1057 réponses à ce sujet

[Hawk227]

AtlasMickey wrote...

Key part of the first game, not so much as the second. In the third game it wasn't even mentioned until the final scne with TIM. The MO of the Reapers had changed to full harvest and the importance of indoctrination as a tactic had diminished.

Pffft.

Kaidan/Ashley says Udina was indoctrinated. An Email tells you Rana Thanoptis was indoctrinated. The Prothean VI mentions Indoctrination several times. Javik talks about it all the time. Especially if you bring him on missions.

Less explicitly, the game deals with reaper control in a bunch of missions. The Ardat Yakshi temple, The Rachni, The Geth. The mission at Sanctuary is all about Reaper Control and how to subvert it.

I'm sure there's more. That was just off the top of my head.

[dreman9999]

OdanUrr wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

OdanUrr wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

 

Didn't I just mention that I have the audio files?<_<

So....Which one of your compinion laughs like a marader?

I thought we were talking about the whispers?

That is a whisper.

[dreman9999]

Hawk227 wrote...

AtlasMickey wrote...

Key part of the first game, not so much as the second. In the third game it wasn't even mentioned until the final scne with TIM. The MO of the Reapers had changed to full harvest and the importance of indoctrination as a tactic had diminished.

Pffft.

Kaidan/Ashley says Udina was indoctrinated. An Email tells you Rana Thanoptis was indoctrinated. The Prothean VI mentions Indoctrination several times. Javik talks about it all the time. Especially if you bring him on missions.

Less explicitly, the game deals with reaper control in a bunch of missions. The Ardat Yakshi temple, The Rachni, The Geth. The mission at Sanctuary is all about Reaper Control and how to subvert it.

I'm sure there's more. That was just off the top of my head.

There's also the the monistry mission with Samaria and the pts Asari commando inthe hospital.

[Myskal1981]

IronSabbath88 wrote...

Myskal1981 wrote...

IronSabbath88 wrote...

Who the HELL wouldn't play through a FREE DLC?

Seriously... it's FREE. That means no charge...

People wouldn't play that?

So I guess you also download every single available free game there is on the internet just because it is free?
You also download every single free software?

People move on, they lose interest, they have better things to do with their time, they just don't want to bother anymore with ME3. Only because something is free won't change that.

Then sorry to say but they aren't true fans if they aren't willing to give BioWare a 2nd chance through DLC that costs you nothing.

Maybe.
Let's assume ME3 sold 4 million copies.
1) Do you think all 4 million are true BW fans? My guess is no.
2) Do you think all 4 million will download the Extended DLC? My guess is no.
3) Do you think that many of those 4 million would buy a Bioware product again if they liked ME3? My guess is yes.
4) Do you think it is wise to alienate many of those 4 million by putting a ****ty ending on the disk? Especially if you answered questions 1) and 2) with no?

The last question for me is the decisive one. ME3 was not made just for true Bioware fans. It was also made to attract new players both to the ME universe as well as to Bioware in general. You risk to lose your new clients before you even made them true Bioware fans. Not a sound business strategy at all.

[dreman9999]

ajm317 wrote...

IronSabbath88 wrote...

Who the HELL wouldn't play through a FREE DLC?

Seriously... it's FREE. That means no charge...

People wouldn't play that?

First of all you're assuming that once people beat ME3 they actually think about it again.  A lot of them won't.

Second of all a lot of console players don't have their systems hooked up to the internet, so DLC isn't an option.

For example according to this site:

http://www.trueachie...-2-xbox-360.htm

Only 29,000 people got any of the achievements for the Kasumi download pack.

Compare with 73,000 who got the most common achievement.

So less than 50% even touched that DLC.

Zaeed and the Cerberus Network downloads, which I think came with the game were around 44k.

...Wait, your saying everyone that go ME2, regestered at an acheivment site?

[Sero303]

STEEEEVE wrote...

I don't like IT because
1.) It's unfalsifiable
2.) The devs have made numerous statements that they want the ending to stand on its own, not be a metaphor
3.) I don't like fan fiction, and that's literally all IT is. BAD fan fiction at that.
4.) Indoctrination theory makes Shepard's story incomplete, which is exactly the opposite of what ME3 is. It's the conclusion of Shepard's story. IT people will say "well bioware lied about all this other stuff" sorry, but that doesn't fly. Their word still has more authority towards lore than your fan fiction.


