284 réponses à ce sujet

[CaduganFaber]

 I've been kicked from a dozen gold games now, just because i'm using the claymore, this is in the last two hours. 

I find I get consistently higher damage and better utility out of this setup than a sniper setup, especially against boss type enemies. it also allows for a one-hit-kill to phantoms, which is unheard of with a sniper setup. 

Why the hate?

[ImperatorMortis]

Did they tell you that was why they were kicking you?

Also Claymore/Shotgun infiltrators are OK in my book. 

Modifié par ImperatorMortis, 09 avril 2012 - 01:52 .

[eldrjth]

you leave the main group and try to gun down stuff that wouldve died to sniper fire. you dont cover your teams blind spots and dont deal dmg at range. you also tend to die in isolated locations that are hard to reach and become swarmed with enemies. you also wont outscore a decent sniper and are severely hindered against some units.

[marshalleck]

Because people have a very narrow view of what's acceptable to play on gold, and in some cases they are right. Though I do think shotgun infiltrators sporting a claymore or GPS are underrated.

[SofieShepard]

Tried this last night and I stunk. Went back to my widow VI and was happy once more. I tried it because a teammate was godlike with a GPS. Hats off to him then...

[marshalleck]

eldrjth wrote...

you leave the main group and try to gun down stuff that wouldve died to sniper fire. you dont cover your teams blind spots and dont deal dmg at range. you also tend to die in isolated locations that are hard to reach and become swarmed with enemies. you also wont outscore a decent sniper and are severely hindered against some units.

Well, from this you'd think it's impossible to clear a gold match without a sniper. 

[Swagger J]

Because a lot of people don't want to think outside the box and can't be bothered with non-optimal builds. Personally, I play the game to have fun, so trying out different builds is part of that. I started playing a Shotgun Inf last week and it's been a blast (Pun intended). My advice would be to find some like-minded people to group up with and just have fun.

[CaduganFaber]

eldrjth wrote...

you leave the main group and try to gun down stuff that wouldve died to sniper fire. you dont cover your teams blind spots and dont deal dmg at range. you also tend to die in isolated locations that are hard to reach and become swarmed with enemies. you also wont outscore a decent sniper and are severely hindered against some units.

Ok... so because some people don't know how to play as a team you're branding everybody with the same iron?

[Eckswhyzed]

No hatin' from this infiltrator.

GPS has pretty sick synergy with charge shots + cloak, but Claymore allows you to start hitting hard from the get go.

[Cloaking_Thane]

Claymore infiltrator is fine, New PUGs that have no business in gold is the problem you're fine OP

[PluralAces]

because you are going to run off by yourself trying to kill everything and then we have to run all the way across the map to heal you, thats why i dont play with krogans or any type of vanguards on gold, add salarian infiltration claymore to that list....

your recharge time for cloak also would be very long...so you will probably die faster than the rest of the group

[CaduganFaber]

Try playing the class Plural.... Recharge rate is not very different from using a Widow.

Modifié par CaduganFaber, 09 avril 2012 - 01:59 .

[Quxorda]

marshalleck wrote...

eldrjth wrote...

you leave the main group and try to gun down stuff that wouldve died to sniper fire. you dont cover your teams blind spots and dont deal dmg at range. you also tend to die in isolated locations that are hard to reach and become swarmed with enemies. you also wont outscore a decent sniper and are severely hindered against some units.

Well, from this you'd think it's impossible to clear a gold match without a sniper. 

To be perfectly honest, while I love my sniper rifles I find it hard to see a true advantage they have over a GPS/Graal/Claymore. The GPS and Graal can reach almost fully across the largest maps and a claymore with smart choke can be lethal just past mid range.

PluralAces wrote...

because you are going to run off by
yourself trying to kill everything and then we have to run all the way
across the map to heal you, thats why i dont play with krogans or any
type of vanguards on gold, add salarian infiltration claymore to that
list....

your recharge time for cloak also would be very long...so you will probably die faster than the rest of the group

Cloak recharge time is based on how long you are cloaked, you could carry a claymore and a Javelin if you wanted and it would make no real difference. Also, those aren't claymore infiltrators your talking about - those are idiots and you get them in every class.

Modifié par Quxorda, 09 avril 2012 - 02:01 .

[Echo Six Grimez]

eldrjth wrote...

you leave the main group and try to gun down stuff that wouldve died to sniper fire. you dont cover your teams blind spots and dont deal dmg at range. you also tend to die in isolated locations that are hard to reach and become swarmed with enemies. you also wont outscore a decent sniper and are severely hindered against some units.

