158 réponses à ce sujet

[Critical Miss]

I would consider DA more in line with FF10 than FF12 as far as a world map is concerned. FF10 pushed the player into areas where the action took place, the same as DA. FF12 on the other hand was a far more expansive world where the player could explore and even grind, somewhat like an MMO.

[MerinTB]

I absolutely disagree that Bioware RPGs are beneath JRPGs. Absolutely disagree.



I think it's arguable whether Bethesda ones are, but I personally look at the Elder Scrolls games as such a completely different animal of an RPG (like comparing penguins to eagles, both are birds, both are loved by people, but they are very different.)



JRPGs are so many there is such a glut of crap. I think Square Enix probably produce some of the best, and the FF series have a story focus that is compelling (if you can get past the random encounters overload in such games.) There are other good ones too - I really enjoyed Golden Sun on the GBA.



JRPGs are born from American RPGs long ago - but, like anime, if you put Princess Mononoke next to Mulan or Tarzan (contemporary Disney films) they are NOTHING ALIKE. Similarly, you put BG2 next to FFX (they are about contemporary) and you'll find few similarities.

[darkblueglass]

Critical Miss wrote...

I would consider DA more in line with FF10 than FF12 as far as a world map is concerned. FF10 pushed the player into areas where the action took place, the same as DA. FF12 on the other hand was a far more expansive world where the player could explore and even grind, somewhat like an MMO.

You can explore the world map in FF12 but the world is full of just generic monsters. Yes you can grind them but is there any story elements or interesting NPCs with dialogue options that you can talk to like DA?
I got bored pretty fast with FF12. I think that FF seriese was doing great job at crafting one movie like linear story but once they decided to go a bit non-linear with FF12, I cannot find any meaning with that. The main story just got weaker and distracted and the non-linearity gave nothing but generic monsters. I can't find much tactical element with FF12 battles either so what I was doing was pressing X button repeatedly for all those non boss battles.

Modifié par darkblueglass, 12 décembre 2009 - 07:12 .

[lilzany]

JRPG is a game where you have to grind to in order to pass some levels. FFX wasn't that bad but there is a major roadblock at the last reincarnation of Seymour at Mt. Gagazet. It makes Sin feels like a wimp after all the grind at Seymour. It wasn't so bad for FF7-9.

FF12 gets a lot worse if you didn't know about learning quickening as early as possible. The License Board is a nice change though. Looks like Square-Enix wants players to fully customize their own characters. It is an advanced version of FFX sphere grid without the locks. IMO, they are leaning closer to wRPG customization style for their character unlike FF7-10 where almost anyone can do the same thing except using the same weapon.

Still, their NPC interactions need some more depth. But yeah one of the thing I hate most of console RPGs is their save point is garbage. I love it how a PC RPG allows us to save anywhere and this is something console gamers can only wet their pants on. 

Modifié par lilzany, 13 décembre 2009 - 08:56 .

[magor1988x]

More along the lines of the OP then anything (And the second comment after that).

Video game sales are tracked by Bioware of course, but they are also tracked by third party entities. Many game retailers release their own data to the public and certain companies or organizations interested in tracking game sales. If you know where to look you should be able to find it, if not wait for a report on gaming news sites or by Bioware themselves.

[MerinTB]

Just out numbers - http://www.gamespot....updates;title;2

2009 PC Game Software
1) The Sims 3 - Electronic Arts
2) World of Warcraft: Wrath of the Lich King - Blizzard
3) The Sims 2 Double Deluxe - Electronic Arts
4) World of Warcraft: Battle Chest - Blizzard
5) Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2 - Activision
6) World of Warcraft - Blizzard
7) The Sims 3: World Adventures - Electronic Arts
8) Spore - Electronic Arts
9) Dragon Age: Origins - Electronic Arts
10) Empire: Total War - Sega

Being number 9, and consider the powerhouse franchises ahead of it, is quite successful IMO!

Modifié par MerinTB, 16 janvier 2010 - 05:38 .

[spernus]

MerinTB wrote...

Just out numbers - http://www.gamespot....updates;title;2

2009 PC Game Software
1) The Sims 3 - Electronic Arts
2) World of Warcraft: Wrath of the Lich King - Blizzard
3) The Sims 2 Double Deluxe - Electronic Arts
4) World of Warcraft: Battle Chest - Blizzard
5) Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2 - Activision
6) World of Warcraft - Blizzard
7) The Sims 3: World Adventures - Electronic Arts
8) Spore - Electronic Arts
9) Dragon Age: Origins - Electronic Arts
10) Empire: Total War - Sega

Being number 9, and consider the powerhouse franchises ahead of it, is quite successful IMO!

Not bad,but it didn't even make the top 20 in the last NPD.

