227 réponses à ce sujet

[kidbd15]

Hudathan wrote...

kidbd15 wrote...

Too much speculation for the ending to a 100+ hour trilogy.  Too many "maybes" "coulds" "mights".  I don't want to speculate, this isn't a 2 hour movie, I want to know what happened, especially in a series like Mass Effect, where they try to rationalize EVERYTHING.  This is a conclusion, where all my questions were advertised to be answered, not give me more questions.

I got good news for you!

blog.bioware.com/2012/04/05/mass-effect-3-extended-cut/

haha... I'd be really happy if it did resolve all my issues, but it's not.  They said they would add cutscenes which I doubt will address every question I have. Example... why does my Shep bend over and take it in the a** from the starchild without questioning it?  My shep would never do that, and yet... clearly did.

[Ownedbacon]

Ownedbacon wrote...

Hudathan wrote...

j78 wrote...

I have a legitimate question for you and others who enjoyed the ending .what was the point of ME1 if the whole time star child was living in the attic of the citadel. Serene and sovereign would have had no problem With accomplishing their mission right .Just call star child on his cell and tell him to open up and bing bam boom ? This is one of the reasons I cannot buy this ending . It makes no scenes to me but if you have solution to this I would be overjoyed to hear it .

The Catalyst is implied to not directly control anything. It informs Shepard of the 'new possibilities' made possible by the Crucible but can't physically make changes. The Reapers, the Keepers, and the Citadel/relays are obviously one giant autunomous system. It could mean that whoever the Catalyst was originally is now gone and only preserved in the form of a simple voice. Or, it could mean that the Catalyst merely observes in order to avoid the creator vs created conflict it set out to prevent in the first place. Reapers and Keepers all go about performing their tasks through out the cycles with no interference from any master in order to keep the motivation pure.

It is implied that the Reapers follow the same strategy when harvesting the galaxy. If the Catalyst doesn't control anything how can he simply give control over to Shepard with the two handles protruding from the Citadel?

Most of what you talked about is speculation. If the Catalyst has the ability to give control to Shepard or let Shepard destroy the Reapers wouldn't there be some level of power that the Catalyst has? It would only make sense that the Catalyst could have taken on the responsiblities of the Vanguard.

Plus with the possible failure of Sovereign and the "solution" wouldn't it be more reliable if the Catalyst just opened the Citadel Mass relay and let the Reapers in not even have the Vanguard in the Milky Way? It would be a better trap.

[Hudathan]

Ownedbacon wrote...

It is implied that the Reapers follow the same strategy when harvesting the galaxy. If the Catalyst doesn't control anything how can he simply give control over to Shepard with the two handles protruding from the Citadel?

Most of what you talked about is speculation. If the Catalyst has the ability to give control to Shepard or let Shepard destroy the Reapers wouldn't there be some level of power that the Catalyst has? It would only make sense that the Catalyst could have taken on the responsiblities of the Vanguard.

The Crucible is designed to use the Citadel in order to affect the Reapers, the choices offered at the end are only possible because connecting the Crucible has changed the Citadel. The Catalyst itself doesn't give you anything new, all it does is explain the functions of the Crucible as it was built and try to offer its own perspective on things. How is any of that speculation since it was stated in game?

Modifié par Hudathan, 09 avril 2012 - 08:12 .

[The Angry One]

Hudathan wrote...

Ownedbacon wrote...

It is implied that the Reapers follow the same strategy when harvesting the galaxy. If the Catalyst doesn't control anything how can he simply give control over to Shepard with the two handles protruding from the Citadel?

Most of what you talked about is speculation. If the Catalyst has the ability to give control to Shepard or let Shepard destroy the Reapers wouldn't there be some level of power that the Catalyst has? It would only make sense that the Catalyst could have taken on the responsiblities of the Vanguard.

The Crucible is designed to use the Citadel in order to affect the Reapers, the choices offered at the end are only possible because connecting the Crucible has changed the Citadel. The Catalyst itself doesn't give you anything new, all it does is explain the functions of the Crucible as it was built and try to offer its own perspective on things. How is any of that speculation since it was stated in game.

Missing the implication that the Catalyst or it's creators must have designed the Crucible in the first place.

[Torrible]

Ubergrog wrote...

First things first, Mr. Hudson did not "make" Kotor or ME. A huge team of dedicated individuals did.

We don't know how much he contributed to Kotor as a whole or ME3's ending. If solely praising him for Kotor is unfair to the other developers, so is solely slagging him for ME3's ending unfair to him.

Modifié par Torrible, 09 avril 2012 - 08:13 .

[j78]

Hudathan wrote...

j78 wrote...

