344 réponses à ce sujet

[GodlessPaladin]

molecularman wrote... you can't spam them like powers (not even in glacier).

  www.youtube.com/watch  Is biotic bubble really more "spammable" than that?  There's very rarely a time where I think "gee, I'd really like to use a grenade now, but I can't afford to."  This is especially true if I'm playing on a team that runs like a well-oiled machine, rather than randoms (the vid is showing randoms.  Second place guy is a Geth Engineer using a Geth Pulse Rifle with half my score).

Anyways, like I said before, I'm considering moving the Justicar back up just because of its lack of need for grenades when considering it for a party slot (since multiple grenadiers anti-synergize with each other).

Modifié par GodlessPaladin, 19 mai 2012 - 08:25 .

[astheoceansblue]

GodlessPaladin wrote...

astheoceansblue wrote...

I honestly don't see how you can rate Turian Soldier so low.

He has Proximity Mine and Marksman which are easily upper tier powers.
He has Concussive shot which is a an extremely underrated power.
And his racial passive is one of the best in the game.

He outshines many of the classes you have in the tier above him, imo, and it doesn't take a genius to use him well.

The TS's Proximity Mine is worse than everyone else's by a long shot due to the way Tactical Cloak synergizes with it so amazing well, and it synergizes terribly with Marksman.  And I don't see what the important part of the racial passive is... I can aim my Hurricane just fine without stability mods.  Heck I could aim it just fine back when it had horrible recoil. 

Anyways, what class do you think he outshines?  Everything in B rank can wipe the floor with entire late wave Gold spawn points in short order.  How do I do that with the Turian Soldier?

The way I see it, the best case scenario for a Turian Soldier is that he plays like a Human Soldier without the synergy and staying power.  He runs out of ammo faster, has to choose between one schtick or the other at any given point, has trouble transitioning between tactics and encounters, and he can't sustain a continuous offensive without fear of harm the way a Human Soldier can run around in the open on Condor blasting things ceaselessly. 

The Turian Soldier is a lot like an infiltrator stripped of survivability, synergy, mobility, and utility.  Still does good weapon damage... but all that other stuff matters too.

TS proiximity minbe might be "worse" than infiltrators, but it's still one of the best powers inthe game in relative terms. just beause infiltrators get a godly power buff does not make it a horrid power on its own. The group/single target debuff potential is still amazing. Comparing it to overpowered cloak buffs and saying it's bad alone is very poor reasoning.

PM synergises brilliantly with MM. With all you knowledge on build I'm really quite perplexed how you could miss this. Debuf and the buffs MM provides makes for extremely high powered and efficient take downs of groups and boss types. With the build in my sig I can easily keep up with any class (perhaps not Gi, but tha'ts not saying much...) much more easily than I can with some of the classes  you've listed above him, and I know how to use them all efficiently.

And how can you overlook how great his passive is?! His stability bonses turn so many guns from OK into superior.

He's not top tier like the over-powered infiltrators (simply due to the Si and Gi having far too much utility, imo), but he can easily keep up in terms of class synergy and offesnive potential with every single class listed in the tier above him.

Sorry if  that came across as confrontational. I'm just passionate about this class. I've spent a lot of time wtih each Solder and Turian, imo, is the best the group has to offer in terms of output. He might not be as versatile as human, but then Adepts aren't exactly versatile either and they're considered top tier...

A well speced Turian Soldier can keep up with everything but a stupid OP Gi easily.

Modifié par astheoceansblue, 19 mai 2012 - 08:31 .

[molecularman]

GodlessPaladin wrote...

molecularman wrote... you can't spam them like powers (not even in glacier).

  www.youtube.com/watch  Is biotic bubble really more "spammable" than that?  There's very rarely a time where I think "gee, I'd really like to use a grenade now, but I can't afford to."  This is especially true if I'm playing on a team that runs like a well-oiled machine, rather than randoms (the vid is showing randoms).

Anyways, like I said before, I'm considering moving the Justicar back up just because of its lack of need for grenades when considering it for a party slot (since multiple grenadiers anti-synergize with each other).

Mmmyeah, no point in arguing about which one is better. But IMO, they aren't so far from each other that they should be in different tiers.

