439 réponses à ce sujet

[Drake_Hound]

Scott2998 wrote...

All this over a blog

From a PR rep (Director of Communications)

Who hasn't even played the game

Anyone remember that time when the supposed 'expert' went on Fox News to report that there are explicit, wild sex scenes in ME1? Then come to find out she never even played the game to begin with?

Maybe that person did play the game .. that is the big difference , in your opnion that person didn´t play the game.
Maybe that person did play the game , decided to act in frustration to it .

See here is the big difference in your argument .
Sorry if you believe FOX then sadly .. eh you also believe afghanistan is over right , occupy is dead ...
And libeya is now free and done .

All those things you can easily find on the internet if you were INTERESTED in it .
So don´t say cause somebody does something , it has no meaning .

[Father_Jerusalem]

Drake_Hound wrote...

Scott2998 wrote...

All this over a blog

From a PR rep (Director of Communications)

Who hasn't even played the game

Anyone remember that time when the supposed 'expert' went on Fox News to report that there are explicit, wild sex scenes in ME1? Then come to find out she never even played the game to begin with?

Maybe that person did play the game .. that is the big difference , in your opnion that person didn´t play the game.
Maybe that person did play the game , decided to act in frustration to it .

See here is the big difference in your argument .
Sorry if you believe FOX then sadly .. eh you also believe afghanistan is over right , occupy is dead ...
And libeya is now free and done .

All those things you can easily find on the internet if you were INTERESTED in it .
So don´t say cause somebody does something , it has no meaning .

Her blog post said she hadn't played the game. Her source for verification of the "false advertising" was that she read it on websites on the internet. Those are statements she, herself, made.

[Scott2998]

Drake_Hound wrote...

Scott2998 wrote...

All this over a blog

From a PR rep (Director of Communications)

Who hasn't even played the game

Anyone remember that time when the supposed 'expert' went on Fox News to report that there are explicit, wild sex scenes in ME1? Then come to find out she never even played the game to begin with?

Maybe that person did play the game .. that is the big difference , in your opnion that person didn´t play the game.
Maybe that person did play the game , decided to act in frustration to it .

See here is the big difference in your argument .
Sorry if you believe FOX then sadly .. eh you also believe afghanistan is over right , occupy is dead ...
And libeya is now free and done .

All those things you can easily find on the internet if you were INTERESTED in it .
So don´t say cause somebody does something , it has no meaning .

The blogger didn't play the game, you can google that.

The point I was making about the Fox News report was to point out the absurdity of listening to someone who hasn't even taken the time to to review the product. She's going by word of mouth. 

[Drake_Hound]

Scott2998 wrote...

Drake_Hound wrote...

Scott2998 wrote...

All this over a blog

From a PR rep (Director of Communications)

Who hasn't even played the game

Anyone remember that time when the supposed 'expert' went on Fox News to report that there are explicit, wild sex scenes in ME1? Then come to find out she never even played the game to begin with?

Maybe that person did play the game .. that is the big difference , in your opnion that person didn´t play the game.
Maybe that person did play the game , decided to act in frustration to it .

See here is the big difference in your argument .
Sorry if you believe FOX then sadly .. eh you also believe afghanistan is over right , occupy is dead ...
And libeya is now free and done .

All those things you can easily find on the internet if you were INTERESTED in it .
So don´t say cause somebody does something , it has no meaning .

The blogger didn't play the game, you can google that.

The point I was making about the Fox News report was to point out the absurdity of listening to someone who hasn't even taken the time to to review the product. She's going by word of mouth. 

Scott let say the person is right , sorry it is the wording and advertisement that is wrong .
Cause it also shows Casey Hudson to take new PR lessons , what you can say what you cannot say in the media.
It teaches young up coming stars , that there words are not god and they cannot play around with wording so easily .

Cause in 2 occasions he has already being busted with lies .
While Lies doesn´t mean much for modern day casual gamers , Bioware stil has the old fanbase .
Where you cannot state one thing and then pretend your nose is bleeding .

