21 réponses à ce sujet

[Snuke7]

I can't quite understand what each means and their relationship to each other.  I'm assuming Arl is second to a King, like a Lord, but can't be sure.  I can't seem to get the info out of the codex.

Anyone?

[J.O.G]

King=King, Teyrn=Duke, Arl=Earl, Bann=Baron

[Aldandil]

A Bann is the lord of an area, allowed to tax the population in exchange for population and all that. A Teyrn rules over a group of Banns in a certain area, and settles disputes and so on and so forth. An Arl is the commander of a strategically important fortress, such as Redcliffe, which often involves having a settlement under his protection as well, but that right comes from the King, not the consent of the common people (which differs from the Banns, who are sort of responsible for their actions in front of their subjects).



I'm sure you'll have a more exact explanation soon, but here it is in a few lines...

[Snuke7]

Thanks, guys. Makes more sense now.



So Arl is really a military position rather than royalty?

[Bibdy]

I think its just a hierarchy. Bann (Baron) -> Arl (Earl/count) -> Teryn (Duke) -> King.

[Taritu]

Aldandill has it right. Bann is lord of an area. Arl is military commander of an important fortress. Teyrn is someone who has the fealty of many Bann's. Note that Ferelden's nobility rule because of the consent of those below them. If enough people decide not to report to a Bann, he's not a Bann, and a Teyrn is a Teyrn because lots of Bann's want to support him. In principle, the Kingship operates the same way. Tradition seems to mean you have to be a real bumbler to be kicked out of your position, but it is possible.

One other point, there are only two Teyrns in all of Ferelden. Loghain and Teyrn Cousland. A child of Teyrn Coulsand is one of the highest nobles in the entire country.

Modifié par Taritu, 05 décembre 2009 - 09:08 .

[Sloth Of Doom]

No an Arl is equivalent to an Earl, which is a title of nobility not a military rank.. An Earl is a British nobleman next in rank above a viscount and below a marquis, corresponding to a count in continental Europe.

A brief history: http://www.britannic.../Englands-earls

Of course, DA isn't Europe, but Fereldan's similarities to England cannot be ignored. The similarly named ranks and responsibilities are quite obvious.

Modifié par Sloth Of Doom, 05 décembre 2009 - 09:12 .

[Jsmith0730]

 I wonder if any Bards in Ferelden ever wrote a song called Teyrn of Arl... 

[J.O.G]

A bann/baron is the lowest rank of inherited nobility, ruling over a few subjects. A feudal landholder usually ruling over a town or countryside, technically a glorified mayor.

A teyrn is like a duke, who gives the baronies in fief resp. to whom barons sworn oaths of fealthy. Among the ranks of those people rise the kings. Queen Elizabeth II of England is actually also the Duke of Lancaster.

An arl / earl / count is like a royal governor, ruling over a feudal state within a kingdom (a count-ry) Like the duke he answers only to the King, but he has no other nobles in fealty.

Modifié par J.O.G, 05 décembre 2009 - 09:50 .

[Sloth Of Doom]

Jsmith0730 wrote...

 I wonder if any Bards in Ferelden ever wrote a song called Teyrn of Arl... 

Oddly enough I thought the same thing when i was replying earier. 

Interesting DA trivia:  Orlais was originally going to be called Arles (which is pronounced Ar-lay), until someone pointed out that there is a region of france called Arles (pronounced Arl).

Maybe if Ferelden took over Orlais there could be a 'Teyrn of Arles"

Modifié par Sloth Of Doom, 05 décembre 2009 - 10:14 .

[Faerell Gustani]

They explain this at some point.



From the ground up.

Freeholders - any land owners. Peasantry can own land, though all nobles own land.

Bann - a Noble that own some territory.

Arl - a Noble who's territory consists of a strategic location. In other words, a Bann with a fortress.

Teyrn - an Arl who has the obligations/oaths/fealty/authority to call/demand another noble to aid them in battle. Teyrns are the only ones (aside from the king) able to legally marshal an army. An Arl can request, but a Teyrn can demand.

King - lord of the entire kingdom. Ferelden used to be a bunch of Teyrns warring with one another. Denerim used to just be a Teyrnier, not an Arling. When the Denerim became named the capitol and the king resided there, they decided that a king commands all of Ferelden and since the lord of Denerim swore fealty to the King, he was no longer a Teyrn and instead an Arl.