The Troll is strong in this one.

Everything you described is focused on a player who doesn't play as a team, it hasn't got anything to do with the class they're using.

The Salarian Infiltrator is the most viable class in the game, i wouldn't say they were 'Severely hindered against some units' as using a SI myself i can dispatch Brutes / Banshees / Primes / Ravagers and all the other enemies the game wants to throw at me.

It's usually me doing all the work simply because most people are set to think just because i have cloak I'll be doing the in-game objectives / reviving and I'll tell you something now, most of the time I'm the one who doing the aforementioned tasks.

Not because i can.. it's because i play as a team and I'd stand a better chance with 4 people on the Battlefield then just me against a full horde.

[MrTango LXXII]

marshalleck wrote...

eldrjth wrote...

you leave the main group and try to gun down stuff that wouldve died to sniper fire. you dont cover your teams blind spots and dont deal dmg at range. you also tend to die in isolated locations that are hard to reach and become swarmed with enemies. you also wont outscore a decent sniper and are severely hindered against some units.

Well, from this you'd think it's impossible to clear a gold match without a sniper. 

The infiltrator class is so 1337 bro.
It can hide from enemies AND do extra damage. 
we ge bonuses for hiding behind counters on gold.

[marshalleck]

PluralAces wrote...

your recharge time for cloak also would be very long...

obviously don't know how cloak works, maybe play the class first before telling others how to?

[Cloaking_Thane]

PluralAces wrote...

because you are going to run off by yourself trying to kill everything and then we have to run all the way across the map to heal you, thats why i dont play with krogans or any type of vanguards on gold, add salarian infiltration claymore to that list....

your recharge time for cloak also would be very long...so you will probably die faster than the rest of the group

Several things wrong with this but I'll address 1

Claymore X = +55% CD

more than enough

[Dasher1010]

I'm a fan. Just don't be an AR/SMG infiltrator. Those builds are horrible.

[PluralAces]

CaduganFaber wrote...

Try playing the class Plural.... Recharge rate is not very different from using a Widow.

thats true, but with a widow you are far away from enemies, with a claymore you are more likely in the middle of a group of enemies so when you need cloak to get away because you have low health, you cant because of the long recharge time...

[Arkley]

I had no idea Claymore Infiltrators were hated. I don't think I've ever failed to top a scoreboard as a shotgun Infiltrator with GPS or Claymore.

eldrjth wrote...

you leave the main group and try to gun down stuff that wouldve died to sniper fire. you dont cover your teams blind spots and dont deal dmg at range. you also tend to die in isolated locations that are hard to reach and become swarmed with enemies. you also wont outscore a decent sniper and are severely hindered against some units.

This is alarmingly inaccurate. A Claymore Infiltrator has no reason to leave the group. With a choke mod, the gun is accurate and powerful enough that a shot in the general direction of an enemy's head will down it even at mid range. No cloak required for standard mooks, cloak for the shielded ones. If a protected enemy is out of comfortable range, cloak and shield drain it first.

The above facts also disprove your assertion that shotgun Infiltrators tend to "die in isolated locations"; no Infiltrator with a Claymore or GPS has any reason to be in an isolated location unless they're the only ones going for an objective.

Lastly, they are not "hindered against some units". GPS ignores armour, and the Claymore - even without the AP mod - deals more damage against armoured targets than a Widow shot. Oh, and with the reload interrupt trick, you can fire two shots while under the cloak's damage bonus. Two cloaked Claymore shots outdamage three cloaked Black Widow shots against armour, too.

But maybe you weren't talking about armour? Maybe you were talking about shields and barriers? Shotgun shotgun users are even better at dealing with those than sniper users, due to the shield gating mechanic being completely useless at protecting from multiple projectiles.

Lastly, if you doubt the effective range of the Claymore or GPS, you can try a simple experiment for yourself; equip one (with a choke, if Claymore) and start up a Gold game on Firebase Dagger. Any enemy will do. Go to the central room, the sniper perch. You know the two spawn points opposite the perch, that snipers love to shoot at? Wait for enemies to spawn, cloak, and fire a shot at the group. You'll most likely kill any of them that are in your reticule, unless they have shields. In which case, shield drain first.

That's how far the Claymore can remain effective.

Oh, and about the cooldown; Claymore X leaves me with +80% cooldown, and weight is damn near irrelevent for Infiltrators anyway. Your cooldown is effected by how long you keep the cloak up. If you're just doing cloak > power > shot, your cooldown is going to be about 3 seconds whether your weight is +100% or -100%.