It is a bit a lesson about the difference between a good troll and noob troll .
Is that the good troll remembers what he said or promised , a noob troll doesn´t .

[Scott2998]

If the blogger is right then the BBB will make an official statement. I assure you it won't be first posted on a blog.

[Embrosil]

Captian Cornhole wrote...

It's absurd how people have come to the point where they get butthurt over a video game.

It is absurd how people come to accept a false advertisement and a fault product as a standard.

[foo man chew]

Who cares the people who are praising bioware are acting just as insane as the people bashing bioware.I mean the real question people should be asking themselves is why are you getting worked up over a company.Seriously if this was somebody talking about a family member or friend i can understand but this is getting as childish as what console is the best.Its a video game company people need to stop defending them like its their mother.

[Drake_Hound]

The whole issue is that normal Fans or PR predictate fans will not .
1 Go to the FCT or BBB .
2 Will not gather 80k donations .
3 Will be appeased by 2 free DLC .
4 Will just move on and let the franchise die .

These are all very big royal F up of PR system .
Cause of underestimating there fanbase also the disconnect between what they percieve as fanbase , and what is really there fanbase .

That is what is the big problem here , In a MMO it is easier to predict the fanbase .
Cause they are selfishe entitled whinning brat .
But in a singleplayer game , it is a much wider spectrum for analysis .
Most of those people do not come onto the mess of a forum .

Modifié par Drake_Hound, 13 avril 2012 - 07:07 .

[fruton]

aLucidMind wrote...

Embrosil wrote...

Captian Cornhole wrote...

It's absurd how people have come to the point where they get butthurt over a video game.

It is absurd how people come to accept a false advertisement and a fault product as a standard.

I think most of the acceptance stems from a subconcious expectation of being exploited by the industry due to the extremely little amount of regulation the gaming industry has.

It hink after this clusterf***, that will change...

[Father_Jerusalem]

aLucidMind wrote...

Father_Jerusalem wrote...

aLucidMind wrote...

Father_Jerusalem wrote...

Kuari999 wrote...

Father_Jerusalem wrote...

So what you're saying is, if you skip stuff, or do the MP (which, again, is the only credible claim of lying that can be attributed to BioWare and should be rectified immediately), it's different than if you don't do either of those things? As in... not an "A, B, C ending" after all?


Mass Effect 3 Endings Guide - HEAVY SPOILERS 

Not A, B, C.

Its only barely different, if that, and there were specific statements regarding specific events, so they lead people to believe that these events had more effect then they really did, making it false advertising by its legal definition.  Look it up.

It's still different enough to not be quantified as an "A, B, C ending". There are multiple variations that refute that claim. Again, your expectations =/= BioWare lied.

*Snip* Link to Post: social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/323/index/11325710/15#11348277

And this is a very reasonable position, one which I understand wholeheartedly. Believe me when I say my expectations were very high as well, are the endings, as is, enough to meet those expectations? Clearly not. But they are enough to satisfy me. Even if we got no more DLC at all in the Mass Effect universe, I would still be content. But I DO understand where people are coming from, and I do try to explain WHY I'm content when people are actually interested and polite instead of demanding, so that maybe they can see my point of view. I won't try to force anyone to agree with me, but I'm willing to at least show them a different point of view.

If someone just flat out doesn't LIKE the ending, that's completely acceptable to me. We all have different tastes, that what makes this community great. While I may not have agreed with #Retake's position early on, I was more than willing to support them in the Child's Play donation drives because helping kids is ALWAYS a good thing. 

But things like filing complaints with the FTC and the BBB, threatening lawsuits, harrassing other people for disagreeing, putting up billboards... that kind of behavior is, to me, over the line. And that's what I take issue with.

Has BioWare's PR fumbled the ball in a lot of cases? Absolutely. That the MP sticky was allowed to stay for so long, in spite of overwhelming evidence that that claim was a lie, is asinine. It really is. I enjoy BioWare's games. All of them. And what I worry about is that people at BioWare are going to see all this massive outrage and just decide to stop making groundbreaking games and go to boring, insipid, forumlaic pieces of crap because they're "safe".

