713 réponses à ce sujet

[Sangheili_1337]

The outrage expressed after a new game is released is usually created by a vocal minority. In ME 3's case it is by the majority. Big difference.

[AngryFrozenWater]

fchopin wrote...

It’s not a case of understanding, i would love for the Geth to survive and i am sure some will whatever the star child says but i would be prepared to sacrifice Earth if it was necessary to kill the reapers as we would still survive with other Earth colonists.

It is a case of understanding. The reapers are built for a reason. Sovereign was vague about that, but Star Child is very clear. The reapers are created to prevent the synthetic rebellion. Well... Thanks, but this time your services are not required. Besides, your genocidal attitude must, for various reasons (the preservation of my own existence being one), not be tolerated. We are doing fine without you. Please self destruct, leave anyone else alive and everything else intact. Bye. Something along those lines. A simple forth option. Doesn't even require colored explosions. Not perfect, but it would have made more sense than the existing 3, because those are solutions to a non-existent problem and thus are irrational.

Modifié par AngryFrozenWater, 10 avril 2012 - 10:15 .

[Dannybare]

I would say the DA2 and ME3 hate are different. DA2 hate come from it being a rushed out game that changed the good things from the first one while ME3 hates comes from the majority of the game being excellent while the last 10 minutes of the game seem to be written by a completely different person.

[Newnation]

I guess its a fad. I remember a lot of people ****ing about ME 2 (I want to use my old squad, I hate the thermal clip concept and they should go back to the way weapons were used in ME 1, The game isn't long enough, I don't like Jacob..etc.). Now  a lot of those same people that ****ed about ME 2 now started to praise it before and after the release of ME 3. Excuse me if I don't take the majority of people on bsn seriously. Especially after seeing a lot of the threads threatning Bioware staff and just the sheer number of threads devoted to ****ing.

Its kind of like wrestling. The fans praise someone with talent but when some new star comes up or they switch companies a lot of the fans turn on them.

[Stanley Woo]

People got angry when NWN came out and it wasn't BG.
People got angry when KotOR came out because it was a console game.
People got angry when Jade Empire came out because it was a different setting, and it was an action RPG.
People got angry when Mass Effect came out because it was a shooter.
People got angry when Dragon Age: Origins came out because it wasn't BG.
People got angry when DA2 came out because it wasn't DAO.
People got angry when ME2 came out because it wasn't ME1.
And now people are angry at ME3.

The cycle will continue as long as people feel they have an inalienable right to never be disappointed, or that their money entitles them to be rude or condescending to others, or that their opinions are the only, best, or right ones.

[Nyctyris]

That depends what you mean by fanrage.

Aside from the recycled maps in DA2 I had no complaints for any of the games Stanley listed, and NO rage. I don't even have rage for ME3, just came to look on the forums because I genuinely thought I'd missed the point or played the game wrong somehow. Disagreeing isn't the same as rage or disappointment, though. 

People can't help having opinions, a reaction is just that: a reaction. It's a fair complaint to say that some, or even a lot, of people express those opinions in an objectionable or inconsiderate way, but if you (mods/devs/companies) don't want any negative feedback at all then why bother hosting a forum =( those kinds of things go hand in hand.

Modifié par Nyctyris, 10 avril 2012 - 10:57 .

[themastakillah]

Stanley Woo wrote...

People got angry when NWN came out and it wasn't BG.
People got angry when KotOR came out because it was a console game.
People got angry when Jade Empire came out because it was a different setting, and it was an action RPG.
People got angry when Mass Effect came out because it was a shooter.
People got angry when Dragon Age: Origins came out because it wasn't BG.
People got angry when DA2 came out because it wasn't DAO.
People got angry when ME2 came out because it wasn't ME1.
And now people are angry at ME3.

The cycle will continue as long as people feel they have an inalienable right to never be disappointed, or that their money entitles them to be rude or condescending to others, or that their opinions are the only, best, or right ones.

maybe ure right, people do expect too much from ur games(that should be a compliment), but defending DA2 and ME3 its too much, even for a bioware employee...