BTW, you should really be on PC so we could enjoy your vids with better quality

Modifié par molecularman, 19 mai 2012 - 08:27 .

[GodlessPaladin]

molecularman wrote...
Mmmyeah, no point in arguing about which
one is better. But IMO, they aren't so far from each other that they
should be in different tiers.

  Remember that I think B is close to A, rather than a world apart.

astheoceansblue wrote...
This synergises briliantly with MM. With all you knowledge on build I'm really quite perplexed how you could miss this. Group debuf and the buffs MM provides makes for extremely high powered and efficient take downs of groups and boss types. With the build in my sig I can easily keep up with any class (perhaps not Gi, but tha'ts not saying much...) much more easily than I can with some of the classes  you've listed above him, and I know how to use them all efficiently.

  I have to wait for Proximity Mine to cool down, THEN use Marksman.  I use one or the other and by the time it cools the enemies are dead unless it's a boss.  Or something the Turian just has an awful time dealing with (Phantoms!).

And how can you overlook how great his passive is?! His stability bonses turn so many guns from OK into superior.

  Explain to me why stability is such a big deal.

He's not top tier like the over-powered infiltrators (simply due to the Si and Gi having far too much utility, imo), but he can easily keep up in terms of class synergy and offesnive potential with every single class listed in the tier above him.

  Okay, why do I want him over, say, the Human Soldier?

Modifié par GodlessPaladin, 19 mai 2012 - 08:34 .

[astheoceansblue]

GodlessPaladin wrote...
 I have to wait for Proximity Mine to cool down, THEN use Marksman.  I use one or the other and by the time it cools the enemies are dead unless it's a boss.  Or something the Turian just has an awful time dealing with (Phantoms!).

Turian takes down Pahntoms in SECONDS. Seconds. MM and shots -or-  PM and shots will fo it., why are you even worrying about using both? EIther one lets you pummel them into dead phantom pieces beforee they can react (if you can aim of course). There are still pletny of opportunities to use both. Using P.Mine to debuff a group or target at distance, close the gap, hit MM as it recharges and you get into close range and the debuff is still valid - for example.

Once again: P.Mine is still an amazing power without TC, don't let the OP nature of TC ruin the Turians P.Mine.

GodlessPaladin wrote... 

And how can you overlook how great his passive is?! His stability bonses turn so many guns from OK into superior.

  Explain to me why stability is such a big deal.

Ever tried it on a high rof high recoil weapon?

GodlessPaladin wrote... 

not top tier like the over-powered infiltrators (simply due to the Si and Gi having far too much utility, imo), but he can easily keep up in terms of class synergy and offesnive potential with every single class listed in the tier above him.

  Okay, why do I want him over, say, the Human Soldier?

...because P.Mine and MM takes down boss types faster than anything the HS can do.
...because Stability and Hurricane, Hornet, Rev make debuffing crowds of mobs with P.Mine into easy mode room clearance on part with anything the HS can do in terms of AoE dmg.

The best set up for TS is CQC high rof Hurricane style damage, debuffing crowds and mobs and using MM to blitz high armoured types. And while this isn't versatile, as I said, Adept isn't either and you rate them so highly.

And I can keep up with a team of adepts with Trurian Soldier when I'm playing at my best.

Modifié par astheoceansblue, 19 mai 2012 - 08:43 .

[GodlessPaladin]

astheoceansblue wrote...
Turian takes down Pahntoms in SECONDS. Seconds. MM and shots -or-  PM and shots will fo it., why are you even worrying about using both? EIther one lets you pummel them into dead phantom pieces beforee they can react (if you can aim of course).

  Uhm, I'd like to see it.  They react pretty much instantly and deflect damage from any rapid firing weapon when I do it... it doesn't matter that I'm hitting their head.  Unless I'm lagging, they always react and get extreme damage reduction.

So please, teach me how to kill phantoms efficiently with the Turian Soldier using a rapid firing weapon.  And don't say "lag more." 

Ever tried it on a high rof high recoil weapon?

I've got a Hurricane 1 I use regularly and I didn't find that I had a hard time aiming without a stability mod on my Drell Adept.

Modifié par GodlessPaladin, 19 mai 2012 - 08:59 .