There's a quote from one of my favorite shows, The West Wing, that is how I feel about BioWare: "If we're gonna walk into walls, I want us running into 'em full speed." I don't WANT BioWare to play it safe, I want them to continue to take risks and make innovative, epic games. And I'm just worried that that won't happen anymore. That's why I defend them.

Thats why I don't call you a troll lol. You should put this post's link in your sig or something as proof your opinion is heartfelt and not trolling XD. Too many can't tell the difference between someone who is just genuinely aggrivated and someone who is a troll. Part of it is the typical gang mentality on both sides; so eager to assign people to the other side despite attempts at being impartial. I remember this being part of my argument in a paper I wrote a while back as to why I feel that, by nature, humans are incapable of truly functioning in a democratic nature. Which is why so many, especially online, belittle and make it seem like who they are talking to are less than a person; they don't see another person, they merely see a human (hope that makes sense lol).

I worry about the same thing when it comes to game industry; I don't want them to feel afraid to innovate and try to push the envelope or break the mold. I love the more unique games; like Assassin's Creed. I love the spin they put on history and how incredibly accurate they manage to stay and how often they maintain that accuracy. Some of the spins can be taken as controversial if one wishes to take them that way. I do fear that the unique stories will stop, but there will always be a group that just says "F*** it!" and go for the unique stories instead of sticking to a homogenous mentality. But I also feel that the gaming industry has far too little regulation for how big it is.

I think the one person filing at FTC and the person/people filing complaints to BBB are fine. It is a natural part of business to have people wanting to complain and even go to official channels like those two. The lawsuits, that isn't really too far because they have no standing. If they want to hire a lawyer and cost themselves money to lose a lawsuit, fine by me lol. Harrassing people generally just annoys me as well and I thought the billboard was rather idiotic. But it would be somewhat amusing to see "I hate the ending" and "I love the ending" billboards lining the interstate lol. The minor stuff like the cupcakes, I thought that was fine. I saw it more like a method of informing them of what the problems were while the cupcakes being a sign of good faith they can and will fix it, despite being a jab at Hudson. Then again, I'm relatively indifferent to both sides of the issue; I always try to stay neutral regardless of my standing.

And thank you for understanding where I'm coming from and not being quick to call people trolls. I wish there were more people like you - on BOTH sides of the discussion. You can disagree with someone, vehemently even, yet still be able to have conversations with them.

[Ket-Bo]

Scott2998 wrote...

If the blogger is right then the BBB will make an official statement. I assure you it won't be first posted on a blog.

Well that's the thing. The BBB doesn't have any Official Capacity. It is a private Organization.

[Kuari999]

Father_Jerusalem wrote...

And this is a very reasonable position, one which I understand wholeheartedly. Believe me when I say my expectations were very high as well, are the endings, as is, enough to meet those expectations? Clearly not. But they are enough to satisfy me. Even if we got no more DLC at all in the Mass Effect universe, I would still be content. But I DO understand where people are coming from, and I do try to explain WHY I'm content when people are actually interested and polite instead of demanding, so that maybe they can see my point of view. I won't try to force anyone to agree with me, but I'm willing to at least show them a different point of view.

If someone just flat out doesn't LIKE the ending, that's completely acceptable to me. We all have different tastes, that what makes this community great. While I may not have agreed with #Retake's position early on, I was more than willing to support them in the Child's Play donation drives because helping kids is ALWAYS a good thing. 

But things like filing complaints with the FTC and the BBB, threatening lawsuits, harrassing other people for disagreeing, putting up billboards... that kind of behavior is, to me, over the line. And that's what I take issue with.

Has BioWare's PR fumbled the ball in a lot of cases? Absolutely. That the MP sticky was allowed to stay for so long, in spite of overwhelming evidence that that claim was a lie, is asinine. It really is. I enjoy BioWare's games. All of them. And what I worry about is that people at BioWare are going to see all this massive outrage and just decide to stop making groundbreaking games and go to boring, insipid, forumlaic pieces of crap because they're "safe".