Modifié par themastakillah, 10 avril 2012 - 10:53 .

[bluewolv1970]

Stanley Woo wrote...

People got angry when NWN came out and it wasn't BG.
People got angry when KotOR came out because it was a console game.
People got angry when Jade Empire came out because it was a different setting, and it was an action RPG.
People got angry when Mass Effect came out because it was a shooter.
People got angry when Dragon Age: Origins came out because it wasn't BG.
People got angry when DA2 came out because it wasn't DAO.
People got angry when ME2 came out because it wasn't ME1.
And now people are angry at ME3.

The cycle will continue as long as people feel they have an inalienable right to never be disappointed, or that their money entitles them to be rude or condescending to others, or that their opinions are the only, best, or right ones.

thanks - maybe you could contribute something productive like if there actually is going to be an xbox 360 patch or why their was a face import issue to begin with, since you know, you are in QA and all...

[Daedalus1773]

Stanley Woo wrote...

People got angry when NWN came out and it wasn't BG.
People got angry when KotOR came out because it was a console game.
People got angry when Jade Empire came out because it was a different setting, and it was an action RPG.
People got angry when Mass Effect came out because it was a shooter.
People got angry when Dragon Age: Origins came out because it wasn't BG.
People got angry when DA2 came out because it wasn't DAO.
People got angry when ME2 came out because it wasn't ME1.
And now people are angry at ME3.

The cycle will continue as long as people feel they have an inalienable right to never be disappointed, or that their money entitles them to be rude or condescending to others, or that their opinions are the only, best, or right ones.

Just like this! ^

edit: And for the record, I haven't been angry or posted on the BSN about any of the previous games you mention here (played all of them except Jade Empire). Disappointed in DA2, but not angry.  But hey, thanks for marginalizing my opinions & concerns!

Modifié par Daedalus1773, 10 avril 2012 - 11:03 .

[mattahraw]

Stanley Woo wrote...

People got angry when Jade Empire came out because it was a different setting, and it was an action RPG.

Those people are silly and Jade Empire is amazing.

[Udalango]

Complaining about complaints is unproductive.

End of line.

[Daedalus1773]

Udalango wrote...

Complaining about complaints is unproductive.

End of line.

Snap!

[Foryou]

Stanley Woo wrote...

People got angry when NWN came out and it wasn't BG.
People got angry when KotOR came out because it was a console game.
People got angry when Jade Empire came out because it was a different setting, and it was an action RPG.
People got angry when Mass Effect came out because it was a shooter.
People got angry when Dragon Age: Origins came out because it wasn't BG.
People got angry when DA2 came out because it wasn't DAO.
People got angry when ME2 came out because it wasn't ME1.
And now people are angry at ME3.

The cycle will continue as long as people feel they have an inalienable right to never be disappointed, or that their money entitles them to be rude or condescending to others, or that their opinions are the only, best, or right ones.

I support this. SO MAN UP EVERYONE AND MOVE ON

[camirish1]

Stanley Woo wrote...

People got angry when NWN came out and it wasn't BG.
People got angry when KotOR came out because it was a console game.
People got angry when Jade Empire came out because it was a different setting, and it was an action RPG.
People got angry when Mass Effect came out because it was a shooter.
People got angry when Dragon Age: Origins came out because it wasn't BG.
People got angry when DA2 came out because it wasn't DAO.
People got angry when ME2 came out because it wasn't ME1.
And now people are angry at ME3.

The cycle will continue as long as people feel they have an inalienable right to never be disappointed, or that their money entitles them to be rude or condescending to others, or that their opinions are the only, best, or right ones.

I think you should account for volume when making a claim like this. 
True, people will always moan about something, but I think in the case of ME3, the volume of angry fans about one particular part is unprecedented. 
And not everyone that is against the ending is rude or condescending.

[FlamingBoy]

Stanley Woo wrote...

