1895 réponses à ce sujet

[Verit]

Michael Gamble wrote...
All of us are feeling pax with a sense of...renewal, and we are ready to work our butts off in the months ahead.

Your post here is very much appreciated. I wasn't expecting a retcon of the Catalyst, although seeing the complete refusal of any new, additional ending DLC was disappointing. Still, like you said a lot can still be done as there's a lot of room for clarification in the current endings.  I think the fans are becoming a bit more optimistic now as well.

[Theobuomai]

Thanks Battuta for this, and Mr. Weekes for his straightforward conversation... First time I've actually felt some refreshment after ending ME3.

And, I think it again goes to show how a gap exists between the dev team and fans over the ending. We can't experience the story you intended, only the story we're shown and given. (I don't say that angrily, just honestly).

Without apparent implicating or objective elements showing otherwise, there can be no conclusion or resolution, only a deeper never ending journey down the rabbit hole of our imagination.

Still hesitant on the Catalyst, but looking forward to the future DLC.

[apieros]

DESTRAUDO wrote...

Ah i did misunderstand your position. Apologies.

Thanks, but no apology necessary. You've been polite to me, I hope I've been polite to you and though we disagree, at least we're being civil. 

DESTRAUDO wrote...

So i agree, it could have been much clearer from the perspective of someone playing the game in the moment.

Basically, that's all I was trying to say.

DESTRAUDO wrote...

and refuse to accept the facts i presented earlier which i have presented in many many topics in the last few weeks.

You've mentioned that you were belittled, and I'm sorry that happened. I wasn't involved in those discussions, but it shouldn't have happened.

As for refusing to accept the facts you presented, I think I can explain why. The endings were nonsense, beginning with the false assertions of the Starchild ("Synthetics will rebel, will genocide, and will wipe out all organic life everywhere in the galaxy. Period.").

On top of that is piled nonsense after nonsense, most of which contradict establish canon. (Even if you don't believe that, just look at it from the POV of those who did.) Normandy running (Joker's implied cowardice), the sudden deceleration not killing everyone onboard (in direct contradiction of the codex), etc. You can see where people would find it hard or impossible to single out one of these events and chose to believe it made sense.

If the ending is pretty much all bull****, it's hard to get people to think that one single part of it (that seems to contradict all known evidence) isn't.

I'm not saying you're wrong to think differently, or wrong to try and explain why. I'm just pointing out why people would find it hard to accept.

Even I can only accept it if it's given a decent explanation in the EC DLC. If it isn't, it'll go down in my mind as a total ass-pull.

So, even though we disagree, I'm glad we could have a civil discussion. Thanks for being willing to overlook the abuse others have given you, and talk with me directly and sincerely.

Cheers!

Modifié par apieros, 08 avril 2012 - 07:38 .

[BobbyTheI]

See, this is the sort of communication we've been looking for since this whole thing started. Thank you for taking some time out of your schedule to talk to us, Mr. Gamble; I'm sure you and the rest of the BioWare team are probably busy, but we appreciate this kind of communication very much.

While I, like most people, hate the Starchild and everything connected to him, I can respect that BioWare doesn't want to completely start from scratch with the ending. And like Mr. Gamble said, a lot can be done to expand and improve upon what's there without having to completely rewrite the conclusion.

And stuff like the informal interview with Mr. Weekes and having the dev team come down to personally chat with us is exactly what is needed to help reduce some of the anger around these parts. Honestly, I'm feeling the best I've ever felt about the ME series than I have since I found out about the endings, because stuff like this is an actual demonstration of the familiar mantra we've gotten over the past few weeks of "We're listening."

I may not play any multiplayer, but I'll keep my copy of ME3 installed and ready for this summer.

[Mr.BlazenGlazen]

Michael Gamble wrote...

By the way, Patrick, John, Reid myself - we were all ready to answer those kinds of questions in dialogue just like the original OP. It was the whole reason we came to PAX. In fact, a lot of people may have gotten a bit *too* much out of me

Either way, we met hundreds of folks - and we were so happy and pleased that everyone just wanted to talk and have some great convo.

All of us are feeling pax with a sense of...renewal, and we are ready to work our butts off in the months ahead.

Hope you all enjoy resurgence!

Gamble! I have a question of super incredible importance.

If shepard survives, where exactly is his body? It looks like it's on Earth. If so, is it possible for him to rescue the normandy in time before Tali and Garrus starve to death? 

[silentwindfr]

Michael Gamble wrote...

By the way, Patrick, John, Reid myself - we were all ready to answer those kinds of questions in dialogue just like the original OP. It was the whole reason we came to PAX. In fact, a lot of people may have gotten a bit *too* much out of me

Either way, we met hundreds of folks - and we were so happy and pleased that everyone just wanted to talk and have some great convo.

