115 réponses à ce sujet

[Spitfire_mcguire]

Gallimatia wrote...

TheGreenAlloy wrote...

I'm sorry but Spouts? She brings it up when she talks about the death of her father and Kaiden's death, both are brief mentions. It shows us that her religion is a tool she uses to deal with some of the harder moments of her life. That's not  mumbo jumbo that's character depth. I don't mean to sound rude but i think you should be more open minded. If you just dismiss someone the second they start talking about their religion, that says alot more about you than them. 

Also Just out of curiousity did you have the same opinion about Thane?

Ashley on occasion acts as if people that aren't religious are too stupid to get it. The most noteworthy example of this is her talk with sole survivor Shepard (vid). She is visibly upset Shepard doesn't realize it was God that kept the Threser Maws at bay. I would call this religious spouting.

Well, I remember her saying something about how many were "freaked out" by her faith,  because they didn't understand it how she could work in space and still believe. I don't think you can judge her about that then

And, after watching that vid, it isn't spouting at all but a understandable reaction.  If you belive in a higherpower, you think that way. Its automatic really. Though implied, she actually doesn't mention God at all so I don't think you can cal it spouting.

[Heimdall]

Spaghetti_Ninja wrote...

According to Shepard, there is no afterlife in the Mass Effect 3 universe.

OMG WHY DID THEY DELETE THIS!!! That would have made up for the incredibly offensive ''no atheists in foxholes'' remark Shep and Ashley make in the first game.

Damn you damn you damn you.

That isn't even remotely what Shepard says in this seen.  All he says is "I don't Know" and "I don't actually remember anything."

How is that line offensive anyway?

[Iakus]

ItsFreakinJesus wrote...

That was the one scene I waited for in ME3, shame it didn't make it in.

That's a scene I wanted in ME2, for that matter.

Double shame it didn't make it in

[The Razman]

Lord Aesir wrote...

Spaghetti_Ninja wrote...

According to Shepard, there is no afterlife in the Mass Effect 3 universe.

OMG WHY DID THEY DELETE THIS!!! That would have made up for the incredibly offensive ''no atheists in foxholes'' remark Shep and Ashley make in the first game.

Damn you damn you damn you.

That isn't even remotely what Shepard says in this seen.  All he says is "I don't Know" and "I don't actually remember anything."

How is that line offensive anyway?

Because when you die, you go to heaven. And anyone who implies otherwise is anti-Christian.

Or at least, that's the reaction you could expect.

[Getorex]

The Razman wrote...

Lord Aesir wrote...

Spaghetti_Ninja wrote...

According to Shepard, there is no afterlife in the Mass Effect 3 universe.

OMG WHY DID THEY DELETE THIS!!! That would have made up for the incredibly offensive ''no atheists in foxholes'' remark Shep and Ashley make in the first game.

Damn you damn you damn you.

That isn't even remotely what Shepard says in this seen.  All he says is "I don't Know" and "I don't actually remember anything."

How is that line offensive anyway?

Because when you die, you go to heaven. And anyone who implies otherwise is anti-Christian.

Or at least, that's the reaction you could expect.

Silly.  Most people who croak and get resuscitated don't see jack squat.  Are they "anti-xtian"?  Of course not.   Silly actually because no one who really dies ever comes back...being temporarily without a heartbeat or breathing does not equate to dead.  Termination of most biological activity, particularly in the brain and other body organs equates to death - when it gets to the point of unrecoverable. If it is recoverable (resuscitation) then you weren't really dead.  You were on your way to being dead but that's it.  People tend to mistake "clinical death" (the set of variables that are legally and medically required to declare someone dead and thus cease attempts to revive) vs actual biological death.  There is no clean, clear demarcation line that you can point to and say, THERE!  RIGHT THERE!  Dead!  The definition of "dead" in the medical profession has changed repeatedly and is still rather controversial, particularly with regards to declaring someone dead enough to be able to be used to farm organs for transplant.  They have to come up with SOME definition that they safely (legally and ethically) use to delineate when someone is deadish enough to yank organs but not so dead to render the organs useless.  Conundrum.

The case of Shepard is a crazy departure from a fantasy/scifi STORY.  No one has been, or will be, revived from carbonized and dessicated death - the whole Lazerus thing was silly to begin with but still, given the STORY, there was nothing offensive about the whole Shepard thing in this.  The character was merely telling the most common outcome of near death:  nothing.

Modifié par Getorex, 12 avril 2012 - 01:56 .

[Getorex]

TheGreenAlloy wrote...

trobbins777 wrote...

Getorex wrote...

jreezy wrote...

Getorex wrote...

The religious stuff from Ash turned me off in the first ME game. Same thing happens in real life. You are a woman, you start spouting religious talk, we're done. That said, I had no problem with the deleted conversation. It worked (and it shat on the beliefs in a satisfying way). Win-win.

What does being a woman have to do with anything?

I said that because I'm a guy and I only go for women.  If a woman I'm interested in spouts off religious mumbo jumbo, no more interest.  Get it?  That applies in game too.  Turns me (Shepard) off.  Simple as that.

