic here.

Modifié par Reorte, 08 avril 2012 - 12:27 .


#227
Kabraxal

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Not surprised... Pachter is generally recognised as a joke to most gamers so not surprised he only makes himself look worst.

#228
HenchxNarf

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Justin2k wrote...

I know retake do not want to hear this, but he is probably right when he says that it's about 1% of total customers that are vocally protesting and 10% of customers that were not fully satisfied.

I mean, he is an analyst, and the maths does work out to show the people who will refuse to buy Bioware again as a very very small minority. Something like 80k out of 2.9 million or something.

Retake is little more than a drop in the ocean for Bioware. And the controversy seems to have raised sales, not dropped them.


IA with this. And Pachter knows more about this than any other financial person around. He's big in the gaming industry, and the fact that the moment he disagrees with RME, they're like "Who the eff is that?!" Which is typical by now towards anyone who isn't on their side.

#229
HenchxNarf

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The Angry One wrote...

Justin2k wrote...

I know retake do not want to hear this, but he is probably right when he says that it's about 1% of total customers that are vocally protesting and 10% of customers that were not fully satisfied.

I mean, he is an analyst, and the maths does work out to show the people who will refuse to buy Bioware again as a very very small minority. Something like 80k out of 2.9 million or something.

Retake is little more than a drop in the ocean for Bioware. And the controversy seems to have raised sales, not dropped them.


He's a biased analyst, his statistics are made up and mean nothing.


I should have known you would be here.

He's not biased, he hates everything equally. And his statistics are more accurate than some of the ones I've seen people spewing out.

#230
HenchxNarf

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Valo_Soren wrote...

I don't see why you don't agree with this, he described all you whiners perfectly and is one hundred percent correct in everything he says. -shrug-


Yeah, he has. And this isn't the first time he's pointed it out.

#231
HenchxNarf

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Acidrain92 wrote...

Pachter doesnt agree with you "Pfft who is this guy and why should I care?"

Pachter agrees with you "yeah see? Patcher knows what he is talking about."

****ing gamers. I miss the days of oregon trail when we were satisfied with getting dysentery.


Omg I miss Oregon Trail! I have it on my iPhone now haha.

Dysentery and broken legs.

#232
Bill Casey

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legion999 wrote...

Is it just me or does this look like EA's paying him to say this?

He's an investment analyst for video game companies...
He has told a lot of people to put stock in EA...

He has a vested interest in the success of EA's stock price and I doubt he plays video games...
He's coming from a completely different point of view here...

#233
legion999

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Bill Casey wrote...

legion999 wrote...

Is it just me or does this look like EA's paying him to say this?

He's an investment analyst for video game companies...
He has told a lot of people to put stock in EA...

He has a vested interest in the success of EA's stock price and I doubt he plays video games...
He's coming from a completely different point of view here...


Thank you for reassuring my fears.

#234
Kabraxal

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HenchxNarf wrote...

Justin2k wrote...

I know retake do not want to hear this, but he is probably right when he says that it's about 1% of total customers that are vocally protesting and 10% of customers that were not fully satisfied.

I mean, he is an analyst, and the maths does work out to show the people who will refuse to buy Bioware again as a very very small minority. Something like 80k out of 2.9 million or something.

Retake is little more than a drop in the ocean for Bioware. And the controversy seems to have raised sales, not dropped them.


IA with this. And Pachter knows more about this than any other financial person around. He's big in the gaming industry, and the fact that the moment he disagrees with RME, they're like "Who the eff is that?!" Which is typical by now towards anyone who isn't on their side.


Research pachter some.. please... then you'd realise how much of an expert he really is.  There is a reason this man is ridiculed across all gaming fanbases, not just the anti ending crowd here.  

#235
legion999

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Valo_Soren wrote...

I don't see why you don't agree with this, he described all you whiners perfectly and is one hundred percent correct in everything he says. -shrug-


<facepalm>

#236
Cyph3rX

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Kabraxal wrote...

HenchxNarf wrote...

Justin2k wrote...