Modifié par Arkley, 09 avril 2012 - 02:12 .

[PluralAces]

marshalleck wrote...

PluralAces wrote...

your recharge time for cloak also would be very long...

obviously don't know how cloak works, maybe play the class first before telling others how to?

so when cloak wears off, the recharge time doesnt start?

and if you have +55% as opposed to +200% the recharge time wouldnt be longer?

[Quxorda]

PluralAces wrote...

CaduganFaber wrote...

Try playing the class Plural.... Recharge rate is not very different from using a Widow.

thats true, but with a widow you are far away from enemies, with a claymore you are more likely in the middle of a group of enemies so when you need cloak to get away because you have low health, you cant because of the long recharge time...

Cloak doesn't work that way. Also since you are tending to strafe and move around a lot using a shotty all the cloaking/decloaking tends to confuse the AI. They fire at where you were instead of where you are (or sometimes flat out ignore you) which lets you circle strafe things pretty easily for the short amount of time it takes to kill things. Also again only someone whos really inpet at situational awareness or just a plain idiot is going to be getting in over their heads away from the team.

PluralAces wrote...

marshalleck wrote...

PluralAces wrote...

your recharge time for cloak also would be very long...

obviously don't know how cloak works, maybe play the class first before telling others how to?

so when cloak wears off, the recharge time doesnt start?

and if you have +55% as opposed to +200% the recharge time wouldnt be longer?

Cloak shouldn't be wearing off, you should either be canceling it manually or by shooting something. The longer you are cloaked the longer the CD, if you use cloak properly then your CD is never more then slightly longer then a reload.. just like a sniper rifle.

Modifié par Quxorda, 09 avril 2012 - 02:14 .

[PluralAces]

Quxorda wrote...

PluralAces wrote...

CaduganFaber wrote...

Try playing the class Plural.... Recharge rate is not very different from using a Widow.

thats true, but with a widow you are far away from enemies, with a claymore you are more likely in the middle of a group of enemies so when you need cloak to get away because you have low health, you cant because of the long recharge time...

Cloak doesn't work that way. Also since you are tending to strafe and move around a lot using a shotty all the cloaking/decloaking tends to confuse the AI. They fire at where you were instead of where you are (or sometimes flat out ignore you) which lets you circle strafe things pretty easily for the short amount of time it takes to kill things. Also again only someone whos really inpet at situational awareness or just a plain idiot is going to be getting in over their heads away from the team.

well i have found that cloaking doesnt work affectively against guardians since they always tend to know that you have run past them when you are cloaked...but anyway

maybe the players i have seen use it use it the way i described, and not to generalize the way that particular build is played, but until i play with someone who uses this type of build effectively, i will have my prejudice against it and will stay away from it as much as possible...maybe if one of my friends shows that it can be effectively used then maybe my prejudice against it will cease to exist

[eldrjth]

Quxorda wrote...

To be perfectly honest, while I love my sniper rifles I find it hard to see a true advantage they have over a GPS/Graal/Claymore. The GPS and Graal can reach almost fully across the largest maps and a claymore with smart choke can be lethal just past mid range.

the GPS is glitchy in close range and tends to miss a lot of shots and the charge up time eats into kills/min. so even though its one of the better shottys (if you get the proj to track at range) it still doesnt out perform any sniper (window, BW, valiant, mantis, javelin are all better). the graal has a lot of trouble hitting units that are moving, even slightly and even at close-ish range, when youre lagging even a tiny bit to the host its crap, youll miss more often that you hit, and the charge up delay makes it only mediocre. the claymore is prob the best at being a shotty, since it can fire a kill shot in close range, but you need to move to the enemy to get this opportunity, while a sniper can kill enemies when they spawn. so still not as good. theres not a threat that comes in close range that I cant handle with my valiant anyway, you just need to aim, quickscope, and drop them.  

Modifié par eldrjth, 09 avril 2012 - 02:21 .

[Arkley]

PluralAces wrote...
I don't understand how cloaking works, but I believe that people should play Infiltrator the way I think is best. I have no evidence to support my assertions that shotgun Infiltrators are bad. I will continue believing that shotgun Infiltrators are bad until one of them proves me wrong by playing with me well. But I refuse to play with them, because I think they're bad.

Got it. Makes sense.

In this thread: People who don't know how cloak works tell Infiltrators how to play.