Basically, no matter what you want to believe, it could not be more clear that the Developers did not make Mass Effect 3 with the idea of ending it like Indoctrination says it ends.  If it's not Bioware's story, it's not 'real' in the sense of the universe.  The end.

There is some basis for IT in the canon of ME, if you pay attention, and considering Indoctrination has literally been a key and vital part of the story since Shepard encoutnered the beacon on Eden Prime, I would say its more than just some poorly written fan fiction.
As far as IT making Shepards story incomplete, I disagree, if the IT holds true its merely the end of this part of his story, a DLC will wrap it up nicely if written correctly and even if IT makes the story "incomplete" isn't it already "incomplete"? (ie Shepard takes a breath in concrete rubble)...

[EpyonX3]

balance5050 wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

Myskal1981 wrote...

Finding holes in Indoctrination Theory ingame will be difficult as seen throughout this thread, but how about holes outside the game? What is the reason for Bioware to intend IT, deliver an uncomplete ending and suffer through such backlash and continously state that these are the real endings?

The holes are not hard to find.

http://www.youtube.c...?v=lqCFkTEAM-8.

So having to turn on free fly camera mode to show things that the player was never supposed to see is easy to find?? The cables they show in that video don't have the same texture as theShepard alive scene.

You don't need freecam to see them. it just makes it clearer. If you look up at the control and destory options you'll see them all.

Of course the textures are different, the last scene is CG and the ones in game are not.

[Hawk227]

ajm317 wrote...

IronSabbath88 wrote...

Who the HELL wouldn't play through a FREE DLC?

Seriously... it's FREE. That means no charge...

People wouldn't play that?

First of all you're assuming that once people beat ME3 they actually think about it again.  A lot of them won't.

Second of all a lot of console players don't have their systems hooked up to the internet, so DLC isn't an option.

For example according to this site:

http://www.trueachie...-2-xbox-360.htm

Only 29,000 people got any of the achievements for the Kasumi download pack.

Compare with 73,000 who got the most common achievement.

So less than 50% even touched that DLC.

Zaeed and the Cerberus Network downloads, which I think came with the game were around 44k.

To be fair, the Kasumi DLC sucked. I wish I could return it. It even reviewed poorly. What about the Shadow Broker, Overlord or The Arrival? Those were much better.

[ajm317]

dreman9999 wrote...

ajm317 wrote...

IronSabbath88 wrote...

Who the HELL wouldn't play through a FREE DLC?

Seriously... it's FREE. That means no charge...

People wouldn't play that?

First of all you're assuming that once people beat ME3 they actually think about it again.  A lot of them won't.

Second of all a lot of console players don't have their systems hooked up to the internet, so DLC isn't an option.

For example according to this site:

http://www.trueachie...-2-xbox-360.htm

Only 29,000 people got any of the achievements for the Kasumi download pack.

Compare with 73,000 who got the most common achievement.

So less than 50% even touched that DLC.

Zaeed and the Cerberus Network downloads, which I think came with the game were around 44k.

...Wait, your saying everyone that go ME2, regestered at an acheivment site?

No.

I'm saying that of the 73k ME2 players that site tracked only about half touched a free day 1 DLC.

Do you think that proportion is going to be bigger amongst the 360 population at large?  Surely not, since I assume anyone who registers at an achievement site is going to at least have a net connection on their console.

The EC DLC is not going to beat the roughly 50% adoption that Zaeed got.  More likely we're talking 25% or less.

Hawk227 wrote...

To
be fair, the Kasumi DLC sucked. I wish I could return it. It even
reviewed poorly. What about the Shadow Broker, Overlord or The Arrival?
Those were much better.

About the same.  27k for the Shadow Broker DLC achievements.

Modifié par ajm317, 14 avril 2012 - 01:06 .

[AtlasMickey]

KevShep wrote...

AtlasMickey wrote...

I'm not kidding about this:

Indoc is one big hole. It is the removal of something, not an addition or clarification. It's like that old riddle– what can you find at the bottom of a barrel, which makes the barrel lighter? A hole. What can you find at the end of Mass Effect 3 that makes the game emptier? Indoc.

And it's not a theory, it's theology. Not exaggerating.

What your saying is the opposite. Bioware is a genius, they are indoctrinating the player with shepard and the last 10 minutes of the game seem like a dream. What makes this interesting is that you can hear shepard's voice in the catalyst's own voice as a wisper. Use headphones to hear it by useing the right ear piece to hear maleshep and the left one to hear femshep.

