283 réponses à ce sujet

[TexasToast712]

 No.

[PaperAlien]

Nerf the good ones, buff the bad ones, whatever. Just get a decent balance into this game.

[Rodia Driftwood]

bloodDragon80 wrote...

nasonia wrote...

bloodDragon80 wrote...

Sdrol117 wrote...

bloodDragon80 wrote...

Sdrol117 wrote...
Nope, people whining for nerfs in a co-op name just need to get over themselves. Buff weapons that suck so people can have fun with them, dont nerf every gun because you don't like how awesome people are with it. Don't like it, don't use it. There is no competition in this game, there is no reason to whine about things other people use. Hold on, let me write your rebuttle for you:

Waaaaah his gun is better than mine Bioware nerf it naooooo. 

how about you not put words in my mouth F*********

You do realize name calling makes you look like a whiny child who isn't getting his way right? 

thats cool bro

Something, again, that makes a person look like a silly/whiny child. 

how very fascinating please continue

Also talking like an classy person does't exactly make you a smart person.

[ArkkAngel007]

Killahead wrote...

Completely agree with the OP.

Not surprised that all the ADHD kids call this a wall of text, nor by the fact that they don't have the faintest idea about balance or why it is needed. Most of them would gladly take a tactical cloak buff reducing the cooldown to a nanosecond, and why not a rapid fire Widow while were at it. Variety keeps the game fresh. This game does a good job at enforcing teamwork, but could have been even better if the cloak sniper shots had been useful only when dealing with the biggest and baddest enemies. And a weapon that gives you a 200% cooldown bonus should have some more drawbacks than the Carnifex currently has.

And the prize for stupidest argument goes to all those who say that balance isn't at all needed in a PvE game. Wow.

No balance, no fun. Also: Hard game = fun. Make game harder. Nerf some of the weapons rather than buffing the rest.

Insutling the other party: check.

Ignoring the issues brought up by others on nerfs: check.

Believes a game has to be hard to be fun: Missing the point.

The OP is upset over a weapon that many found to be a great alternative, despite it not being the best in it's category and that it already has shortcomings to it.  Tactical cloak is also not just about laying out high damage output in a single/two actions.  That's only 1/4 of what that ability is for.  The cooldown is lengthy enough for those who are going for objectives, saving hides, and relocating, which is what a good Infiltrator should be doing.

All the OP is concerned about is how much damage and the rate of kills that these objects are capable of, which quite frankly calls out the OP being one of those who can't stand any other way then their own to get scores that don't even matter in the end.  

Every class has their strength and weaknesses.  Same with weapons.  As many have stated, BioWare was a bit too eager to nerf so many aspects while at the same time buffing the enemy.  As this happens, the useless weapons continue to be useless.  What happens when suddenly, nothing is effective?  Obviously, that will be the best day for you, as it will present the ultimate challenge in your solo run on Gold.  Yet, for the rest of us, we just want to enjoy playing the game without bloodying up our keyboard and getting kicked from lobbies so that the "hardcore" and "elite" can do things the hard way or the easy way, instead of having a middle ground.

[bloodDragon80]

Rodia Driftwood wrote...
Also talking like an classy person does't exactly make you a smart person.

very cool stuff indeed

[James D Sidious]

@OP

how about, NOOOOOOO.

[vonSlash]

ArkkAngel007 wrote...
All the OP is concerned about is how much damage and the rate of kills that these objects are capable of, which quite frankly calls out the OP being one of those who can't stand any other way then their own to get scores that don't even matter in the end.  

Every class has their strength and weaknesses.  Same with weapons.  As many have stated, BioWare was a bit too eager to nerf so many aspects while at the same time buffing the enemy.  As this happens, the useless weapons continue to be useless.  What happens when suddenly, nothing is effective?  Obviously, that will be the best day for you, as it will present the ultimate challenge in your solo run on Gold.  Yet, for the rest of us, we just want to enjoy playing the game without bloodying up our keyboard and getting kicked from lobbies so that the "hardcore" and "elite" can do things the hard way or the easy way, instead of having a middle ground.

I think you completely misunderstood what kind of player I am.

