554 réponses à ce sujet

[DRUNK_CANADIAN]

TLDR

[Kanon777]

Chrillze wrote...

Kanon777 wrote...

the leak from nov2011 said you COULD kill liara during the Udina Coup, but people here started complaining about that (calling it Virmire 2.0/terrible idea) and Bioware decided to remove it...

and NOW people are complaing that she can't be killed?!? LOL

 I also remember how people hated the "we fight or we die" quote from the leaked demo in 2011, they also complained about the "rpg mode" vs "action mode" in the leaked demo. Bioware removed both of those things in the main game (at least MY pc version had no rpg/action mode to choose).

Its things like that (also Da2:Legacy and DA2:MotA) that make me believe in Biowares hability to take feedback and give more of what players wanted  in the EC.

[Mr. Big Pimpin]

Sparatus wrote...

Also, Liara is literally the same character archetype as Tali. The shy, awkward girl.

Well, Tali doesn't spontaneously morph from that into an ruthless cold information broker, while Liara does. I tend to see that as a positive, though.

[Karrie788]

Sparatus wrote...

MrRag wrote...

I like Liara, but I wish I could have had those dialogues with Miranda (ME2 LI), who was absent literally the whole game! There was nearly no private dialogue with Ashley (my ME1 LI), which I still don't understand why.

My favorite thing about Ashley is how every character gets a unique scene that helps them grow as a character.

And Ash just gets drunk and passes out. That's it.

Mr. Big Pimpin wrote...
Well, Tali doesn't spontaneously morph
from that into an ruthless cold information broker, while Liara does. I
tend to see that as a positive, though.

Tali is one of the few characters that grows as a character in a logical, and not hamfisted way. Along with Wrex, Mordin, and Refund Guy.

Am I the only one who found that scene pathetic? She could have least called me up and we would have gotten wasted together.

Agreed on Tali.

[Vexille]

Chrillze wrote...

Xion66 wrote...

Chrillze wrote...

"Liara can't die, she must be the writers favourite character!!!" Well Hackett can't die either and I don't see you complaining about that. And does it REALLY matter if the writers like Liara more than say useless Ashley or stereotype shy girl Tali?

My post mentions nothing about Liara's 'immortality' as a character

I never talked about your post, I talked about the other whiners

name calling is always a sign of a strong argument

[joshko]

Interesting points about Cerberus. Honestly I was expecting Cerberus to be helping Shepard off the record until the end when Shepard would have to choose between Hackett's plan to beat the Reapers or TIM's.

[Mr. Big Pimpin]

Sparatus wrote...

Mr. Big Pimpin wrote...
Well, Tali doesn't spontaneously morph
from that into an ruthless cold information broker, while Liara does. I
tend to see that as a positive, though.

Tali is one of the few characters that grows as a character in a logical, and not hamfisted way. Along with Wrex, Mordin, and Refund Guy.

This is very true; I think the fact that Tali and Mordin didn't experience a writer switch between ME2 and 3 like virtually everyone else really helped towards that. Basically another reason why Weekes is the best.

MrRag wrote...

I like Liara, but I wish I could have had those dialogues with Miranda (ME2 LI), who was absent literally the whole game! There was nearly no private dialogue with Ashley (my ME1 LI), which I still don't understand why.

My favorite thing about Ashley is how every character gets a unique scene that helps them grow as a character.

And Ash just gets drunk and passes out. That's it.

Makes me glad I saved Kaidan. Although that feeling is somewhat lessened due to that engineering dialogue bug.

Modifié par Mr. Big Pimpin, 15 avril 2012 - 01:51 .

[Seboist]

Kanon777 wrote...

Chrillze wrote...

Kanon777 wrote...

the leak from nov2011 said you COULD kill liara during the Udina Coup, but people here started complaining about that (calling it Virmire 2.0/terrible idea) and Bioware decided to remove it...

and NOW people are complaing that she can't be killed?!? LOL

 I also remember how people hated the "we fight or we die" quote from the leaked demo in 2011, they also complained about the "rpg mode" vs "action mode" in the leaked demo. Bioware removed both of those things in the main game (at least MY pc version had no rpg/action mode to choose).

Its things like that (also Da2:Legacy and DA2:MotA) that make me believe in Biowares hability to take feedback and give more of what players wanted  in the EC.

If you import then you're locked into "rpg mode".

[Seboist]

joshko wrote...

Interesting points about Cerberus. Honestly I was expecting Cerberus to be helping Shepard off the record until the end when Shepard would have to choose between Hackett's plan to beat the Reapers or TIM's.

Problem with that is that it makes too much sense, doesn't involve retcons and respects player choice.

[Mr. Big Pimpin]

Sparatus wrote...

Arrival was pretty pointless too.

Hey you blew up that relay and pissed off every batarian. Now let's forget about that after the first five minutes of 3.

Arrival was really nothing more than a contrived excuse to push the reset button again; the minute Hackett told me I was going to have to go to Earth I figured that one out. It was pretty much Lazarus Project 2.0.

[Seboist]

Sparatus wrote...

Arrival was pretty pointless too.

Hey you blew up that relay and pissed off every batarian. Now let's forget about that after the first five minutes of 3.