I have a legitimate question for you and others who enjoyed the ending .what was the point of ME1 if the whole time star child was living in the attic of the citadel. Serene and sovereign would have had no problem With accomplishing their mission right .Just call star child on his cell and tell him to open up and bing bam boom ? This is one of the reasons I cannot buy this ending . It makes no scenes to me but if you have solution to this I would be overjoyed to hear it .

The Catalyst is implied to not directly control anything. It informs Shepard of the 'new possibilities' made possible by the Crucible but can't physically make changes. The Reapers, the Keepers, and the Citadel/relays are obviously one giant autunomous system. It could mean that whoever the Catalyst was originally is now gone and only preserved in the form of a simple voice. Or, it could mean that the Catalyst merely observes in order to avoid the creator vs created conflict it set out to prevent in the first place. Reapers and Keepers all go about performing their tasks through out the cycles with no interference from any master in order to keep the motivation pure.

It controlled Tim and it could’ve of just had Saren come upstairs or indoctrinate any number of beings to insure the cycle would continue .
If this get’s to hot don’t feed the flamers

[Phategod1]

kidbd15 wrote...

Phategod1 wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

Phategod1 wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

The ending being bad is not, 

The term bad it totally subjective, To me Licorice is bad, but some people love it. You can say the same thing about The Ending, ****'s, Korean cars anytthing. so just because something is Bad  To you, or the masses or the minority the simple FACT  that you can find one person  who likes what you find bad destroys the notion of BAD=FACT.

Nope, it's objectively bad because it violates the core themes of Mass Effect.
It violates Shepard's core character.
It's laden with plot holes and nonsensical scenes, such as the Normandy scene which is heavily disliked even by people who like the ending.

That still does not make anything you said a fact. The simple fact that you can not say EVRYONE disliked it makes it an opinion. 

TAO is not saying everyone disliked it, but instead the ending is "bad" in that it doesn't follow what ME series has set itself to be about.  There are a lot of instances in the ending that don't make sense, that makes you question what is going on, and completely disregards what Shepard has been up to that point.  I'm not sure how you cannot consider something like that to be "bad".  

Regardless of HOW the fact that I CAN means that "it being bad" is not a fact but an opinion. 

[Hudathan]

kidbd15 wrote...

Hudathan wrote...

kidbd15 wrote...

Too much speculation for the ending to a 100+ hour trilogy.  Too many "maybes" "coulds" "mights".  I don't want to speculate, this isn't a 2 hour movie, I want to know what happened, especially in a series like Mass Effect, where they try to rationalize EVERYTHING.  This is a conclusion, where all my questions were advertised to be answered, not give me more questions.

I got good news for you!

blog.bioware.com/2012/04/05/mass-effect-3-extended-cut/

haha... I'd be really happy if it did resolve all my issues, but it's not.  They said they would add cutscenes which I doubt will address every question I have. Example... why does my Shep bend over and take it in the a** from the starchild without questioning it?  My shep would never do that, and yet... clearly did.

There will most likely be dialogue too. I'm sure they're still in the planning phases and are looking to literally eliminate any potential arguments with this additional content.

[Menethra]

I don't like the fact he lied to us all but it's not just his fault it's Michael Gamble and Mac Walters fault as well they said a bunch of crap that never came to fruition so the blame cannot lie entirely with him.

Don't forget the main culprit behind all of this though, EA deserve more blame than anyone for that god damn game deadline crap they've been running for years.

[Topsider]

The Angry One wrote...

Phategod1 wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

tobito113 wrote...

The Angry One wrote...
Every time someone with that troll-tag banner says this, I consider it a personal victory.

You consider a victory everytime you annoy someone, and you dare call others "trolls"...

I consider it a victory when people who continually misrepresent and insult me leave me alone.
Which is something you have yet to do, by the way.

Stop presenting your Opnions as facts and you'll be left alone. 

They're not opinions. They are objective truth. Don't like it? Tough.
You are free to disagree with me as long as you're not insulting, by the way.

"Objective truth" is a fancy way of saying My Opinion. Please, give it a rest, you're making a fool of yourself.

[Hudathan]

The Angry One wrote...

Missing the implication that the Catalyst or it's creators must have designed the Crucible in the first place.

Not necessarily, since even a small group of Prothean scientists could figure out how to create their own prototype relay on Ilos. It's plausible that one of the previous cycles managed to gain enough insight into the technology of the Reapers to come up with plans for a device that could target the neural center of the entire network.

[UnstableMongoose]

nitefyre410 wrote...

UnstableMongoose wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

Every time someone with that troll-tag banner says this, I consider it a personal victory.