The purpose of nerfing the Carnifex is just to make a few other alternative weapons equally viable, instead of having one weapon that is the best weapon in most situations for 5/6 of the classes. I'm just trying to promote weapon variety, but the only way to do that is change the current weapon balance, since some are too weak and some are too strong. What I want to see is a situation where for the same class, different weapons will work better with different builds instead of one weapon working best for virtually all builds.

From that, I'm not sure how you managed to characterized me as a Gold-soloing control freak.

[Xaijin]

Knight JEM wrote...

No. Stop "nerfing" and diminishing the game.

[monkeybusinessIU]

You want to nerf the Carnifex? Go ahead. No skin off my nose.

But you keep your dirty hands off my Tactical Cloak.

There is no more useful power from both an individual as well as a team perspective.

Individual: cloak, headshot, profit. Just that simple.
Team: Objective deep behind enemy lines? Cloak, run, complete objective. Teammate down? Cloak, revive. Geth Primes bearing down on you with pulse cannons? Cloak, energy drain, headshot, and now it's half dead with no shields and stunned. Turrets got you pinned down? Cloak, energy drain, one shot, gone. Entire team except for you dead on Wave 8? Cloak, run, headshot everyone until they're dead.

[Darkslayer557]

no, they already did make it MUCH heavier. Buff the other weapons instead.

[Distilled Poison]

@Rodia- Don't bother arguing with blood. He's just another 13 year old who goes to 9gag and thinks he's a meme expert troll. People like him are the cancer of the internet.

[ArkkAngel007]

vonSlash wrote...

ArkkAngel007 wrote...
All the OP is concerned about is how much damage and the rate of kills that these objects are capable of, which quite frankly calls out the OP being one of those who can't stand any other way then their own to get scores that don't even matter in the end.  

Every class has their strength and weaknesses.  Same with weapons.  As many have stated, BioWare was a bit too eager to nerf so many aspects while at the same time buffing the enemy.  As this happens, the useless weapons continue to be useless.  What happens when suddenly, nothing is effective?  Obviously, that will be the best day for you, as it will present the ultimate challenge in your solo run on Gold.  Yet, for the rest of us, we just want to enjoy playing the game without bloodying up our keyboard and getting kicked from lobbies so that the "hardcore" and "elite" can do things the hard way or the easy way, instead of having a middle ground.

I think you completely misunderstood what kind of player I am.

The purpose of nerfing the Carnifex is just to make a few other alternative weapons equally viable, instead of having one weapon that is the best weapon in most situations for 5/6 of the classes. I'm just trying to promote weapon variety, but the only way to do that is change the current weapon balance, since some are too weak and some are too strong. What I want to see is a situation where for the same class, different weapons will work better with different builds instead of one weapon working best for virtually all builds.

From that, I'm not sure how you managed to characterized me as a Gold-soloing control freak.

Unfortunantly, it's been the pattern since the subject has been discussed on this forum.  I am sorry if it wasn't the case, and I didn't mean for it to be that extreme of an angle, but the hard=fun struck that chord for some reason.

I'd rather just give the carnifex a slightly higher weight if it needed to be nerfed (or even better, decrease the accuracy a tad) if BioWare went that route.  It would solve most of the issues.  Not a great deal, but enough to discourage some of the more...power-prone classes.  Again, not enough as the OP is suggesting, but enough so it isn't quite the crazy train weapon for already crazy train classes.  Instead of 200% cooldown, perhaps 170%.  Not huge, but enough to strike the right balance.  The accuracy thing is up in the air.  Quite frankly I've gotten so used to the BW that I don't like using the Carnifex to pull headshots, but I remember it being very easy before I obtained the BW.

The issue is though is that the majority of the weapons in the game are, quite frankly, not very effective.  And that is why so many don't like what they are hearing from the OP, because it isn't a negative feedback system, but a positive one.  Nerfing the player's weapons and abilities, or leaving them be, while buffing the enemies has been BioWare's mantra, and it is a factor in why the multiplayer has such a narrow line of effective play.  Further nerfs would lead to a greater change in that unwanted direction.

Instead, as many have tried to state, buff some weapons enough to even the field in the weapon roster.  Sure, let there be a few standouts in their respective field and situational use, but no longer will they be the only path.  No, it isn't a call to make everything overpowered to where Gold becomes a thing of the past, but enough to give other players with certain preferences a chance instead of playing to a mold.

