140 réponses à ce sujet

[liggy002]

Dendio1 wrote...

Redoing the endings would probably take longer than a few months. Clarification is probably the only reasonable option at this point

Unless they've been working on it longer than we know.  Clarification and nothing else is the stupidest thing they can do and the easiest route they can take.  You see how that works?  In this case, the easiest route is the dumbest one.  Offering gameplay and going with IT is the best thing they can do.  People would love them for it.  Most people anyway.

Modifié par liggy002, 10 avril 2012 - 07:49 .

[oblique9]

liggy002 wrote...

Dendio1 wrote...

Redoing the endings would probably take longer than a few months. Clarification is probably the only reasonable option at this point

Unless they've been working on it longer than we know.  Clarification and nothing else is the stupidest thing they can do and the easiest route they can take.  You see how that works?  In this case, the easiest route is the dumbest one.  Offering gameplay and going with IT is the best thing they can do.  People would love them for it.  Most people anyway.

I'd buy them all weed for a year. Not that I advocate such behavior.

But srsly, if they pull this off... And the 'real' ending is actually good... holy crap will they win the internets for a cycle.

[devSin]

This is not what Mike Gamble was alluding to.

Fact is, he has butter brain, and sometimes things come out of it before being checked if they make sense. See the comment at PAX, where he said the extended cut couldn't be on the disc, because they didn't know there'd be demand for it. (What he meant to say was that they didn't know it'd need to be created, because they didn't know the ending would be such a big failure, and they never intended to create it.)

Mike's message means that the extended cut is something that will make you want to hold on to your copy of the game forever (don't disappoint me, Mike, please). But the stuff he was talking about on March 8 has yet to be revealed, and he still seems to think you might like it.

Modifié par devSin, 10 avril 2012 - 07:55 .

[DGuyton]

I think this is all to keep people off balance. "Oh BOY! Just wait you guys, we'll show how awesome we are and how our ending makes TOTAL sense and then you fans that tried to get a new ending are going to feel so guilty for all the bad things you've said!" It's all smoke and mirrors. That's why nothing concrete is being said.

Even if it isn't, even if the ending is still horrible with the clarification, though, it's all we're getting. This is Bioware's 'apology' rather they planned it that way or not. Once the DLC is out they can say that they made a new ending or whatever and spin it that way in the media and come out smelling like roses while the media crucifies anyone who continues to lobby for a better ending.

Modifié par DGuyton, 10 avril 2012 - 08:06 .

[oblique9]

DGuyton wrote...

I think this is all to keep people off balance. "Oh BOY! Just wait you guys, we'll show how awesome we are and how our ending makes TOTAL sense and then you fans that tried to get a new ending are going to feel so guilty for all the bad things you've said!" It's all smoke and mirrors. That's why nothing concrete is being said.

Perhaps.

But their PR/PAX statements aside, there are things from the game alone that make it hard to believe that the ending was just so terribad that it MADE me think there was more coming.

This is either going to be a hard win or a hard fail for Bioware. If the ending DLC doesn't give what fans have been asking for, it will be the last straw and the Biowares digital galaxy will plundge into the dark ages, fans will riot the boards and EA will have a new mess.

On the other hand, if they pull an IT, they might have the opposite reaction... But it's been so long now, I feel like no matter what more harm than good has come of this whole debacle. 

[DGuyton]

oblique9 wrote...

DGuyton wrote...

I think this is all to keep people off balance. "Oh BOY! Just wait you guys, we'll show how awesome we are and how our ending makes TOTAL sense and then you fans that tried to get a new ending are going to feel so guilty for all the bad things you've said!" It's all smoke and mirrors. That's why nothing concrete is being said.

Perhaps.

But their PR/PAX statements aside, there are things from the game alone that make it hard to believe that the ending was just so terribad that it MADE me think there was more coming.

This is either going to be a hard win or a hard fail for Bioware. If the ending DLC doesn't give what fans have been asking for, it will be the last straw and the Biowares digital galaxy will plundge into the dark ages, fans will riot the boards and EA will have a new mess.

