114 réponses à ce sujet

[Sdrol117]

 yay, a thread that helps stop the ignorance of the forum masses who think only 3 guns are gold viable and every other gun is trash.

[Craquehead]

datako12 wrote...
as far as i know the RoF of 800 for the geth SMG is the base, remember its firing speed ramps up  with sustained fire, quick example, i just rattled of 2 clips that had a clip capacity and a heat sink...

That's... not a very good test... since the heat sink gives you a chance not to use a shot, the results wil be variable depending on the kindness of the RNG gods.

Furthermore, if the stated aim is to apply a disruptor effect in order to set-up a tech burst, you're only going to be firing it in short bursts, just long enough to get the sparks flying; Then you are going to stop and activate your Tech Burst power. We can really only consider the lower end of the RoF range.

You could take just about any other gun and apply the same disruptor effect, but do more damage in the same amount of time it takes to set it up.

[Blissey1]

while I would love to try this, I'm still at the phase where most of my packs are weapon upgrades instead of consumables, so I don't have a very steady supply of any ammo type.

[datako12]

Craquehead wrote...

datako12 wrote...
as far as i know the RoF of 800 for the geth SMG is the base, remember its firing speed ramps up  with sustained fire, quick example, i just rattled of 2 clips that had a clip capacity and a heat sink...

That's... not a very good test... since the heat sink gives you a chance not to use a shot, the results wil be variable depending on the kindness of the RNG gods.

Furthermore, if the stated aim is to apply a disruptor effect in order to set-up a tech burst, you're only going to be firing it in short bursts, just long enough to get the sparks flying; Then you are going to stop and activate your Tech Burst power. We can really only consider the lower end of the RoF range.

You could take just about any other gun and apply the same disruptor effect, but do more damage in the same amount of time it takes to set it up.

the lower end being the first 1.4s of firing, or at least thats how often i spam my powers. and im not using my guns to put out damage, my main source of damage with this setup is the concussive shot hitting the target and detonating the tech bursts, all of my shooting is merely to get the targets full of disruptor rounds. and i take the 2 guns that help me do that the fastest, the GPR and the geth SMG

[datako12]

Blissey1 wrote...

while I would love to try this, I'm still at the phase where most of my packs are weapon upgrades instead of consumables, so I don't have a very steady supply of any ammo type.

yeah, unfortunately bioware took one of the best part about the soldier in SP away from the multplayer soldiers, and now we're stuck with consumable ammo powers

[Craquehead]

datako12 wrote...

the lower end being the first 1.4s of firing, or at least thats how often i spam my powers.

The first few shots of the GSMG are pretty slow - I'm betting it doesn't even make it to 800 RoF in 1.4 seconds.

datako12 wrote... 

and im not using my guns to put out damage, my main source of damage with this setup is the concussive shot hitting the target and detonating the tech bursts, all of my shooting is merely to get the targets full of disruptor rounds. and i take the 2 guns that help me do that the fastest, the GPR and the geth SMG

My purely subjective observation (but repeated over two full gold games with identical results) is that the lower damage weapons require more hits to apply the ammo power. My Carnifex + Disruptor 1 needed at most 3 hits to apply, and usually took 2.

My Geth SMG + Disruptor often would not apply the effect before my power cooldown was up and I could ED again (2.5sec)

I set off a lot of tech bursts with the carnifex, and far, far fewer when using the SMG.

Admittedly, my Carnifex is VIII and I only have Geth SMG II, but the damage range is so small on the SMG I don't think that would affect it much. 

It's probable that the GPR handles the same way. I really think these are two of the worst guns for applying ammo powers.

[Omega-202]

I haven't gotten around to testing out my shiny new GSMG but I know that this strategy works wonders with the Hornet on my Turian Soldier.

I played a round today and got the 25 Tech Kills medal...on a character with no Tech powers. 1.2 second cooldown Concussive Shot is a monster with a pinpoint accurate Hornet. Add in 2 Engineers spamming Overload and Energy Drain and you have a lot dead Geth. With the Engineers, I found it was more effective not even bother shooting and just use my time to focus on what targets were currently sparking so I could hit them with my next CS.

[datako12]

Craquehead wrote...

datako12 wrote...

the lower end being the first 1.4s of firing, or at least thats how often i spam my powers.

The first few shots of the GSMG are pretty slow - I'm betting it doesn't even make it to 800 RoF in 1.4 seconds.

datako12 wrote... 

and im not using my guns to put out damage, my main source of damage with this setup is the concussive shot hitting the target and detonating the tech bursts, all of my shooting is merely to get the targets full of disruptor rounds. and i take the 2 guns that help me do that the fastest, the GPR and the geth SMG

My purely subjective observation (but repeated over two full gold games with identical results) is that the lower damage weapons require more hits to apply the ammo power. My Carnifex + Disruptor 1 needed at most 3 hits to apply, and usually took 2.

