197 réponses à ce sujet

[kbct]

Here is another article:

http://kotaku.com/59...sely-advertised

None seem to be discounting BBB.

[AJRimmsey]

AJRimmsey wrote...

Advertising Review

BBB has nothing to report concerning Bioware Corp's advertising at this time.

www.bbb.org/edmonton/business-reviews/computers-system-designers-and-consultants/bioware-in-edmonton-ab-111723


just another BS flame bait thread

[TheBlackBaron]

Bogsnot wrote...

TheBlackBaron wrote...

The second that Bioware demonstrates that past decisions affect War Assets and thus the EMS, which -does- have a tangible effect on the results of the final decision, the complaint is out the door from a legal standpoint.

You may not like it, but it's the truth. 

Not for those who dont play MP. We were promised that we would be able to get the best possible ending without MP, which has been shown to be false.
So, in essence, past decisions end up not having any impact on EMS or War Assets, because no matter what we do, we cannot receive the ending we were promised.

You may not like it, but its the truth. Bioware did not deliver on what they promised.

Doesn't matter. You can't argue that that past decisions don't, in some tangible way, affect what ending you can get. Because they do. Not being able to get the "best" ending - which is just one of several - through single player doesn't change that. You're being asinine if you claim otherwise. 

Now, whether or not you could go after them for claiming you can get the best ending through single player alone is another matter. That could hold water, if pre-release statments from devs and Jarret Lee are held to be "advertising". But the average RME'er whining that his choices had no effect on the ending is absolutely wrong, from a legal standpoint, and that's all that applies when it comes to the FTC.

The sooner you people understand that, the better. 

Modifié par TheBlackBaron, 12 avril 2012 - 03:21 .

[Bogsnot]

Lenimph wrote...

Bogsnot wrote...

Not for those who dont play MP. We were promised that we would be able to get the best possible ending without MP, which has been shown to be false.
So, in essence, past decisions end up not having any impact on EMS or War Assets, because no matter what we do, we cannot receive the ending we were promised.

You may not like it, but its the truth. Bioware did not deliver on what they promised.

You can using that APP thing and that other game... but yeah it still sucks but MP  isn't the only way to get your EMS up... 

Except for the fact that we were promised we could get the best possible ending playing SP, not "get the best possible ending by playing SP, and using Facebook games and Apples apps".

Due to the fact that I have a fully functioning cerebral cortex, I neither use Failbook, nor any Apple products.


Edit: Holding out for delivery on what you were promised is not being asinine. We were promised by the devs the ability to get the exact same outcome in SP, as you can get in MP. This is currently not the case.
If you want to defend Bioware/EA for delivery of a substandard product that does not match up with the advertised claims, then fine, you can go ahead and continue to be disappointed as they lie and deceive time and again.

Me, I'll hold out until I get what was promised. If its not delivered, then I'll take it as an indication that Bioware no longer has any control over their brand, or products, and will treat them the same way I treat all other EA subsiduaries.

Modifié par Bogsnot, 12 avril 2012 - 03:28 .

[TheBlackBaron]

[quote]Bogsnot wrote...

[quote]Lenimph wrote...

[quote]Bogsnot wrote...

Not for those who dont play MP. We were promised that we would be able to get the best possible ending without MP, which has been shown to be false.
So, in essence, past decisions end up not having any impact on EMS or War Assets, because no matter what we do, we cannot receive the ending we were promised.

You may not like it, but its the truth. Bioware did not deliver on what they promised.
[/quote]

You can using that APP thing and that other game... but yeah it still sucks but MP  isn't the only way to get your EMS up... 

[/quote]

Except for the fact that we were promised we could get the best possible ending playing SP, not "get the best possible ending by playing SP, and using Facebook games and Apples apps".[/quote]

[/quote]

That's not relevant to the claim here that past decisions don't have an effect on the ending, the most commonly cited complaint of false advertising, and the one specifically being addressed by the BBB. Use that cerebral cortex of yours and you might figure that out. 

Modifié par TheBlackBaron, 12 avril 2012 - 03:32 .

[Lenimph]

#1 Facebook has nothing to do with raising your EMS...

#2 I said it sucks didn't I? I hate the fact that you have to meta game to raise your EMS but I used my 2 free days of xbox live to get it up and moved on with my life. I do hope that it gets fixed in the future, but at least there's an option their for people who detest MP

[Dudeman315]

Opsrbest wrote...

An American court can't impose anything on a Canadian Branch. They can impose it on the American version of the branch but all EA would have to do is shut down that branch and they are free to continue to ignore it. Jurisdiction is very important on things like this.

For example NCSoft and Tera.

