133 réponses à ce sujet

[LinksOcarina]

FlashedMyDrive wrote...


Professional reviewers usually don't play the full game in general. They are normally handed a special copy or given a certain time limit to play. At they same time, the developer or publisher's representative is nearby to ask, "What did you think?"

NO!

For the last time that is not true. Reviewers are contractually obligated to play the game to completion and do not have a time limit unless if it is a specific event with the publishers or dev team, meaning the game is a preview only since it was not completed. The reps for the publishers or dev team are not nearby when they do official reviews at all either, that only happens during events where games are previewed.

If they fail to do this, mind you, if they fail to play the entire game, then they are bad reviewers and the website or magazine hiring them either has no clause in their contract that says this is a firable offense, or is turning a blind eye to that practice. 

Typically review Copies are sent out a week or two before release, or day of release, for game sites to review. For those a week before, its so they can put the review up on time. For those after, they have some lee-way on when it is up, but it is usually a weeks worth of time. Point being, there is no big brother watching them and they don't have time limits. PLEASE stop spreading this. 

[Repearized Miranda]

Blastback wrote...

Overule wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

What would constitute an appropriate setup for a twist ending?

Layers upon layers of subtle hints dropped the entire length of the narrative from the 1st installment. That's an appropriate setup for a twist ending that's been built up for 5 years.

For a twist to work, you need to be able to look back at the experiance with your new knowledge an pick up subtle hints and clues that you never noticed until now. 

Like how in KotOR, the plot twist was forshadowed almost a dozen times with lines like, "The lure of the Dark Side can be difficult to resist.  I fear this quest to find the Star Forge could lead you down an all to familar path" or "What greater weapon is there than to turn an enemy to your cause.? To use thier own knowledge against them?"

You have to have been setting it up and droping hints thoughout the experiance. 

Yep! As people have stated upon first day release: Joe (the Kid) is a cheap way to garner catharsis - not realizing whom was deemed "Star-child" later was this same kid; however, it is his "transformation" - despite the reasonings, that seems illogical - I mean to say forced.

If we were talking to him in ME3, we've been talking to him since ME1 (which of course, he implies), but we don't find out until the third game!

Of course, what we really find out if we get the "special ending" which really cheapens the whole thing!

[Reanimated One]

LinksOcarina wrote...

Reanimated One wrote...

matthewmi wrote...

Wow game sales dropped after the first week!!!! They always drop sharply after the first week in all forms of entertainment media.

Yeah just like you ALWAYS see them selling for as much as HALF of their original price after just 3 weeks. That's pretty normal.

Happens to a lot of games actually. Funny enough, Modern Warfare 3 had a price drop to $49.99 right before Christmas, and Mass Effect 3 had their price drop before Easter break this year...

Must be a coincidence. 

Well here in the US (only because I don't know if you're speaking from experiences in other places) it is very RARE for a $60 game to be selling for $30 in 3 weeks unless it is bombing in sales. If you walk into any US retailer right now (Target, Walmart, Gamestop, etc.) and MW3 is still $60. Usually it drops $10-$15. Even on amazon right now, MW3 has been out since November and its still sellling for $40. ME3 has been out for 5 weeks and is selling for $43. 22 weeks since release vs. 5 weeks doesn't seem very proportionate to me.

[FlashedMyDrive]

LinksOcarina wrote...

FlashedMyDrive wrote...


Professional reviewers usually don't play the full game in general. They are normally handed a special copy or given a certain time limit to play. At they same time, the developer or publisher's representative is nearby to ask, "What did you think?"

NO!

For the last time that is not true. Reviewers are contractually obligated to play the game to completion and do not have a time limit unless if it is a specific event with the publishers or dev team, meaning the game is a preview only since it was not completed. The reps for the publishers or dev team are not nearby when they do official reviews at all either, that only happens during events where games are previewed.

If they fail to do this, mind you, if they fail to play the entire game, then they are bad reviewers and the website or magazine hiring them either has no clause in their contract that says this is a firable offense, or is turning a blind eye to that practice. 

Typically review Copies are sent out a week or two before release, or day of release, for game sites to review. For those a week before, its so they can put the review up on time. For those after, they have some lee-way on when it is up, but it is usually a weeks worth of time. Point being, there is no big brother watching them and they don't have time limits. PLEASE stop spreading this.

I spread it because, in many cases, its true.

[tobiasks]

Dridengx wrote...

matthewmi wrote...

Love how folks pull stats out of thin air 95 % this and 50% that lol there is no way of knowing how many want a new end, and making up stats.doesn't make your argument stronger.

Actually there is a few ways to tell and it's less than 2% of total sales want a new ending.

Here's what we know

We know how many members wanted a new ending via Retake numbers of 62,000

We know how many customers bought the game via sales 1.6 million to 3.4 million

We know how many costumers didn't like the ending 200,000 (but, there is no proof they wanted it changed!)

We know based on study that only 9% of fans participate in polls and forums, 90% of happy customers remain silent.


put all that together and you a very small minority who wants a new ending.