People got angry when NWN came out and it wasn't BG.
People got angry when KotOR came out because it was a console game.
People got angry when Jade Empire came out because it was a different setting, and it was an action RPG.
People got angry when Mass Effect came out because it was a shooter.
People got angry when Dragon Age: Origins came out because it wasn't BG.
People got angry when DA2 came out because it wasn't DAO.
People got angry when ME2 came out because it wasn't ME1.
And now people are angry at ME3.

The cycle will continue as long as people feel they have an inalienable right to never be disappointed, or that their money entitles them to be rude or condescending to others, or that their opinions are the only, best, or right ones.

all do respect
people complain about DA2 because it was a broken mess
as for mass effect 3 its problems are on the same line as da2 but to a lesser extent

[Udalango]

Daedalus1773 wrote...

Udalango wrote...

Complaining about complaints is unproductive.

End of line.

Snap!

Stanleys words.  Seemed oddly appropriate  But he deemed this complaint thread ok somehow

[Cobra5]

Stanley Woo wrote...

People got angry when NWN came out and it wasn't BG.
People got angry when KotOR came out because it was a console game.
People got angry when Jade Empire came out because it was a different setting, and it was an action RPG.
People got angry when Mass Effect came out because it was a shooter.
People got angry when Dragon Age: Origins came out because it wasn't BG.
People got angry when DA2 came out because it wasn't DAO.
People got angry when ME2 came out because it wasn't ME1.
And now people are angry at ME3.

The cycle will continue as long as people feel they have an inalienable right to never be disappointed, or that their money entitles them to be rude or condescending to others, or that their opinions are the only, best, or right ones.

No! It can't be eternal! We just need a hero to unite the forums together despite their differences and break the cycle down.

[TheKristoffski]

Well i for one am not complaining, granted i was upset about ME3's ending maybe even a little dissapointet, but i dont waste my time, shouting and throwing hateful speech at bioware, or its employers, because I have better things to do in my life....like play video games and fantasise about kaidan, anders, merril and liara too name a few (trust me the list could go on;)

[julio77777]

People got angry at DA2 because it felt rushed (and it was) and oversimplified.

People are angry at ME3 because of the ending, however most of them recognize it's a great game otherwise.

I kinda agree, in a perfect world you shouldn't get angry, but in most cases it's the only way to be heard. Of course nothing excuses rudeness, but actually very few of those who complain are actually rude.

[Stanley Woo]

camirish1 wrote...

I think you should account for volume when making a claim like this. 
True, people will always moan about something, but I think in the case of ME3, the volume of angry fans about one particular part is unprecedented.

Of course it's unprecedented. Just as when you're growing, each time you grow an inch, your height is unprecedented. We got a ton more people in our community when ME3 was coming up to release. It was only natural that more people would participate in the forums after they got the game.

That doesn't excuse the rudeness, name-calling, insults, accusations and conspiracy theories, though.

And not everyone that is against the ending is rude or condescending.

True, which is why I'm still around and still participating in discussions.But everyone agreed to follow the same rules. Many people can follow those rules withotu any difficulty whatsoever. Some, however, can't.

[Daedalus1773]

Udalango wrote...

Daedalus1773 wrote...

Udalango wrote...

Complaining about complaints is unproductive.

End of line.

Snap!

Stanleys words.  Seemed oddly appropriate  But he deemed this complaint thread ok somehow

Oh I agree. I thought it was awesome to watch a mod complain about complaints, and word it in a rude & condescending manner while making the case that the cycle of criticism exists because of people being rude & condescending.

Yay irony.

[Sabrestrikealpha]

Stanley Woo wrote...

People got angry when NWN came out and it wasn't BG.
People got angry when KotOR came out because it was a console game.
People got angry when Jade Empire came out because it was a different setting, and it was an action RPG.
People got angry when Mass Effect came out because it was a shooter.
People got angry when Dragon Age: Origins came out because it wasn't BG.
People got angry when DA2 came out because it wasn't DAO.
People got angry when ME2 came out because it wasn't ME1.
And now people are angry at ME3.