[astheoceansblue]

GodlessPaladin wrote...

astheoceansblue wrote...
Turian takes down Pahntoms in SECONDS. Seconds. MM and shots -or-  PM and shots will fo it., why are you even worrying about using both? EIther one lets you pummel them into dead phantom pieces beforee they can react (if you can aim of course).

  Uhm, I'd like to see it.  They react pretty much instantly and deflect damage from any rapid firing weapon when I do it... it doesn't matter that I'm hitting their head.  Unless I'm lagging, they always react and get extreme damage reduction.

So please, teach me how to kill phantoms efficiently with the Turian Soldier using a rapid firing weapon.

I just did...

PM + Hurricane Fire (from hip at cloase range) = dead before they can react.
MM + Hurricane Fire (from hip at cloase range) = dead before they can react.

PM staggers, which stops the deflection.

I'm not sure if the super high rof of all the bonuses when using MM negates some of their deflection ability. All I know is that I use this tactic and it works and people comment often how ridiculous it is, too.

Hoenslty, I wouldn't be arguing against your poitns if it didn't work so well so consistently.

GodlessPaladin wrote...


I've got a Hurricane 1 I use regularly and I didn't find that I had a hard time aiming without a stability mod on my Drell Adept.

 

And that means?

We're talking about increwase of efficiency here. Sure, Hurricane on other classes is possible, but on Turian it''s even better.

Modifié par astheoceansblue, 19 mai 2012 - 09:03 .

[GodlessPaladin]

astheoceansblue wrote...

GodlessPaladin wrote...

astheoceansblue wrote...
Turian takes down Pahntoms in SECONDS. Seconds. MM and shots -or-  PM and shots will fo it., why are you even worrying about using both? EIther one lets you pummel them into dead phantom pieces beforee they can react (if you can aim of course).

  Uhm, I'd like to see it.  They react pretty much instantly and deflect damage from any rapid firing weapon when I do it... it doesn't matter that I'm hitting their head.  Unless I'm lagging, they always react and get extreme damage reduction.

So please, teach me how to kill phantoms efficiently with the Turian Soldier using a rapid firing weapon.

I just did...

PM + Hurricane Fire (from hip at cloase range) = dead before they can react.
MM + Hurricane Fire (from hip at cloase range) = dead before they can react.

PM staggers, which stops the deflection.

I'm not sure if the super high rof of all the bonuses when using MM negates some of their deflection ability. All I know is that I use this tactic and it works and people comment often how ridiculous it is, too.

Hoenslty, I wouldn't be arguing against your poitns if it didn't work so well so consistently.

Video?  This totally doesn't work when I try it.  No stagger from proximtiy mine, no death from Hurricane.  Do you mean that I should be at POINT BLANK range so that I'm shooting them as they actually try to melee me?  And if so... that seems like it would cause me to get sync killed.

I mean, I guess I can try again.  How close are we talking?

Modifié par GodlessPaladin, 19 mai 2012 - 09:09 .

[heybigmoney]

Geth should really have his own tier. He makes the rest of the A tier characters look like scrubs.

[astheoceansblue]

GodlessPaladin wrote...

astheoceansblue wrote...

GodlessPaladin wrote...

astheoceansblue wrote...
Turian takes down Pahntoms in SECONDS. Seconds. MM and shots -or-  PM and shots will fo it., why are you even worrying about using both? EIther one lets you pummel them into dead phantom pieces beforee they can react (if you can aim of course).

  Uhm, I'd like to see it.  They react pretty much instantly and deflect damage from any rapid firing weapon when I do it... it doesn't matter that I'm hitting their head.  Unless I'm lagging, they always react and get extreme damage reduction.

So please, teach me how to kill phantoms efficiently with the Turian Soldier using a rapid firing weapon.

I just did...

PM + Hurricane Fire (from hip at cloase range) = dead before they can react.
MM + Hurricane Fire (from hip at cloase range) = dead before they can react.

PM staggers, which stops the deflection.

I'm not sure if the super high rof of all the bonuses when using MM negates some of their deflection ability. All I know is that I use this tactic and it works and people comment often how ridiculous it is, too.

Hoenslty, I wouldn't be arguing against your poitns if it didn't work so well so consistently.