I'm sorry but Spouts? She brings it up when she talks about the death of her father and Kaiden's death, both are brief mentions. It shows us that her religion is a tool she uses to deal with some of the harder moments of her life. That's not  mumbo jumbo that's character depth. I don't mean to sound rude but i think you should be more open minded. If you just dismiss someone the second they start talking about their religion, that says alot more about you than them. 

Also Just out of curiousity did you have the same opinion about Thane?

Or Mordin, Samara, Wrex, Javik, Liara?

Pretty much.  All nonsense...just like real life.  You IGNORE that stuff until it is made impossible (ie, a potential romantic interest starts going on about that stuff, because by going off on that stuff means they actually BUY it...ugh).  With the examples of Samara (the "Goddess" that ME 3 shows to have been anything BUT a goddess, poor dears) or Thane...yup, nonsense but since they were just going on that stuff in response to a direct question rather than constantly bringing it up and feeding it to you (Shepard) it is ignorable.  Something you file away, "Yeah, whatever.  Interesting cultural thing but...phooie."  Totally different thing from a colleague or friend vs a lover/potential lover. 

Modifié par Getorex, 12 avril 2012 - 01:51 .

[DeinonSlayer]

Lord Aesir wrote...

Spaghetti_Ninja wrote...

According to Shepard, there is no afterlife in the Mass Effect 3 universe.

OMG WHY DID THEY DELETE THIS!!! That would have made up for the incredibly offensive ''no atheists in foxholes'' remark Shep and Ashley make in the first game.

Damn you damn you damn you.

That isn't even remotely what Shepard says in this seen.  All he says is "I don't Know" and "I don't actually remember anything."

How is that line offensive anyway?

I don't get it either. Mass Effect acknowledges that religious people exist. Shepard isn't forced to agree with them. Is this something to be offended by? I don't see anyone ripping on Thane...

Taking offense at the existence of a person who admits to holding vague religious beliefs in ME1 is no better than taking offense at the existence of gay love interests in ME3. "You hesitantly admitted to believing in a higher power! DIE IN NUCLEAR FIRE!"

Seriously, who's being the real zealot here?

Modifié par DeinonSlayer, 12 avril 2012 - 02:01 .

[SamT3N7]

RyuujinZERO wrote...

 I don't really see how any negative connotations coudl be drawn from this.

"He doesn't remember" - plain and simple. That fits the scientific expectations (Not alive, no memories being written, thus no memory of event), without disrupting or competing with anyone theistic beliefs (maybe while he was dead he did experience something, but has no memory of it)

Wow, I didn't think of it that way.  BioWare really presented the scene in a very neutral way, I don't think anyone should feel offended.

[Kelwing]

Rather good scene. Wouldn't mind seeing it added in again or being made available for those that would want it.

[TweedleDee66]

Saw this posted in the Spoilers forums.

It totally sucks that this and the cut Kaiden dialog was deemed not good enough for the game.

I don’t care what the easily offensive people out there say about Ashley and her religious beliefs (same twits who  probably complained about the nudity from ME1 and DAO), this dialog not only asks the questions we should have been asked in ME2 but makes you wonder why Ashley doesn’t have a religious faith breakdown with the possible ending of humanity, something that I‘m sure anyone with any religious beliefs would likely be asking.

[Spectre_Shepard]

wish that was in there

[Spectre_Shepard]

holy crap that was great. that and the cut andersen conversation are the two best in the game. and they got CUT. WTF.

[Demmin Nass]

I really wish that was in the game. Half of the scenes you have with Ash have her in the hospital. It would have been nice to have another scene with her on the Normandy besides her being hung over on the floor.

[J0hnick]

Demmin Nass wrote...

I really wish that was in the game. Half of the scenes you have with Ash have her in the hospital. It would have been nice to have another scene with her on the Normandy besides her being hung over on the floor.

Agreed, she was far from my fav but this would have helped.

[Han Shot First]

OMG WHY DID THEY DELETE THIS!!! That would have made up for the incredibly offensive ''no atheists in foxholes'' remark Shep and Ashley make in the first game.

There are a few problems with this statement.

First, in Mass Effect 1 Shepard isn't forced into making the 'no atheists in foxholes' remark. He'll only say that if you, as the player, choose to agree with Ashley. In which case if it offends you, why are you choosing the dialogue option that indicates Shepard is going to agree with Ashley's belief in an afterlife?

Also the statement that there are 'no atheists in foxholes' isn't something that Shepard made up. It is an old saying in the military based on the fact that a great many people (but certainly not everyone) *do* pray when they are facing the possibility fo an imminent death, regardless of whether or not they considering themselves to be believers prior. Sort of like this guy at 1:49. Fear is a powerful motivator.

Second, this supposed cut conversation with Ashley does not have Shepard either confirming or denying the existence of an afterlife. He tells Ashley that he doesn't remember anything, and that he 'doesn't know.' I

Modifié par Han Shot First, 14 avril 2012 - 06:31 .

[Tishiro88]

clipped_wolf wrote...

There is a lot of hostility toward religion in the forums, and probably a lot more apathy in the fan base.
In ME1 Ashley said she believes in God and Heaven and she was branded as a zealot.
I'm not sure if that had anything to do with.

see for me as someone who went to bible college it is a plus.