263 réponses à ce sujet

[nocbl2]

OdanUrr wrote...

Bomberman2_0 wrote...

The Reapers didn't shut down the mass relays because the Keepers interfered with that. (I wish I could've asked a follow-up here, it doesn't make much sense.)

How could the Keepers interfere with the Reapers shutting down the mass relays? The Reapers created the mass relays in the first place!<_<

Remember the whole thing with the Conduit where the Prothean scientists changed the Keepers into basically just maintenance machines WITHOUT the whole "destroy all life" program?

[OdanUrr]

nocbl2 wrote...

Remember the whole thing with the Conduit where the Prothean scientists changed the Keepers into basically just maintenance machines WITHOUT the whole "destroy all life" program?

The Prothean scientists only "re-programmed" (if they did that) the Keepers so they wouldn't act on the signal sent by the Reaper vanguard. That doesn't mean they have ultimate control over the mass relay network.

[DeinonSlayer]

Don't suppose the interviewer got any answers on whether the Normandy crew can be rescued, reunion of any sort? I could care less about EDI's cameltoe...

Edit: At least Refund Guy can sleep easy.

"Fifteen credits! Wow..."

Modifié par DeinonSlayer, 08 avril 2012 - 03:42 .

[hitorihanzo]

Justin2k wrote...

chris2365 wrote...

I was surprised how much he said that resources were a limiting factor, considering that EA is one of the biggest publishers out there. Unless they decided to take part of the resources out for later (DLC)

It could also mean that ME3 suffered because of TOR.  Well it obviously did because Drew went  there instead of overseeing  this.  Maybe other teams did too.

Do you remember seeing the amount of money that EA threw at TOR? Wasnt it somewhere around $200 million? Don't quote me on that. TOR may, IMO, be the worst thing to ever happen to BioWare given the amount of things it effected.

[MrnDpty161]

yeah I would have gladly donated 100.00 if there was a drive of some kind - what a shame.

[Nepp]

hitorihanzo wrote...

Justin2k wrote...

chris2365 wrote...

I was surprised how much he said that resources were a limiting factor, considering that EA is one of the biggest publishers out there. Unless they decided to take part of the resources out for later (DLC)

It could also mean that ME3 suffered because of TOR.  Well it obviously did because Drew went  there instead of overseeing  this.  Maybe other teams did too.

Do you remember seeing the amount of money that EA threw at TOR? Wasnt it somewhere around $200 million? Don't quote me on that. TOR may, IMO, be the worst thing to ever happen to BioWare given the amount of things it effected.

I've been hearing numbers as high as $300 million. The TORtanic is just a giant money pit for EA/BW now, it uses one of the worst engines ever, the hero engine.

I wished Drew would of stayed on the ME3 game, probably would of been better.

I don't mind weekes, some interesting things he says

[SpideyKnight]

Man Patrick, I think you're a cool dude, but some of this just outright infuriates me.  This guy has the gist of it, Charliesomething:

 Urgh the answers Patrick gave really bugged the hell out of me. Specifically :-

Originally Posted by Patrick:Galactic civilization will rebuild. The mass relays were not necessary for interstellar flight. Remember, what does it say in the Codex about the speed of ships? That's right, 12 lightyears per (day? hour? minute?). And that's only the cruising speed, not the maximum speed.

Yeah Pat I also remember in Mass Effect 1 it was clearly stated that interstellar travel would be impossible without the Mass Effect relays. If memory serves it is one of the first damn things Nhilus says to you. If You spend two games drumming it into your audience that "no Mass Relay's = no interstellar travel" don't be too surprised when they conclude "no Mass Relay's = everyone is screwed".

Originally Posted by Patrick:No, they didn't. They overloaded, they didn't rupture. We really didn't mean to imply that the whole galaxy had been destroyed. People interpreted the ending in ways we really didn't expect.

So wait let me see if I have this straight ? In Mass Effect 2 you show a relay being destroyed and that destroys the entire system that relay is in. Then in Mass Effect 3 you destroy all the relay's and you don't expect your audience to think "well there goes the galaxy" ? I mean you set the precedent in ME 2 and then right after the relay's blow the only sign of life we get is your crew on an Eden like world and you didn't expect us to "interpret the ending that way" ?

