73 réponses à ce sujet

[Brass_Buckles]

Well, I think the reason for the lack of full frontal nudity, aside from that making it an Adult-Only rating, is that in some states, pornography (and let's face it, this would be considered porn if it appeared in a video game, even if it showed nothing more risque than your standard R-rated film) is limited to 21+.



Also just because we're 17+ years old, that doesn't mean we all want hardcore porn in our video games. Besides, that'd be a lawsuit waiting to happen, and doesn't the video game industry get enough flakk as it is, while those of us who are responsible enough to keep our T and M rated games out of the hands of kids too young for them end up getting the short end of the stick? Let's face it, M rating or no, there are plenty of parents out there who'd still buy DA for their 13-year-old sons. Then they would walk in while their son was playing the game with full frontal nudity, have a cow, and bam, lawsuit.



Personally, I find the undies silly, but I'd rather have the whole scene fade to black (kind of like Fable) than show the actual act on my monitor. But that's just me.



In other news, my thanks to Mr. Gaider for giving us this great game (Say, when the DA cast pray to the Maker, are they praying to David and his fellow developers, I wonder?). I love that the characters have personalities and none of them are perfect (it's funny how I hear so much whining about certain characters not being this or that way when there are plenty of real-world people with the same flaws--it just makes them more believable to me). I even love the more heart-wrenching endings that you can get. Here's to an excellent sequel and/or expansion(s) to come.

[orpheus333]

As far as i see it certifications are there for a reason. Games and films go through this process to give parents the power of an informed choice. If that parent then chooses not to heed that warning then perhaps a swift visit from social services might set them straight.



Personally i don;t care one way or the other about nudity in DA or any other game. The majority of the time developer over sexualise their games to the point that nudity becomes pretty moot anyway.



As far as I see it from a DA players perspective. The engines ability to animate, form facial expression etc just doesn't cut it and leaves the scene feeling clumsy. Nudity would just add to the clumsiness I feel. Mass Effects engine on the otherhand could pull it of to a reasonable degree.

[Kalfear]

Axterix wrote...

RunCDFirst wrote...

Kalfear wrote...
Nudity post

I imagine it was a development team decision with probably just as many reasons to include clothing as to have everyone naked. In the end, they decided to go with the undies and I can't really fault them for it. As for official response, if you get one, it'll probably be along the lines of 'the current version fit our vision for Dragon Age.'

Even if it were strictly American Public Reaction (which I doubt), they wouldn't publicly blame their decision on the current political climate.

Sadly, it does make the cutscenes laughably bad.  MEs were much better.  Saw nothing, but felt a lot better, more natural.  ME's was polished.  DA's scenes felt rushed, compromised.  It detracted from the moment.

Basically, the feel I got from the love scenes in DA is that they slapped the underwear on to avoid nudity.  That means most likely there was a design change, so it was added late to cutscenes originally planned for nudity, or else there wasn't enough time to set up the cutscenes like they were in ME initially and so the underwear was there was the start.

Hopefully, when they get around to DA2, they'll go with ME's route.  Don't need nudity for a good game and if that means they can sell more copies, excellent, it'll insure more good games.  But things that are obviously out of place do hurt.

Agree fully!

You might be right about original design vrs released content. Thats kinda why I want a actual reply on it (and hopefully Run wrong and I dont just get a spin PC reply).

The love scenes are just bad in DA:O. As are the hookers and their fade to black sound effects version.
Its weird, everyone keeps saying the only nudity is the Broodmother but I have the 360 version and the desire deamons are definately topless and one even lifts her breast and lets it bounce back into place.

There is nudity in this game already, so why cheap out on the love scenes?

And your also right, if they had done the Mass Effect style where you just dont see cause of camera angles, it would have been much better and more immersive.

But they went with mostly well lite, top down angles and im sorry, the bras (dont actually see panties in the love making if memory serves me right) just ruin the atmoshere.