Sure they can'timpose anything on a company in another country, ask Kim Dotcom about his Mega uploads site.

Not that I think this case is something that would win in court.

[Overule]

Opsrbest wrote...

Overule wrote...

http://www.escapistm...d-Mass-Effect-3

(Forgive Andy Chalk's now -as always- slightly smug and irritating tone.)

There's where I first spotted the story. To all the people deriding the FTC complaints: HAH.

In all seriousness though, this is a pretty big step. Having *anyone* officially state promises were made and broken regarding the nature of the game by Bioware is a win for Retake/Line Holders.

OP as a reminder, you also need to edit your post.

No I don't. I edited the title, that was my first and only **** up. I can laugh derisively at people who choose to complain about certain things all I ****ing want, thanks much.

[UnstableMongoose]

BBB is trollin' hard in the paint for pageviews.

[Bogsnot]

[quote]TheBlackBaron wrote...

[quote]Bogsnot wrote...

[quote]Lenimph wrote...

[quote]Bogsnot wrote...

Not for those who dont play MP. We were promised that we would be able to get the best possible ending without MP, which has been shown to be false.
So, in essence, past decisions end up not having any impact on EMS or War Assets, because no matter what we do, we cannot receive the ending we were promised.

You may not like it, but its the truth. Bioware did not deliver on what they promised.
[/quote]

You can using that APP thing and that other game... but yeah it still sucks but MP  isn't the only way to get your EMS up... 

[/quote]

Except for the fact that we were promised we could get the best possible ending playing SP, not "get the best possible ending by playing SP, and using Facebook games and Apples apps".[/quote]

[/quote]

That's not relevant to the claim here that past decisions don't have an effect on the ending, the most commonly cited complaint of false advertising, and the one specifically being addressed by the BBB. Use that cerebral cortex of yours and you might figure that out. 
[/quote]

Past decisions are just one aspect of how the advertising was wrong. Multiple promises were given, and broken.
Use that cerebral cortex of yours to understand that this is more than just a single issue that people have with the game.

Simple rule of advertising. If you cant back up your claim, either dont make it, or given a retracttion, and apology, prior to the product going to market.

[Molenir]

There is a winnable case here. For the simple reason, you can go back and look at all the interviews done by the developers. Interviews which promised multiple endings, endings in which your choices would impact the closing story. Do I really need to rehash some of the claims made by developers? Bioware could try to claim that these were individuals promoting the game they were working on, and that they were not speaking for Bioware. However given the nature of the claims, the publicity etc, its very doubtful that that would hold up.

[Xerxes52]

Well, the BBB doesn't have any government powers. Now if the FTC found Bioware/EA guilty of false advertisement, that would be a completely different can of worms for the company.

Although, the BBB's statement does add an air of legitimacy to the claim.

Modifié par Xerxes52, 12 avril 2012 - 04:27 .

[Metalrocks]

it sure made my day when i read this article. now if this also takes action, it will make my year. but now bioware really cant ignore it. we are still pissed and want the ending we have been promised. not an extended ending which doenst make any sense what so ever.
i want this stupid brat child out, like he never existed.

[clone wars]

this website http://www.bigshinyr.../archives/39435 i seen on google

[InvincibleHero]

It is a blog post made by someone that works for the BBB. It is not an offical finding. They tend to agree with consumers most of the time and BW obviously did not submit any defense to the filings. This means nothing. She also said technically as in well if I really massaged the definition I could see where a person might have their issue.

Nowhere does it mention if she palyed the game to make an evaluation. If not then what evoidence was used? IE that of the complainat that is biased towards I'm right BW/EA wrong.

I am not saying it might not eventually work out to be false advertising but if it does then things will get worse. Devs will relase next to nothing in real info and we may just get demos or not to evaluate games before we buy them. So if this winds you might kill the industry as a consequence because any dev can be sued for small reasons because if you only have to prove one technicality then they are all guilty.

[Wynteryth]

Opsrbest wrote...

EternalAmbiguity wrote...

xsdob wrote...

Oh great, now tell me how you plan for an American governmental institution to fine a Canadian branch of a company for claims it made. Also, who you plan to send into the 5 to 8 year waiting period of getting the case to court, and to than convince the judge to not throw the case out, all while raking up large amounts of legal fees, and hoping to god EA doesn't drag the process out an additional 20 years.

EDIT: so it's just the same BBB story as the other, well isn't that just great, all you have to do is replace the term "govermental institution" with "grop who actually have no power at all in this matter" and it all still makes sense.

No ****e, people don't understand the court system and big corps.

Edit: curses, I'd hoped to get that past. Oh well. Point still stands.