Then you have no understanding of what a victory is. But fear not, I can provide you with the resources to get you started on your path to knowledge. Happy hunting!

 

*/lurke*
Oh... dropping the Art of War... **** just got real...

though  I suggest being careful that can be turned against you.. 
*lurke* 

Yes, but if I provide the Art of War, I know my opponents will be using it against me, and by the principles of the Art of War, I have now created an infinite logical loop. Hopefully, this will result in circular logic that should derail the spambots. 

They are bots, right?

[Blackbear2106]

not jumping to the "fire him" thing but if he is the only one decided the ending as people says, then he should be more open minded and listen to criticism instead of defending his own personal "artistic vision" which went completely against the ME theme and spirit.

If he said he'd want to fix the ending then I believe there is no reason for bioware to be so conservative. So this mess is partly his fault for acting so stubbornly.

[kidbd15]

Hudathan wrote...

kidbd15 wrote...

Hudathan wrote...

kidbd15 wrote...

Too much speculation for the ending to a 100+ hour trilogy.  Too many "maybes" "coulds" "mights".  I don't want to speculate, this isn't a 2 hour movie, I want to know what happened, especially in a series like Mass Effect, where they try to rationalize EVERYTHING.  This is a conclusion, where all my questions were advertised to be answered, not give me more questions.

I got good news for you!

blog.bioware.com/2012/04/05/mass-effect-3-extended-cut/

haha... I'd be really happy if it did resolve all my issues, but it's not.  They said they would add cutscenes which I doubt will address every question I have. Example... why does my Shep bend over and take it in the a** from the starchild without questioning it?  My shep would never do that, and yet... clearly did.

There will most likely be dialogue too. I'm sure they're still in the planning phases and are looking to literally eliminate any potential arguments with this additional content.

Man it'd be great if this is true, but I am not counting on it (maybe that'll be to my benefit: expect the worst, won't be dissappointed! )

[shepskisaac]

The Angry One wrote...

Before somebody rushes in and claims "LOL he'd be harassed by evil retakers!" take a look at the Patrick Weekes threads for a minute. BioWare devs who actually stop and say something to us for one minute get all the respect in the world.

No. He didn't stop at BSN to tell 'us' something. Nor on Twitter. He told it to a fan on PAX who spread it on the net (without Patrick's knowledge). But people immediately crowned him as the "Robin Hood" of the ME3 endings drama. Just as you guys did earlier with this "Drew would've saved it!". Drew himself made fun of such reasoning, reminding people that Star Wars fans were very unhappy with his ending to Revan novel thus no one should scrutinize people responsible for the current ME3 ending on the assumption that "Drew would surely made it amazing!". You and other people are just looking for scapegoats and heros. Childish reasoning just to reassue yourself in your opinion. This witchhunt and dividing ME3 dev team into "good fan-loving" devs and "bad evil" devs only causes more problems. Seriosly, have you seen what kind of stuff is being tweeted to Casey or Mac? twitter.com/#!/search/realtime/MacWaltersLives, twitter.com/#!/search/realtime/%40CaseyDHudson Check yourself, then ask yourself why aren't they tweeting anymore

Modifié par IsaacShep, 09 avril 2012 - 08:20 .

[felipejiraya]

The Angry One wrote...

Or, Hudson could stop using the PR machine and talk with us on the level.

Before somebody rushes in and claims "LOL he'd be harassed by evil retakers!" take a look at the Patrick Weekes threads for a minute. BioWare devs who actually stop and say something to us for one minute get all the respect in the world.

I fully agree with this.

[AxisEvolve]

IsaacShep wrote... 
Seriosly, have you seen what kind of stuff is being tweeted to Casey or Mac? 

4chan trolls that are not reflective of anyone that posts here.

Every famous person has trolls belittle them on Twitter. They need to grow a thicker skin. This is the life they chose, for good and for bad.

[shepskisaac]

AxisEvolve wrote...

4chan trolls that are not reflective of anyone that posts here.

Except that there were personal insults regarding some devs here on BSN as well, threads calling Casey to resign, fans demanding heads etc.

[j78]

IsaacShep wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

Before somebody rushes in and claims "LOL he'd be harassed by evil retakers!" take a look at the Patrick Weekes threads for a minute. BioWare devs who actually stop and say something to us for one minute get all the respect in the world.

