54 réponses à ce sujet

[Matthew Young CT]

what browser do you use?



i disagree because magic/spellpower doesnt give us much of a benefit as say str does to damage. many spells are like 0.1*SP, big whoop.

[OneBadAssMother]

My opinion for warrior: For DPS -> go 2-handed berserker... seriously. STR should be primary, WILL should be secondary, and AGL should be third but it's hardly needed. No need for CONS, forget about it, just try not to get mobbed - that's the tank's job. It's a big waste of precious ability points. Try to focus entirely on strength, willpower is secondary.

For talents, your main attacks should be sunder arms/sunder armor -> both of them do 2 hits at the same time as 1 attack, not much stamina usage either. Use mighty blow/critical strike for mages/archers, pommel strike is last resort - does no damage. You want powerful swings + indominable on at all battles. Upgraded berserk is just for extra damage, and you will want deathblow as a passive too.

For rogues:

My wife on her recent playthrough actually noticed that a rogue with a high cunning score + lethality talent, still recieves additional damage from her strength score as well - this COULD be a bug, but it might be intended. In other words, you get bonuses from BOTH CUN and STR at the same time. (As long as your cunning is higher then strength maybe but we don't know, we never tested)

Still, her character did ~80 damage each with VERY FAST backstabs as a DW rogue + momentum.

Modifié par OneBadAssMother, 05 décembre 2009 - 11:46 .

[Statue]

Try updating from Internet Explorer 4

[ZtriDer1379]

Statue wrote...

Try updating from Internet Explorer 4

I can't.... It is the deffault broser at this firm.... Im using firefox though for brosing, so Im woundering why it says exploerer 4 when I post....

[Matthew Young CT]

Wow. I didn't think someone could actually still be using IE 4.

[ZtriDer1379]

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Matthew Young CT
wrote...



Wow. I didn't think someone could actually still be using IE 4.

A lot o big firms around the world are still using IE4, and even windows 95 too
:s

The company Im working for is Norway’s biggest company. They are
using WinXP though, but dod to bad comparability with different programs that
they have been using for ages and the new IE, they are still using IE4 for comparability
and stability.

It sucks,
but I just have to suck it up and take it like a man

Modifié par ZtriDer1379, 05 décembre 2009 - 12:14 .

[Matthew Young CT]

Letting people browse the net on IE 4 is just daft though. That thing probably has more security holes than swiss cheese by now.

[Booisbackagain]

To original poster:



Alistair and every custom made tank are awful at their job early in the game. Later they do get better, when str and con are higher and with some decent equipment but still a tank in DA is not so much better at absorbing damage than any dps warrior. The DPS warrior gets to do much more damage and he can still tank.



Not to mention that dex based characters seem to be equally efficient once they can not be hit easily. I have a ranger that used to wear the starting armor up to lvl 14 having no big issues with dying.



Rogues shine in the mid game, so you have to be patient.



Rangers actually make the game quite hard till lvl 10. They require too much micromanagement, too much kiting the bosses. But later at about lvl 10-12 there isn't a real problem. Remember the mage and the archer can work really good together. A buffed ranger with a bear tank is unstoppable. Still harder to play than a mage but I think that type of rogue gives me most fun than any other character I made.



If careful pulling is out of the question then Scatter shot is the way to go. Place 2-3 traps in a narrow spot, then place warriors carefully to block the way, run behind them, and that is all for the enemies.



DPS is not everything. My lvl 15 ranger has no Slaying arrow and he is doing fine. And my lvl 12 warrior is following a hybrid build (2handed for CC and dual wield for damage) and he can survive without much effort on hard, wearing the Chasind armor (I just like the looks better than Blood armor).



So to sum up, if you are going to play again do not worry about who does the most DPS. It is single player, so go create anything you like and have fun. Almost any build can work. If now you are a perfectionist then go make a mage and specialize him in blood magic or as an arcane warrior. It is up to you.

[rheed]

I think your problem is you are suposing every melee needs ****loads of willpower, it's not true, you only gain a marginal increase on your stamina pool, you will get more benefits spending those points into strength or dex,cunning, depending your class.