The kicker is that if Shepard doesn't do it then Hackett sends marines to do it. 

Overlord is also completely pointless as well.  The Cerberus controlled Geth plot goes nowhere and if you keep David in the program then you get absolutely nothing from it.

[Kanon777]

Seboist wrote...
If you import then you're locked into "rpg mode".

Oh, didnt know about that lol. 

[joshko]

Seboist wrote...

Sparatus wrote...

Arrival was pretty pointless too.

Hey you blew up that relay and pissed off every batarian. Now let's forget about that after the first five minutes of 3.

The kicker is that if Shepard doesn't do it then Hackett sends marines to do it. 

Overlord is also completely pointless as well.  The Cerberus controlled Geth plot goes nowhere and if you keep David in the program then you get absolutely nothing from it.

But there are aesthetically pleasing views and organic life forms may wish to take note...

[sergio71785]

I understand that Liara gets used a lot in ME3 as Shepard's friend/emotional support because she's the only one who can't die, but that fact is irrelevent. When creating ME1 and ME2, and deciding between both games that they would make every character killable, they made a commitment. "Yes, everyone can die. Yes, that means that in the last game, many people may not have certain characters for their game. But that's okay. We'll put in the extra work and create character content that not everyone may see. It'll pay off, because everyone's journey will be unique."

Liara's excessive usage makes it clear that Bioware bit off more than it could chew when they made every other squadmate killable in the previous two games. If ME3 were better executed, the role of being Shepard's emotional support and close friend would be fulfilled by the player's LI or best buddy (determined by squad preference, I guess). But instead of that, we ended up getting Liara to fulfill that role, because it was just plain easier.

I really hated that my Shepard dedicated his final thought to Liara, when I really didn't have very strong feelings for her.

Modifié par sergio71785, 15 avril 2012 - 01:57 .

[Mr. Big Pimpin]

sergio71785 wrote...

I really hated that my Shepard dedicated his final thought to Liara, when I really didn't have very strong feelings for her.

I don't know what they were thinking when they designed that flashback thing, honestly. The game deciding for you who the most important people in Shepard's life were is something that should never be done.

[Karrie788]

Mr. Big Pimpin wrote...

sergio71785 wrote...

I really hated that my Shepard dedicated his final thought to Liara, when I really didn't have very strong feelings for her.

I don't know what they were thinking when they designed that flashback thing, honestly. The game deciding for you who the most important people in Shepard's life were is something that should never be done.

Well, after the nightmares focusing on the damn kid, I honestly wasn't surprised by the flashbacks.

[Wolven_Soul]

Xion66 wrote...

Mr.House wrote...

I don't care if Liara is a writers pet, she is still my fav character in the series

True, anyone who's a fan of her just wants to see more of her, but someone who isn't really into Liara/doesn't care about her just thinks:

"Why the **** is she always there, can't Tali or Wrex come hold my hand?'

I love Liara to death, but I can give you this.  People who do not like her as much should not be forced into having to always have her there like that.

[Aggie Punbot]

I really dislike the fact that Liara is forced on you a lot more than any other character in ME3.

Kaidan/Ashley: 1 (Mars)
James: 2 (Mars, Palaven)
Liara: 4 (Mars, Palaven, Thessia, Eden Prime)
Garrus: 1 (Palaven)
EDI: 1 (Cerberus Base)
Tali: 2 (Disable Dreadnaught, Reaper Base)

I mean, come on. Enough is enough.

Modifié par TS2Aggie, 15 avril 2012 - 02:05 .

[garf]

for me the most egregious 'writer's pets' were the vent kid and Kai Leng. It was an OOC pleasure not an IC one to kill him with contempt.

[HooblaDGN]

I love Liara, but I can definitely see your point there. She was my LI so it was no big deal, but my bro's LI was Miranda and he got totally shafted in ME3. That LI storyline is a pretty big deal.

With Liara as my LI the story was so close to greatness (despite ALL of its MANY problems) that I can't help but tear the ending to shreds and demand a new one (not this EC load of bullocks). So many great moments for the Liara storyline. Shame they're FORCED onto people.

For my brother with Miranda as LI, the experience was so much drastically worse that he just plain called the game a failure and stopped caring about it. To him, Miranda was on equal terms with Garrus as far as importance goes, and one of his favorite characters gets the off-screen treatment.

That is not good. We grow attached to these characters, and in ME3 it felt like a lot of them got second-class treatment.

Kai Leng is definitely a huge problem. Just so... forced? He was shoved in, poorly written, failed at every turn, and was just generally annoying.

And Cerberus as the primary antagonist of the game also felt terribly wrong. By the end of the game I was worried that the ending was going to be something about how Cerberus had split humanity and diverted too much attention away from the Reapers to the point that it was too late to stop them. Sigh, if only...

Starchild was definitely a problem, of course. Shame to hear that they cut a scene where Shepard contemplates his resurrection, it was one of the issues that kept being hinted at but that they never really dealt with very much.

Would have been good to have the nightmares based on former sacrifice/bad decisions AND the child. Building weight and such. In a way that IS there because of the voices, but I think that some of the lost should have been featured.

Modifié par HooblaDGN, 15 avril 2012 - 02:14 .