On the other hand, if they pull an IT, they might have the opposite reaction... But it's been so long now, I feel like no matter what more harm than good has come of this whole debacle. 

The thing that makes me not believe that they're intending to give us what we want or that they were working on all of this for a long time is the simple fact that they didn't just come out and say 'Wait, guys, it's not over!' when the complaints and rage kept flying.

If they had a huge clarification DLC in the works, they would have just said, 'Shepard's story isn't over yet! We're glad you guys are all fired up about this and you're going to love some of the stuff in store!'

Instead, this makes me think that they had a ton of stuff on the cutting room floor or whatnot and when the hate for their 'Artistic' ending began, and got media attention they went 'Uh-oh! We can't give these guys an actual new ending, let's cobble some stuff together and call it a day!'

Modifié par DGuyton, 10 avril 2012 - 08:11 .

[oblique9]

DGuyton wrote...

oblique9 wrote...

DGuyton wrote...

I think this is all to keep people off balance. "Oh BOY! Just wait you guys, we'll show how awesome we are and how our ending makes TOTAL sense and then you fans that tried to get a new ending are going to feel so guilty for all the bad things you've said!" It's all smoke and mirrors. That's why nothing concrete is being said.

Perhaps.

But their PR/PAX statements aside, there are things from the game alone that make it hard to believe that the ending was just so terribad that it MADE me think there was more coming.

This is either going to be a hard win or a hard fail for Bioware. If the ending DLC doesn't give what fans have been asking for, it will be the last straw and the Biowares digital galaxy will plundge into the dark ages, fans will riot the boards and EA will have a new mess.

On the other hand, if they pull an IT, they might have the opposite reaction... But it's been so long now, I feel like no matter what more harm than good has come of this whole debacle. 

The thing that makes me not believe that they're intending to give us what we want or that they were working on all of this for a long time is the simple fact that they didn't just come out and say 'Wait, guys, it's not over!' when the complaints and rage kept flying.

If they had a huge clarification DLC in the works, they would have just said, 'Shepard's story isn't over yet! We're glad you guys are all fired up about this and you're going to love some of the stuff in store!'

Instead, this makes me think that they had a ton of stuff on the cutting room floor or whatnot and when the hate for their 'Artistic' ending began, and got media attention they went 'Uh-oh! We can't give these guys an actual new ending, let's cobble some stuff together and call it a day!'

Yea, you're probably right. Well, I go to bed to(day) with my dreams crushed yet again.

[DGuyton]

oblique9 wrote...

DGuyton wrote...

oblique9 wrote...

DGuyton wrote...

I think this is all to keep people off balance. "Oh BOY! Just wait you guys, we'll show how awesome we are and how our ending makes TOTAL sense and then you fans that tried to get a new ending are going to feel so guilty for all the bad things you've said!" It's all smoke and mirrors. That's why nothing concrete is being said.

Perhaps.

But their PR/PAX statements aside, there are things from the game alone that make it hard to believe that the ending was just so terribad that it MADE me think there was more coming.

This is either going to be a hard win or a hard fail for Bioware. If the ending DLC doesn't give what fans have been asking for, it will be the last straw and the Biowares digital galaxy will plundge into the dark ages, fans will riot the boards and EA will have a new mess.

On the other hand, if they pull an IT, they might have the opposite reaction... But it's been so long now, I feel like no matter what more harm than good has come of this whole debacle. 

The thing that makes me not believe that they're intending to give us what we want or that they were working on all of this for a long time is the simple fact that they didn't just come out and say 'Wait, guys, it's not over!' when the complaints and rage kept flying.

If they had a huge clarification DLC in the works, they would have just said, 'Shepard's story isn't over yet! We're glad you guys are all fired up about this and you're going to love some of the stuff in store!'

Instead, this makes me think that they had a ton of stuff on the cutting room floor or whatnot and when the hate for their 'Artistic' ending began, and got media attention they went 'Uh-oh! We can't give these guys an actual new ending, let's cobble some stuff together and call it a day!'

