70 réponses à ce sujet

[adi4444]

 like brian fargo doing with wasteland 2

thats way you will not need to dumb it down and make even more mony

[AlexJK]

Right. How much do you think it costs to make (and support, market, etc.) a title like DA3?

[adi4444]

mm i dont know but wastland 2 almost got to 3 milion and i think they will get the 3 mil ...

how much it cost to make da2? i think a lot less

[Pzykozis]

adi4444 wrote...

mm i dont know but wastland 2 almost got to 3 milion and i think they will get the 3 mil ...

how much it cost to make da2? i think a lot less

About $20-30 million most likely. And thats cheap for a AAA game.

Kickstarter results will be like great indie games but they don't have anywhere near the investment to make something like Dragon Age.

[Massakkolia]

Kickstarter is for start-up companies, small business owners and freelancers. Bioware is owned by EA, a major corporation listed on NASDAQ-100. Bioware would be laughed off Kickstarter before the funding could even start. They are too well financed and even if they'd get a few millions, it wouldn't make much of a difference to their budget.

[adi4444]

but with kickstarter they can make dragon age 3 exacly like they want and not restrict and dumb down by the EA publisher

[Massakkolia]

adi4444 wrote...

but with kickstarter they can make dragon age 3 exacly like they want and not restrict and dumb down by the EA publisher

Business doesn't work that way, sorry. As I said, Bioware is owned by EA. That means they can't just go doing solo whatever they want. Having a huge owner like EA does have its perks and a stabilizing effect. I assume it gives them more resources to work with but it doesn't mean, however, that they have all the money and time in the world at their disposal. Thus the resource problems with DA2. It's an allocation issue, which they just have to solve without the help of Kickstarter.

[syllogi]

Dragon Age as an intellectual property is owned by Electronic Arts. Bioware is a subsidiary of Electronic Arts. There's no leeway for an independent project, by Bioware, relating to Dragon Age.

I'm pretty sure even side projects while employed by EA would be a big no no.

[adi4444]

Filament wrote...

I'd like an ancillary product in the form of a Journeys 2 tablet RPG, but as I understand it, kickstarter is for companies that need a kickstart... EA could fund this just fine.

EA will dumb down evry game to make it appeal for the masses just like they did with dragon age origin 

Modifié par adi4444, 15 avril 2012 - 08:17 .

[addiction21]

adi4444 wrote...

Filament wrote...

I'd like an ancillary product in the form of a Journeys 2 tablet RPG, but as I understand it, kickstarter is for companies that need a kickstart... EA could fund this just fine.

EA will dumb down evry game to make it appeal for the masses just like they did with dragon age origin 

Just like Neverwinter was dumbed down from BG? Just like KotOR was dumbed down? Just like Jade Empire? OMG A SONIC THE HEDGEHOG RPG ON A HANDHELD!!!!


Wait that was long before EA ever came in the picture.


It could not have anything to do with it being a common practices for BioWare to "dumbdown the games"

Let me get the rest of the simple buzzword rhetoric out the way. Streamlined, sell out, corporate shills, console kiddy crowd, CoD crowd, old school, hardcore, real fans.... did I miss anything?

[DeadPoolX]

adi4444 wrote...

Filament wrote...

I'd like an ancillary product in the form of a Journeys 2 tablet RPG, but as I understand it, kickstarter is for companies that need a kickstart... EA could fund this just fine.

EA will dumb down evry game to make it appeal for the masses just like they did with dragon age origin 

That's a new one.  I don't believe I've heard anyone say DA:O was "dumbed down."

Unfortunately, BioWare can't just do whatever it wants.  Like several others have already said in this thread, it's owned by EA.

Kickstarter is for indie developers or other new companies that lack the necessary funds to create their game.  BioWare doesn't fit that into that category and hasn't since the mid-to-late 90s.

[ShadowAussie]

adi4444 wrote...

Filament wrote...

I'd like an ancillary product in the form of a Journeys 2 tablet RPG, but as I understand it, kickstarter is for companies that need a kickstart... EA could fund this just fine.

EA will dumb down evry game to make it appeal for the masses just like they did with dragon age origin 

you mean mass effect 3 not dragon age origins which the develop team for mass effect had to many plot endings, corruptions, glitches and the ending at most. but DA:O game and the rest of dlc including that awesome expanion did a better and awesome job of making fans loving the game. it was never dumb down. having allthose options to what race, having so many quests, siding with who ever you wanted. it was truely a great game and for DA2 it was good but bioware wasn't at their best having said that I love the game plus the dlc's in DA2 which some up to how great bioware is. they just need to fix afew perks for DA3 and fix the import issues most of us are having.<3

Modifié par ShadowAussie, 16 avril 2012 - 03:57 .

