114 réponses à ce sujet

[astheoceansblue]

Disclaimer: originally this thread was made to praise the Geth SMG as a primer for TB application, but after testing I've found it to be too situational. 

It works great if your enemies are being funneled at a choke and you can hold down the fire button to spray and concentrate more on your Overload placement and picking the right target for your Tech Burst, I prefer it in these situations to weapons such as the Carnifax as you don't have to worry about clicking each individual shot and you can really concentrate on setting up the bursts. They also tear through shields.

However, for play where you're moving around more and enemies are coming from different directions, it just doesn't apply the effect fast enough unless you're using a higher rank  rail amp or ammo type. 

Anyway, I'm going to run some numbers and do some testing and see just how effective this thing really is in comparison to some of the more lauded weapons and come back to this. 

In the meantime, if you enjoy using these guns and want to make them more useful then try a set-up like:

Geth Engineer
Geth SMG - Disruptor ammo
Overload to set off Tech bursts primed by the ammo

It's fun, and makes the weapons like this much mroe useful, but there are currently more efficient methofs out there to praise this one too greatly. Hopefully Bioware will add some kind of benefit to guns like these, or buff them a little so they can become more effecitive overall.

Modifié par astheoceansblue, 15 avril 2012 - 06:55 .

[CNevarezN]

Hah, good shiet man. I'mma have to try it out! Thanks OP!

[datako12]

same as what i do with my soldier, except both GPR and geth smg (brings me up to over 1200 shots withou reloading, and thats not even counting the smg's heat sink) and then i spam concussive shot every 1.4s, tech bursts FTW!

edit. turns out those "waterguns" are good for something

also i think incendiary ammo might be able to set up fire explosions that same way. correct me if im wrong

Modifié par datako12, 14 avril 2012 - 07:45 .

[astheoceansblue]

 

CNevarezN wrote...

Hah, good shiet man. I'mma have to try it out! Thanks OP!

 

Np my friend. Have some fun with one of the most damaging combinations in the game! 

datako12 wrote...

same as what i do with my soldier, except both GPR and geth smg (brings me up to over 1200 shots withou reloading, and thats not even counting the smg's heat sink) and then i spam concussive shot every 1.4s, tech bursts FTW!

edit. turns out those "waterguns" are good for something

Exactly. 

People dismiss some of these thigns without even trying to understand them. If it's nto a one-shot killer, they dont' want to know.

-

Here's an example from a recent post of mine regarding this:

I was playing with a very competent SI on GOLD yesterday.We were chasing down final targets, and though we weren't speaking on the mic you could sense the competition in general. 
He was Widow V, good build, hitting most headshots.I was Geth Enginner, Geth SMG, leaving my drone for team-mates and not just going for kills.

SI scored 87k
I hit 81k.

Not so bad for a "watergun".

And while I did have to apply ammo types to this to keep up, I am playing a SUPPORT class that's not built to rack up the kills like an infiltrator. 

This is how configuring your build can work in your favour.

Modifié par astheoceansblue, 14 avril 2012 - 07:47 .

[datako12]

with my tech burst soldier set up, i ended up leading my team by 30k, course that was FBW geth, but still, i "supported" my way to the top, and my tech burst set up allows me to one man a wave if s**t hits the fan, theres nothing worse than wiping because the only guy left is only setup to work with others

edit. and actually until i figured out this tech burst soldier set up earlier tonight, i absolutely hated playing my soldier class, no matter what gun i used i found myself feeling rather unhelpful, then i grab one of the guns that is considered the most useless and now i love my soldier

Modifié par datako12, 14 avril 2012 - 08:08 .

[astheoceansblue]

 

datako12 wrote...

with my tech burst soldier set up, i ended up leading my team by 30k, course that was FBW geth, but still, i "supported" my way to the top, and my tech burst set up allows me to one man a wave if s**t hits the fan, theres nothing worse than wiping because the only guy left is only setup to work with others

 

Good example. Glad to see others making use of creative weapon builds.

-

Did a little search, here's a very decent list of combo-set up potential using various ammo types:
social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/343/index/9629730

Modifié par astheoceansblue, 14 avril 2012 - 08:09 .

[Mandalore313]

Okay.

But carnifex is still better if you do consistent headshots.

[datako12]

looks like disruptor ammo will be my main setup, followed by incendiary or cryo if i run out. @astheoceansblue, do you have any clue what rank the ammos are considered when part of a burst?

[tvih]

In my books the problem with this is that as you can't reliably buy a single type of consumable, you can't stay stocked on Disruptor ammo to use it in every match. Same goes for all Bonus consumables.

EDIT: Well, that and the fact that Hornet shoots fast enough for the same kind of use too, while doing a lot more damage by the actual shooting.

Modifié par tvih, 14 avril 2012 - 08:13 .

[lays12]

I was actually thinking about this earlier today and was wondering which ammo/skill combination would give tech bursts (if it was possible). Thanks for confirming this! Going to try this class out today.

[datako12]

tvih wrote...

In my books the problem with this is that as you can't reliably buy a single type of consumable, you can't stay stocked on Disruptor ammo to use it in every match. Same goes for all Bonus consumables.