Retake likes to use BSN polls which only consist of less than the 9% spoken about.. their polls consist of numbers around 78,000 or less where they take a high percentage of the poll.. but again the numbers of the poll is so small in comparison to the fans and sales it proves nothing for them other than what Bioware already stated, a minority

I want a new ending and I have not joined the retake group. Also I know I am not the only one, so no, you do not know how many members want a new ending. Also I believe you do not know how all this works. Anyway if you believe the silent customers = happy with the ending, you are clearly wrong. I have 3 friends who absoloutely hates the ending, but they don't care enough to go to the forums and just moved on to other games. But that does not change the fact that they actually want a new ending, and are asking me to keep them updated.

Modifié par tobiasks, 15 avril 2012 - 08:35 .

[tobiasks]

Double post, sorry.

Modifié par tobiasks, 15 avril 2012 - 08:34 .

[LinksOcarina]

Reanimated One wrote...

LinksOcarina wrote...

Reanimated One wrote...

matthewmi wrote...

Wow game sales dropped after the first week!!!! They always drop sharply after the first week in all forms of entertainment media.

Yeah just like you ALWAYS see them selling for as much as HALF of their original price after just 3 weeks. That's pretty normal.

Happens to a lot of games actually. Funny enough, Modern Warfare 3 had a price drop to $49.99 right before Christmas, and Mass Effect 3 had their price drop before Easter break this year...

Must be a coincidence. 

Well here in the US (only because I don't know if you're speaking from experiences in other places) it is very RARE for a $60 game to be selling for $30 in 3 weeks unless it is bombing in sales. If you walk into any US retailer right now (Target, Walmart, Gamestop, etc.) and MW3 is still $60. Usually it drops $10-$15. Even on amazon right now, MW3 has been out since November and its still sellling for $40. ME3 has been out for 5 weeks and is selling for $43. 22 weeks since release vs. 5 weeks doesn't seem very proportionate to me.

Well I do live in the U.S. 

I also worked at Gamestop, and most of the time they put out deals near holiday times and keep them going for as long as possible, especially on new games.

It is presumptuous to say the game is bombing in sales when we know it is over a million sold already, I think the problem is the boming in reviews more than anything else. Literally. That is not helping things so the drop in price is tandem with the spring break that just occured.

Although Mass Effect 2 had a sharp price drop as well when it was first released; I remember it going down to $49.99 (was working at Gamestop then) after a month on the shelves. Although that was different because we were told not to sell the game new if we can help it...but I digress. It might also be the genre the game is in as well, RPGs tend to become more expensive over time, but also have a niche audience in the end so prices go down quicker than say shooters. 

Still, speculation. I don't think it is due to sales being bad. I think its the other outlying factors right now. 

[LinksOcarina]

FlashedMyDrive wrote...

LinksOcarina wrote...

FlashedMyDrive wrote...


Professional reviewers usually don't play the full game in general. They are normally handed a special copy or given a certain time limit to play. At they same time, the developer or publisher's representative is nearby to ask, "What did you think?"

NO!

For the last time that is not true. Reviewers are contractually obligated to play the game to completion and do not have a time limit unless if it is a specific event with the publishers or dev team, meaning the game is a preview only since it was not completed. The reps for the publishers or dev team are not nearby when they do official reviews at all either, that only happens during events where games are previewed.

If they fail to do this, mind you, if they fail to play the entire game, then they are bad reviewers and the website or magazine hiring them either has no clause in their contract that says this is a firable offense, or is turning a blind eye to that practice. 

Typically review Copies are sent out a week or two before release, or day of release, for game sites to review. For those a week before, its so they can put the review up on time. For those after, they have some lee-way on when it is up, but it is usually a weeks worth of time. Point being, there is no big brother watching them and they don't have time limits. PLEASE stop spreading this.

I spread it because, in many cases, its true.

No, it's not. 

And if you honestly believe that, then you are just as foolish in the end to spread this around. It is **** like this that gives the good reviewers out there a bad name. 

[Arsenic Touch]

LinksOcarina wrote...

Arsenic Touch wrote...

Dridengx wrote...

Overule wrote...

-The "unbiased" opinions of game reviewers who didn't even factor in the ending of the game into their reviews and the snide journalists who've belittled and pigeonholed us.

That's false. Many factored the ending, some even re-reviewed it like Game Informer but none of them are crying like you guys or dropping the score 9 pts over it.

Saying something doesn't it make it so, especially when there's evidence to the contrary. Majority of the "perfect" reviews were made by people that didn't even complete the game or it was so vague that you'd have no diea what they were talking about. But carry on trying to belittle people, it shows class.

And your proof of this is what exactly, the two guys that changed their minds via twitter a while back?

My post has nothing to do with twitter, so what are you blathering on about? 

[AJRimmsey]

dont worry

practically everything used so far to try and smear bioware or ME 3 has been speculation or opinion.

as soon as facts appear they are poo poo`d with more speculation and opinion.

Modifié par AJRimmsey, 15 avril 2012 - 08:39 .

[LinksOcarina]

Arsenic Touch wrote...