I know retake do not want to hear this, but he is probably right when he says that it's about 1% of total customers that are vocally protesting and 10% of customers that were not fully satisfied.

I mean, he is an analyst, and the maths does work out to show the people who will refuse to buy Bioware again as a very very small minority. Something like 80k out of 2.9 million or something.

Retake is little more than a drop in the ocean for Bioware. And the controversy seems to have raised sales, not dropped them.


IA with this. And Pachter knows more about this than any other financial person around. He's big in the gaming industry, and the fact that the moment he disagrees with RME, they're like "Who the eff is that?!" Which is typical by now towards anyone who isn't on their side.


Research pachter some.. please... then you'd realise how much of an expert he really is.  There is a reason this man is ridiculed across all gaming fanbases, not just the anti ending crowd here.  


Pachter is just here to cash in on the controversy via clicks from both pro and anti ending people, nothing new here. Probably is also trying to save his stock in EA with that article.

#237
GreyLord

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It amazes me how much some people get paid when their even more stupid then the rest of us.

Michael Pachter as per the article

"I think the Worst Company award is pretty silly,” said Michael Pachter, videogame analyst, Wedbush Morgan Securities"

Is not the smartest man of the bunch from what I can tell.

Though in some ways he's right...it's silly. Just as silly as the Oscars and MTV movie awards (both polls based on popularity either from a smaller set of people in an industry or more public), just as silly as any item based on public perception.

It can tell you what is trending in the public right now...and that is important information. Believe it or not, sometimes being at the top of that list is good, if it means that you've risen from a no-name status and suddenly HAVE a name. In other occasions it's a VERY BAD position to be in...as it can be telling in harsh times down the road without change.

His statement
"It’s not particularly scientific, and given that gamers are far more vocal (and bitter) than any other broad consumer group, it’s surprising to me that a game publisher doesn’t end up at the top of the list every year"

Truly shows why he shouldn't be in his position and why people that aren't worth the money are paid high anyways (that 1% aren't really that smart or more hard working than the rest of us...most times it's because they were lucky and at the right place at the right time). This guy shows that it's not how smart or hardworking you are at all that determines your position in a Capitalistic society.

For starters...

:)

Video game players aren't the biggest gripers out there and definately not the most vocal.

American Political groups are....

Either that or the Star Wars vs. Star Trek fans...

Everyone knows that!

:)

#238
HenchxNarf

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Cyph3rX wrote...

Pachter is just here to cash in on the controversy via clicks from both pro and anti ending people, nothing new here. Probably is also trying to save his stock in EA with that article.


So is Forbes, yet RME worshipped the paper they wrote on.

Modifié par HenchxNarf, 08 avril 2012 - 12:45 .


#239
legion999

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HenchxNarf wrote...

Cyph3rX wrote...

Pachter is just here to cash in on the controversy via clicks from both pro and anti ending people, nothing new here. Probably is also trying to save his stock in EA with that article.


So is Forbes, yet RME worshipped the paper they wrote on.


Typed.

#240
Zix13

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"I can’t think of anything that EA does that is bad enough to warrant this distinction. They sell entertainment products that are better than the average, at competitive prices.”"

"“EA handled it fine,” said Pachter. “They treated their customers with respect, addressed the situation directly and promptly, and are offering free DLC to satisfy those who hated the ending. I shudder to think what will happen if gamers don’t like the new ending choices.”"

"But looking at the sales of the game and the overwhelming critical reviews and scores from trusted gaming sites, BioWare didn’t offend everyone with its ending"

Credibility = 0%
Ignorance = 100%

Modifié par Zix13, 08 avril 2012 - 12:51 .


#241
Cyph3rX

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HenchxNarf wrote...

Cyph3rX wrote...

Pachter is just here to cash in on the controversy via clicks from both pro and anti ending people, nothing new here. Probably is also trying to save his stock in EA with that article.


So is Forbes, yet RME worshipped the paper they wrote on.


So did IGN, Kotaku, and Gamespot which have been cited endlessly by the opposing camp despite having paid ads by various gaming companies on their site, and IGN having an employee in their game. What's your point?