EDIT: Well, that and the fact that Hornet shoots fast enough for the same kind of use too, while doing a lot more damage by the actual shooting.

true, that is a problem with this setup, but you can use 3 different types of ammos for tech burst setups, disruptor, incendiary and cryo

pshh, who uses their guns for actual damage, i'll stick to my water guns TYVM. but actually the GPR and the geth SMG are good for this because they are so accurate and stable, unlike your hornet. also, the hornet with clip mod V only houses 43 shots in the magazine and around 200 total. the GPR has a mag of 144 with the clip mod V and a total capacity of 600 shots. the geth SMG has a clip of 180 and a capacity of over 600 shots

Mandalore313 wrote...

Okay.

But carnifex is still better if you do consistent headshots.

this one does not seem to quite comprehend what we are saying

Modifié par datako12, 14 avril 2012 - 08:26 .

[astheoceansblue]

datako12 wrote...

looks like disruptor ammo will be my main setup, followed by incendiary or cryo if i run out. @astheoceansblue, do you have any clue what rank the ammos are considered when part of a burst?

Actually looking into this now, can't find any solid informatoin so I might have to run some numbers myself. If you find anything useful, please share!

datako12 wrote...
 the GPR and the geth SMG are good for this because they are so accurate and stable, unlike your hornet

 

Truth.

I tried the Hornet V versus the GPR IV, and the GPR IV worked much better simply because I didn't have to compensate for the massive recoil constantly. 

On a more combat orientated class, the Hornet can be cool, but for Geth enginner at least I prefer stability so I can manage my targets more effciently.

Mandalore313 wrote...

Okay.

But carnifex is still better if you do consistent headshots.

Untruth.

Geth Enginner with Hunter Mode on can't afford the exposure. Constant headshots at the rate you'd need to keep up with the Tech Burst destruction, or Cryo Explosions, or Fire Booms, would require you to stay out of cover for far too long.

The CC nature of these configurations allows you to manage groups of mobs so you can expose yoruself and fire your high ROF weapon. A slow ROF weapon like a Carnifax would not allow it.

Not only have I given a perfect example of me almost matching point-for-point a straight up killing class with a high-tier weapon using this idea, but I will be more than willing to prove my point with a game or two. Add me if you're on Origin, username same as forum name.

Modifié par astheoceansblue, 14 avril 2012 - 08:28 .

[Stardusk]

Hornet seems much better.

[datako12]

Stardusk wrote...

Hornet seems much better.

hornet has a standard clip of 24 shots, 43 with the magazine mod V, and only holds 200 total shots

the geth SMG has a standard clip of 100, 180 with the magazine mod V, and holds over 600 total shots

no need to camp ammo with the geth SMG

[astheoceansblue]

Stardusk wrote...

Hornet seems much better.

Explained above. 

The little extra effort required to manage the recoli of the Hornet makes the Geth SMG superior for this, at least in the testing I've done, and this was Geth SMG I Vs Hornet V.

I'm a good shot, too, and can use the Hornet well, so it's not an issue with not being able to use the gun properly.

EDIT: Plus what datako12 rightly said about capacity. Hornet just requires too much management to be as efficient at this.

Modifié par astheoceansblue, 14 avril 2012 - 08:33 .

[datako12]

astheoceansblue wrote...

datako12 wrote...

looks like disruptor ammo will be my main setup, followed by incendiary or cryo if i run out. @astheoceansblue, do you have any clue what rank the ammos are considered when part of a burst?

Actually looking into this now, can't find any solid informatoin so I might have to run some numbers myself. If you find anything useful, please share!

ive been looking for a while now, im starting to considering trying to pm a dev for the answer

astheoceansblue wrote...

Add me if you're on Origin, username same as forum name.

damn, i was hoping such a sensible player as yourself would share the same platform as i, but oh well

and we should probly try and get out of this edit loop we have created, its getting almost as bad as some of the revive loops ive seen in games

[Tangster]

Similar to how I've been using it (cryo ammo+QE incinerate). The advantage over a GPR is that it's light enough that you can carry a heavier weapon for bosses along with it.

[Quxorda]

astheoceansblue wrote...

Stardusk wrote...

Hornet seems much better.

Explained above. 

The little extra effort required to manage the recoli of the Hornet makes the Geth SMG superior for this, at least in the testing I've done, and this was Geth SMG I Vs Hornet V.

I'm a good shot, too, and can use the Hornet well, so it's not an issue with not being able to use the gun properly.

EDIT: Plus what datako12 rightly said about capacity. Hornet just requires too much management to be as efficient at this.

Hornet is better in CQC, the bigger the map the more awkward the Hornet becomes. Having said that, the GSMG also discourages power use since you have to restart the ramp up everytime. My engineer is spec'd for increased geth weapon damage (cause hey why not), playing Silver Glacier verse Geth these two guns preformed about the same. The big difference was with the GSMG I had more tech kills and far fewer SMG kills - over all result was similar. The advantage of the hornet is it's high damage per round and burst fire nature make it safer to use on enemies that you can't stagger or cc with overload (primes).

