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I'm afraid we need to use... Math (Weekes is right).


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#1
MyChemicalBromance

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As long as everyone survived the destruction of the relays...

(Quoted from ME wiki, source: Conversation with Ash in ME1. This information is consistant with the new ME3 codex entry on Reaper flight, which is the only other known source that gives flight speed in units, and thus should be considered the most definitive source.)











With a mass effect drive, roughly a dozen light-years can be traversed in the course of a day's cruise."

The Milky Way Galaxy is estimated to be 100,000 light-years across.

100,000[ly]/12[ly/day]=8,300[days]

8,300[days]/365=23[years]
Based on this information, it would only take around 23 years to cross the entire galaxy, even without Reaper upgrades. Granted they would have to plot their courses to find discharge points, so it would likely take even longer.

Edit: Add 2 months if you needed to travel all the way through the "thickness" (1000[ly])of the galaxy as well as all the way across the disk

Edit: Earth isn't 50,000[ly] from the core however, it is only 27,000[ly]. Given that it appears no homeworlds are farther than the distance between the Earth and the core (Besides Rannoch), I'll use it as an average.
27,000[ly]/12[ly/day]=2,300[days]

2,300[days]/365=only 6.3[years] And that is without Reaper upgrades. Super-close homeworlds, such as the Salarian homeworld, may only be 2 years away.

The Quarians have the longest journey ironically, (which we can estimate as around 73,000[ly]), but they are also the most well-suited to long distance travel.



But if they did use Reaper tech...
(Quoted from ME3 Codex)

The Reapers' thrusters and FTL drives appear to propel them at more than twice the speed of Citadel ships. Estimates of their location in dark space suggest they can travel nearly 30 light-years in a 24-hour period.
Reaper power sources seem to violate known physical laws. Reapers usually destroy fuel infrastructure rather than attempting to capture it intact, indicating that Reapers do not require organic species' energy supplies. Consequently, the Reapers attack without regard for maintaining supply lines behind them, except to move husks from one planet to another. Unlike Citadel ships, Reapers do not appear to discharge static buildup from their drive cores, although they sometimes appear wreathed in static discharge when they land on planets.


All they have to do now is explain why destroying the relays didn't kill everyone and you guys can all have your happy endings.
Edit: The consensus we are coming to is that the energy of the Relay was carried along with the "Crucible Beams." This energy may be consumed to propagate the "signal." It follows logically that any excess energy at the Omega Relay would be fired into the Galactic Core, thus only bothering the Collector Corpses/Dust :P
There is a picture giving visual support of this theory on page 18. Thanks to Dobiog101 for the pic.


 
Fuel Concerns

In space, there is virtually nothing slowing down matter once it is in motion.

ME2 Marine Physics Rant


So why is fuel consumed in the galaxy map?

(Quoted from ME1 Codex)



















Any long-duration interstellar flight consists of two phases: acceleration and deceleration. Starships accelerate to the half-way point of their journey, then flip 180 degrees and apply thrust on the opposite vector, decelerating as they finish the trip. The engines are always operating, and peak speed is attained at the middle of the flight.


Fuel is thus only consumed when attempting to travel as fast as possible, or when making course corrections. Deceleration is needed because you don't want to be moving at 12[ly/day] when you reach your destination.

If we held at "cruising speed," we wouldn't need any fuel at all to move anywhere. Then the problem comes down to discharge and food sources.

Addendum: There has been some discussion about how much fuel is required simply to sustain a current through the Eezo core, thus sustaining the Mass Effect envelope around the ship. When the Normandy is stationary, it consumes no fuel, so it could be infered that the amount is very little. However, fuel consumption increases when moving, and it may be that a larger current is needed to lower the mass enough to fly faster. Whether the fuel consumption is primarily caused by propulsion or current, we do not know and can only speculate.
Food Concerns

Joker describes vat-grown meat on human ships, implies it is common. (1:21)

That gives an out for Levo-Amino Acids (Everyone except Quarians and Turians)

(Quoted from ME2 Codex)