But then why am I surprised, the Relays have been rewritten that many damn times. First off they were "indestructible" these things were so tough one even survived the shock wave from a Supernova. Then it became "oh yeah just slam an asteroid into one and you can destroy them but beware it wipes out the system" and then it became "space casper can fart on one but it is special so it destroys it in a super special nice way so that what we told you in the last game does not apply".

I already mentioned the Citadel bs so I am not even going there. I have to say I don't even want an "extended cut" now, if the explanations they have given so far are a guide line it is gonna be complete and utter garbage. 

I mean damn, was about to type that same stuff.  I have some things to add to it though:

About Vega:  Are you kidding me?  Anyone could've taken that spot, look Grunt is stupid as stone, put him there.  If all you needed was someone dumber than newcomers then you had a pretty wide range of people you could've stuck there.  Or you could've done it like Japanese animes/games and give those players the proto-typical sensei character that could expound on events as they happened, just to further elucidate on events.  Veterans don't have to take her, and new players can tell her to shut up if they want.  Heck, just for awesomeness/giggles it should've been Kasumi.  Bam, Japanese and everything, it would've been brilliant and Kasumi deserves more.

About Star Wars battles:  Then why not just put in the codex, hey these happen just like you've seen in Stars Wars/BSG/Star Trek/every other sci-fi story ever.  It would've been that easy.  Don't just take an eraser to your own lore because of pretty colors, are you serious?

I have to comment more on the relays.  I normally don't type mad, but I'm literally fuming right now.  If you choose Red you get explosions and a giant red one that you can reasonably infer is destructive.  I mean it's ripping the Normandy apart, and the Citadel gets blown all to hell.  Though the people on Earth just take cover from it... (WTF?)  But normally red explosions equal bad things.  Especially when almost immediately afterwards you show us the damn galaxy map almost EXACTLY as you did in Arrival and show Solar Systems being engulfed in red explosions, just like what happened in Arrival and we aren't supposed to assume that everyone in monolitically screwed?  Really?  WTF?

Look, I get it, deadlines and budget constraints.  But what's with the lies?  A week, and I mean literally like 6-7 days before launch Mac says that the Rachni play a HUGE role in the battle against the Reapers.  The game is likely sitting in stockrooms at that time.  He knew damn well that was a lie and a half.  Why?  It makes no difference on EMS.  If you save the Queen you get the exact same EMS as if you destroy her and save the Krogan squad.  Let me reiterate that for you:  Genocide of an entire species gives you the same EMS as saving a single Krogan squad. 

So space magic on the Citadel saves everyone of plot importance?  Can we be serious for a second here?  Mac said anyone who didn't escape before the arms closed was in for bad times, which is already vague enough.  Now we have space magic that ensures that even though the place is likely overrun with Reaper forces and explodes everyone is ok?  Come on man, and people talk about how we didn't understand the endings?  No crap, we aren't a race of mindflayers, am I supposed to come up there and read all your minds?  It's nonsensical hogwash at it's very finest.  

Look, I'm down with Patrick maybe/possibly not liking the endings.  Whether that's true or not hardly matters, kudos to you sir, the parts of the game you did are remarkable.  Cut me some slack here though, could you not have looked the jokers responsible for this mess in the face and just ask a simple two word question?  The F***?

Modifié par SpideyKnight, 08 avril 2012 - 03:50 .

[What a Succulent Ass]

Lol these answers wat.

[Ethical]

SpideyKnight wrote...
TL;DR

calm down bro, read the original thread with Patrick's tweets and remember that everything said in the OP is paraphrased hours after the interview, with the interviewer not having a notepad or recorder. This is still in the very early stages of being written so take it all with a grain of salt and try not to read into everything. 

Most of us are just satisfied that a writer(who wrote Rannoch and Tuchanka iirc) is talking to us like humans and knows exactly why we are upset and is going to try to address them.

[sedrikhcain]

kbct wrote...

The relays didn't explode, civilizations survive, FTL travel is the future, and all key Citadel characters survive. So, basically a galaxy reset for future games.

ETA: Much props to Patrick Weekes for actually addressing the community of fans and players. Following the panel, this is a real breath of fresh air.


