167 réponses à ce sujet

[jango111]

What I want to know is why Shepard hasn't been promoted yet.

[Little Princess Peach]

jango111 wrote...

What I want to know is why Shepard hasn't been promoted yet.

she/he died and was with T.l.M. no roo  for promotion and then Shepard gets locked up for blowing up a colony

[SeismicGravy]

Tali-vas-normandy wrote...
But in ME1 Kaidan says that he and shep are both marines so can you change to the Army after being a Marine how dose that work?

What about a transfer?

With the Normandy SR-1 destroyed, and with him believing that Shepard died, what's to stop him from requesting a transfer from the Navy to the Marine Corp?

I'm not military so I don't know, but if it were possible it would explain things.

[Little Princess Peach]

SeismicGravy wrote...

Tali-vas-normandy wrote...
But in ME1 Kaidan says that he and shep are both marines so can you change to the Army after being a Marine how dose that work?

What about a transfer?

With the Normandy SR-1 destroyed, and with him believing that Shepard died, what's to stop him from requesting a transfer from the Navy to the Marine Corp?

I'm not military so I don't know, but if it were possible it would explain things.

But what I am saying is that he was not Navy to start with he clearly says he and Shep are both marines not Navy unless its the same thing Im not an expert on this ><

[Farbautisonn]

The officers in charge of the defense of earth committee acting like civillians ganpressed into service from a latte shop.

A member of N7/Seal Team Six, a highyly specialized tactical infantry unit, telling the comittee we are beyond tactics and strategy....

Whoever wrote this crap never ever served in any mans army and seems to have forgotten ever Crichton and Clancy novel ever published.

[Han Shot First]

Tali-vas-normandy wrote...

jango111 wrote...

What I want to know is why Shepard hasn't been promoted yet.

she/he died and was with T.l.M. no roo  for promotion and then Shepard gets locked up for blowing up a colony

Posthumous promotions are not unheard of for war heroes who are killed in action. If the ME universe were real, Shepard would probably have been posthumously promoted for his heroics at the Battle of the Citadel, as well as staying behind to get every possible survivor off the stricken Normandy SR1.

The real reason Shepard isn't promoted is that 'Commander' became too iconic, to the point where it basically became part of his or her name. So he doesn't get promoted for the same reason that Master Chief doesn't get a battlefield commission to 2nd Lieutenant or Ensign.

That being said, IIRC Shepard is simply referred to as 'Commander' throughout the entirety of Mass Effect 3. Unless I'm mistaken, I don't believe there is a single instance in ME3 where he is called Lt. Commander, either in dialogue or in the codex. So I just head canon that he was posthumously promoted from Lt. Commander to Commander, following the destruction of the Normandy SR1.

Tali-vas-normandy wrote...

But in ME1 Kaidan says that he and shep are both marines so can you change to the Army after being a Marine how dose that work?

The Alliance military isn't divided into seperate services, like real world militaries are. The Alliance military combines the functions of a land-based army, a space-faring navy, and Marines into a single service. So Shepard and Kaidan are both Alliance Navy *AND* Marines.

Rather than being a seperate service, Marines in the Mass Effect universe seem to be an occupational field of the Alliance Navy. My guess would be that anyone who joins the Alliance Navy and serves in a ground-combat related military occupational speciality (infantry, armor, artillery, combat enginneers, biotics, ect) are also considered Marines.

Modifié par Han Shot First, 13 avril 2012 - 10:15 .

[fealhach]

Maybe his folks christened him 'Commander'. He could be a commodore for all we know.

[l7986]

the left handed salutes. how do you let something so basic to the military as a salute get messed up.

[GothamLord]

l7986 wrote...

the left handed salutes. how do you let something so basic to the military as a salute get messed up.

Its artistic...??? 

[Han Shot First]

l7986 wrote...

the left handed salutes. how do you let something so basic to the military as a salute get messed up.

I'm not sure how they bungled that. That hand salutes are always performed with the right hand is fairly common knowledge even for people without any military experience.

[spacehamsterZH]

Alexein wrote...

This is case where "Artistic license" can be invoked. Even if it's wrong its a minor detail to overlook when making a story.

If you want to nitpick you can argue the much more glaring scientific problem of stable element zero being scientifically impossible and mass effects fields being space magic.