Video?  This totally doesn't work when I try it.  No stagger from proximtiy mine, no death from Hurricane.  Do you mean that I should be at POINT BLANK range so that I'm shooting them as they actually try to melee me?  And if so... that seems like it would cause me to get sync killed.

I mean, I guess I can try again.  How close are we talking?

Just tried ran a Cerberus solo until I got a Pahntom and it and I staggered her back with a P.Mine. She had half barriers. 

Tbh, the most effective way is to Debuff, fall back, spray with MM. And even though you have to wait for MM to recharge it's still very fast. MM on it's own witll do it too.

Hip-fire with Hurricane and aiming as best you can for her head. That's all I do and she drops very quickly, usually before she can do anything to hurt me at all.

[molecularman]

As for the stability buffs turians have, GP is pretty much right there. They aren't all that necessary to control the recoil (compare to some FPS games where guns actually kick back) and they don't improve the actual accuracy of your weapons.

[GodlessPaladin]

molecularman wrote...

As for the stability buffs turians have, GP is pretty much right there. They aren't all that necessary to control the recoil (compare to some FPS games where guns actually kick back) and they don't improve the actual accuracy of your weapons.

Yeah, I don't think I've ever used my stability mod equipment, EXCEPT on Turian Soldiers (so that I can actually snipe things in the head with the Hurricane across the map for lulz).  

[astheoceansblue]

molecularman wrote...

As for the stability buffs turians have, GP is pretty much right there. They aren't all that necessary to control the recoil (compare to some FPS games where guns actually kick back) and they don't improve the actual accuracy of your weapons.

GP is right in that other classes can use the weapons  a Turian does well, but Turian adds extra efficiency and makes them easier to manage. 

That extra ease may not be essential, but it does add to the overall performance increase. Which is why the Turian is so good with these guns, he's just optimised that little bit more and that works out a lot in the long run.

Modifié par astheoceansblue, 19 mai 2012 - 09:39 .

[Spiffspoo]

Phantoms seem bugged to me, since the demo back in Feb even. Sometimes you can stagger them/get a power on them that TRAVELS, and other times you just can't. If I do stagger them, or get a power to hit them like warp, they are going to die fairly easily for me or get comboed. If not I will have a harder time dealing with them.

And this is with barrier up or down, though it seems things affect them much more easily with they have no barriers. Just as a comparison, I can set BEs on Banshees very easily while on a Phantom it is very hard to do so regardless if they are moving, dodging or standing still.

Modifié par Spiffspoo, 19 mai 2012 - 09:43 .

[Dynamik78]

Just use a GPS on Turian Soldoer and you will see his true potential

I can stagger anything including big bosses so that the lack of sidestep/rolling isn't anymore an issue...I also mostly use PM as main power/debuff but when I have the occasion of hitting that Marksman button the GPS makes wonders

[GodlessPaladin]

Dynamik78 wrote...

Just use a GPS on Turian Soldoer and you will see his true potential

I can stagger anything including big bosses so that the lack of sidestep/rolling isn't anymore an issue...I also mostly use PM as main power/debuff but when I have the occasion of hitting that Marksman button the GPS makes wonders

To that I respond Human Soldier with a GPS.

[joker_jack]

I gotta put the se in the A tier. You give him a hurricane and his just become a very deadly person coupled with the decoy (which too many call weak but saves your butt every time). Shield gate isn't a problem for him or if you have him on a team for anyone else.

[Dynamik78]

GodlessPaladin wrote...

Dynamik78 wrote...

Just use a GPS on Turian Soldoer and you will see his true potential

I can stagger anything including big bosses so that the lack of sidestep/rolling isn't anymore an issue...I also mostly use PM as main power/debuff but when I have the occasion of hitting that Marksman button the GPS makes wonders

To that I respond Human Soldier with a GPS.

Yeah also but Turians have PM

[GodlessPaladin]

joker_jack wrote...

I gotta put the se in the A tier. You give him a hurricane and his just become a very deadly person coupled with the decoy (which too many call weak but saves your butt every time). Shield gate isn't a problem for him or if you have him on a team for anyone else.

Or I could just give a Hurricane to a Geth Engineer, and be a deadlier person.

[XavierVN]

Hey, do you think gold can be completed solo with any class?