Yea, you're probably right. Well, I go to bed to(day) with my dreams crushed yet again.

Sorry, I hate to do something like that. For your sake, I hope I'm completely wrong. I just don't have any trust left for this company is all.

[M Hedonist]

By this point it would be a big suprise if IT turns out to be true.

[JDMiller5150]

This story has yet to receive attention from news leaders. I just emailed at Huffington Post about the movement concerning issues with the ending.

But thats just one person.

If you folks could possibly email them aswell, it would help spur Bioware to address our problems. The email address is below.

scoop@huffingtonpost.com

Make your email as short or as long as you want. As long as you send it, it greatly increases the chance of receiving the noteriety that Mass Effect deserves,

Thank you, and spread the word.

[BentOrgy]

They have no idea what the hell they're doing anymore; its like they fully expected every person who bought the game to fall instantly in love with it, and never question a thing regarding its content or direction, and the instant they were proven wrong, (After the initial reviving from the comas they probably all endured.) they began furiously trying back-pedal their way out of the mess they made.

Seemed simple to me.

EDIT: It reminds me of the idiots who created RAGE; they were interviewed by a journalist who started noting the various things in the game that didn't really make sense, and when they couldn't explain anything properly, they accused him of being "Hostile," and "Blatantly attacking," them.

Modifié par BentOrgy, 10 avril 2012 - 08:23 .

[Cirreus]

ShadowNinja1129 wrote...

Mr. Gamble tweet;

"Hardest. Day. Ever. Seriously, if you guys knew all the stuff we are planning, you'd, we'll[sic] - hold onto your copy of me3 forever."

Remember that the game kicks you back to the Illusive Man's base mission after the DLC window pops up. If you delete your save you can not access the pre-ending DLC planned for the game. It all has to take place before the end of the game ,which starts at the Illusive Man's base & the point of no return. This is a logical assumption to his tweet too. (who knows if it's the right one?). The pre-ending DLC might be story/theme aligned with some content the player "had to have" completed first, unlike most of ME2's DLC.

As for repiortizing the schedule, I think the fan backlash has lead to the "extended cut" DLC needing to be out before "Omega" or any other paid DLC. It's possible it was planned (if at all of course) to be out later, perhaps an Arrival like DLC to the next step in the franchise (if there is one now).

Lots of Speculation ....

[CSMone01]

My only worry is that EA will take control of the IP like they have with so many other companies after this massive screwup, like they did with, Maxis, Westwood, Et al.

[BentOrgy]

CSMone01 wrote...

My only worry is that EA will take control of the IP like they have with so many other companies after this massive screwup, like they did with, Maxis, Westwood, Et al.

Not to be rude but:

News flash: It already happened.

[kidbd15]

OP, I challenge you to compile all the "odd" tweets you speak of in your original post!

As for the topic... From a business perspective, wouldn't a story-driven DLC sell worse if the consumer already knew the ending, regardless of what this new DLC does? Even if ME3 has a great ending, wouldn't the DLC still suffer sales wise for some people, knowing that it won't affect the ending, knowing the full narrative already?

Perhaps BioWare thought they needed to make the ending up for interpretation, with the possibility of a new ending, so people would buy their DLCs..? If so, it backfired on them.

Just a thought.

[DamonD7]

devSin wrote...

This is not what Mike Gamble was alluding to.

Fact is, he has butter brain, and sometimes things come out of it before being checked if they make sense. See the comment at PAX, where he said the extended cut couldn't be on the disc, because they didn't know there'd be demand for it. (What he meant to say was that they didn't know it'd need to be created, because they didn't know the ending would be such a big failure, and they never intended to create it.)

Mike's message means that the extended cut is something that will make you want to hold on to your copy of the game forever (don't disappoint me, Mike, please). But the stuff he was talking about on March 8 has yet to be revealed, and he still seems to think you might like it.

I don't know about "butter brain", heh, and lord knows I've misspoken before, but I agree with the general gist of this.