It's not a bad gun, but like most SMGS it feels like it should be better. I really wish they would give SMGS back their bonus verse shields.

[astheoceansblue]

 

datako12 wrote...
damn, i was hoping such a sensible player as yourself would share the same platform as i, but oh well

 

That is a shame, I was going to PM you and suggest a team-up.

Maybe it's for the best, we can carry The Word to more needy souls this way. 

Quxorda wrote...
Having said that, the GSMG also discourages power use since you have to restart the ramp up everytime.

 

I was worried about this initially, but the 2 seconds or so it takes Overload to cool allows for enough ramp on the SMG to apply the necessary effect/dmg. I guess this combination of class and wepaon config might be something of a sweet-spot for the gun.

I agree fully with the rest of your assesment on the Hornet. It's better in the hands of a Turian Sentinal setting up HIS tech burst, for example, and he can spec deeper into mobile shields for more CQC styles.

Tangster wrote...

Similar to how I've been using it (cryo ammo+QE incinerate). The advantage over a GPR is that it's light enough that you can carry a heavier weapon for bosses along with it.

I also bring a heavier weapon along with my Geth SMG for boss types, it's called the Salarian Infiltrator Teammate. 

Modifié par astheoceansblue, 14 avril 2012 - 08:46 .

[Tangster]

astheoceansblue wrote...

Tangster wrote...

Similar to how I've been using it (cryo ammo+QE incinerate). The advantage over a GPR is that it's light enough that you can carry a heavier weapon for bosses along with it.

I also bring a heavier weapon along with my Geth SMG for boss types, it's called the Salarian Infiltrator Teammate. 

I usually spray it with cryo ammo until it chills, swap to the carnifex and blast a couple times. I still have a 200% CD with UL materials and 175% CD without, barely makes a difference.

Modifié par Tangster, 14 avril 2012 - 08:44 .

[datako12]

Quxorda wrote...

Hornet is better in CQC, the bigger the map the more awkward the Hornet becomes. Having said that, the GSMG also discourages power use since you have to restart the ramp up everytime. My engineer is spec'd for increased geth weapon damage (cause hey why not), playing Silver Glacier verse Geth these two guns preformed about the same. The big difference was with the GSMG I had more tech kills and far fewer SMG kills - over all result was similar. The advantage of the hornet is it's high damage per round and burst fire nature make it safer to use on enemies that you can't stagger or cc with overload (primes).

It's not a bad gun, but like most SMGS it feels like it should be better. I really wish they would give SMGS back their bonus verse shields.

true the hornet is a better gun in CQC, but if you use the setup properly and stagger everything they shouldnt get close enough for it to matter. and i dont think that the geth SMG discourages power uses, but thats because i'm only using it as a way to quickly set up tech bursts

edit. should probly throw this point out there too. thanks to @tangster for reminding me, the ULM for the geth SMG isnt bugged so its much more versatile as a secondary weapon than the hornet is

Modifié par datako12, 14 avril 2012 - 08:45 .

[astheoceansblue]

Tangster wrote...

I usually spray it with cryo ammo until it chills, swap to the carnifex and blast a couple times. I still have a 200% CD with UL materials and 175% CD without, barely makes a difference.

Good example of creative paring with cooldown managment and overall effciency. 

Nice.

Modifié par astheoceansblue, 14 avril 2012 - 08:47 .

[mr_afk]

astheoceansblue wrote...

Mandalore313 wrote...

Okay.

But carnifex is still better if you do consistent headshots.

Untruth.

Geth Enginner with Hunter Mode on can't afford the exposure. Constant headshots at the rate you'd need to keep up with the Tech Burst destruction, or Cryo Explosions, or Fire Booms, would require you to stay out of cover for far too long.

The CC nature of these configurations allows you to manage groups of mobs so you can expose yoruself and fire your high ROF weapon. A slow ROF weapon like a Carnifax would not allow it.

Not only have I given a perfect example of me almost matching point-for-point a straight up killing class with a high-tier weapon using this idea, but I will be more than willing to prove my point with a game or two. Add me if you're on Origin, username same as forum name.

Not to disparage your build, but your example of keeping up with a 'competent SI' isn't the be all and end all as widow snipers generally aren't the highest scoring, especially on gold. The shield gate mechanics and the relatively slow recharge speed and reload rate means that black widow or valiant SIs will generally rack up more points (more kills and tech bursts from energy drain).

That said, your self-detonate/tech burst setup does sound interesting. How does it fair against larger enemies? In terms of exposure though, wouldn't you say that a rapid-fire weapon would require a lot more than the GPS for example? And does the smg with disruptor provide any CC or is that solely from the overload spam?
I would think that if you're playing with salarians it's unlikely that you need to set up your own tech bursts and having a higher weapon damage will be probably more useful, especially for taking out the bigger enemies. But that's just me.

Modifié par mr_afk, 14 avril 2012 - 08:53 .

[Axialbloom]

Good thing I have unlimited ammo mods and can only put them on bad SMGs and ARs.

[Brettic]

But you have to like, HAVE disruptor ammo mods in order to do this...