[Zenon]

Perhaps someone should make a stamina potion mod, if it doesn't exist yet. Just an idea. I mean you can get one in the browsergame... kinda missing it in the 3D game.

[ZtriDer1379]

@Booi.
The dps is just 1 bit of it. What’s annoy me the most is how viable a melee class is in combat.
As a mage, you can do something anytime in the fight, either it is offence hard nuke dps, or sudden freeze/knock-back CC or healing. Even if the mage did not have pots, they skill outperform melee classes in viability.
To my experience so far when micromanage the melee classes, I have found that I am extreme limited to just a few movies totally in every fight. Fights with multiple mobs are ending up with auto-attack 70% of the fight wail with the mage, there is always something I can do.
Using abilities is so costy on the stamina that I have to choose to save the stamina for special moves like CC or dps. I can’t dps and CC. If I CC, I have to auto attack trough the fight. If I use dps abilities, I have no CC.

I am seeing people saying, put points on str, you do not need much wisdom…….and they still are bragging that they can go trough a fight spaming attack skills….. Im LvL 17 now and no……what they are saying are pure lies and pull-****. I am a micromanage freak. I prefer to pause, give order and unpause. I love having the control. Im not just playing a mage and letting the rest of the group go AI combat and tactics. No. 2/3 of the fun is to micromanage the fight and it is trough this micromanage that I notes how “limited” warrior and rogues are.

And it is all because of a ****ed up stamina system imo. Stamina regen? What is that? I have yet to see any regen in a fight.
I have tried Rejuvinate but to my experience so far, it is a spell that is not working. It does not regen mana OR stamina (the regen is sooooo small that you can't hardly notes it.... like 3-5% of total?). A spell on a heavy cool-down with no function so far.

Modifié par ZtriDer1379, 05 décembre 2009 - 02:27 .

[Matthew Young CT]

ZtriDer1379 wrote...
The dps is just 1 bit of it. What’s annoy me the most is how viable a melee class is in combat.

My rogue kicks arse :>

As a mage, you can do something anytime in the fight, either it is offence hard nuke dps, or sudden freeze/knock-back CC or healing. Even if the mage did not have pots, they skill outperform melee classes in viability.

They are more versatile, they aren't more powerful (sans pots).

To my experience so far when micromanage the melee classes, I have found that I am extreme limited to just a few movies totally in every fight. Fights with multiple mobs are ending up with auto-attack 70% of the fight wail with the mage, there is always something I can do.

Shrug I use my abilities every time the cooldown is finished.

Using abilities is so costy on the stamina that I have to choose to save the stamina for special moves like CC or dps. I can’t dps and CC. If I CC, I have to auto attack trough the fight. If I use dps abilities, I have no CC.

Use CC abilities when they cool down, attack stuff for dps. Well that's what I do on my rogue. It depends entirely on the character not all melee is the same

I am seeing people saying, put points on str, you do not need much wisdom…….and they still are bragging that they can go trough a fight spaming attack skills….. Im LvL 17 now and no……what they are saying are pure lies and pull-****. I am a micromanage freak. I prefer to pause, give order and unpause. I love having the control. Im not just playing a mage and letting the rest of the group go AI combat and tactics. No. 2/3 of the fun is to micromanage the fight and it is trough this micromanage that I notes how “limited” warrior and rogues are.

I don't have a single point in willpower. I spam my abilities all fight.

And it is all because of a ****ed up stamina system imo. Stamina regen? What is that? I have yet to see any regen in a fight.

Stamina regen is a stat. Several items, spells, and abilities increase it. Try use them.

I have tried Rejuvinate but to my experience so far, it is a spell that is not working. It does not regen mana OR stamina. A spell on a heavy cool-down with no function so far.

Rejuvenate increases stamina/mana (they're the same thing to the game) by 8.

Modifié par Matthew Young CT, 05 décembre 2009 - 02:30 .

[F-C]

every time i see one of these threads i just get the impression that melee classes should have been dumbed down to the point it was just impossible to make them poorly.



thats basically the way mages are. they are so simple to build and play that you would have to be a complete drooling idiot to get it wrong. i mean really. so everyone always thinks mages are the overpowered super class.