My Geth SMG + Disruptor often would not apply the effect before my power cooldown was up and I could ED again (2.5sec)

I set off a lot of tech bursts with the carnifex, and far, far fewer when using the SMG.

Admittedly, my Carnifex is VIII and I only have Geth SMG II, but the damage range is so small on the SMG I don't think that would affect it much. 

It's probable that the GPR handles the same way. I really think these are two of the worst guns for applying ammo powers.

 from what i know of the ammo powers you only having a geth SMG II shouldnt affect how often it activates, the only things that i know of affecting how often the ammo powers activate is the lvl of the ammo power and something to do with the RoF of the gun. slow stuff like the carnifex and snipers have a higher percent chance on each shot, and rapid fire things have a lower chance, but thats the extent of it that i know, it sure would be nice if the devs were nice enough to actually explain the concepts like these to us somewhere, and it would be nice if somewhere they explained what rank the ammo power is considered for the tech burst

[Londo 07]

I'd really like it if the results of this thread could be converted into some kind of an index of successful weapon setups and strategies. I often find myself clinging to the easy-mode weapons (valiant, black widow, carnifex, eagle, mattock, ...), because I just can't seem to make most of the other weapons to work. Even some of the ones that are generally considered to be great. Much like the op, I believe that a majority of the weapons can be used effectively enough, and even if they wouldn't be 100% as powerful as some of the others, they would still add nice variety and longevity to the game.

For example I really can't seem to get any good results with the GPS, even though I have it at level X. I like the fact that it bypasses the shield gate, and insta-kills quite a lot of stuff when applied successfully, but I'm really struggling with the whole mechanic, especially with infiltrators. I know you're supposed to charge it first, then cloak, fire and fire again in the duration that the cloak boost is effective. In a sticky situation that just seems to take too long, and I haven't been able to figure out how to charge the weapon while staying in cover, not to mention the fact that I often find myself uncloaked (and shortly thereafter lying on my face) when I though I was supposed to be in cloak.

Another example is the Revenant (which i consequently also have at level X) and the Turian Soldier setup, which according to some is awesome, but in my incapable hands quickly turns into a loud suicide machine gunner.

Modifié par Londo 07, 15 avril 2012 - 06:19 .

[Methanoid666]

i keep wondering when you look at the falcon and strikers "blank/missing" shots, does rapid firing smg/ar's have the same issue with missing shots and we just dont see it or do they actually work "properly".

[Craquehead]

Methanoid666 wrote...

i keep wondering when you look at the falcon and strikers "blank/missing" shots, does rapid firing smg/ar's have the same issue with missing shots and we just dont see it or do they actually work "properly".

All of the SMG's, for instance, are "hit-scan" weapons. This means that when the gun fires, the game decides whether you hit or not based on where you are aiming, and the accuracy of the gun (more or less). If you hit, the damage is applied instantly; Despite what it may look like, the bullets don't actually travel across the map.

The Striker, Falcon, Graal, GPS, Scorpion, and Kishock are different; When they fire, the game creates an acutal projectile that moves through the game world, and damage isn't applied until it hits something (or, in the case of the grenades, near something)

It seems that these non hit-scan weapons are the only ones with this problem.

[astheoceansblue]

Craquehead wrote...
The Striker, Falcon, Graal, GPS, Scorpion, and Kishock are different; When they fire, the game creates an acutal projectile that moves through the game world, and damage isn't applied until it hits something (or, in the case of the grenades, near something)

It seems that these non hit-scan weapons are the only ones with this problem.

I've not noticed a problem with this, but I almost always host. Is it simply a latancy issue for players being placed in games too far from them perhaps?

[Duranndal]

I'm no hater of SMGs, etc. I keep trying to tell people how awesome Tempest X with arp/cryo ammo & smg III mod is on a turian soldier.

But... isn't this thread kind of pointless? Couldn't you do any of what you're saying with another weapon? It doesn't really point out the usefulness of the Geth SMG vs any other weapon.

[Craquehead]

astheoceansblue wrote...

Craquehead wrote...
The Striker, Falcon, Graal, GPS, Scorpion, and Kishock are different; When they fire, the game creates an acutal projectile that moves through the game world, and damage isn't applied until it hits something (or, in the case of the grenades, near something)

It seems that these non hit-scan weapons are the only ones with this problem.

I've not noticed a problem with this, but I almost always host. Is it simply a latancy issue for players being placed in games too far from them perhaps?

It's believed to be caused by lag, yes. If you host, these problems vanish.