All of us are feeling pax with a sense of...renewal, and we are ready to work our butts off in the months ahead.

Hope you all enjoy resurgence!

thanks dude for the answer, actually i think most of us want to have a simple answer, being in the dark for soo long can make stupid comment come out.

anyway i will enjoy Resurgence.

because: "Geth don't intentionally infiltrate!"

[The Speedster]

I'm still convinced that real catalyst is Shepard. He is the only seeing the child since the beginning.

[AllThatJazz]

MadRabbit999 wrote...

The Charnel Expanse wrote...

Michael Gamble wrote...

The Charnel Expanse wrote...

Michael Gamble wrote...

Cmon - give us some time with the DLC, and let's try to avoid hatin' on Patrick or Jessica:P

Honestly, after all the valid and incisive criticism leveled at the Catalyst and his presence in the ending, why insist on keeping him around? 90% of what's wrong with the ending can be solved simply by retconning him out of existence.

Why not just answer this question directly?

Is your question about whether or not we are going to retcon the catalyst? The answer is no. We've already said we are not changing the endings, but again - there are many things that we *can* do without changing them. 

My question is WHY you're so resistant to retconning him out.
He damages the ending in such a fundamental way that as long as he remains in place, the ending is irredeemable.

That is not what  we all believe (And we are definetely  NOT the minority), that is your opinion which you are entitled to.

Agreed. I'm not a fan of the catalyst, but irrdeemable? I don't think so, as long as the confusing bits are explained better, and we can end the trilogy on a note of real optimism. Hopefully also involving a reunion with some of our friends? And without necessarily murdering the Geth? (This is just in case Mike is still reading)  

[Hexley UK]

Michael Gamble wrote...

Luiginius wrote...

Weekes said those were his statements seen through the eyes of the person asking the questions.
I don't know what other confirmation you could ask for. In no way is it accurate, Weekes said that himself, but it's still the best PR piece concerning bioware.
Done by a fan, answers given by a man in the writing team, no pr people in sight.
Paints a pretty clear picture what is the other issue bioware is having besides the ending.

You know, most of us in game development would love to have all the time in the world to make our games, but that doesn't mean we put something out that we don't believe is quality.

As for some of this specifics of the questions...

Of course joker wouldn't abandon Shepard for no reason, and yes - let's not underestimate FTL here let's also not forget about quantum communication...or the incredible store of food rations that the Normandy has.

Cmon - give us some time with the DLC, and let's try to avoid hatin' on Patrick or Jessica:P

Was anyone hating on Patrick or Jessica?

I didn't see any of that personally most of the dialogue has been pretty upbeat tbh.

[mugwuffin1986]

Gamble! *Shakes Fist*

Do what you do... you magnificent wizard!

Also Marauder Shields as MP DLC... get on it.

[zerobounds]

thanks for being open and taking the time to answer questions like these openly and from a more personal perspective.

[DESTRAUDO]

I know this may be looked over easily but something which i think could kill some of the hate of ending/catalyst would be to have the crucible fire a destroy wave by default. Have an initial dialogue with catalyst in room where TIM confrontation took place, where catalyst asks you to consider some alternative options the crucibles design presents. People who would choose destroy could reject him at this point and the crucible would autofire.

Those who are willing to hear it out (consider control and synth) would go 'upstairs' to where the current game finale is to hear about those options.

The reason i think this is critically important is that anyone who would choose destroy in the current scenario is forced to trust the catalyst as being 100 percent truthful to go through with the destroy ending. There is no reason for the player with a destroy mindset, who believes the reapers cannot be trusted, to believe the head of the reapers would tell him how to kill them. Forcing that trust is a big problem i think and kind of makes it like the catalyst is letting you destroy the reapers rather than you doing it.

I say this as someone who chose synth and would again.

Modifié par DESTRAUDO, 08 avril 2012 - 07:39 .

[GorrilaKing]

Michael Gamble wrote...

By the way, Patrick, John, Reid myself - we were all ready to answer those kinds of questions in dialogue just like the original OP. It was the whole reason we came to PAX. In fact, a lot of people may have gotten a bit *too* much out of me

Either way, we met hundreds of folks - and we were so happy and pleased that everyone just wanted to talk and have some great convo.

All of us are feeling pax with a sense of...renewal, and we are ready to work our butts off in the months ahead.

Hope you all enjoy resurgence!

As many others have said...you have no idea how it feels to actually have some people from the writing/producing crew here NOT talking PR.

I am pretty sure at this moment nobody expects any definitive answers regarding the extended cut.

But what I think many of us are hoping for is simply a glimmer of hope. Something that brings a light to the nihilism of the ending.
Really. Show me the galaxy being rebuilt, some of your squadmates reuniting with their people, maybe some way Shepard's legacy goes on (blue children or heck, even a friggin' statue!)...and I will be happy with the game for years to come!
Yes, I am easy to please. I think these few things I would like to see would be the easiest to implement without changing the ending we have.