[Kuraiken]

My character is the party's 1h+shield tank+dmg dealer, and he deals 37% of the party damage. Especially in the late game my character turned out to be *the* damage dealer, dispatching most darkspawn with a single hit as well as eating rare and elite Ogres alive (second highest difficulty).
With Bloodrage, Haste and Berserkerrage, he has a 1h dps of 128.
And I never found it neccessary to really invest much in willpower or constitution. Strength as main, agility as second, and the rest is slight fine-tuning.

Yesterday I met a friend who also started playing DAO, and he is playing the game with a rouge. A few runes that can paralyze in your sword&dagger, combined with haste, self-buffs and the combat skills, and the rogue stuns a foe and then does nothing but crit for 70-90 per hit in very quick succession. As long as the tank holds all the aggro, he slaughters enemies without any problem.
He mainly builds up cunning,  then dex, and goes for 22 strength to be able to wear the drake armors.

I use Morrigan mainly for control&additional damage, since she actually can't do that much damage. AOEs are bound to hit my own NPCs, so unless the opportunity presents itself or she can decrease the friendly fire with clever placement, she mostly uses single person damage and control spells like paralyze.

When it comes to good AOE damage, Sten is actually very neat with his twohander. Combine it with Berserkerrage and Haste, and he is a powerhouse as well.

Modifié par Kuraiken, 05 décembre 2009 - 03:08 .

[ZtriDer1379]

The aoe the mages can dish out is just immensive. Using nova + earthshake is a killer.
Using death cload + blizzardis just OP's.
This is a combo of 2 mages.

Put down grease in a bottleneck or a door, pause, start casting blizzard and nova.
a second before the nova and blizzard are cast, use someone ells to pull with bow or LoS.
The nova will put the grease on fire.
Pause, now start death cloud.
You will now have a nature damage fire, cold damage blizzard, spirit damage death cload killing everything that comes towards the door.
The blizzard will also freeze or knoc down people inside that death zone.
Just to add more fuel to the fire. Cast an earth shake inside so those who makes a successfully saving throw against blizzard, must still do one more from earth shock.
2 mages can vipe out a battalion of mobs alone.
And if someone do should manage to get trough… oh.. stonefist. Knock him back into the hell hole



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I also
often use earthquake on my own people. Having the tank far up in the front
gathering up all the mobs, throw earthquake. Most of the mobs, and my tank,
will be stumbling around and falling over. Now just let the range pick down the
ones that manage to stand up. The tank takes less damage and you are more safe.
Works perfect when saving friendly’s. (can’t say that is a spoiler is it? Use earthquake
to knock mobs over? It says so in the description)

Modifié par ZtriDer1379, 05 décembre 2009 - 03:30 .

[TileToad]

I agree with the TC that the melee classes are underpowered but what I also find fascinating is why melee characters have talents like threaten and taunt. Why would anyone want their melee character to be swarmed with enemies if they can't hold their own? Besides, if a certain enemy (usually bosses) fixates on your mage those talents don't seem to do much anyway, forcing you to constantly move your mage all over the place.



I also agree that creating melee characters compared to mages is more difficult since they rely on, at least, four attributes. Finding a good balance of these four with only three upgrade points per level is a challenge indeed.

[MartinJHolm]

it doesn't really matter it's a single player only game and melee is actually pretty good if you have a debuffer in your party.



Personally I run with a group consisting of tank/2h DPS/mage debuffer and me a rogue works just fine.

[Mlauthemighty]

I respecced Zevrahn to ranger/bard and even though his dex could have been much higher (i bumped cunning to 30 in order to unlock all chests) he seems quite lethal with his bow.



Between having a low upkeep (ranged dps, little damage taken), being able to deal with chests and traps, having aoe cc with scatter shot, having a party buff/a pet for me to leech health from and high single target dps with skills like critical shot, I think a rouge is a very worthy addition to the party (at least a bard/ranger).

[Diomed]

Mages are far more powerful than any melee class, warrior or rogue, regardless of spec. Yes, some are better than others but the disparity between casters and non-casters is pathetic. Bioware did a terrible job balancing the classes.