There are few wide-open spaces in quarian spacecrafts; liveships are the exception. Each ship is a massive hydroponics facility, growing thousands of tons of genetically modified staple crops under artificial light and in highly enriched soil.
The surface of a liveship is studded with docking bays so as many shuttles as possible can distribute the foods throughout the flotilla on a daily basis. When received, the crops are sterilized with radiation, ground up into nutritious paste, and pumped into quarian suits through feeding tubes. In return, waste products are that could be used as fertilizer or compost are returned to the liveships through an efficient (if odorous) recycling program.
Liveships do not hold animals. The quarians consume a vegan diet, driven not by ethics but by practicality. Captive animals require living space, and consume large amounts of water and plant matter. The quarians cannot afford such an inefficient resource-to-calorie ratio, to say nothing of a live animal's disease or allergen potential. As a result, when the flotilla arrives in a star system where life is based on the same dextro-amino acids that the quarians consume, pastes based on animal proteins fetch highly inflated prices, and the vendors are typically mobbed by quarians wanting a new taste sensation. The sickness that often follows these binges is treated much the same way as hangovers are in human culture; painful, but part of the overall experience of excess.

And that covers Dextros.



 
Synthesis
I'm probably going to catch some flak for this, but synthesis kind of solves the other two problems.

1.)It is possible that "Synthesee's" no longer need to eat.
2.)All the races will presumably work together right away, including the Reapers and Geth.
3.)If we can work with the Reapers, then we have 30[ly/day] tech right away.
Maybe it is the best endingPosted Image

 The Geth
Assuming you picked Control or Synthesis, and saved them on Rannoch, the Geth can't be taken out of the equation. They have a huge fleet that doesn't need to feed it's own population, and could easily house food production facilities. I'm beginning to see how 16 endings may be possible...

Communication Concerns
Quantum Entanglement Communicators will allow everyone to talk and coordinate no matter where they are in the galaxy. Traditional communication was limited by the speed of light, and then sped up by beaming the information through the Relays. Quantum Entanglement Communicators are actually more advanced than the Relays are communications-wise, and thus represent a technology that exceeds what the Reapers gave us. Also, the Reapers used this tech to control husks and Collectors, so it is not impossible for us to develop tech the Reapers didn't want us to have.

Edit: a.m.p. came to many of the same conclusions in this thread, and also made it 8 days before me :P. She also took the time to calculate the estimated times to specific homeworlds.

Discharge
There has been significant discussion on the problem of drive discharge. It is stated that the drive must be discharged every 50 hours, which would mean roughly 30[ly] could be traveled before discharge. There is evidence in Mass Effect 1 that the 50 hour-limit may be specific to the size of the Eezo core, and thus the size of an Eezo core may be part of solving this issue.

As positive or negative electric current is passed through an FTL drive core, it acquires a static electrical charge. Drives can be operated an average of 50 hours before they reach charge saturation. This changes proportionally to the magnitude of mass reduction; a heavier or faster ship reaches saturation more quickly.

This seem to agree with our statement. The size of the core relative to the mass of the ship is proportional to the saturation limit. Therefore, a massive core on a small ship (like the Normandy SR1) will need to be discharged less frequently. 
Based on the Reaper Codex Entry in Mass Effect 3, we can estimate how far the Reapers flew without discharging.
Moving at 30[ly/day] for 3 years (Twitter post states they started approaching the galaxy as soon as Sovereign died, meaning it took them from 2183-2186 to fly to the galaxy) reveals that they were roughly 32,000[ly] from the edge of the galaxy, meaning they flew a distance roughly a third the diameter of the galaxy without discharging. We at least know the solution exists. More extensive discussion of the discharge problem is on page 16-18.

Modifié par MyChemicalBromance, 15 avril 2012 - 09:53 .


#2
rebo_tfc

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Yeah cos those military ships have enough food for 23 years ....

#3
Apocsapel91

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rebo_tfc wrote...

Yeah cos those military ships have enough food for 23 years ....


And fuel...

#4
wintermaul55

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rebo_tfc wrote...

Yeah cos those military ships have enough food for 23 years ....

u better believe it... they also have giant pink bunnies and coward pilots who leave the greatest fight to decide the fate of there time to go running away with there commanders girl on a random planet

#5
Goober2049

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I recall in another thread that it mentioned the 12 light year per day speed being a "cruising" speed, not maximum. It may have even been the one with the unofficial Weeke's interview.

#6
CronoDragoon

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Sorry, but we need to be talking "home in months" instead of decades for this to approach happy.

#7
NReed106

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Ahem, what of fuel? Are there random fuel stations everywhere in the uncharted galaxy?