[J.O.G]

Actually "Teyrn" is Welsh for souvereign / king...

[Tzupi88]

I was wondering this same thing the other day and the wiki cleared a lot for me:



http://dragonage.wik.../wiki/Fereldans (under Politics)

[valex-jedi]

Faerell Gustani wrote...

Bann - a Noble that own some territory.
Arl - a Noble who's territory consists of a strategic location. In other words, a Bann with a fortress.

Then how come Redcliffe  have both Bann and Arl?

[Ashaman X]

valex-jedi wrote...

Faerell Gustani wrote...

Bann - a Noble that own some territory.
Arl - a Noble who's territory consists of a strategic location. In other words, a Bann with a fortress.

Then how come Redcliffe  have both Bann and Arl?

It doesn't. Eamon is the Arl of Redcliffe, while his brother Teagan is Bann of Rainesfere, a small Bann close to Redcliffe I think. Depending on how you play the game, Teagan can become Arl of Redcliffe eventually. 

[Gipp3r]

does Arls only answer to the king, or do they also answer to a Teyrn if, the arling is situated inside a Teyrnir.

I'm thinking of how Howe seem to answer to Bryce Cousland as if he is of higher rank Howe

[Beaner28]

There's a codex entry Fereldan Politics that explains this quite nicely. One place you can get it for 50 xp is in Fergus' room in the Human Noble origin or in the Market District in Denerim.

[Marvin_Arnold]

Gipp3r wrote...

does Arls only answer to the king, or do they also answer to a Teyrn if, the arling is situated inside a Teyrnir.
I'm thinking of how Howe seem to answer to Bryce Cousland as if he is of higher rank Howe

No, like a dukedom, a Teynir is a separate territory as well as an Arling is a separate territory. Like different states.

All nobility was originally Banns, then some Banns rose as war leaders, became Teyrns and appointed Arls, who were Banns with a fortress. The Teyrns had Banns swear fealty to them, but didn't rule over their lands (as the Teynirs are seprarate from Arlings etc.)
Teyrns are, nevertheless, of higher rank than an Arl or a Bann. (There are only two Teyrns, afaik, Highever (Cousland) and Gwaren (Mac Tir), whereas there are five Arls and a lot more Banns.)

As someone said, Teyrn = Duke, Arl = Earl (or Count), and Bann = Baron. More or less, but you get the idea.

[Cromeman]

That sheds some light, yes

I already figured the structure, but didn't get the background. Alas, I should be reading more codex entries...



Is there any proof out there that these Titles were used back in the centuries? J.O.G. mentioned a welsh usage.

[Faelix_Majere]

If Teyrns are so close to the throne, and there's just you of the Couslands, and Mac Tir as the sole other, it makes me wonder why you can't try and place yourself on the throne at the landsmeet.



For all intent and purposes, the Queen is so by marriage into the bloodline, and Alistair is outside of marriage.



Spoiler: If Loghain is actually plotting killing the Queen to blame the Wardens, and strengthen his position, his plan must surely be to put himself on the throne. But in that situation you would have as much right to it as he has.

[Cromeman]

I get your point, but don't forget that Wardens 'normally' have no titles or right to the throne..



There is only one option to get the throne yourself (as a Cousland)... but there is.



Although I don't think Loghain Mac Tir would not dare to kill his own daughter... She's family after all...

[yaw]

Faelix_Majere wrote...

If Teyrns are so close to the throne, and there's just you of the Couslands, and Mac Tir as the sole other, it makes me wonder why you can't try and place yourself on the throne at the landsmeet.<br />
<br />
For all intent and purposes, the Queen is so by marriage into the bloodline, and Alistair is outside of marriage.<br />
<br />
Spoiler: If Loghain is actually plotting killing the Queen to blame the Wardens, and strengthen his position, his plan must surely be to put himself on the throne. But in that situation you would have as much right to it as he has.

You probably just wouldn't be supported.
Anora is well-loved. Alistair is a direct desendant. If Loghain did end up killing his daughter (and subsequently blaming it on you, and pretty much destroying support for you) then he simply would have no opposition to stop him from taking the crown.

While a Cousland warden could in theory go for the throne him/herself, there would have to be no Alistair and no Anora opposing them, and you'd have to have more support than Loghain. And if Anora was killed and the blame passed onto you, then you wouldn't have that support.

Modifié par yaw, 01 juin 2011 - 01:52 .