Can't say I agree with you there. The ME universe is meant to be a possible real-world future, and while any sci-fi of this type will have impossible technology, typically at least to explain FTL space travel, that basically amounts to space magic dressed up in pseudo-scientific mumbo-jumbo, keeping everything else consistent with reality goes a long way towards helping the audience's suspension of disbelief. And getting military ranks right and keeping them consistent, and making sure your characters all salute with your right hand is pretty easy to get right.

Does anyone know what the etiquette is for soldiers of different countries addressing one another? Aside from the left-handed salutes (which stand out like a sore thumb to me, and I've never been in the military, nor do I particularly care about military etiquette, I actually think it's all kind of silly), what always kind of bothers me is the turian soldiers saluting Shepard. That soldiers from another planet would just happen to use the same salute as humans is strange to begin with, that they'd salute a human officer is even weirder.

[Awookie]

Spectre automatically nullifies ranks.

[Little Princess Peach]

spacehamsterZH wrote...

Alexein wrote...

This is case where "Artistic license" can be invoked. Even if it's wrong its a minor detail to overlook when making a story.

If you want to nitpick you can argue the much more glaring scientific problem of stable element zero being scientifically impossible and mass effects fields being space magic.

Can't say I agree with you there. The ME universe is meant to be a possible real-world future, and while any sci-fi of this type will have impossible technology, typically at least to explain FTL space travel, that basically amounts to space magic dressed up in pseudo-scientific mumbo-jumbo, keeping everything else consistent with reality goes a long way towards helping the audience's suspension of disbelief. And getting military ranks right and keeping them consistent, and making sure your characters all salute with your right hand is pretty easy to get right.

Does anyone know what the etiquette is for soldiers of different countries addressing one another? Aside from the left-handed salutes (which stand out like a sore thumb to me, and I've never been in the military, nor do I particularly care about military etiquette, I actually think it's all kind of silly), what always kind of bothers me is the turian soldiers saluting Shepard. That soldiers from another planet would just happen to use the same salute as humans is strange to begin with, that they'd salute a human officer is even weirder.

probably to show respect and not let some sort of diplomatic inccident from forming

[GothamLord]

As for the rank thing a Major in the Marines is a O-4 Officer rank.  A Commander in the Navy is a O-5. So Shepard would still outrank Kaidan. I generally try and ignore the weird rank structure of the Codex. Ashley if she survives is a Lieutenant Commander which is also a O-4 rank but Navy. At at least puts both her and Kaidan on even footing for promotion levels.

Ashley going from Marine Corp themed enlisted rank as a Gunnery Chief (doesnt really exist)  to a Navy Officer rank is far more confusing than Kaidan getting promoted a single rank.

Modifié par GothamLord, 13 avril 2012 - 10:35 .

[ploppy54]

Awookie wrote...

Spectre automatically nullifies ranks.

my shepard wasn't a spectre at that point has told them to stick it in ME2 the only reason why shepard gets command of the Normandy again and placed in charge of the mission is because the reapers are attacking and he/she is only one who has had first hand experiance dealing with them "the **** you done...hell you even spoke to one"  Had the reapers not attacked earth Anderson was going to use it has his mobile command ship.

Modifié par ploppy54, 13 avril 2012 - 10:38 .

[TjM78]

I would just assume fictional space military rankings are different

[chevyguy87]

Giskler wrote...

You have to keep in mind that we're talking about a fictional unified extrasolar human military organization roughly 200 years in the future. Things dont have to be exactly like they are today.

Well said.

[T1l]

Raseri wrote...

The kicker?  Towards the end of the game, on 6 separate occasions, there were military giving left handed salutes. 

At no point in my career has it ever been acceptable to throw a left handed salute, either. If you're incapable of popping a salute with your right hand, you simply brace up instead. I noted this as well, OP, and it made me rage.

[Awookie]

ploppy54 wrote...

Awookie wrote...

Spectre automatically nullifies ranks.

my shepard wasn't a spectre at that point has told them to stick it in ME2 the only reason why shepard gets command of the Normandy again and placed in charge of the mission is because the reapers are attacking and he/she is only one who has had first hand experiance dealing with them "the **** you done...hell you even spoke to one"  Had the reapers not attacked earth Anderson was going to use it has his mobile command ship.

No one is as capable as Shepard.  Whether his decisions are good or not, the Alliance needs him.  Plus, he does get reinstated. 

[Escocido]

First, the customs of the 21st Century US of America don't necessary apply to a space faring future. Maybe it is not wrong to salute with the left hand in the Alliance Military, or maybe you NEED to salute with the left hand in some social circumstances, who knows. In any case, lots of assumptions.