#8
xxskyshadowxx

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So...the Relays are destroyed because using Reaper tech before they're fully ready is bad for the races out there and causes chaos....so we destroy the Relays, but it's a happy ending because there's all that Reaper tech everyone can scavenge in order to get home before they starve and whatnot...

...hmm,,,so Shepard sacrifices him/herself and a crapton of other lives to end a cycle that didn't actually end.

How uplifting.

#9
Billabong2011

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So it's basically the Odyssey in space?

#10
xxskyshadowxx

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NReed106 wrote...

Ahem, what of fuel? Are there random fuel stations everywhere in the uncharted galaxy?


Well there were....but the Normandy emptied them all in those war asset side missions.

If everyone had only known that war assets meant nothing at all, and the end is the same regardles, they may have left those fuel stations alone...

Whoops!

#11
SilentK

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So, long distance travel will require lots of time. I can live with that =)

edit: as far as food goes, there are still maps, and plantes with resources. Pro-tip is aiming for a planet with stuff you need.

Modifié par SilentK, 08 avril 2012 - 03:36 .


#12
MyChemicalBromance

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rebo_tfc wrote...

Yeah cos those military ships have enough food for 23 years ....

The Quarians survived for 300 years.

#13
Deuterium_Dawn

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That's still essentially crippling for galactic society. Long range communication is now possible only via courier ship, and will still take years to to reach far flung systems. Trade is now far more expensive and dangerous, and the capacity may not exist to supply any colonies that are not fully self-sufficient. And few are likely to be. The economy was extremely interconnected, no one place will produce everything. Even the homeworlds are likely to suffer(though not to the same extent) without the inflow of resources from their respective empires. Rebuilding the relays is the only way to reestablish galactic civilization as it was anytime soon. And the stargazer scene suggests that even in the distant future we don't have even basic starflight.

MyChemicalBromance wrote...

rebo_tfc wrote...

Yeah cos those military ships have enough food for 23 years ....

The Quarians survived for 300 years.


The Quarians used the relays. They would gather/buy/trade for resources in the systems they passed through, and there were places for them to discharge their drive cores. They weren't making a thirty year journey through uninhabited and possibly hostile systems. Interstellar travel would still be possible, but it would be rather costly and difficult. Most vessels probably aren't equipped for long distance travel without supporting infrastructure as there's previously been no need for it except for exploration.

Modifié par Deuterium_Dawn, 08 avril 2012 - 03:40 .


#14
Arturia Pendragon

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MyChemicalBromance wrote...

rebo_tfc wrote...

Yeah cos those military ships have enough food for 23 years ....

The Quarians survived for 300 years.

They also had the mass relays to travel between systems to purchase/barter for fuel, food, and other supplies. Did you really even think that reply through?

#15
lillitheris

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I did the math earlier, and obviously we need to approximate. There are a few considerations:

- As far as we know, Eezo doesn't need to be replenished in a significant manner.
- Fuel does, so need fuel depots or gas giants.
- Drives need to be discharged every 50 hours, i.e. < 2 days, and the discharge time depends on the location.
- Need to navigate FTL paths to avoid any obstacles.
- Need to navigate A) within the galaxy, but B) not near the core.
- Assume 15 LY/d average speed.

With the overhead, my most optimistic estimate is around 45 years across the galaxy. Certainly doable, and an entirely different prospect than something like 200 years.

Food will still be the major problem. Even though there're planets to scavenge, both developed and undeveloped, it'll take a lot of time to handle unprocessed food logistics, so to be on the safe side, I think something like 55-60 years is a reasonable estimate – if all goes well.

Edit: of course by the time you've been on the move for 20 years, the surviving systems have probably started getting their infrastructure in shape and will be able to help better (if so inclined).

Modifié par lillitheris, 08 avril 2012 - 03:40 .


#16
Nivenus

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MyChemicalBromance wrote...

As long as everyone survived the destruction of the relays...

(Quoted from ME1 Codex)

With a mass effect drive, roughly a dozen light-years can be traversed in the course of a day's cruise."

The Milky Way Galaxy is estimated to be 100,000 light-years across.

100,000[ly]/12[ly/day]=8,300[days]

8,300[days]/365=23[years]
Based on this information, it would only take around 23 years to cross the entire galaxy, even without Reaper upgrades. Granted they would have to plot their courses to find discharge points, so it would likely take even longer. 