It's obvious that it won't sell as well as projected,which is why the game is constantly affected by price cut.EA overshipped copies of Dragon Age(EA is so sloppy it's not even funny,since they actually expected Dragon Age to outsell Mass effect 2),so now retailers must get rid of copies.

[Sloth Of Doom]

spernus wrote...

Not bad,but it didn't even make the top 20 in the last NPD.

It's obvious that it won't sell as well as projected,which is why the game is constantly affected by price cut.EA overshipped copies of Dragon Age(EA is so sloppy it's not even funny,since they actually expected Dragon Age to outsell Mass effect 2),so now retailers must get rid of copies.

All of this is based on what info?  The numbers and facts you just made up?

Modifié par Sloth Of Doom, 16 janvier 2010 - 06:06 .

[ThomasRipley]

Just a tidbit of information: on a french website, the EA executive for France said that he was very happy about the sales of Dragon age(this was not false positivism as in the same article he said Brutal Legend had been a commercial failure), both on PC and console even if he admitted it wasn't in the same numbers as their blockbusters like FIFA and the Sims(not really a surprise).

edit:
He was talking about the sales in France obviously...

Modifié par ThomasRipley, 16 janvier 2010 - 06:24 .

[spernus]

Sloth Of Doom wrote...

spernus wrote...

Not bad,but it didn't even make the top 20 in the last NPD.

It's obvious that it won't sell as well as projected,which is why the game is constantly affected by price cut.EA overshipped copies of Dragon Age(EA is so sloppy it's not even funny,since they actually expected Dragon Age to outsell Mass effect 2),so now retailers must get rid of copies.

All of this is based on what info?  The numbers and facts you just made up?

Every publisher will usually try to sell X amounts of copies to retailers,based on their projection or the reception from retailers.There was a report that EA expected(related to quarter earning and fiscal year):

Mass effect 2 to sell 2 100 000
Dragon Age:origins to sell 2 800 000

So if they did convince retailers to buy this many copies,you will be seeing plenty of reduction from various retailers pretty soon(once copies don't disappear off the shelves quickly).It happen with nearly every game that are shipped in massive quantity or end up being overstocked,even massive sellers like Gears of War or Halo(these game are massive seller,but frontloaded).The exception would be Fallout 3,since Bethesda nearly shipped 5 million copies and the game has been able to be a consistant seller until the game of the year version.

[MerinTB]

Sloth Of Doom wrote...

spernus wrote...
Not bad,but it didn't even make the top 20 in the last NPD.

It's obvious that it won't sell as well as projected,which is why the game is constantly affected by price cut.EA overshipped copies of Dragon Age(EA is so sloppy it's not even funny,since they actually expected Dragon Age to outsell Mass effect 2),so now retailers must get rid of copies.

All of this is based on what info?  The numbers and facts you just made up?

I know, right?

My information has a quoted source and is sales for the year for PC - Spore is the only non-franchise game that outsold DAO, which to me means it was a resounding success on the PC platform.

Spernus, what were the projected sales of DAO?  I'd love to see that information!
What were the actual sales of DAO at this point on PC, XBOX 360 and PS3, including digital downloads?  You have those numbers too, to compare to the projected sales numbers?  It sounds like you do since you find it "obvious that it won't sell as well as projected" - you must have some hard evidence to back that up, right?
And can you tell me the article or professional report which explains that EA overshipped Dragon Age?

"EA is so sloppy it's not even funny,since they actually expected Dragon Age to outsell Mass effect 2" is derived from what source?  Honestly, if they said that, I'd like to see it.

Finally, the price cuts so retailers can get rid of copies?  What retailers are cutting prices to get rid of copies?  PC copies at Best Buy are, as of this moment, still $49.99, as it is priced at Dell, Barnes & Noble, K-Mart and Gamestop.  It's $49.96/$49.95 at Walmart and EA, but those are what they started selling at.  You can find cheaper - Overstock is $48.80, Family Video is $47.99 - oh, hey, Amazon has it for $39.99!  That must be the retailer who had too many shipped to it and needs to move prodcuts off it's shelves to make room for ... sorry, what was that, Amazon isn't a brick n' mortar store so it doesn't have valuable shelf space to manage - oh, and Amazon usually sells stuff for cheaper than most retailers?   Yes, you can find it for cheaper on ebay and at certain stores with like 3 copies trying to get rid of them for like $28, but that's not "the game is constantly affected by price cut (...) so now retailers must get
rid of copies." - http://www.google.co...ring=pd|start=0
And I only looked at PC sales because PC games drop in price faster than console games (usually) and the industry "common wisdom" is that PC retail (non-DD) is dying a very quick death.  It SHOULD show the fastest price drops for DAO.

So go ahead and back up your arguments with some sources (other than your say-so) and I'll check your sources and gladly admit you are right when you have convincing evidence.