Modifié par ArkkAngel007, 13 avril 2012 - 05:00 .

[bloodDragon80]

Distilled Poison wrote...

@Rodia- Don't bother arguing with blood. He's just another 13 year old who goes to 9gag and thinks he's a meme expert troll. People like him are the cancer of the internet.

tehe

Modifié par bloodDragon80, 13 avril 2012 - 05:00 .

[Dr Derp]

The carnifex, I agree with but not with a major nerf maybe just a bit more weight

However...

vonSlash wrote...

 And while you're at it, nerf Tactical Cloak too.

This you can take it and shove it where it came from: up your ass

Modifié par Dr Derp, 13 avril 2012 - 05:06 .

[EVani]

staindgrey wrote...

Sdrol117 wrote...

staindgrey wrote...

Carnifex isn't even the best pistol.

Phalanx is. 

Surprisigly, in the hands of the right user, the Phalanx is so godly overpowered for a common. That gun should be a rare. 

I agree. While the Carnifex is definitely more powerful without question, I love the Phalanx's quicker firing. Add a barrel and scope, and it's a better rapidfire sniper than the actual multi-shot snipers.

If we are going along those lines, don't forget the eagle. About the same as Phalanx but full automatic.

[Sdrol117]

EVani wrote...

staindgrey wrote...

Sdrol117 wrote...

staindgrey wrote...

Carnifex isn't even the best pistol.

Phalanx is. 

Surprisigly, in the hands of the right user, the Phalanx is so godly overpowered for a common. That gun should be a rare. 

I agree. While the Carnifex is definitely more powerful without question, I love the Phalanx's quicker firing. Add a barrel and scope, and it's a better rapidfire sniper than the actual multi-shot snipers.

If we are going along those lines, don't forget the eagle. About the same as Phalanx but full automatic.

It might just be me, but that's exactly why I hate the eagle XD 

[Tranquiescent]

Sdrol117 wrote...

Tranquiescent wrote...

A pistol that out damages 90% of the other guns.

And has a very slow rate of fire and holds very little bullets compared to 90% of other guns.

I'll keep that in mind when I'm whimpering in the corner with an arc pistol and a GPR. 

[dios.mio]

Read this whole "beautiful" thread and I liked this comment the best:

dgumb wrote...

Here's the thing about nerfing: the cycle cannot be broken.

If you nerf whatever weapon/loadout the min/maxers are using they'll find the next best combo and use that, and they'll still own compared to other players. So, what do you do then? Nerf that combo. Then the min/maxers will find the next best setup and own with that, and then what? Nerf!

I've seen this happen in so many games, and it always sucks. The fact is, people that care to, will always crunch the numbers and find the optimal build for ownage and leave everyone else behind. It can't be avoided. If you keep nerfing whatever works best, eventually you're left with a game that sucks equally for everyone. Why forum complainers always want this, and seem oblivious to the eventual outcome, is really beyond me.

If this truly is about giving out more choice in arsenal - buff guns, don't nerf them! - it won't make the game any easier because let's say other guns (on same rarity or lower rarity with higher rank) would get the same result as Carnifex does now.

If you nerf the top gun, you make the game harder for the whole community and not everyone is a solo Gold farmer on every map and enemy combination - and if you are, you can use weaker weapons/classes that aren't OP to give it a bigger challenge...

I just fail to see any advantage to nerfing the fex in comparisson to buff other weapon choices.

[Sdrol117]

Tranquiescent wrote...

Sdrol117 wrote...

Tranquiescent wrote...

A pistol that out damages 90% of the other guns.

And has a very slow rate of fire and holds very little bullets compared to 90% of other guns.

I'll keep that in mind when I'm whimpering in the corner with an arc pistol and a GPR. 

So why would you be dumb enoough to take 2 of the worst gun games into battle at once? Your own fault. 

[bloodDragon80]

dios.mio wrote...

Read this whole "beautiful" thread and I liked this comment the best:

dgumb wrote...

Here's the thing about nerfing: the cycle cannot be broken.

If you nerf whatever weapon/loadout the min/maxers are using they'll find the next best combo and use that, and they'll still own compared to other players. So, what do you do then? Nerf that combo. Then the min/maxers will find the next best setup and own with that, and then what? Nerf!