Not at all. What you see as indoctrinating the player is just straight up lying to them, which in fictional storytelling amounts to wasting the player's time, because, newsflash, it's already fiction to start with. There are ways such a story could be told in an interesting way, involving misdirection and confusion, but this isn't what you guys claim. You have to claim that many high profile, richly meaningful events in the ending are not real.

The events don't seem like a dream. What kind of dreams do you have? Are they as raw, bloody, agonizing, heavy, and painful as that? Or are they the opposite, light, floaty, bloodless, and painless? More importantly, they are not even dreamlike in the context of the game, which has dream sequences in it! The visual cues for dream sequences in Mass Effect 3 are weaponless, clean, crisp autumn-like air, desaturated backgrounds, whispering voices echoing in background which appear in the subtitles, smokey apparitions for people in the periphery, among other things, none of which appear in the ending.

What is so far removed from genius is the notion that meaning and significance are somehow added to events in a story by changing them from reality to extended metaphor. It's already fiction. It can already be interepreted as metaphor. You can look at the ending as it is told, see a pattern and reflect on a sort of meta-signficance on how it is a metaphor for indoctrination. That's interesting. But to say that it must be a metaphor for Shepard, as if the protagonist himself has to be a reader of his own novel, is meaningless and stupid for its redundancy.

Modifié par AtlasMickey, 14 avril 2012 - 01:04 .

[EpyonX3]

dreman9999 wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

Hawk227 wrote...

KevShep wrote...

from oil shadows was only an example to how they conmunicate and has nothing to do with anything.

Second you did (in a way) mention Exo Geni when I said that she says shepard is fighting the ones responsible for souring the songs of there mothers, You were saying that it was not sovereign/reapers(indoctrination) and then you did not say what it was and the only thing other then the reapers that it could be is Exo Geni.

Third if you run into an asari in ME2 then she states it more clearly that it was the reapers. Any time that the songs of our mothers comes up it is shepard asking about the war!...not the ones that captured her.

QFT

The oily shadows thing comes up when you ask the queen about the original Rachni War. She says they only heard songs of discordance, the color of oily shadows.

www.youtube.com/watch Start at 3:35 for that line of questions.

In ME2 you meet an Asari on Illium who is working as an agent for the Rachni. She tells you that the Queen believes you(shepard) are fighting the ones responsible for the Rachni war, and pledges her help.

www.youtube.com/watch Start at 3:15 for that line

The Rachni were indoctrinated by Reapers and made to start the war. The Queen discribes that experience as songs the color of oily shadows.

PS: Exogeni because of the Thorian? The queen was actually held by Binary Helix. In case thats what you were thinking.

"he tells you that the Queen believes you(shepard) are fighting the ones responsible for the Rachni war, and pledges her help."

I don't think that's what she says. The quote is "we know you seek those who soured our mother's songs."

I agree that this sounds like Indoctrination, but Shepard isn't seeking reapers in ME2. He's seeking collectors, at which point (I'm guessing here) the link between them and the reapers weren't clear.

Oh my god......How are there people who still don't understand that the collecter are just tools for the reapers. They're one in the same. Collectors are prothean Husk.

This conversation ended already. You're late again Dreman. Yes this is Zero_epyon from System wars. Hiya!

[Hawk227]

EpyonX3 wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

Myskal1981 wrote...

Finding holes in Indoctrination Theory ingame will be difficult as seen throughout this thread, but how about holes outside the game? What is the reason for Bioware to intend IT, deliver an uncomplete ending and suffer through such backlash and continously state that these are the real endings?

The holes are not hard to find.

http://www.youtube.c...?v=lqCFkTEAM-8.

So having to turn on free fly camera mode to show things that the player was never supposed to see is easy to find?? The cables they show in that video don't have the same texture as theShepard alive scene.

You don't need freecam to see them. it just makes it clearer. If you look up at the control and destory options you'll see them all.

Of course the textures are different, the last scene is CG and the ones in game are not.

You cannot see those cables without free cam. They are on top of the destroy tank. Which is dark, way above you, and you can't explore it without activating a cut scene.

(Although, I agree they look similar to the Alive scene, I don't think its relevant because those cables are everywhere Reapers are. Including hooked into Legion)

[EpyonX3]

Myskal1981 wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

Myskal1981 wrote...

Finding holes in Indoctrination Theory ingame will be difficult as seen throughout this thread, but how about holes outside the game? What is the reason for Bioware to intend IT, deliver an uncomplete ending and suffer through such backlash and continously state that these are the real endings?