Modifié par GorrilaKing, 08 avril 2012 - 07:43 .

[Neko Hibiki]

I want to see a scene with a naked female Shepard.

I mean we got to see her naked when she was crawling on top of Kaiden in ME 1.

I want to see her naked again, especially the default template... those freckles are cute.

[Madecologist]

Oh don't worry I am waiting till the DLC before I make any real opinion and fully believe you guys will work on it hard and with dedication. I don't question that.

I am just a horrible cynic and pessimists and expect to be disappointed in the end. But I am giving you a lot of room to prove me wrong and would be very happy if you do. If you knew me in real life, that is as high a vote of confidence anyone can drag out of me .

Don't worry, I am just as much a jerk and critical about myself.

[xsdob]

Total Biscuit wrote...

Tirranek wrote...

bboynexus wrote...

Total Biscuit wrote...

Well that's the first thing I've heard from anyone at Bioware that's made me feel better about th ending

If what Weekes said is actually put into the extended cut, and we get to see the Normandy crew getting rescued, and preferably reunited with Shepard if they survive the Destroy ending, I'll actually be ok with the ending.

Still seems pointless to destroy the Relays if they're just going to say FTL will be faster now, so their wont be a difference though. Still, keeping the Mass Effect universe in a recognisable state is more important than being completely logical in this case frankly.

It isn't pointless.

The ‘Galactic Dark Age’ concept is really interesting. Conceptually, I think there’s potential there. I don’t think fans dislike the idea of it so much as it being forced on every single one of them regardless of how prepared you were going into the final battle on Earth. The Mass Relays by their very nature bind all advanced organic life in the galaxy, and it’s precisely because of this that the Reapers are able to grab everyone by the throat. The destruction of the Mass Relays on a symbolic level means liberating ourselves from the system of control and inevitable extinction they’ve had set up for so very, very long. It represents our chance to develop on our own terms. Be completely self-determined.

I find this idea really interesting as well. Since development was more or less directed by the positioning of the relays, tis new setup now means that space exploration will go off in loads of new directions.

Never said otherwise. There is loads of potential for interesting plots since they're hand waving away how screwed everyone would be without the relays based on what existed in canon by moving the goalposts.

However, doing so replaces all the potential the Mass Effect universe had with th Relays, that can never be brought back.

Instead we've now g
 a situation and set up that's identicle to 99% of other space based sci if universes. 

The relays, and all their story potential, was one of the main things that set mass effect apart from the crowd, that allowed it to tell stories not possible in any other setting, and without them it's no different to the potential Farscape, Star Trek, or even Star Wars already has.

You can write Great stories in ANY setting, but making them unique and original requires not being just like everyone else in your genre. We lost more than we gained.

No offense TotalBiscut, I know your video was popular and you have a large amount of people here who like you, but are you arguing that what made mass effect special was simply a gimick that bioware did right?

Cause I played mass effect because it was the first game to ever actually let me choose my own adventure, and that was fun to play, and had a great story. I just always thought of the relays as being codeword for plotdevice to travel through space like warp drive, wormholes, lightspeed jumps and all the other hypertime methods, with the only difference that mass effect took their method of travel semi-seriously.

They're iconic, yes, but they are also a trap made to restrict the ability of other races from exploring areas not linked together by the relays. So, if they need to be sacrificed, than let them be sacrificed, halo destroyed the halo's that halo was named after, but ti's still around, and making a 4th sequel.

Modifié par xsdob, 08 avril 2012 - 07:44 .

[zephyr2025]

tobito113 wrote...

Im happy that more people can see it, my problem is how negative and pessimist people can be until they hear a indirect dev quote.
Unlike alot of people here i didnt see the vagueness and and lack of clarity of the ending as meaning its all doom and gloom, when Casey said he wanted to have something uplifting and hopefull I completely recognized what he meant as beeing what i felt with the ending...

...his explainations of the endings don't clear up any of the plot holes and even introduces more weird stuff. Oh it turns out reapers/catalyst can't control the citadel unless its important for plot. He doesn't explain the EDI thing about the destroy ending, nor Joker leaving. He's just saying to stretch our imaginations until we want to rage less about the ending.

[Luiginius]

 Jesus, the more i see my text quoted the more pessimistic it looks. Need to work on them writing skills.
Anyhoo. I'd hazard a guess that you must be swimming in feedback atm and some of it must be the sort that can't be incorporated to the ending. Are you rethinking some of the dlc to be released after the EC?
For example I'd love to see more Harbinger and I can't quite imagine where to put more in the current game, but maybe in future dlc...

[Mr.BlazenGlazen]

No, Gamble seems to have escaped guys. Party is over.