I think it's just getting twisted a little, particular because 140 characters or less is rarely the best way to get a properly encompassing conversation.

[kidbd15]

Bill Casey wrote...

Mike Gamble also said "holding onto your Mass Effect 3 save states wouldn't be a bad idea, obviously I can't say why. But it wouldn't be a bad idea" before ME3 was even released...

www.gamerzines.com/xbox/news-xbox/mass-effect-3-saves.html

Haha, I like this quote from that article even more:

“We want the outcomes to be satisfying to the player. That doesn’t
necessarily mean they’re all going to be happy or positive, but they
have to be satisfying. Players have to understand that the choices
they’ve been making in this game and in previous have had an impact, and
that they’re an architect in what happens.”


Way to live up to that MISTER Gamble.

[silverstreakusa]

devSin wrote...

This is not what Mike Gamble was alluding to.

Fact is, he has butter brain, and sometimes things come out of it before being checked if they make sense. See the comment at PAX, where he said the extended cut couldn't be on the disc, because they didn't know there'd be demand for it. (What he meant to say was that they didn't know it'd need to be created, because they didn't know the ending would be such a big failure, and they never intended to create it.)

Mike's message means that the extended cut is something that will make you want to hold on to your copy of the game forever (don't disappoint me, Mike, please). But the stuff he was talking about on March 8 has yet to be revealed, and he still seems to think you might like it.

actually on that same tweet i asked gamble straight out if the extended cut dlc derailed thier original plans for more and his response was somewhat cryptic yet positive.  sorry for crude cut and past i dont know how to include images of the tweets..


@GambleMikeHardest. Day. Ever. Seriously, if you
people knew all the stuff we are planning...you'd, we'll - hold onto
your copy of me3 forever.







@silverstreakusa are all those great plans still in effect or did this whole extended cut dlc business derail the original plans?


[/b] ‏
@GambleMike

@silverstreakusa we have a big team

Modifié par silverstreakusa, 10 avril 2012 - 08:44 .

[Ajna]

oblique9 wrote...

I've thought for a while, in the back of my head, ever since playing the ending for myself and watching this whole mess unfold that something just wasn't right.

More than 'terrible rushed writing'. If they are up to something big, I think they have the VA's in on it too... as a few of them (Maleshep and Femshep) have alleged that they haven't been contacted about VA stuff... But who knows, if the ending DLC was meant to be done later on then that would make it consistent.

I admit I am honestly a bit surprised that they 're actively decided to do a several month long dev-process ending DLC for free based on fan outcry... And their crazy refusal to actually do what all the same fans that allegedly made them do the DLC want (change the endings)... That just seems a little too odd to be a form of 'damage control'. But on the other hand, maybe they just don't want to ****** off pro-enders/be seen as spineless.

And it's possible that the 'interesting' twitter comments are just PR speech.

But I don't know. Even the endings themselves... For every piece of evidence I find for the IT, I find at least 1 that makes it sound out of the question at this point.

But why the shady answer on IT at PAX? They denounced several rumors of leaked content... And they are up front about not changing the endings... But they shy away from answering IT theory...

At this point, if they do pull an IT theory, it will probably have been the best kept secret in gaming. And it will have the most press coverage everywhere. Bioware is in every major news article with a bad name because of this now... Maybe if they pull an IT theory now with the press still hot on them, all the negative stuff will turn around.

I don't know. Every day I'm on the other side of the fence.

I have not ruled out the possibility that all of us - everyone here - is being totally mindf***ed.

We will see... with this ending DLC, we will see.

Oh, and on the very, very, very off chance that this is a huge Bioware stunt... Well, it will make for quite an interesting sociology project.

This is how I saw it about 10 mins after completing it.  Discussing it with my sister who used to work in the entertainment (music) industry, her first thought was "publicity stunt to end all publicity stunts!  That would be awesome!", I've kept that at the back of my mind ever since as it was my first thought also.