Exactly. And I expect that from the game company. I'm surprised to hear critics like Brad Galloway, who is also a writer and generally takes his job as a critic quite seriously, brush off such plot inconsistencies and say things like "you can retcon anything". Honestly, I do not get the way critics almost unanimously excuse the ending of this game. They don't claim that it's good. They acknowledge that it doesn't make sense, they just don't care. And, worse, they think we're fools because we do care.

Modifié par sedrikhcain, 08 avril 2012 - 04:02 .

[SpideyKnight]

Also, can we get some priorities straight for a single game? Every last dime spent on Chobot could've went somewhere else. I didn't mind her character, but if their were budget/time constraints then you cut fluff out first. I mean come on man.

[CrazyCatDude]

SpideyKnight wrote...

About Vega:  Are you kidding me?  Anyone could've taken that spot, look Grunt is stupid as stone, put him there.  If all you needed was someone dumber than newcomers then you had a pretty wide range of people you could've stuck there.  Or you could've done it like Japanese animes/games and give those players the proto-typical sensei character that could expound on events as they happened, just to further elucidate on events.  Veterans don't have to take her, and new players can tell her to shut up if they want.  Heck, just for awesomeness/giggles it should've been Kasumi.  Bam, Japanese and everything, it would've been brilliant and Kasumi deserves more.

Um...  I'm gonna nitpick here.  Grunt is NOT stupid.  Grunt is young, and impulsive, yes, but if you listen to his conversations, it's pretty clear that he's actually got a brain under his plates.  Also, remember what Okeer created him to be.  Not something he could do if he wasn't smart.

[MrnDpty161]

SpideyKnight wrote...

Man Patrick, I think you're a cool dude, but some of this just outright infuriates me.  This guy has the gist of it, Charliesomething:

 Urgh the answers Patrick gave really bugged the hell out of me. Specifically :-

Originally Posted by Patrick:Galactic civilization will rebuild. The mass relays were not necessary for interstellar flight. Remember, what does it say in the Codex about the speed of ships? That's right, 12 lightyears per (day? hour? minute?). And that's only the cruising speed, not the maximum speed.

Yeah Pat I also remember in Mass Effect 1 it was clearly stated that interstellar travel would be impossible without the Mass Effect relays. If memory serves it is one of the first damn things Nhilus says to you. If You spend two games drumming it into your audience that "no Mass Relay's = no interstellar travel" don't be too surprised when they conclude "no Mass Relay's = everyone is screwed".

Originally Posted by Patrick:No, they didn't. They overloaded, they didn't rupture. We really didn't mean to imply that the whole galaxy had been destroyed. People interpreted the ending in ways we really didn't expect.

So wait let me see if I have this straight ? In Mass Effect 2 you show a relay being destroyed and that destroys the entire system that relay is in. Then in Mass Effect 3 you destroy all the relay's and you don't expect your audience to think "well there goes the galaxy" ? I mean you set the precedent in ME 2 and then right after the relay's blow the only sign of life we get is your crew on an Eden like world and you didn't expect us to "interpret the ending that way" ?

But then why am I surprised, the Relays have been rewritten that many damn times. First off they were "indestructible" these things were so tough one even survived the shock wave from a Supernova. Then it became "oh yeah just slam an asteroid into one and you can destroy them but beware it wipes out the system" and then it became "space casper can fart on one but it is special so it destroys it in a super special nice way so that what we told you in the last game does not apply".

I already mentioned the Citadel bs so I am not even going there. I have to say I don't even want an "extended cut" now, if the explanations they have given so far are a guide line it is gonna be complete and utter garbage. 

I mean damn, was about to type that same stuff.  I have some things to add to it though:

About Vega:  Are you kidding me?  Anyone could've taken that spot, look Grunt is stupid as stone, put him there.  If all you needed was someone dumber than newcomers then you had a pretty wide range of people you could've stuck there.  Or you could've done it like Japanese animes/games and give those players the proto-typical sensei character that could expound on events as they happened, just to further elucidate on events.  Veterans don't have to take her, and new players can tell her to shut up if they want.  Heck, just for awesomeness/giggles it should've been Kasumi.  Bam, Japanese and everything, it would've been brilliant and Kasumi deserves more.