I've seen this happen in so many games, and it always sucks. The fact is, people that care to, will always crunch the numbers and find the optimal build for ownage and leave everyone else behind. It can't be avoided. If you keep nerfing whatever works best, eventually you're left with a game that sucks equally for everyone. Why forum complainers always want this, and seem oblivious to the eventual outcome, is really beyond me.

If this truly is about giving out more choice in arsenal - buff guns, don't nerf them! - it won't make the game any easier because let's say other guns (on same rarity or lower rarity with higher rank) would get the same result as Carnifex does now.

If you nerf the top gun, you make the game harder for the whole community and not everyone is a solo Gold farmer on every map and enemy combination - and if you are, you can use weaker weapons/classes that aren't OP to give it a bigger challenge...

I just fail to see any advantage to nerfing the fex in comparisson to buff other weapon choices.

the other weapons should be buffed but then the carnifex should get some kind of nerf the pros of the carnifex heavily outweigh the cons

[Sdrol117]

bloodDragon80 wrote...

dios.mio wrote...

Read this whole "beautiful" thread and I liked this comment the best:

dgumb wrote...

Here's the thing about nerfing: the cycle cannot be broken.

If you nerf whatever weapon/loadout the min/maxers are using they'll find the next best combo and use that, and they'll still own compared to other players. So, what do you do then? Nerf that combo. Then the min/maxers will find the next best setup and own with that, and then what? Nerf!

I've seen this happen in so many games, and it always sucks. The fact is, people that care to, will always crunch the numbers and find the optimal build for ownage and leave everyone else behind. It can't be avoided. If you keep nerfing whatever works best, eventually you're left with a game that sucks equally for everyone. Why forum complainers always want this, and seem oblivious to the eventual outcome, is really beyond me.

If this truly is about giving out more choice in arsenal - buff guns, don't nerf them! - it won't make the game any easier because let's say other guns (on same rarity or lower rarity with higher rank) would get the same result as Carnifex does now.

If you nerf the top gun, you make the game harder for the whole community and not everyone is a solo Gold farmer on every map and enemy combination - and if you are, you can use weaker weapons/classes that aren't OP to give it a bigger challenge...

I just fail to see any advantage to nerfing the fex in comparisson to buff other weapon choices.

the other weapons should be buffed but then the carnifex should get some kind of nerf the pros of the carnifex heavily outweigh the cons

It doesn't need a nerf. The pros of any good gun outweigh the cons. Thats the point of the gun not sucking. Just like the GPS, BW, Widow, javelin, valient, phalanx, claymore, disciple, and every other gun in the game. You use them because pros outweigh cons. Duh. 

Modifié par Sdrol117, 13 avril 2012 - 05:13 .

[Dr-Rai1]

I don't know you but I hate you for suggesting this. I wanna do this to you

[bloodDragon80]

Sdrol117 wrote...
It doesn't need a nerf. The pros of any good gun outweigh the cons. Thats the point of the gun not sucking. Just like the GPS, BW, Widow, javelin, valient, phalanx, claymore, disciple, and every other gun in the game. You use them because pros outweigh cons. Duh. 

it makes pretty much every other gun useless

[Tranquiescent]

Sdrol117 wrote...

Tranquiescent wrote...

Sdrol117 wrote...

Tranquiescent wrote...
A pistol that out damages 90% of the other guns.

And has a very slow rate of fire and holds very little bullets compared to 90% of other guns.

I'll keep that in mind when I'm whimpering in the corner with an arc pistol and a GPR. 

So why would you be dumb enoough to take 2 of the worst gun games into battle at once? Your own fault. 

Think it through... We almost have a winner...

Modifié par Tranquiescent, 13 avril 2012 - 05:25 .

[Sdrol117]

bloodDragon80 wrote...

Sdrol117 wrote...
It doesn't need a nerf. The pros of any good gun outweigh the cons. Thats the point of the gun not sucking. Just like the GPS, BW, Widow, javelin, valient, phalanx, claymore, disciple, and every other gun in the game. You use them because pros outweigh cons. Duh. 

it makes pretty much every other gun useless

Far from it. The BW, and Widow are two examples that clearly outclass the carnifex in damage. You pose no actual arguments besides crying the Carnifex is good without posing any actual back up arguments to why it needs a nerf besides that it's good. No point in talking to you anymore. Adios.