Heck, id be happy if they just showed a bare back (no bra) in the love scene with no actual nudity but the suggestion of such. Many many many movies get away with doing that route for PG13 movies. But this wasnt a PG13 game, it was 17+ Mature. So I just dont see the issue?

LOL, I know I harp on this issue abit but the contradition just drives me batty and if my game design is truely being censored by the american soccer moms, well I wanna know, truth be told. I paid my money so I should have that many rights at a minimum.

PS: Brass Buckels, no one, not one person, nil, nada, neit has suggested the game has hardcore porn. If you really think a bare breast is hardcore porn, well thats sad and lets leave it at that

Modifié par Kalfear, 08 décembre 2009 - 04:54 .

[Kanner]

This game has huge issues and totally sucks.



That's why I'm playing it through all over again, buying the online content and spending hours posting on the message boards. =D



Thank you David Gaider now GET BACK TO WORK YOU ARE NOT NEARLY FINISHED ON THIS. =P

[Brass_Buckles]

Kalfear wrote...

Axterix wrote...

RunCDFirst wrote...

Kalfear wrote...
Nudity post

I imagine it was a development team decision with probably just as many reasons to include clothing as to have everyone naked. In the end, they decided to go with the undies and I can't really fault them for it. As for official response, if you get one, it'll probably be along the lines of 'the current version fit our vision for Dragon Age.'

Even if it were strictly American Public Reaction (which I doubt), they wouldn't publicly blame their decision on the current political climate.

Sadly, it does make the cutscenes laughably bad.  MEs were much better.  Saw nothing, but felt a lot better, more natural.  ME's was polished.  DA's scenes felt rushed, compromised.  It detracted from the moment.

Basically, the feel I got from the love scenes in DA is that they slapped the underwear on to avoid nudity.  That means most likely there was a design change, so it was added late to cutscenes originally planned for nudity, or else there wasn't enough time to set up the cutscenes like they were in ME initially and so the underwear was there was the start.

Hopefully, when they get around to DA2, they'll go with ME's route.  Don't need nudity for a good game and if that means they can sell more copies, excellent, it'll insure more good games.  But things that are obviously out of place do hurt.

Agree fully!

You might be right about original design vrs released content. Thats kinda why I want a actual reply on it (and hopefully Run wrong and I dont just get a spin PC reply).

The love scenes are just bad in DA:O. As are the hookers and their fade to black sound effects version.
Its weird, everyone keeps saying the only nudity is the Broodmother but I have the 360 version and the desire deamons are definately topless and one even lifts her breast and lets it bounce back into place.

There is nudity in this game already, so why cheap out on the love scenes?

And your also right, if they had done the Mass Effect style where you just dont see cause of camera angles, it would have been much better and more immersive.

But they went with mostly well lite, top down angles and im sorry, the bras (dont actually see panties in the love making if memory serves me right) just ruin the atmoshere.

Heck, id be happy if they just showed a bare back (no bra) in the love scene with no actual nudity but the suggestion of such. Many many many movies get away with doing that route for PG13 movies. But this wasnt a PG13 game, it was 17+ Mature. So I just dont see the issue?

LOL, I know I harp on this issue abit but the contradition just drives me batty and if my game design is truely being censored by the american soccer moms, well I wanna know, truth be told. I paid my money so I should have that many rights at a minimum.

PS: Brass Buckels, no one, not one person, nil, nada, neit has suggested the game has hardcore porn. If you really think a bare breast is hardcore porn, well thats sad and lets leave it at that

It's Brass Buckles; spell it right, please.  And I said nothing about nudity = porn, but full frontal nudity, which is what I was referring to (showing all the naughty bits) would qualify as R-rated in a movie.  In a love scene, with obvious arousal, it would be porn.  I really can't believe I'm having to clarify this.

[Kalfear]

/shrug

Everyone (but you) has already said they dont want guys and girls lower parts showing so again, "NO ONE BUT YOU is talking porn"

Way to make that leap though!

Oh and in Canada 17+ is basically equivilant to a restricted movie so its no change at all for us (and most places outside the USA).