[themaxzero]

[quote]MerinTB wrote...

Just out numbers - http://www.gamespot....updates;title;2

2009 PC Game Software
1) The Sims 3 - Electronic Arts
2) World of Warcraft: Wrath of the Lich King - Blizzard
3) The Sims 2 Double Deluxe - Electronic Arts
4) World of Warcraft: Battle Chest - Blizzard
5) Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2 - Activision
6) World of Warcraft - Blizzard
7) The Sims 3: World Adventures - Electronic Arts
8) Spore - Electronic Arts
9) Dragon Age: Origins - Electronic Arts
10) Empire: Total War - Sega[/quote]

[/quote]

Heh, according to the WoW forums the game is dying.

Not bad for a game released in 2004.

[Sloth Of Doom]

themaxzero wrote...

Heh, according to the WoW forums the game is dying.

Not bad for a game released in 2004.

Well, to be fair the game actually COULD be dying and still have good sales.  The sales figures were so huge for that game to begin with that even a fraction of them is still bigger than most games.

I look back to Everquest, whee the hardcoe players saw the decline of the game and were told specificaly by Verant reps that sales didn't back up our predictions.  Yet in two years (which was about when the playerbase said the game would sart having issues) they were closing servers left and right.

Another, more recent game wuld be Age of Conan, where within the first month most players predicted the games downfall within the year, only to be assured by Funcom that saes were WAY over what they expected.   You've head of AoC right?  It has dozens of players now.

[addiction21]

Sloth Of Doom wrote...

themaxzero wrote...

Heh, according to the WoW forums the game is dying.

Not bad for a game released in 2004.

Well, to be fair the game actually COULD be dying and still have good sales.  The sales figures were so huge for that game to begin with that even a fraction of them is still bigger than most games.

I look back to Everquest, whee the hardcoe players saw the decline of the game and were told specificaly by Verant reps that sales didn't back up our predictions.  Yet in two years (which was about when the playerbase said the game would sart having issues) they were closing servers left and right.

Another, more recent game wuld be Age of Conan, where within the first month most players predicted the games downfall within the year, only to be assured by Funcom that saes were WAY over what they expected.   You've head of AoC right?  It has dozens of players now.

Tabula Rasa anyone? Honestly it was a game with giant potential but failed so hard god damned hard Garriot went even more crazy then he allready was. That my friends is a accomplishment no matter how you cut it.

Honestly tho WoW is and was a freak. 200k subscribers is good for a MMO and it seems everyone now expects new MMO's to end up in the same bracket as WoW. No blizz did what blizz has always done. They made a fun and addictive game.

WoW smashed all preconceptions anyone had of MMO's and how much they could sell or how widly accepted they could be.

[themaxzero]

Sloth Of Doom wrote...

themaxzero wrote...

Heh, according to the WoW forums the game is dying.

Not bad for a game released in 2004.

Well, to be fair the game actually COULD be dying and still have good sales.  The sales figures were so huge for that game to begin with that even a fraction of them is still bigger than most games.

I look back to Everquest, whee the hardcoe players saw the decline of the game and were told specificaly by Verant reps that sales didn't back up our predictions.  Yet in two years (which was about when the playerbase said the game would sart having issues) they were closing servers left and right.

Another, more recent game wuld be Age of Conan, where within the first month most players predicted the games downfall within the year, only to be assured by Funcom that saes were WAY over what they expected.   You've head of AoC right?  It has dozens of players now.

All valid concerns but we still get new servers being released every xpac. Wouldn't make much economic sense if the game was stagnating.

[Olof85]

I suspect the sales to be just fine. Vgchartz(not the most reliable source I know) have them at soon 2 mill(1,85) on consols only. Add pc sales to that and we are well above 2 mill and prolly closer to 3. I wouldnt concider that bad for a rpg after slightly more than 3 months. It is also most likely a game that will continue to sell quite well for quite some time due to the lack of decent rpgs nowdays. To outsell Empire total war wich was released very early 2009 is quite impressive.

Modifié par Olof85, 16 janvier 2010 - 08:20 .

[TheRealIncarnal]

Burningwolf wrote...

*sighs* RIP Might and magic.

Anyway,yea hope these sales live up to what Bioware expected.

Indeed, after the loss of Might and Magic, I don't think I could bear the loss of another treasured RPG world to me. I'm sure this game is doing very well, just look at the forums.

[spernus]

Olof85 wrote...

I suspect the sales to be just fine. Vgchartz(not the most reliable source I know) have them at soon 2 mill(1,85) on consols only. Add pc sales to that and we are well above 2 mill and prolly closer to 3. I wouldnt concider that bad for a rpg after slightly more than 3 months. It is also most likely a game that will continue to sell quite well for quite some time due to the lack of decent rpgs nowdays. To outsell Empire total war wich was released very early 2009 is quite impressive.