Fair enough. Although a separate Codex entry (specifically, the one about the Mass Relays themselves) does contradict this information by saying that travel between relays could take decades or centuries on standard FTL, either way one source is wrong and the other is correct, so we might as well go with the one that agrees with Weekes' statement.

That being said, issues of fuel, food, and other supplies remain an issue, as does the actual matter of salvaging Reaper drives safely. However, Weekes' statement about the Relays not being required for effective FTL travel may well, in fact, be correct.

As for "happy endings," many other issues remain with the ending that are irrelevant to whether it's happy or not.

#17
Clayless

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rebo_tfc wrote...

Yeah cos those military ships have enough food for 23 years ....


If only they had some sort of stasis technology, or cloning technology.

#18
wintermaul55

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Arturia Pendragon wrote...

MyChemicalBromance wrote...

rebo_tfc wrote...

Yeah cos those military ships have enough food for 23 years ....

The Quarians survived for 300 years.

They also had the mass relays to travel between systems to purchase/barter for fuel, food, and other supplies. Did you really even think that reply through?

And you think that the rest of the races will accept having no resources and let the quarians go? LOL
let me remind you. KROGANS 

#19
Dean_the_Young

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rebo_tfc wrote...

Yeah cos those military ships have enough food for 23 years ....

Hydrophics is a wonderful technology.

#20
wintermaul55

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Our_Last_Scene wrote...

rebo_tfc wrote...

Yeah cos those military ships have enough food for 23 years ....


If only they had some sort of stasis technology, or cloning technology.

curious as to what stasis will solve....

#21
Dean_the_Young

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xxskyshadowxx wrote...

NReed106 wrote...

Ahem, what of fuel? Are there random fuel stations everywhere in the uncharted galaxy?


Well there were....but the Normandy emptied them all in those war asset side missions.

Not necessarily all, but-

Not only do you have surviving colonies, but fleets could transport their own Helium 3 processing abilities.

#22
MyChemicalBromance

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NReed106 wrote...

Ahem, what of fuel? Are there random fuel stations everywhere in the uncharted galaxy?


(Quoted from ME1 Codex)

Any long-duration interstellar flight consists of two phases: acceleration and deceleration. Starships accelerate to the half-way point of their journey, then flip 180 degrees and apply thrust on the opposite vector, decelerating as they finish the trip. The engines are always operating, and peak speed is attained at the middle of the flight.


This is obviously designed to reach the destination in the fastest time. There is no resistance in space, so fuel is only consumed when trying to travel as fast as possible. "Cruising" speed (12ly per day) would require no fuel.

#23
KingNothing125

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So many times this has been brought up.

Yes, we know that it's feasible to go from one end of the galaxy to the other over a not-extremely-long period of time.

That's not the issue. The issue is He-3 fuel, discharging the core, food and water. The space between relays is devoid of any civilization whatsoever. Only about 1% of the galaxy has been explored. There are no He-3 fueling stations between relays. There are no grocery stores. It's anyone's guess if there are any planets with strong enough magnetic fields to discharge your ship's core.

Picture the old American pioneer days, people loading up Conestoga wagons to walk across North America in the 1830s. Galactic travel without the mass relays is pretty much like that. Describing galactic life post-Reapers as anything other than a "dark age" is wishful thinking.

#24
Clayless

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wintermaul55 wrote...

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

rebo_tfc wrote...

Yeah cos those military ships have enough food for 23 years ....


If only they had some sort of stasis technology, or cloning technology.

curious as to what stasis will solve....


It'd be like whoevers in stasis wont need food. If only this technology was used for keeping incredibly dangerous criminals locked away, and if only there was some sort of machine race left above Earth who could quickly create more of these small stasis pods.

#25
Dean_the_Young

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Arturia Pendragon wrote...

MyChemicalBromance wrote...

rebo_tfc wrote...

Yeah cos those military ships have enough food for 23 years ....

The Quarians survived for 300 years.

They also had the mass relays to travel between systems to purchase/barter for fuel, food, and other supplies. Did you really even think that reply through?

They grew their own food.

They can transport their own fuel infrastructure.

Manufactories to make refined tools out of raw materials are established.



Fortunately, the ME universe has the explanation technologies necessary.