Course in Canada and Europe a bare breast doesnt make it resticted anyways! Heck in England the Sun Shine Girls appear topless in the daily newspaper.

Get with the times.

Modifié par Kalfear, 08 décembre 2009 - 05:38 .

[Brass_Buckles]

Kalfear wrote...

/shrug

Everyone (but you) has already said they dont want guys and girls lower parts showing so again, "NO ONE BUT YOU is talking porn"

Way to make that leap though!

Oh and in Canada 17+ is basically equivilant to a restricted movie so its no change at all for us (and most places outside the USA).

Course in Canada and Europe a bare breast doesnt make it resticted anyways! Heck in England the Sun Shine Girls appear topless in the daily newspaper.

Get with the times.

Seriously, you're razzing me because I don't like a lot of nudity?  First of all, I said nothing about bare breasts bothering me.  I have two of those of my own, you know, and I see them every time I bathe myself, which would be daily.  However, if I wanted porn, I'd buy porn or Adult Only games.  Granted, I don't particularly like being forced to see some other female's boobs, seeing as I'm straight, but I can deal with that.  However, I can see how even that much would ruffle the feathers of a lot of parents.  I don't recall reading anyone who wanted more nudity specifying they would not be okay with nudity below the waistline, either, though perhaps I didn't read closely enough to see this--and I am grateful if the opinion has already been expressed.  I'm going to leave it at this though:  I'm entitled to my personal opinion as much as you are to yours, and should be able to express it without personal attacks being made on either side.  I have no desire to argue with you over this further, so I won't.  If I misread, shame on me, my mistake, my apologies, etc., but I do not do flame wars.

And FYI, here in the US, bare breasts can be shown in PG-13 films.  The kind of *full frontal* nudity I refer to would be more akin to really racy R-rated to X-rated flicks.  R-rated if there's no obvious arousal (even so, I'm sure parents here in the U.S. would be up in arms about showing a man's dangly bits in a video game)-.  X-rated if there is.

[Jacks-Up]

Kanner wrote...

This game has huge issues and totally sucks.

That's why I'm playing it through all over again, buying the online content and spending hours posting on the message boards. =D

Thank you David Gaider now GET BACK TO WORK YOU ARE NOT NEARLY FINISHED ON THIS. =P

It's humorous when sarcasm becomes irony.

[Jayce]

David Gaider wrote...

1xs3thx1 wrote...
Would you kindly post a reply to this thread of a few of the plots that were left out of the final game?

No, I don't think that's a good idea. When people hear about cut content they immediately get the idea that what was cut was perfect -- when the truth is it was likely not working at all, not likely to be made to work or not even started (many things are cut while still in there formative stages) -- and you end up with a response like "Wha-aaat?! How could you have cut THAT?!". So playing a game of "what might have been" is not really healthy, I think.

Plus I don't really want to re-live it.

That's a shame I really enjoyed your old posts on BG 2 cut content.

Ce la vie.

[Chragen]

I really wish more games had a proper making of documentary. Would love to see a more in depth look at how games like Dragon Age gets developed.

But then again that would require a pretty big budget to cover the length of a production and not sure if every employ would appreciate a having a camera in their face for a lengthy period of time

[Adria Teksuni]

They kind of did it with JE. V. sad that they didn't with DA.

[Beerfish]

David, was the spectator beholder companion cut from Dragon Age? 

[Kanner]

Chragen wrote...

I really wish more games had a proper making of documentary. Would love to see a more in depth look at how games like Dragon Age gets developed.
But then again that would require a pretty big budget to cover the length of a production and not sure if every employ would appreciate a having a camera in their face for a lengthy period of time

Based on seeing some horrible cut-scene of a town battle 2-3 years ago and hearing virtually nothing about DA:O since then until the Sacred Ashes trailer came out, I figure that would more of a fully fledged drama than a pure documentary.

"It's got everything - violence, drama, blood, tears, and a small band of heros working against impossible odds to save the day.  It's called 'The making of Dragon Age: Origins'."

[Lucy Glitter]

Kanner wrote...