An American court can't impose anything on a Canadian Branch. They can impose it on the American version of the branch but all EA would have to do is shut down that branch and they are free to continue to ignore it. Jurisdiction is very important on things like this.

For example NCSoft and Tera.

First off, EA is an American Company.  So, just because it was a "Canadian Branch" doesn't mean diddly when it comes to court.  It will affect the parent company.  Secondly, the Court can and has imposed sanctions on companies who have tried to get out of paying fines stipulated by the courts.  Thirdly, ANY smart lawyer would include the parent company as part of the lawsuit to ensure that money is paid.  Fourth, a smart lawyer sees the name EA and knows that they are just another big Computer Company waiting to get smacked.  One only has to look at Microsoft and Apple to know that it's coming.  And, on this sort of thing, it IS something that the government could very easily get involved in. Particularly since it would fall under international trade and it would be them taking EA to court.  

Don't write off the BBB weighing in negatively on Bioware and EA.  While they aren't a "government agency", they are looked on very favorably by the FTC and have used BBB rulings as evidence previously.  

[thunderhawk862002]

InvincibleHero wrote...

It is a blog post made by someone that works for the BBB. It is not an offical finding. They tend to agree with consumers most of the time and BW obviously did not submit any defense to the filings. This means nothing. She also said technically as in well if I really massaged the definition I could see where a person might have their issue.

Nowhere does it mention if she palyed the game to make an evaluation. If not then what evoidence was used? IE that of the complainat that is biased towards I'm right BW/EA wrong.

I am not saying it might not eventually work out to be false advertising but if it does then things will get worse. Devs will relase next to nothing in real info and we may just get demos or not to evaluate games before we buy them. So if this winds you might kill the industry as a consequence because any dev can be sued for small reasons because if you only have to prove one technicality then they are all guilty.

Not really.  Most people recognize that things change in development.  However, when things change what they say in the interviews should change as well.  This is especially important when the development period is finished and the game has gone gold.  It would be like Nintendo advertising their realistic zelda game from the gc era all the way up until release.  Then when people actually boughtthe game they get cel shaded wind waker.  I can only imagine what would have happened if Nintendo did that.

[FlamingBoy]

BBB does how connections with canada and therefore can "touch" a canadian company. also i would have though bioware would be multi-national now

[InvincibleHero]

thunderhawk862002 wrote...

Not really.  Most people recognize that things change in development.  However, when things change what they say in the interviews should change as well.  This is especially important when the development period is finished and the game has gone gold.  It would be like Nintendo advertising their realistic zelda game from the gc era all the way up until release.  Then when people actually boughtthe game they get cel shaded wind waker.  I can only imagine what would have happened if Nintendo did that.

Mark my words it will have a chilling effect on dev and player relationships. They will show screenshots and release carefully parsed bits of text/commentary. No one will say anything remotely actionable and we all lose because we'll be even more in the dark about games because someone felt they were entitled to a better ending than they got.

[addiction21]

It was the opnion of a person that works at many of the BBB places. On the blog section.

Come back when they make an actual ruling then there might be something to it.

[thunderhawk862002]

InvincibleHero wrote...

thunderhawk862002 wrote...

Not really.  Most people recognize that things change in development.  However, when things change what they say in the interviews should change as well.  This is especially important when the development period is finished and the game has gone gold.  It would be like Nintendo advertising their realistic zelda game from the gc era all the way up until release.  Then when people actually boughtthe game they get cel shaded wind waker.  I can only imagine what would have happened if Nintendo did that.

Mark my words it will have a chilling effect on dev and player relationships. They will show screenshots and release carefully parsed bits of text/commentary. No one will say anything remotely actionable and we all lose because we'll be even more in the dark about games because someone felt they were entitled to a better ending than they got.

Well that's the developers own fault.  Don't make claims about the game that are barely considered to be true.  If you advertise that there will be dozens of fighters in the game don't put 12 in and expect no one to be upset.  If you say the game comes with a free dlc, don't be surprised when people get upset about it when you don't actually do it (Battlefield 1943).    So if you're game converges into three basic endings don't state the opposite and expect everything to be dandy.  People disliked Windwaker's graphics when it first came out, but at least Nintendo didn't hide it.

[AJRimmsey]

addiction21 wrote...

It was the opnion of a person that works at many of the BBB places. On the blog section.

Come back when they make an actual ruling then there might be something to it.

why bother to wait ?

when the idiots can simply say "BBB has come out against bioware"

they dont need there to be any actual statement or proof from BBB,all they need is to say it enough times and the sheeple just follow suit.

EVEN when the BBB site clearly states they have nothing on bioware.

Its not about proof,its just about ranting on this forum

Modifié par AJRimmsey, 12 avril 2012 - 05:21 .