[The Charnel Expanse]

AllThatJazz wrote...

MadRabbit999 wrote...

The Charnel Expanse wrote...

Michael Gamble wrote...

The Charnel Expanse wrote...

Michael Gamble wrote...

Cmon - give us some time with the DLC, and let's try to avoid hatin' on Patrick or Jessica:P

Honestly, after all the valid and incisive criticism leveled at the Catalyst and his presence in the ending, why insist on keeping him around? 90% of what's wrong with the ending can be solved simply by retconning him out of existence.

Why not just answer this question directly?

Is your question about whether or not we are going to retcon the catalyst? The answer is no. We've already said we are not changing the endings, but again - there are many things that we *can* do without changing them. 

My question is WHY you're so resistant to retconning him out.
He damages the ending in such a fundamental way that as long as he remains in place, the ending is irredeemable.

That is not what  we all believe (And we are definetely  NOT the minority), that is your opinion which you are entitled to.

Agreed. I'm not a fan of the catalyst, but irrdeemable? I don't think so, as long as the confusing bits are explained better

As long as the part about having to resolve the conflict between organics and synthetics remains in place, it's doomed. It completely alters the theme of the series at the worst possible time.

[deryita]

We all know that they did couple of DLC's for ME2. And seeing Shepard alive if you have high war assets, I think they will do some DLC including Shepard. Whether rescuing him/her or Shepard fighting her way back to reach his/her squadmates etc.
I think they all know most of the people does not care to play any DLC w/o Shepard.
And do not forget that at the end of the game, the "old man" says he will tell another story of Shepard.

They just cannot be relying on multiplayer DLCs. Plus, they are providing them with free content.
If you are not a fan, you may consider this just a game and you do not care about the ending, and won't buy any DLC. But for us fans, I think Bioware was planning couple of DLC's from the start.We have seen this with many other games, including Fallout 3. And if you get the alive ending, you can see that its easy to make a DLC. Shepard wakes up while somebody cleans the rubble etc.
We just have to wait for the summer. If the ending is still not satisfies us fans, then we can push further.
I also do not want a Mass Effect 4 I must say. Since the beginning, they were saying that this game was "planned" as trilogy. Making the 4th would just kill the story I believe.

Peace!

[kbct]

Michael Gamble wrote...

By the way, Patrick, John, Reid myself - we were all ready to answer those kinds of questions in dialogue just like the original OP. It was the whole reason we came to PAX. In fact, a lot of people may have gotten a bit *too* much out of me

If you were ready to answer those questions at PAX, then why not now while you're here... with your BSN homies?

I hope this is not the Three-Posts-And-Skedaddle routine.

[Anduin The Grey]

Yay! Am now unofficially oficially adding Mike to my Hero Worship, Weekes may get the Batmobile but Mike can have the cape! =]

[JaylaClark]

Neko Hibiki wrote...

I want to see a scene with a naked female Shepard.

I mean we got to see her naked when she was crawling on top of Kaiden in ME 1.

I want to see her naked again, especially the default template... those freckles are cute.

Priorities!

Hey, though, if you romance Liara, you get naked asari butt It's quite a sight to see. Trust me. Or don't.

[apieros]

The Charnel Expanse wrote...

As long as the part about having to resolve the conflict between organics and synthetics remains in place, it's doomed. It completely alters the theme of the series at the worst possible time.

To expand on what's wrong with the Catalyst:

The Catalyst is presented as the solution to an inevitable problem: synthetics will always rebel, and they will always wipe out all life in the galaxy. Thus, the entire ending of the game is an attempt to solve this inevitable conflict.

On its face, this is a bull**** contention. There is nothing in the real world which indicates this to be the case. It's like asserting an inevitable genocidal conflict between ice cream and caterpillars. This makes it hard to build a game around.

But, if you want to do so anyway (in direct contradiction of reason and common sense) you have to establish that, in your own fictional world, this assertion is actually true. You have to give examples of it, in the present and the past. You have to personalize it, in the form of characters and ongoing problems.

You have to give the player chances to solve it (or smaller instances of it) and show how their attempts are futile. Keep increasing the stakes of the conflict. From personal, to planetary, to galactic.

Thus, by the end of the game, players will accept it is a real conflict, and care about solving it, and be desperate for a solution. Enter the Catalyst.

That's how you establish a central theme.

Did they do this with the "inevitable conflict between synthetics and organics"? No, not even a little bit.

Did they do it with anything? Yeah, the Reapers. See the problem?

"Inevitable blah blah" is not only false on its face, the game itself never establishes the conflict as being of critical importance. The conflict between the Reapers and galactic civilization, on the other hand, is the central conflict of the game, and it is that central conflict the ending should have resolved.

That's the problem with the entire Starchild sequence.