Chragen wrote...

I really wish more games had a proper making of documentary. Would love to see a more in depth look at how games like Dragon Age gets developed.
But then again that would require a pretty big budget to cover the length of a production and not sure if every employ would appreciate a having a camera in their face for a lengthy period of time

Based on seeing some horrible cut-scene of a town battle 2-3 years ago and hearing virtually nothing about DA:O since then until the Sacred Ashes trailer came out, I figure that would more of a fully fledged drama than a pure documentary.

"It's got everything - violence, drama, blood, tears, and a small band of heros working against impossible odds to save the day.  It's called 'The making of Dragon Age: Origins'."

It's called, "being told by devs the documentary would be exclusive and then finding out you have seen it before on official gaming sites." Yeah. Can't say I was a happy customer.

[Statulos]

Truth be told, most of the scenes, at least in story terms (not visual representation) felt quite "cute" or "how tender"; particularly for the cases of Leliana and Alistair. Man, even Morrigan felt kind of "lovely" instead of "feral".

[Vormaerin]

"Full Frontal", at least in American parlance, does not mean merely topless. So, you may not have meant it that way, but you implicitly asked for content that is either X or NR in the US. This is particularly true when you consider that many of the underwear scenes are full body visuals. So you can't very well make a legitimate argument that someone other than you started with the X rated stuff.



Regardless, there's nothing more that needs to be said other than "Adult Only" is the kiss of death for mass market games. You can't sell them in many major American retailers and many parents will let their teenagers watch R rated or play M rated games that won't go for X or AO.

[Acemath]

HAHAHA,you have to give props to the devs.Not much game boards the Dev DOESN'T answer a question and other people have other questions already ready lol

[Jwade86]

Kalfear wrote...
Course in Canada and Europe a bare breast doesnt make it resticted anyways! Heck in England the Sun Shine Girls appear topless in the daily newspaper.

Its pretty cool. One of my friends said that in Europe they have like dirty mags on full display in gas stations and things while here in the USA we have a black plastic board over our cosmo. I'm also not a fan of censorship, Its just funny to see how the whole world gets over it and we cant even but naughty parts in out video game. Any one with a computer to internet access can enter the word blow in google and get things much worse.

[SleepyBird]

I just got back from a trip to Paris, and there were pictures of Sharon's Stones boobs everywhere. She had done a topless photo shoot for some magazine, and it was on the cover at every newstand around. And it was no big deal at all. No one making a fuss, no horrified children, just another magazine cover. Yawn... Americans are just wierdly uptight about nudity. But I'm a hippie-chick who thinks violence is way more harmful to the kiddies.



I also think it's hilarious that Morrigan is clearly not wearing that bra throughout the game, but just puts it on for the sex scene. I guess she was carrying around some 'just in case' lingerie all along.

[Raxtoren]

Jwade86 wrote...

Kalfear wrote...
Course in Canada and Europe a bare breast doesnt make it resticted anyways! Heck in England the Sun Shine Girls appear topless in the daily newspaper.

Its pretty cool. One of my friends said that in Europe they have like dirty mags on full display in gas stations and things while here in the USA we have a black plastic board over our cosmo. I'm also not a fan of censorship, Its just funny to see how the whole world gets over it and we cant even but naughty parts in out video game. Any one with a computer to internet access can enter the word blow in google and get things much worse.

Its true, im swedish and plenty of gas stations has it here, the only costumer I seen buying one was some creepy old dude.
ANyway, its true though, Bioware(Canadian developers) has no problem showing people being decapicated, or having someone slit your throat, or even stabbing someone defenseless with a knife, but a nipple? has to censor that.
They are hilarious, and the NA culture is very confusing to me, a human body party needs to be hidden, while brutally murdering people is advs heavily in the game and used.
lol.

[Raxtoren]

dp.

Modifié par Raxtoren, 09 décembre 2009 - 01:02 .

[Kalfear]

Raxtoren wrote...

Jwade86 wrote...