[HiroVoid]

While I doubt it could get anywhere near the needed amount, I am genuinely curious how much a popular, modern game would do on Kickstarter?

[wsandista]

adi4444 wrote...

Filament wrote...

I'd like an ancillary product in the form of a Journeys 2 tablet RPG, but as I understand it, kickstarter is for companies that need a kickstart... EA could fund this just fine.

EA will dumb down evry game to make it appeal for the masses just like they did with dragon age origin 

EA dumbs down the games to reduce development time and (try) to make the game appeal more to the people who want a hack-and-slash instead of an RPG. So even if the fans who want a hardcore RPG throw money at them with kickstarter, they will chase what appears to be the most profitable.

The problem with EA's strategy is that players who want Action games have a much larger variety of titles to choose from, while hardcore RPG fans have a much more limited selction. So by alienating RPG fans to court Action fans EA is leaving a smaller less competitive market for a much larger market that is much harder to compete in.

[Maria Caliban]

DeadPoolMK wrote...

That's a new one.  I don't believe I've heard anyone say DA:O was "dumbed down."

There was blood at the opera house when BioWare announced they would release Dragon Age: Origins consoles and would delay the PC version six months.

[Realmzmaster]

wsandista wrote...

adi4444 wrote...

Filament wrote...

I'd like an ancillary product in the form of a Journeys 2 tablet RPG, but as I understand it, kickstarter is for companies that need a kickstart... EA could fund this just fine.

EA will dumb down evry game to make it appeal for the masses just like they did with dragon age origin 

EA dumbs down the games to reduce development time and (try) to make the game appeal more to the people who want a hack-and-slash instead of an RPG. So even if the fans who want a hardcore RPG throw money at them with kickstarter, they will chase what appears to be the most profitable.

The problem with EA's strategy is that players who want Action games have a much larger variety of titles to choose from, while hardcore RPG fans have a much more limited selction. So by alienating RPG fans to court Action fans EA is leaving a smaller less competitive market for a much larger market that is much harder to compete in.

EA already competes in the Action game market (Battlefield, Crysis, Dead Space etc). Now if you are talking about action-cRPGS EA is not leaving a small pond for a larger pond. The size of the pond for action -crpgs is not that big. In fact it is relatively small in comparison to the market. EA also competes in action -crpgs (the lastest being Kingdoms of Amalur: Reckoning)

Now if you are talking about a tactical, realtime with pause game then Bioware/EA is about the only AAA publisher making that type of game (which DAO and DA2 are part of).

In fact cRPGs are a small segment of the market. There is probably more money to be made in making casual and sports games. The casual and sports games have  longer staying power in terms of sales. (One reason that EA acquired PopCap games).

EA's goal is what it has always been make revenue and profit like any business. You may take issue with how it goes about the goal (which is strategy), but you are looking a one part of a complex picture.

[Realmzmaster]

DeadPoolMK wrote...

That's a new one.  I don't believe I've heard anyone say DA:O was "dumbed down."

Yes , many said it was dumbed down in comparison to other Bioware cRPGS that were based on the 2.0, 3.0 and 3.5 D & D rulesets. The cries were very vocal esepcially when DAO was called the spiritual successor to BG.

@OP, Kickstarter is for new independent companies trying to get a footing. Bioware is funded and owned by EA which means all products and intellectual property associated with Dragon Age is owned by EA

Modifié par Realmzmaster, 16 avril 2012 - 09:31 .

[adi4444]

MY MISTEK I MENT THAT EA DUMB DOWN DA2 not origins for me origins was great...
da 2 show that EA take this saga to diffrent direction and its a sham ispecily wen dao sold more copies than da2 that means that the rpg fans are not a small crowd

[devSin]

Maria Caliban wrote...

There was blood at the opera house when BioWare announced they would release Dragon Age: Origins consoles and would delay the PC version six months.

Because they missed the post where David revealed all options were being explored re: Shale.

Best nine-month delay ever.

[Realmzmaster]

adi4444 wrote...