The holes are not hard to find.

http://www.youtube.c...?v=lqCFkTEAM-8.

What I meant was that IT-supporters can always say "This isn't real." or "Shep was not indoctrinated at this point.", so you cannot really grab them. I do see holes ingame, but none of those will be accepted by IT-supporters.

Oh then agreed. This makes them trolls without even knowing. They're....indoctrinated trolls!

Seriously though, it's really a bad excuse for all of the plot holes in the game.

[Myskal1981]

dreman9999 wrote...

1.Yes.....It's bluntly stated in the codex. And you have what rapid incotrination is wrong...That makes husk. That just done with dragons teeth. Rapid indoctrination leave the being with out a will. The crazed salarian has a will. Also, you need to reread my post....I state process of being indoctrinated. When the signs really show, it's too late, Shep is only are the early stages.

2.No, That's dedutive reasoning. The project Javik was part of was after their crucible fell and that VI that was used could sense indoctrinated agent....The project still was infiltrated by indoctrinated sleeper agents anyway.

1. Fair enough, I mentioned that it will be hard to refute by ingame events, because they leave so much open to interpretation.

2. Javik did not know that the catalyst was the Citadel, but the Prothean VI did. I deduce that Javik had no idea about the details of the crucible project and therefore Javik's project was not started after the crucible fell but rather in parallel. I furthermore deduce that the Prothean VI was stored on Thessia at the end of the crucible project as it basically knows the last detail of it. I therefore believe that the VI was upgraded to identify indoctrinated people in order to protect what was learned (that is even shown ingame).

[Hawk227]

ajm317 wrote...

Hawk227 wrote...

To
be fair, the Kasumi DLC sucked. I wish I could return it. It even
reviewed poorly. What about the Shadow Broker, Overlord or The Arrival?
Those were much better.

About the same.  27k for the Shadow Broker DLC achievements.

So, if this is a an accurate sample (big if) more people played kasumi than shadow broker!? That's a shame. Maybe the lameness of spending $10 on a useless squad member that does nothing but gossip alienated people to DLC entirely.

[EpyonX3]

Hawk227 wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

Myskal1981 wrote...

Finding holes in Indoctrination Theory ingame will be difficult as seen throughout this thread, but how about holes outside the game? What is the reason for Bioware to intend IT, deliver an uncomplete ending and suffer through such backlash and continously state that these are the real endings?

The holes are not hard to find.

http://www.youtube.c...?v=lqCFkTEAM-8.

So having to turn on free fly camera mode to show things that the player was never supposed to see is easy to find?? The cables they show in that video don't have the same texture as theShepard alive scene.

You don't need freecam to see them. it just makes it clearer. If you look up at the control and destory options you'll see them all.

Of course the textures are different, the last scene is CG and the ones in game are not.

You cannot see those cables without free cam. They are on top of the destroy tank. Which is dark, way above you, and you can't explore it without activating a cut scene.

(Although, I agree they look similar to the Alive scene, I don't think its relevant because those cables are everywhere Reapers are. Including hooked into Legion)

You can see them. The wrap around under the blocks. You can even make out the patterns on the blocks that were in the breathe scene. Look at the pic below, no flycam.

[Zweipersona]

[quote]Ariq wrote...

Whispers and oily shadows are mentioned. Sort of like you experienced in the dream sequences.
[/quote]

Not entirely.  There's no whispers in your head.  Shepard doesn't hold his head and suddenly hear Harbinger.  Oily shadows?  I remember hearing that from the videos I watched.  You could perceive them as 'oily shadows', sure, or as amibiguous figures of the sentients that have died in the war.  Shepard's dreams make just as much sense (if not moreso) if they are perceived from the eyes of a tortured soldier.  A child he couldn't save.  His nightmare progresses to seeing the shadows of all the people he can't or couldn't save.  The oily shadows quote is pretty far reaching, I doubt the spider looking Rachni perceive as we do.  

[quote]
No, the dream sequences made me think of Indoctrination, as did awakening in a dream state after being hit with Harbinger's beam. 
[/quote]

I can see both.  Though towards the end, I agree, it makes more sense for Shepard to be dreaming than for him to be actually crawling around.  But, well, the end is where all of ME3's storytelling goes to hell, so god only knows what we are meant to interpret.