Kalfear wrote...
Course in Canada and Europe a bare breast doesnt make it resticted anyways! Heck in England the Sun Shine Girls appear topless in the daily newspaper.

Its pretty cool. One of my friends said that in Europe they have like dirty mags on full display in gas stations and things while here in the USA we have a black plastic board over our cosmo. I'm also not a fan of censorship, Its just funny to see how the whole world gets over it and we cant even but naughty parts in out video game. Any one with a computer to internet access can enter the word blow in google and get things much worse.

Its true, im swedish and plenty of gas stations has it here, the only costumer I seen buying one was some creepy old dude.
ANyway, its true though, Bioware(Canadian developers) has no problem showing people being decapicated, or having someone slit your throat, or even stabbing someone defenseless with a knife, but a nipple? has to censor that.
They are hilarious, and the NA culture is very confusing to me, a human body party needs to be hidden, while brutally murdering people is advs heavily in the game and used.
lol.

heh Rax, I grew up outside Edmonton and have freinds that know the Bioware guys (it really was a small city for many years, expecially the White Ave South Side sceen) so I always been a big fan and supporter of Bioware (Edmonton that is, Bioware Austin can ... err nm, ill behave) but I gotta admit im disappointed in their double standard on touchy topics like nudity and homosexuality! How you can promote one but censor the other is, well its uncanadian is what it is! Im 43 and was watching nude films on CBC whenI was 10  there was only 3 TV channel to be had. Nudity in Canada has never been a big issue. 

Im now living in Ontario and we passed a law over a decade ago that girls could go topless (if they wanted) outside in public. Very few do (outside beachs and parliment grounds during summer break) but the option is there. Female breasts are simply not a taboo issue in Canada.

And again (as some posters like going to extremes for no reason) we not talking about full on intercourse happening. Just nudity when IT FITS the atmosphere being created.

I gotta admit, that short exchange I had with Bucky buckels opened my eyes at how prissy and puritan so Americans are and how they just instantly let their minds jump to worse possible senario! Maybe thats the reason why the game done as it is? I could actually understand that. Just wish someone would say so officially.

PS: Its not a north American culture, its a AMERICAN CULTURE! Canada is apart of North America and as I said above, we have no such short comings.

Modifié par Kalfear, 09 décembre 2009 - 04:38 .

[Saurel]

David Gaider wrote...

Krigwin wrote...
Why is there no option to execute Anora? I don't see how this would be too costly to implement, all it would take is another execution scene like with Loghain

You have your answer right there. We were busy cutting unnecessary cutscenes because of insufficient cinematics resources to cover all the variations we wanted in some of the plots. You don't need to execute Anora, and pulling out the "murder knife" for some kind of weird stabbing ending was hardly appropriate.

See? Hardly a satisfactory answer, I'm sure. So I'm not going to answer any more "why isn't there X?" questions, if you don't mind.

Someone should make a mod or machinima where the blood just keep splurting onto Anora for like 5 minutes after you decapitate or whatever you do to Loghain

[Brass_Buckles]

Vormaerin wrote...

"Full Frontal", at least in American parlance, does not mean merely topless. So, you may not have meant it that way, but you implicitly asked for content that is either X or NR in the US. This is particularly true when you consider that many of the underwear scenes are full body visuals. So you can't very well make a legitimate argument that someone other than you started with the X rated stuff.

Regardless, there's nothing more that needs to be said other than "Adult Only" is the kiss of death for mass market games. You can't sell them in many major American retailers and many parents will let their teenagers watch R rated or play M rated games that won't go for X or AO.

If you are addressing me, I'm the one who said I don't want full frontal nudity in this or any game, and then felt the need to explain to someone what full frontal meant because I'd specified that was what I didn't want and they did not seem to understand... 'Cause I took the whole "more nudity in M-rated game" thing to mean full frontal was what they were asking for.  This was most likely a misunderstanding on my part of what the other poster was asking for, so can we drop that topic already?  Dead horse, stick, and all that.  If you weren't addressing me, then, um... sorry for being an idiot.