MY MISTEK I MENT THAT EA DUMB DOWN DA2 not origins for me origins was great...
da 2 show that EA take this saga to diffrent direction and its a sham ispecily wen dao sold more copies than da2 that means that the rpg fans are not a small crowd

Actually Bioware did streamline DAO from it predecessors. The Dragon Age system is streamlined in comparison to the D & D (BG1, BG2,NWN 1 & 2)  and other systems.

The market for cRPGs like DAO (and to a lesser extent for some DA2)  is smaller than the market for Single character first person (with possible third person perspective) action oriented-rpgs (like Skyrim, Witcher 2 and Kingdom of  Amalur: Reckoning). Very few (almost none) are making party based games like Bioware. 

Modifié par Realmzmaster, 17 avril 2012 - 01:33 .

[HanErlik]

Pzykozis wrote...

adi4444 wrote...

mm i dont know but wastland 2 almost got to 3 milion and i think they will get the 3 mil ...

how much it cost to make da2? i think a lot less

About $20-30 million most likely. And thats cheap for a AAA game.

Kickstarter results will be like great indie games but they don't have anywhere near the investment to make something like Dragon Age.

The Witcher 2, a far superior game to DA:II in many ways, was done with $6.5 million. Making a game is not very expensive, but promotions are very expensive. CoD:MW2's advertisement budget was three times bigger than its production cost.

Bioware can't use Kickstarter, because Bioware is a division of EA Games.

[SeanMurphy2]

Bioware don't need the funding.

If they wanted, they could put together a small team to make a more old school game with limited marketing and distribution. And they would probably make money on it. I don't think it fits with the rest of the company.

Also I wonder whether people have higher expectations of Bioware. I thought Origins DLC had that kind of model. Smaller team on a small budget. But people not happy with production values and use of assets. DA2 seemed to have full team working on DLC to make it similiar to main game.

Modifié par SeanMurphy2, 17 avril 2012 - 10:26 .

[Maria Caliban]

HanErlik wrote...

The Witcher 2, a far superior game to DA:II in many ways, was done with $6.5 million. Making a game is not very expensive, but promotions are very expensive. CoD:MW2's advertisement budget was three times bigger than its production cost.

Bioware can't use Kickstarter, because Bioware is a division of EA Games.

Given that the biggest expense on a software project is salary, couldn't that just mean tha CDProjket can pay its workers less because the cost of living isn't as expensive in Poland?

[wsandista]

Realmzmaster wrote...

wsandista wrote...

adi4444 wrote...

Filament wrote...

I'd like an ancillary product in the form of a Journeys 2 tablet RPG, but as I understand it, kickstarter is for companies that need a kickstart... EA could fund this just fine.

EA will dumb down evry game to make it appeal for the masses just like they did with dragon age origin 

EA dumbs down the games to reduce development time and (try) to make the game appeal more to the people who want a hack-and-slash instead of an RPG. So even if the fans who want a hardcore RPG throw money at them with kickstarter, they will chase what appears to be the most profitable.

The problem with EA's strategy is that players who want Action games have a much larger variety of titles to choose from, while hardcore RPG fans have a much more limited selction. So by alienating RPG fans to court Action fans EA is leaving a smaller less competitive market for a much larger market that is much harder to compete in.

EA already competes in the Action game market (Battlefield, Crysis, Dead Space etc). Now if you are talking about action-cRPGS EA is not leaving a small pond for a larger pond. The size of the pond for action -crpgs is not that big. In fact it is relatively small in comparison to the market. EA also competes in action -crpgs (the lastest being Kingdoms of Amalur: Reckoning)

Now if you are talking about a tactical, realtime with pause game then Bioware/EA is about the only AAA publisher making that type of game (which DAO and DA2 are part of).

In fact cRPGs are a small segment of the market. There is probably more money to be made in making casual and sports games. The casual and sports games have  longer staying power in terms of sales. (One reason that EA acquired PopCap games).

EA's goal is what it has always been make revenue and profit like any business. You may take issue with how it goes about the goal (which is strategy), but you are looking a one part of a complex picture.

Action-cRPGs compete with action games more than they compete with the more D&D(before 4ed) style cRPGs. The point that I was trying to make was that by making games more like Action-RPGs(goes for D&D as well) will mean that players who prefer more tactical RPGs will be less inclined to buy the games. Also the market is not only smaller in terms of consumers but producers, and since BW is one of the few(if not the only) AAA producers active in this niche market, losing the foothold they have could have severe consequences for them.