[quote]
This is an unproven assertion. I see no reason to take it as a given. The chaotic evolution of organics may move in directions unpredictable by any synthetic intelligence. Biological singularity may be reached in some other fashion (biotics?) 
[/quote]

I did say it was unproven.  There's nothing chaotic about evolution.  Only asari have natural biotic ability.  The geth 'evolved' from simple machines to contemplating their own existence in a short (relatively) span of time.

[quote]
Undoubtedly? Legion says the Geth will be destroyed without the Reaper upgrades. 

There's a lot that follows that quote though.  The quarians started a strike on the Geth.  The geth had not yet maximized their potential as a species.  The Geth ship is destroyed after Legion disables its shields.  And the geth DID win their first war, there's no question about that.  That's confirmed in ME3, where it's implied if they had pursued, they could've destroyed the quarians.  But yes, it's ambiguous, which is why I think that entire section with Catalyst is just crap.  

[quote]
No. According to IT, the offers are a lie. Most everything Starchild (ahem, Harbinger) says is a lie. Why would they offer you control? They just laughed off TIM gaining control.
[/quote]

That would make sense.  But if it's ALL a lie, what's the purpose of what you're experiencing?  Do the Reapers die?  Don't they, regardless of what you do?

[quote]
Why would you assume that the Catalyst told you anything that was correct? He is the Lord of the Reapers. The villain behind the villains. The puppet master behind Harbinger's throne if he is not Harbinger himself. 
 [/quote]

That's also an assumption.  We don't really know what the Catalyst is, other than, well, what we see.  

[quote]
Because you haven't made it to the Citadel yet?[/quote]

I could see that.  I just don't see where the indoctrination would start and end.  If we take Shepard breathing as some form of evidence of where he might be, he certainly isn't on the Citadel.  But why would Bioware leave it at that?  If it was indoctrination, the next step is to let us continue and destroy the Reapers.

[dreman9999]

ajm317 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

ajm317 wrote...

IronSabbath88 wrote...

Who the HELL wouldn't play through a FREE DLC?

Seriously... it's FREE. That means no charge...

People wouldn't play that?

First of all you're assuming that once people beat ME3 they actually think about it again.  A lot of them won't.

Second of all a lot of console players don't have their systems hooked up to the internet, so DLC isn't an option.

For example according to this site:

http://www.trueachie...-2-xbox-360.htm

Only 29,000 people got any of the achievements for the Kasumi download pack.

Compare with 73,000 who got the most common achievement.

So less than 50% even touched that DLC.

Zaeed and the Cerberus Network downloads, which I think came with the game were around 44k.

...Wait, your saying everyone that go ME2, regestered at an acheivment site?

No.

I'm saying that of the 77k ME2 players that site tracked only about half touched a free day 1 DLC.

Do you think that proportion is going to be bigger amongst the 360 population at large?  Surely not, since I assume anyone who registers at an achievement site is going to at least have a net connection on their console.

The EC DLC is not going to beat the roughly 50% adoption that Zaeed got.  More likely we're talking 25% or less.

Hawk227 wrote...

To
be fair, the Kasumi DLC sucked. I wish I could return it. It even
reviewed poorly. What about the Shadow Broker, Overlord or The Arrival?
Those were much better.

About the same.  25k for the Shadow Broker DLC achievements.

Does it stat how many of those ME2 owners bought the game new, which would of given them the dlc for free?
Does every ME fan register at an acheivement site?(I know I didn't.)
Is this a consensus of every acheivement site, being that a person can use diffent acheivemnt sites?
What of the pc version?
What of the people who switched to the ps3 version which had all the dlc except for Arrival?


Really, before using it as a factor, question how accurate it is first? Why would we use it as a factor if it not a true concensus of every person who bought ME2?

[Hawk227]

Myskal1981 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

1.Yes.....It's bluntly stated in the codex. And you have what rapid incotrination is wrong...That makes husk. That just done with dragons teeth. Rapid indoctrination leave the being with out a will. The crazed salarian has a will. Also, you need to reread my post....I state process of being indoctrinated. When the signs really show, it's too late, Shep is only are the early stages.

2.No, That's dedutive reasoning. The project Javik was part of was after their crucible fell and that VI that was used could sense indoctrinated agent....The project still was infiltrated by indoctrinated sleeper agents anyway.

1. Fair enough, I mentioned that it will be hard to refute by ingame events, because they leave so much open to interpretation.