There's a quote from one of my favorite shows, The West Wing, that is how I feel about BioWare: "If we're gonna walk into walls, I want us running into 'em full speed." I don't WANT BioWare to play it safe, I want them to continue to take risks and make innovative, epic games. And I'm just worried that that won't happen anymore. That's why I defend them.

The billboard I would agree is over the line, but the FTC and BBB complaints are legitimate whether you like them or not, for whatever reason you dislike them.  If BioWare kneejerks in response, yeah, that's an issue, but I sure as hell am not going to blame the customer for that or get on their asses because of my fear of it.  They choose how they react to things.  A bad reaction on their part is a bad reaction on their part, no matter who triggers it.  No one is asking them to not take risks, but they sure as hell are telling them not to be blatantly misleading again.  To be blunt, whether you believe it or not, I don't pull out false advertising complaints whenever I hate something.  There's specific reasons for it here.  At this point, I'm not going to convince you otherwise, but I DID read up on the law to be sure of a few aspects.  Frankly the next step would be to find examples of cases that are similar to this if I really wanted to convince you, but to be honest?  I really don't see the point in that.  It seems you're pretty stuck on the position and just don't get the difference between opinioniated hype like "Riveting!" and all that grabage, and hype on the basis of giving misleading facts.

EDIT: Not to mention its currently pointless...  they are already taking corrective action specifically on the misleading facts involving the ending, so really, if anyone tried to sue, it'd be thrown out simply because of that.

Modifié par Kuari999, 13 avril 2012 - 03:59 .

[I99I Dragoon]

Brats. They don't agree with something and starting ****ing till they get what they want. What the **** did their parents teach them?

[bennyjammin79]

retic wrote...

 http://m.computerand..._medium=twitter

I have come to respect the opinions of many ME fans who hated the endings...but this is just too much. Does this mean we are now welcoming the age of "tour guide" gamerism, where whiners actually can force game developers everywhere to make changes on something they don't agree with? 

Yeah it's pretty lame but pitifully funny as well. Who has the time for this? 

[Kuari999]

bennyjammin79 wrote...

Yeah it's pretty lame but pitifully funny as well. Who has the time for this? 

About anyone who has time to post on a forum...  so clearly you have time as well!  Was that supposed to be an insult?

[streamlock]

retic wrote...

 http://m.computerand..._medium=twitter

I have come to respect the opinions of many ME fans who hated the endings...but this is just too much. Does this mean we are now welcoming the age of "tour guide" gamerism, where whiners actually can force game developers everywhere to make changes on something they don't agree with? 

Oh FFS.  Get off of it.  Any developer can make any game, any way they please.  (Bar copyright infringement, it physically damaging a console/PC, or stuff like that).  And either change it or not change it for whatever reason.  Or no reason.  This does not change that.

The issue the BBB put a piece out on is false advertisement.  A product was billed as being or doing one thing, and it did another.  It was sold under false pretenses.  There is nothing more to it than that.

The only thing that it means 'we are welcoming' is a day an age where the video game entertainment industry, and to a larger extent the software industry as a whole is held to the same standard other buisnesses have been held to for decades.  It's about damn time.

The scyophantic rage on anything and everthing calling out EA/Bioware on their cooporate BS is reaching American political commentary proportions.  Even by interweb standards.

[thunderhawk862002]

I99I Dragoon wrote...

Brats. They don't agree with something and starting ****ing till they get what they want. What the **** did their parents teach them?

My parents taught me never to mislead or lie to people.  Not to mention not shutting myself off in my own little world when I have problems.

[william.munden]

well if it hurts ea in any way at all then i approve

[Scott2998]

Ket-Bo wrote...

Scott2998 wrote...

If the blogger is right then the BBB will make an official statement. I assure you it won't be first posted on a blog.

Well that's the thing. The BBB doesn't have any Official Capacity. It is a private Organization.

I made that point ten pages ago, but no one seems to care. Make no mistake I'm with you 100% on that. 

This conversation, though, is about a BBB blog that people seem to view as the BBB's official stance on the subject.