Like you, I've always had the feeling that something just isn't right though, can't put my finger on it.  I've come to terms with them the way they are after taking some time to think about it for myself, away from here (this place was a hindrance to coherent thought for me) "just in case". And I'm completely ready to take them at face value, what they appear to be creating now I feel very hopeful for, call it a hunch, I'm listening to my gut on this and my gut tells me "eh, it will be fine!".  I trust the dev team and summer cannot come soon enough! 

[CSMone01]

BentOrgy wrote...

CSMone01 wrote...

My only worry is that EA will take control of the IP like they have with so many other companies after this massive screwup, like they did with, Maxis, Westwood, Et al.

Not to be rude but:

News flash: It already happened.

I don't mean in the vague sense of EA influencing them, I mean in a more literal sense, as in EA continues to produce Mass Effect games after killing the studio. Hence why I mentioned Maxis(Simcity) and Westwood(Command and Conquer).

[Cirreus]

CSMone01 wrote...

BentOrgy wrote...

CSMone01 wrote...

My only worry is that EA will take control of the IP like they have with so many other companies after this massive screwup, like they did with, Maxis, Westwood, Et al.

Not to be rude but:

News flash: It already happened.

I don't mean in the vague sense of EA influencing them, I mean in a more literal sense, as in EA continues to produce Mass Effect games after killing the studio. Hence why I mentioned Maxis(Simcity) and Westwood(Command and Conquer).

I shout it from the roof tops every chance I get. I believe Bioware is being forced (or planned to) sell off the ME franchise to another developer within EA. The ending (and pre-order/day one DLC hit & run) makes perfect sense from the business point of view. The franchise has good numbers (especially ME3, 75 perfect reviews, millions in DLC & pre-orders) & the story slate is virtually wiped clean. Another developer could easily come in & take the name & do what they want with it, not being tired down by previous games. Call of Duty comes to mind on this very thing. Horrible line of thought though.

Modifié par Cirreus, 10 avril 2012 - 08:58 .

[Devils-DIVISION]

OP I feel the same way. But I fear your questions will not be answered nor will they be touched on in the Extended Cut DLC. I can only hope I am wrong, but I've grown weary of hope as a solution.

[wryterra]

BringBackNihlus wrote...
Matthew Shepard/Spacer/War Hero/Paragon - ComMANder Shepard. Coincidence? I think not.

Wildly off topic but:

SHEpard.

Boom goes the dynamite.

[yahtzo]

I think at this point if IDT was true they would just come out and say "Ok Indoctrination Theory is true now shut up until were finished with it in ~6 months."

I really want IDT to be true but I just can't see it happening

[ShadowNinja1129]

Cirreus wrote...

CSMone01 wrote...

BentOrgy wrote...

CSMone01 wrote...

My only worry is that EA will take control of the IP like they have with so many other companies after this massive screwup, like they did with, Maxis, Westwood, Et al.

Not to be rude but:

News flash: It already happened.

I don't mean in the vague sense of EA influencing them, I mean in a more literal sense, as in EA continues to produce Mass Effect games after killing the studio. Hence why I mentioned Maxis(Simcity) and Westwood(Command and Conquer).

I shout it from the roof tops every chance I get. I believe Bioware is being forced (or planned to) sell off the ME franchise to another developer within EA. The ending (and pre-order/day one DLC hit & run) makes perfect sense from the business point of view. The franchise has good numbers (especially ME3, 75 perfect reviews, millions in DLC & pre-orders) & the story slate is virtually wiped clean. Another developer could easily come in & take the name & do what they want with it, not being tired down by previous games. Call of Duty comes to mind on this very thing. Horrible line of thought though.

Not to mention they did this with other legendary studios sitting on great IP, like Pandemic (Battlefront 3) and Ensemble Studios (Age of Empires). Its something I've been paranoid about ever since EA bought BioWare. I was more than happy for them to take as long as they needed with ME3 because I was very afraid of what would happen to them afterward. All 10 of my fingers and toes crossed that such a thing does not happen to BioWare.