2. Javik did not know that the catalyst was the Citadel, but the Prothean VI did. I deduce that Javik had no idea about the details of the crucible project and therefore Javik's project was not started after the crucible fell but rather in parallel. I furthermore deduce that the Prothean VI was stored on Thessia at the end of the crucible project as it basically knows the last detail of it. I therefore believe that the VI was upgraded to identify indoctrinated people in order to protect what was learned (that is even shown ingame).

Upgraded is different than perfected.

Nevermind that shepard wasn't indoctrinated... yet.

[eran5005]

Every piece of "evidence" for the IT requires you to first believe the IT is true. 2nd - like many people said before me, the IT requires me to believe that BioWare purposefully developed an incomplete game and charged a complete (and even more) amount of money for it - That's unacceptable to me on any level of thought as a gamer and a consumer (and happily it's not true).
Besides, the stupid prothean VI on Thessia appears to be able to recognize indoctrinated people (as seen when Kai-Leng enters the shrine) and it has no problem with Shepard what so ever, so you have an in game, lore consistent fact that proves Shepard is not indoctrinated up to that point, and he/she can't be indoctrinated in the short time that passes between the shrine and the battle on London - not without ruining Shepard's mind completely - another in game lore consistent fact.

Modifié par eran5005, 14 avril 2012 - 01:10 .

[ajm317]

Hawk227 wrote...

ajm317 wrote...

Hawk227 wrote...

To
be fair, the Kasumi DLC sucked. I wish I could return it. It even
reviewed poorly. What about the Shadow Broker, Overlord or The Arrival?
Those were much better.

About the same.  27k for the Shadow Broker DLC achievements.

So, if this is a an accurate sample (big if) more people played kasumi than shadow broker!? That's a shame. Maybe the lameness of spending $10 on a useless squad member that does nothing but gossip alienated people to DLC entirely.

I agree that the accuracy is questionable, but it is going to be an overestimation, both because people who register there are going to have a net connection and because they're going to be "serious gamers".

So actual download rates will almost surely be lower than that.

dreman9999 wrote...
Does it stat how many of those ME2 owners bought the game new, which would of given them the dlc for free?
Does every ME fan register at an acheivement site?(I know I didn't.)
Is this a consensus of every acheivement site, being that a person can use diffent acheivemnt sites?
What of the pc version?
What of the people who switched to the ps3 version which had all the dlc except for Arrival?


Really,
before using it as a factor, question how accurate it is first? Why
would we use it as a factor if it not a true concensus of every person
who bought ME2?

See above.  It will almost certainly overestimate download rates, not understimate.

You're going to have to come up with a good argument to convince me otherwise.

Modifié par ajm317, 14 avril 2012 - 01:11 .

[OdanUrr]

My work has been done for me it would seem. The whispers in the dreams:

http://social.biowar...dex/10654432/12

[Hawk227]

EpyonX3 wrote...

You can see them. The wrap around under the blocks. You can even make out the patterns on the blocks that were in the breathe scene. Look at the pic below, no flycam.

From that distance you (I) cannot tell that those are the same cable. Only with the flycam can you get close enough to see the detail. Plus, I think its irrelevant, they are ubiquitous reaper cables. They're everywhere. Including hooked up to reaper controlled characters. It could just as easily be a sign that Shepard was being indoctrinated.

As for the marks on the citadel/stone. Considering how unlikely the player is to actually see them, its a clear cut opportunity for asset re-use.

Plus, the citadel is all metal alloy. The rubble in london is clearly concrete/stone. You can tell by how its broken and crumbly. Metal doesn't crumble.

[EpyonX3]

Hawk227 wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

You can see them. The wrap around under the blocks. You can even make out the patterns on the blocks that were in the breathe scene. Look at the pic below, no flycam.

From that distance you (I) cannot tell that those are the same cable. Only with the flycam can you get close enough to see the detail. Plus, I think its irrelevant, they are ubiquitous reaper cables. They're everywhere. Including hooked up to reaper controlled characters. It could just as easily be a sign that Shepard was being indoctrinated.

As for the marks on the citadel/stone. Considering how unlikely the player is to actually see them, its a clear cut opportunity for asset re-use.

Plus, the citadel is all metal alloy. The rubble in london is clearly concrete/stone. You can tell by how its broken and crumbly. Metal doesn't crumble.

It's because the image got shrunken down by the forum. Here's a link to the full sized image,

http://i43.tinypic.com/34f8g.png

[EpyonX3]

Here's a better pic. Look towards the center.

http://i39.tinypic.com/15zlhzr.png