About Star Wars battles:  Then why not just put in the codex, hey these happen just like you've seen in Stars Wars/BSG/Star Trek/every other sci-fi story ever.  It would've been that easy.  Don't just take an eraser to your own lore because of pretty colors, are you serious?

I have to comment more on the relays.  I normally don't type mad, but I'm literally fuming right now.  If you choose Red you get explosions and a giant red one that you can reasonably infer is destructive.  I mean it's ripping the Normandy apart, and the Citadel gets blown all to hell.  Though the people on Earth just take cover from it... (WTF?)  But normally red explosions equal bad things.  Especially when almost immediately afterwards you show us the damn galaxy map almost EXACTLY as you did in Arrival and show Solar Systems being engulfed in red explosions, just like what happened in Arrival and we aren't supposed to assume that everyone in monolitically screwed?  Really?  WTF?

Look, I get it, deadlines and budget constraints.  But what's with the lies?  A week, and I mean literally like 6-7 days before launch Mac says that the Rachni play a HUGE role in the battle against the Reapers.  The game is likely sitting in stockrooms at that time.  He knew damn well that was a lie and a half.  Why?  It makes no difference on EMS.  If you save the Queen you get the exact same EMS as if you destroy her and save the Krogan squad.  Let me reiterate that for you:  Genocide of an entire species gives you the same EMS as saving a single Krogan squad. 

So space magic on the Citadel saves everyone of plot importance?  Can we be serious for a second here?  Mac said anyone who didn't escape before the arms closed was in for bad times, which is already vague enough.  Now we have space magic that ensures that even though the place is likely overrun with Reaper forces and explodes everyone is ok?  Come on man, and people talk about how we didn't understand the endings?  No crap, we aren't a race of mindflayers, am I supposed to come up there and read all your minds?  It's nonsensical hogwash at it's very finest.  

Look, I'm down with Patrick maybe/possibly not liking the endings.  Whether that's true or not hardly matters, kudos to you sir, the parts of the game you did are remarkable.  Cut me some slack here though, could you not have looked the jokers responsible for this mess in the face and just ask a simple two word question?  The F***?

Good rant, I agree with your points --- one of the things that are frustrating is the catering to new players.  I'm jsut one of those people in which, if your late for the dinner then you get the leftovers you know? I don't go back and cook you an entirely new meal because you just GOT there.  If your new --- welp ... you got a lot of catching up to do!  But Noooo.... I think  ME2 suffered this with a total  reboot shall we say of the story in order to usher in another story branch from ME1.  In this case for ME3... now you messed up the squad.  I don't mind Vega, I think he's cool but shoot.... why couldn't you have him AND another ME2 member of the team?  I mean what...  why the hell did they decide to put  Allers on the ship but not say ... GRUNT...or... Zheed...or... SOMEONE.

Hell - if you were truly playing ME3, Allers was dead weight to me on the ship, not really useful and I already had an Li locked in.

  simply put, there are many who dropped the ball badly

[sedrikhcain]

SpideyKnight wrote...

Also, can we get some priorities straight for a single game? Every last dime spent on Chobot could've went somewhere else. I didn't mind her character, but if their were budget/time constraints then you cut fluff out first. I mean come on man.

I had no problem with the Allers character either but I have to agree with this.

[sedrikhcain]

CrazyCatDude wrote...

SpideyKnight wrote...

About Vega:  Are you kidding me?  Anyone could've taken that spot, look Grunt is stupid as stone, put him there.  If all you needed was someone dumber than newcomers then you had a pretty wide range of people you could've stuck there.  Or you could've done it like Japanese animes/games and give those players the proto-typical sensei character that could expound on events as they happened, just to further elucidate on events.  Veterans don't have to take her, and new players can tell her to shut up if they want.  Heck, just for awesomeness/giggles it should've been Kasumi.  Bam, Japanese and everything, it would've been brilliant and Kasumi deserves more.

Um...  I'm gonna nitpick here.  Grunt is NOT stupid.  Grunt is young, and impulsive, yes, but if you listen to his conversations, it's pretty clear that he's actually got a brain under his plates.  Also, remember what Okeer created him to be.  Not something he could do if he wasn't smart.

Probably better to call Grunt ignorant than stupid.