Second, since the Normandy left Earth Shepard was given command of the Normandy and, as a war hero and the person who knows most about the reapers, is in practice acting as an admiral. He still recognizes Hackett as his superior officer, but he is commanding forces way beyond his rank, you can see that in the final battle. From what I understood he was given some sort of field promotion, his rank has not gone up because there was no time for paperwork.

Modifié par Escocido, 13 avril 2012 - 10:47 .

[Warden130]

T1l wrote...

Raseri wrote...

The kicker?  Towards the end of the game, on 6 separate occasions, there were military giving left handed salutes. 

At no point in my career has it ever been acceptable to throw a left handed salute, either. If you're incapable of popping a salute with your right hand, you simply brace up instead. I noted this as well, OP, and it made me rage.

It may not be acceptable today but things can change in 200 years.

[GothamLord]

chevyguy87 wrote...

Giskler wrote...

You have to keep in mind that we're talking about a fictional unified extrasolar human military organization roughly 200 years in the future. Things dont have to be exactly like they are today.

Well said.

Obviously said by non-military individuals.   Those that have been prior service or those that are currently active military would likely argue that military tradition is a very important thing to be maintained.  Obviously of course though the Alliance is a global organization, rather than just United States so rankings getting mixed on that scale is going to become screwy.

Proper right handed salutes though I could never see being changed.   Unless of course a right handed salute is like throwing up a middle finger based on Turian culture.  Maybe it was changed after the First Contact War. 

Modifié par GothamLord, 13 avril 2012 - 10:52 .

[chevyguy87]

GothamLord wrote...

chevyguy87 wrote...

Giskler wrote...

You have to keep in mind that we're talking about a fictional unified extrasolar human military organization roughly 200 years in the future. Things dont have to be exactly like they are today.

Well said.

Obviously said by non-military individuals.   Those that have been prior service or those that are currently active military would likely argue that military tradition is a very important thing to be maintained.  Obviously of course though the Alliance is a global organization, rather than just United States so rankings getting mixed on that scale is going to become screwy.

Left handed salutes though I could never see being changed.   Unless of course a right handed salute is like throwing up a middle finger based on Turian culture.  Maybe it was changed after the First Contact War. 

It's a video game seriously it doesn't have to follow ranks and regulations armed forces abide by in reality. I have several friends who are in the service who have played this game. They told me that they did not take notice to the salute at all and one of them is a Marine. 

[Grimwick]

kelsjet wrote...

Raseri wrote...

Giskler wrote...

So if a General from the Army comes on board a frigate hes suddenly in charge and the Commander has to salute him first?

I'm not a military buff, but I thought everyone has to salute the officer in command of a vessel first when they are on board it regardless of their difference in rank.

To answer your question simply: Yes

Wrong.

Army and Navy are two separate branches. A higher ranking Army officer does not assume command of a Navy asset if no higher or equal equivalent rank of the Navy is present.

Instead, the highest ranking navy officer is in charge of the vessel.

I'm not sure what you think you are talking about, but you are dead wrong. You say you are ex-military, but your basic lack of understanding on chain of command across different branches of the armed forces leads me to believe you are full of ****.

Kaidan is a major in the Army. Shepard, whilst being a Commander, is still the highest ranking Alliance Navy officer aboard the Normandy. Hence, he is in charge.

Free Advice: Go read up on the facts before you start "ZOMG PLOTHOZLEZ ******** ********" screaming.

They are part of the alliance navy so i don't see your point....

[Han Shot First]

Escocido wrote...

First, the customs of the 21st Century US of America don't necessary apply to a space faring future. Maybe it is not wrong to salute with the left hand in the Alliance Military, or maybe you NEED to salute with the left hand in some social circumstances, who knows. In any case, lots of assumptions. 

I have to disagree with you there, because saluting with the right hand is not just protocol for Western militaries. It is in fact an ancient and deeply ingrained tradition in all human cultures. The modern military salute evolved from an ancient version where people would raise their right hand (the sword hand) to show that they were not brandishing naked steel. (or bronze, if you want go back further)

Unless for some bizarre reason left hand dominance has become far more common than right in the Mass Effect universe, people should still be saluting with the right hand.

A left-handed salute is just as 'off' as shaking hands with the left.

Modifié par Han Shot First, 13 avril 2012 - 11:02 .