No. He didn't stop at BSN to tell 'us' something. Nor on Twitter. He told it to a fan on PAX who spread it on the net (without Patrick's knowledge). But people immediately crowned him as the "Robin Hood" of the ME3 endings drama. Just as you guys did earlier with this "Drew would've saved it!". Drew himself made fun of such reasoning, reminding people that Star Wars fans were very unhappy with his ending to Revan novel thus no one should scrutinize people responsible for the current ME3 ending on the assumption that "Drew would surely made it amazing!". You and other people are just looking for scapegoats and heros. Childish reasoning just to reassue yourself in your opinion. This witchhunt and dividing ME3 dev team into "good fan-loving" devs and "bad evil" devs only causes more problems. Seriosly, have you seen what kind of stuff is being tweeted to Casey or Mac? twitter.com/#!/search/realtime/MacWaltersLives, twitter.com/#!/search/realtime/%40CaseyDHudson Check yourself, then ask yourself why aren't they tweeting anymore

It controlled Tim and it could’ve of just had Saren come upstairs or indoctrinate any number of beings to insure the cycle would continue . I think it boils down to the fact we all Know form the app that Casey and Mac went of on their own and came up with this ending when the rest of the game was a joint effort and it shows.
Originally, with the Catalyst, the Star Child at the end of the game, I had written that much more in the guise of a investigative style conversation, where there is something he tells you but then, you get to ask a bunch of questions and you get your questions answered. But then me and Casey talked and decided, let's keep the conversation high level, give you the details that you need to know, but don't get into the stuff that you don't need to know. Like 'How long have they been reaping?'. You don't need to know the answers to the Mass Effect universe, so we intentionally left those out."

[The Angry One]

Topsider wrote...

"Objective truth" is a fancy way of saying My Opinion. Please, give it a rest, you're making a fool of yourself.

I have explained why it is so, it's not my fault that you jump to conclusions.

[Kanon777]

AxisEvolve wrote...

IsaacShep wrote... 
Seriosly, have you seen what kind of stuff is being tweeted to Casey or Mac? 

4chan trolls that are not reflective of anyone that posts here.

Actually given the fact that this forums are moderated and only those with official copies can post, i would say Twitter/Metacritic is a much better referential to the madness the people in this comunity can sink to...

[Oakenshield1]

Just make it so that he can never have a word processor on his computer ever and we'll be ok.

[The Angry One]

IsaacShep wrote...
No. He didn't stop at BSN to tell 'us' something. Nor on Twitter. He told it to a fan on PAX who spread it on the net (without Patrick's knowledge).

Which is more than Hudson has done.
Also.. really.. without his knowledge? In this day and age, anything anyone says can end up on the internet.

But people immediately crowned him as the "Robin Hood" of the ME3 endings drama. Just as you guys did earlier with this "Drew would've saved it!". Drew himself made fun of such reasoning, reminding people that Star Wars fans were very unhappy with his ending to Revan novel thus no one should scrutinize people responsible for the current ME3 ending on the assumption that "Drew would surely made it amazing!". You and other people are just looking for scapegoats and heros. Childish reasoning just to reassue yourself in your opinion. This witchhunt and dividing ME3 dev team into "good fan-loving" devs and "bad evil" devs only causes more problems. Seriosly, have you seen what kind of stuff is being tweeted to Casey or Mac? twitter.com/#!/search/realtime/MacWaltersLives, twitter.com/#!/search/realtime/%40CaseyDHudson Check yourself, then ask yourself why aren't they tweeting anymore

This is not Twitter. Twitter is full of tosspots.
Why can't Hudson give us a few non-PR approved words on his company's own forums exactly?
Get the mod squad with the banhammers ready just in case some people get out of hand, I don't care.

You say Casey deserves the benefit of the doubt? So do we.

[Dridengx]

Topsider wrote...

"Objective truth" is a fancy way of saying My Opinion. Please, give it a rest, you're making a fool of yourself.

That's a daily occurance though

[AxisEvolve]

IsaacShep wrote...

AxisEvolve wrote...

4chan trolls that are not reflective of anyone that posts here.

Except that there were personal insults regarding some devs here on BSN as well, threads calling Casey to resign, fans demanding heads etc.

There are extremists on both sides of the argument. Trying to present a few bad apples as the face of the Anti-ending crowd isn't accurate or fair.

Whenever someone goes to great depths to personally insult a developer on here, that person is jumped on right away by everyone. Pro-Enders and Anti-Enders alike. You know this is true. 

The difference is that people who dislike the ending simply ignore these stupid people but the pro-enders perpetuate it by using the troll posts as constant ammunition.

What's really dividing the community isn't the negative feedback for Bioware, but the intolerance for those that want to do leave honest feedback.

There are borderline militant supporters of Bioware who go around attacking fans that voice any disapproval for the ending. I click on the profiles of these people and 100% of their posts are railing against people for having an opinion that goes against their own.

It disgusts me.