[Osprey39]

Diomed wrote...

Mages are far more powerful than any melee class, warrior or rogue, regardless of spec. Yes, some are better than others but the disparity between casters and non-casters is pathetic. Bioware did a terrible job balancing the classes.

Not really.  Mages use a ton of mana to cast their most powerful spells.  The problem is that mana is unlimited if you want it to be because you can make infinite lyrium potions.  Trust me, a mage that doesn't have unlimited mana, while still powerful, is a whole lot more in line with the melee characters.

[ZtriDer1379]

Osprey39 wrote...

Diomed wrote...

Mages are far more powerful than any melee class, warrior or rogue, regardless of spec. Yes, some are better than others but the disparity between casters and non-casters is pathetic. Bioware did a terrible job balancing the classes.

Not really.  Mages use a ton of mana to cast their most powerful spells.  The problem is that mana is unlimited if you want it to be because you can make infinite lyrium potions.  Trust me, a mage that doesn't have unlimited mana, while still powerful, is a whole lot more in line with the melee characters.

Agree, what should be done is to look at the mana regen/pot usage and stamina regen. The both of them needs tweeking.

[TileToad]

Osprey39 wrote...

Diomed wrote...

Mages are far more powerful than any melee class, warrior or rogue, regardless of spec. Yes, some are better than others but the disparity between casters and non-casters is pathetic. Bioware did a terrible job balancing the classes.

Not really.  Mages use a ton of mana to cast their most powerful spells.  The problem is that mana is unlimited if you want it to be because you can make infinite lyrium potions.  Trust me, a mage that doesn't have unlimited mana, while still powerful, is a whole lot more in line with the melee characters.

True, in that both classes would be crippled then.

I'd rather play both classes balanced in their full potential. Unfortunately it's much easier to balance a game by gradually chipping away strenghts from characters.

[Booisbackagain]

ZtriDer1379 wrote...

@Booi.
The dps is just 1 bit of it. What’s annoy me the most is how viable a melee class is in combat.
As a mage, you can do something anytime in the fight, either it is offence hard nuke dps, or sudden freeze/knock-back CC or healing. Even if the mage did not have pots, they skill outperform melee classes in viability.
To my experience so far when micromanage the melee classes, I have found that I am extreme limited to just a few movies totally in every fight. Fights with multiple mobs are ending up with auto-attack 70% of the fight wail with the mage, there is always something I can do.
Using abilities is so costy on the stamina that I have to choose to save the stamina for special moves like CC or dps. I can’t dps and CC. If I CC, I have to auto attack trough the fight. If I use dps abilities, I have no CC.

I am seeing people saying, put points on str, you do not need much wisdom…….and they still are bragging that they can go trough a fight spaming attack skills….. Im LvL 17 now and no……what they are saying are pure lies and pull-****. I am a micromanage freak. I prefer to pause, give order and unpause. I love having the control. Im not just playing a mage and letting the rest of the group go AI combat and tactics. No. 2/3 of the fun is to micromanage the fight and it is trough this micromanage that I notes how “limited” warrior and rogues are.

And it is all because of a ****ed up stamina system imo. Stamina regen? What is that? I have yet to see any regen in a fight.
I have tried Rejuvinate but to my experience so far, it is a spell that is not working. It does not regen mana OR stamina (the regen is sooooo small that you can't hardly notes it.... like 3-5% of total?). A spell on a heavy cool-down with no function so far.

Ok, now I see your point and I agree. In most fights I delpete my large stamina pool so fast that is nothing left for me to do than leave it on auto attack. It would be nice to have a few stamina pots and less mana pots I think.
Or maybe a decent stamina regenaration spell.

[Matthew Young CT]

there is one, it's called rejuvenate. +80 stamina over 10 seconds. throw in items and mass rejuv and you should be fine.

[Rainen89]

Let me clarify if you are having problems with stamina it is your gear once you are past level 10 and have decent gear (plenty to be had, not the default heavy chainmail stuff.) You will have lots some good reccomendations for warriors anyway Dragonbone/Knight commander/Wardens Commander etc. Lots of jewlery and other pieces as well, expensive but pivotal to a high dps build.