[MrnDpty161]

CrazyCatDude wrote...

SpideyKnight wrote...

About Vega:  Are you kidding me?  Anyone could've taken that spot, look Grunt is stupid as stone, put him there.  If all you needed was someone dumber than newcomers then you had a pretty wide range of people you could've stuck there.  Or you could've done it like Japanese animes/games and give those players the proto-typical sensei character that could expound on events as they happened, just to further elucidate on events.  Veterans don't have to take her, and new players can tell her to shut up if they want.  Heck, just for awesomeness/giggles it should've been Kasumi.  Bam, Japanese and everything, it would've been brilliant and Kasumi deserves more.

Um...  I'm gonna nitpick here.  Grunt is NOT stupid.  Grunt is young, and impulsive, yes, but if you listen to his conversations, it's pretty clear that he's actually got a brain under his plates.  Also, remember what Okeer created him to be.  Not something he could do if he wasn't smart.

I agree --- Grunt was Grunt.  Vega isn't stupid either, he's just written as a Marine would act on ship ( I should know, infact he looks like somone I served with) he's basically going in the foot steps of an N7 Marine. Rough around the edges but fights well.  I don't know why people want to assosiate people who are physically built up to be automatically stupid, its a very lame sterotype.

[sth128]

The Keepers couldn't stop Saren but they managed to stop THE REAPERS? Okay...

Anyway, if what OP posted about Weekes' comments are true, then I like him. Weekes sounds like an intelligent and reasonable person. A while back there was a thread asking if fans would "forgive" Bioware had Hudson apologized. I think if Weekes made the statement (not necessarily an apology, just some sympathetic words like these) then people would not have been so angry.

[Arsenic Touch]

Why are the official responses almost always conflicting with established canon?

[oblique9]

Arsenic Touch wrote...

Why are the official responses almost always conflicting with established canon?

Pat's paraphrased unofficial comments were unofficial.

I am VERY glad to see a Bioware writer give what seem like his real thoughts on this whole issue. Restored some faith that this ending DLC will be redeaming after all.

[MrnDpty161]

If they would have just given out honest answers like this in the first place, perhaps they wouldn't have been in the position they are in now.

[sth128]

MrnDpty161 wrote...

If they would have just given out honest answers like this in the first place, perhaps they wouldn't have been in the position they are in now.

Agreed.

[sth88]

I hope these responses are genuine and reflect the attitude of the dev team, because they are encouraging responses.

[BiancoAngelo7]

No amount of explaining away (or trying to at least...."keepers preventing the reapers from interfering"??? what???) will make the shi* of an ending magically turn into a flower.

Hey BIOWARE staff: if you have to EXPLAIN it, then it FAILED.

Ever tell a joke and then have to explain WHY it's funny?

Yeah. Same thing. It fails.

[sedrikhcain]

MrnDpty161 wrote...

CrazyCatDude wrote...

SpideyKnight wrote...

About Vega:  Are you kidding me?  Anyone could've taken that spot, look Grunt is stupid as stone, put him there.  If all you needed was someone dumber than newcomers then you had a pretty wide range of people you could've stuck there.  Or you could've done it like Japanese animes/games and give those players the proto-typical sensei character that could expound on events as they happened, just to further elucidate on events.  Veterans don't have to take her, and new players can tell her to shut up if they want.  Heck, just for awesomeness/giggles it should've been Kasumi.  Bam, Japanese and everything, it would've been brilliant and Kasumi deserves more.

Um...  I'm gonna nitpick here.  Grunt is NOT stupid.  Grunt is young, and impulsive, yes, but if you listen to his conversations, it's pretty clear that he's actually got a brain under his plates.  Also, remember what Okeer created him to be.  Not something he could do if he wasn't smart.

I agree --- Grunt was Grunt.  Vega isn't stupid either, he's just written as a Marine would act on ship ( I should know, infact he looks like somone I served with) he's basically going in the foot steps of an N7 Marine. Rough around the edges but fights well.  I don't know why people want to assosiate people who are physically built up to be automatically stupid, its a very lame sterotype.

Well, they're already bigger and stronger, people have to picture them as dumb jocks to complete the picture, otherwise they'd feel vastly inferior. #wehumansareweakmindedfools.