#242
Guest_OrangeLazarus86_*

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katamuro wrote...

man that guy knows nothing about what he is talking about. How many uninformed people they have there? and anyway this is the first time i hear about this guy so i do not care and he should go back wherever he was hiding in.


Michael Prachter tried to convince consumers from not playine Duke Nukem Forever. It got bad reviews, but consumers who actually played it love it. He even went as far as to try and insult Randy Pichford and offer to throw money at stores so people would buying it and enjoying it.

He's like a whiny brat, but with a keyboard.

#243
Ahms

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Mr. Pachter should inform himself of the situation much better. He doesn't understand the reasons why there's an upset fanbase, and doesn't see the big picture.

#244
Bill Casey

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He's just doing his job...
He has a completely different set of concerns to deal with...
Mainly keeping investors from panicking...

#245
Noatz

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I've no idea who this guy is, or what "Wedbrush Securities" are or why anyone cares what he/they have to say.

I do know that hes flat out wrong in at least some of what hes saying however.

Saying the industry cannot support longer development times and still remain profitable? From what I see Blizzard have always and are still doing rather well with extremely lengthy development periods.

If as a supposed "games commentator" he makes ignorant statements such as that, I have a hard time taking any of what he says seriously.

Modifié par Noatz, 08 avril 2012 - 12:58 .


#246
LinksOcarina

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Big Mac Heart Attack wrote...

I thought Forbes were the good guys in all this.

Guess it's us against all the internets now. They're still going to lose but they can keep coming at us.


Only sith deal in absolutes...

Honestly, stop associating the website with the opinions of the writer.

But then again, stop saying Forbes is on your side too. They are basically IGN just with a better writing and editorial staff, and mostly agreeing with the populace.

Modifié par LinksOcarina, 08 avril 2012 - 12:58 .


#247
GreyLord

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Pachter doesn't know what he's talking about with EA right now if the stocks are a telling picture.

EA may actually be in a LOT of trouble, and what's even bigger is that the results of that poll may actually have NOTHING to do with the whining that the ME fans did in that poll.

EA has fallen extremely far in the past few years. Don't beleive me...look at their stock from a mere 4 years ago...then look at their stock today.

Heck, though FAR from where it was a few years ago, if you look at EA stock a year ago, it's been on a decreasing trend for a YEAR.

IT got a bump right after ME3 was announced. It seemed ME3 was doing well for about 2 to 3 days...and I would guess that was what caused the bump overall in EA stock...and then it starts going down again.

Right before ME3 release EA stock was the lowest point it had been...well, it was pretty low.

It's had another bump around the 27th...who knows what that was caused by, perhaps by People finally calming down for a bit after thinking finally something would get announced at PAX.

Stocks are not quite as low as they were right before ME3 release...but they are getting their at this rate.

EA's position could also be a result of angry stockholders, and those who are angry due to OTHER reasons than Bioware or ME3 that have caused the company to go downhill overall.

Something that is unrelated to this forum...but which probably should be analyzed by Forbes and others instead of assuming it's merely ME3 fan voting on that poll.

EA isn't smiling like it used to...and in fact I'd say the future isn't looking incredibly bright.

EA has other major worries right now.

Which is why I'd say Pachtel in his statements is an idiot...either that or he realizes that the problems with EA are from BIGGER things than ME3...if anything was wrong with the way ME3 was handled or marketed it's more a symptom of the BIGGER problems currently undergoing at EA rather than anything close to being the cause.

#248
DnVill

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Noatz wrote...

I've no idea who this guy is, or what "Wedbrush Securities" are or why anyone cares what he/they have to say.

I do know that hes flat out wrong in at least some of what hes saying however.

Saying the industry cannot support longer development times and still remain profitable? From what I see Blizzard have always and are still doing rather well with extremely lengthy development periods.

If as a supposed "games commentator" he makes ignorant statements such as that, I have a hard time taking any of what he says seriously.



Not to mention that Blizzard is concentrating only on PC.