The cycle will continue as long as people feel they have an inalienable right to never be disappointed, or that their money entitles them to be rude or condescending to others, or that their opinions are the only, best, or right ones.

I think this is true, but only up to a point. I think the logic of it, at least as it applies to BioWare, breaks down at the "DA2 wasn't DAO" stage. Yes, people are often upset merely because things change. Yes, that is irrational and often not based on looking at the objective quality of the new product.

In the case of DAO --> DA2 and now ME2--> ME3 however, I think there is some justification for the rage based on the fact that there are elements in the newer games that just aren't as good as the previous ones. For example, I didn't actually mind the change in combat style from DAO-->DA2. Complaining about that would have been an example of complaining about change just because it changed. However, there were also the issues of re-used environments, lack of character customization, and a story/characters that was mostly disappointing. Compared to those same elements in DAO, DA2 was not as good.

The same thing applies to ME3. Wholly aside from the ending, there are bits of that game that just are not as good as ME1 or ME2. The quest log is hard to use and unhelpful, the lack of film grain removes a signature visual element of the series, the planet scanning is even more obnoxious than it was in ME2, there are fewer hub worlds, and side-quests are collected in the same uncomfortable stalker-y manner that didn't work in DA2.

[Sherbet Lemon]

Stanley Woo wrote...

The cycle will continue as long as people feel they have an inalienable right to never be disappointed, or that their money entitles them to be rude or condescending to others, or that their opinions are the only, best, or right ones.

Agreed.  

The BSN is hardly the first time I've seen fan outrage or fandom meltdowns and it will not be the last.  This is the very embodiment of what it means to be fan  who wishes to be wholly involved with something to that point that we involve ourselves in every way shape or form that we possibly can be.  Social media has made this even more pronounced and due to the hyperimmediacy of the internet we have a new culture, a culture of convergence.

The term, participatory culture, is intended to contrast witholder notions of media spectatorship. In this emerging media system, what might traditionally be understood as media producers and consumers are transformedinto participants who are expected to interact with each other according to a new set of rules which none of us fully understands. Convergence does not occurthrough media appliances - however sophisticated they may become. Convergence occurs within the brains of individual consumers. Yet, each of us constructs
our own personal mythology from bits and fragments of information we have extracted from the ongoing flow of media around us and transformed into resourcesthrough which we make sense of our everyday livese net.

Fanfiction, fanart, forum postings and interactions between developers and consumers make up this evolving form of communication.  There are some very positive benefits and opportunities for exchange between the producers and conusmers of media.  There are also some incredibly horrifying side effects (i.e. the abuse of Jennifer Hepler, the abuse of many Bioware employees on this forum and also via twitter).  My hope is that fans will eventually learn to find some equilibrium.  

EDIT: Format fail. >.<

Modifié par Village Idiot, 10 avril 2012 - 11:24 .

[blacqout]

I think that BioWare are trying to take their games in a new direction, and not all fans are willing to evolve with them. Much of the complaints against ME2 and DAII were about how "dumbed down" the RPG elements were.

Similar criticisms can be made about ME3, though obviously the ending is getting all the attention.

Personally i really like the striped back / simplified approach to traditional RPG elements.

[MidgardSerpentZ]

bluewolv1970 wrote...

Stanley Woo wrote...

People got angry when NWN came out and it wasn't BG.
People got angry when KotOR came out because it was a console game.
People got angry when Jade Empire came out because it was a different setting, and it was an action RPG.
People got angry when Mass Effect came out because it was a shooter.
People got angry when Dragon Age: Origins came out because it wasn't BG.
People got angry when DA2 came out because it wasn't DAO.
People got angry when ME2 came out because it wasn't ME1.
And now people are angry at ME3.

The cycle will continue as long as people feel they have an inalienable right to never be disappointed, or that their money entitles them to be rude or condescending to others, or that their opinions are the only, best, or right ones.

thanks - maybe you could contribute something productive like if there actually is going to be an xbox 360 patch or why their was a face import issue to begin with, since you know, you are in QA and all...

And then you come in and exactly prove his point.