For a proper number,we will have to wait until EA release their 3rd quarter results.They should give a good approximation of how much Dragon age copies were sold.

By the way,the PC version should be the one who's performing the best(relatively to the number of copies shipped).Perfectly normal,since it's the superior version and also the one who will have mods.It's the console and especially 360 version that appear to be in massive numbers in store.I don't think the console versions will stay at their full price for much longer.

In fact,there's still plenty of EA games which are sold at a reduced price.It's not just Dragon age,but it make sense giving the fact that EA stated that their titles didn't sell up to expectation.Future shop,which is the biggest electronic store in Canada has been selling DA at a reduced for close to a month(console version).NHL 10,Madden 10,Brutal legend and Left for dead 2 (to a lesser extend) saw plenty of price cut here and there already(seems like best buy in the US is also selling DA 10$ cheaper).

[Dam Wookie]

MerinTB wrote...

Sloth Of Doom wrote...

spernus wrote...
Not bad,but it didn't even make the top 20 in the last NPD.

It's obvious that it won't sell as well as projected,which is why the game is constantly affected by price cut.EA overshipped copies of Dragon Age(EA is so sloppy it's not even funny,since they actually expected Dragon Age to outsell Mass effect 2),so now retailers must get rid of copies.

All of this is based on what info?  The numbers and facts you just made up?

Finally, the price cuts so retailers can get rid of copies?  What retailers are cutting prices to get rid of copies?  PC copies at Best Buy are, as of this moment, still $49.99, as it is priced at Dell, Barnes & Noble, K-Mart and Gamestop.  It's $49.96/$49.95 at Walmart and EA, but those are what they started selling at.  You can find cheaper - Overstock is $48.80, Family Video is $47.99 - oh, hey, Amazon has it for $39.99!  That must be the retailer who had too many shipped to it and needs to move prodcuts off it's shelves to make room for ... sorry, what was that, Amazon isn't a brick n' mortar store so it doesn't have valuable shelf space to manage - oh, and Amazon usually sells stuff for cheaper than most retailers?   Yes, you can find it for cheaper on ebay and at certain stores with like 3 copies trying to get rid of them for like $28, but that's not "the game is constantly affected by price cut (...) so now retailers must get
rid of copies." - http://www.google.co...ring=pd|start=0
And I only looked at PC sales because PC games drop in price faster than console games (usually) and the industry "common wisdom" is that PC retail (non-DD) is dying a very quick death.  It SHOULD show the fastest price drops for DAO.

So go ahead and back up your arguments with some sources (other than your say-so) and I'll check your sources and gladly admit you are right when you have convincing evidence.

Well DAO in Amazon was reduced to £15 from £35 for a good few weeks over the christmas holiday period and it was saw similar price cuts elsewere. It then slowly rose up to £25. I would say it spent a good month at 40-50% of its guide price in between (ish) the 10th December and the 10th January.

[addiction21]

I dunno why I felt like posting this but I WANT A REAL FINAL FANTASY TACTICS SEQUEL GOD DAMNIT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[TyroneTasty]

I'd like this game to do well if only to get more companies to stop making so many MMOs and perhaps realize that there are RPG fans out there who don't only want that kind of experience.

[Celuwen]

We have two copies of DA:O in my house. I didn't want to give it up, so my husband had to buy his own copy.

[spernus]

Dam Wookie wrote...

Well DAO in Amazon was reduced to £15 from £35 for a good few weeks over the christmas holiday period and it was saw similar price cuts elsewere. It then slowly rose up to £25. I would say it spent a good month at 40-50% of its guide price in between (ish) the 10th December and the 10th January.

One thing is sure: console performance must be under expectation.

Vg chartz has been banned from several gaming site because it's not reliable.No way Dragon age:origins sold 1.4 million copies in the US.That number must be off by close to 400 000-500 000 copies.Dragon age did 550 000 in november and didn't chart on the NPD in december.It probably did less in december,but nothing too catastropihc given the price cut.Sales in Europe must be weaker,since Bioware has never been strong in that market(and EA saying that 3rd quarter will be marked by weak sales in Europe).

The real number is probably around 1.2 or 1.3 million copies sold on console and who know about the PC version(maybe 500 000?).It's probably close to 2 million all across the board.

Then again,it might have done even less in december.A game like Uncharted 2 sold well in october and hit rock bottom in november.

Modifié par spernus, 16 janvier 2010 - 09:21 .

[Olof85]

Well your using make up figures. Id say ur even less trustworthy than vgchartz

and about the pc numbers..if Da sold more than empire I suspect them to be a bit higher than 500k. Would be extremly suprised if empire total war had that bad figures for 2009 since it was released jan

Modifié par Olof85, 16 janvier 2010 - 09:31 .