#249
LinksOcarina

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DnVill wrote...

Noatz wrote...

I've no idea who this guy is, or what "Wedbrush Securities" are or why anyone cares what he/they have to say.

I do know that hes flat out wrong in at least some of what hes saying however.

Saying the industry cannot support longer development times and still remain profitable? From what I see Blizzard have always and are still doing rather well with extremely lengthy development periods.

If as a supposed "games commentator" he makes ignorant statements such as that, I have a hard time taking any of what he says seriously.



Not to mention that Blizzard is concentrating only on PC.


He is right, actually. Long dev times= more money spent, more resources and manpower allocated to singular projects, and overall, less impact on the market.

Basically, if you have five development studios working on five games for five years, versus those five studios working on ten games for five years, you tend to lose more money than gain money. Most of those games would not be triple A titles, they would be new I.P's to establish new franchises, older I.Ps for sequel power and brand familiarity, and even speculative games. 

EA, for example, has Madden, Battlefield 3 and Mass Effect 3 as their major bits out right now, but they also have collaborated on speculative titles like Kingdoms of Amalur, and had studios develop titles like Mirrors Edge and new I.Ps like Dead Space, to generate a more diverse portfolio.

Dev times were cut down for most of this, and for the lesser experienced teams it shows heavy sometimes. That said, the average development cycle for a game is 24 months, most good games take 2-3 years to complete, some with longer cycles 3-4, although that is when you see feature creep...but thats another story. But you also got to keep in mind that most games never make money. An average game is usually a cost of 20-30 million, unless if the numbers have gone up recently. Most games make a fraction of that back, with few exceptions. And those numbers are based on average dev-times and team size. A bigger scaled project would be double that, 60-70 million, if it took longer to make. It would also cost an arm and a leg more for advertising costs as well to keep interest up during the games development.

Arguably, Blizzard is in worse shape than EA. EA may have lower stocks than from five years ago, but EA has also been fairly consistant for the past five years in terms of averaging out losses and gains. Blizzard, on the other hand: 

A) has had their revenue stream begin to wane in the past three years.Cataclysm underperformed based on previous numbers for WoW, and they lost a lot of the player base because of FTP modeled MMO's.

B) Has not made a new I.P since Starcraft in 1998, so 14 years. Since then it's been Warcraft, Diablo, and WoW (which is based off an I.P) and more Starcraft. 

C) Has not really made a new game from 2004-2010, when Starcraft II came out. And it was considered lackluster as well.

D) Is co-owned by Activision, even though it is a laizee faire policy between the two, they are basically following Activision rules for short-term gains over long term investments. Simply put, Activisions buisness model is short-term profit making, then when the bubble bursts, to no longer exploit it. Guitar Hero was the big casualty of that, CoD is close to following suit soon, Tony Hawk died that way as well, and in it's wake Activision is promoting the hell out of Skylanders and Prototype. 

Because of this, I am honestly half-expecting Blizzard to take heavy losses in the coming years, mainly because they are banking on Mists of Pandaria to keep WoW going a bit longer, and Diablo III to sell well when pre-release buzz has been really lukewarm. Hell, when one of your product managers says not to get overly excited about the game they are making, thats a red flag to me.


Anyway, my point is, longer dev times making better games is basically a myth. Some studios get away with it, Nintendo and Rockstar come to mind, but for the most part, that is a skill that is difficult to master correctly...and it takes really good business sense to balance out a fiscal year involving 20 or so releases per year to keep the company afloat as much as possible. 

#250
Oldbones2

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HenchxNarf wrote...

Valo_Soren wrote...

I don't see why you don't agree with this, he described all you whiners perfectly and is one hundred percent correct in everything he says. -shrug-


Yeah, he has. And this isn't the first time he's pointed it out.


Yeah, and your sig, makes you objective in this.


The guy is nothing, he is a non entity looking for his 15 minutes.  He's welcome to them.  I read the interview, nothing he says is particularily insightful and none of it is new.

He's just regurgitating the same rhetoric as anyone else on the Pro ending side of the argument.