LinksOcarina wrote...

Arsenic Touch wrote...

Dridengx wrote...

Overule wrote...

-The "unbiased" opinions of game reviewers who didn't even factor in the ending of the game into their reviews and the snide journalists who've belittled and pigeonholed us.

That's false. Many factored the ending, some even re-reviewed it like Game Informer but none of them are crying like you guys or dropping the score 9 pts over it.

Saying something doesn't it make it so, especially when there's evidence to the contrary. Majority of the "perfect" reviews were made by people that didn't even complete the game or it was so vague that you'd have no diea what they were talking about. But carry on trying to belittle people, it shows class.

And your proof of this is what exactly, the two guys that changed their minds via twitter a while back?

My post has nothing to do with twitter, so what are you blathering on about? 

You offered no proof of what you claim, so I can ask you the same thing.

As for twitter, I believe a staff writer for Gamespot or something tweeted that he would of lowered his score of Mass Effect 3 if he saw the ending of the game. He is obviously a bad writer if he put out a review without finishing the damn product, but I digress. That is what I was referring to

[Reanimated One]

LinksOcarina wrote...

Reanimated One wrote...

LinksOcarina wrote...

Reanimated One wrote...

matthewmi wrote...

Wow game sales dropped after the first week!!!! They always drop sharply after the first week in all forms of entertainment media.

Yeah just like you ALWAYS see them selling for as much as HALF of their original price after just 3 weeks. That's pretty normal.

Happens to a lot of games actually. Funny enough, Modern Warfare 3 had a price drop to $49.99 right before Christmas, and Mass Effect 3 had their price drop before Easter break this year...

Must be a coincidence. 

Well here in the US (only because I don't know if you're speaking from experiences in other places) it is very RARE for a $60 game to be selling for $30 in 3 weeks unless it is bombing in sales. If you walk into any US retailer right now (Target, Walmart, Gamestop, etc.) and MW3 is still $60. Usually it drops $10-$15. Even on amazon right now, MW3 has been out since November and its still sellling for $40. ME3 has been out for 5 weeks and is selling for $43. 22 weeks since release vs. 5 weeks doesn't seem very proportionate to me.

Well I do live in the U.S. 

I also worked at Gamestop, and most of the time they put out deals near holiday times and keep them going for as long as possible, especially on new games.

It is presumptuous to say the game is bombing in sales when we know it is over a million sold already, I think the problem is the boming in reviews more than anything else. Literally. That is not helping things so the drop in price is tandem with the spring break that just occured.

Although Mass Effect 2 had a sharp price drop as well when it was first released; I remember it going down to $49.99 (was working at Gamestop then) after a month on the shelves. Although that was different because we were told not to sell the game new if we can help it...but I digress. It might also be the genre the game is in as well, RPGs tend to become more expensive over time, but also have a niche audience in the end so prices go down quicker than say shooters. 

Still, speculation. I don't think it is due to sales being bad. I think its the other outlying factors right now. 

I agree with everything you are saying. The only thing I am pointing to is the sharp price drop for ME3, at least in regards to online retailers (give or take a week) pretty much corolates with the bad reviews and the consumer out cry about the ending gaining steam in the media.

[Laurencio]

Overule wrote...

*Except not really.

Would people please stop saying stuff like this? People said it about Extended Cut, people said it about the face import issue, people said it about the Resurgence Pack. But the thing is it hasn't been true, not once. If you claim that a "reprioritization" of an existing DLC plan (Extended), a broken patch, and some free multiplayer crap is what people wanted- you don't know what you're talking about. Period.

The reason people keep whining after each EA/Bioware press release is because they still have yet to address our grievances. Said grievances include:

-Day 1 DLC.
-Face import still being broken.
-The introduction of a new character at the last second with 0 foreshadowing.
-The complete abandonment of any pretense that our decisions have a real impact on the outcome of the story.
-The fact that you explicitely stated over and over and over that you wouldn't force space magic or deus ex machinas on us.
-The fact you're still talking incessantly about the multiplayer we didn't ask for and don't care about.
-The "unbiased" opinions of game reviewers who didn't even factor in the ending of the game into their reviews and the snide journalists who've belittled and pigeonholed us.
-YOUR PR CAMPAIGN. Literally every step you've taken from the onset has made people angrier.

The bolded parts can't actually be changed, so there's little use in getting worked up about it. Because no matter what Bioware do those things still happened, you will continue to feel down about that regardless, and nothing will ever change that.

The greenish thing is highly unlikely to be changed. The rest are probably going to be changed, however that decisions doesn't matter is entirely untrue. The Quarian/Geth conflict has completely different outcomes based on earlier decisions, and there are a ton of side-characters that pop up all over the place based on decisions in the prevoius two games, as well as "mathematical" equations based on earlier decisions that determine the outcome of certain scenes.

That decisions aren't reflected in an epilogue is someting I believe they will adress with the DLC, and the face import bug will no doubt be fixed, as it would be silly not to fix it.

[translationninja]

Dridengx wrote...

Blastback wrote...

The fact is we don't know how the majority of players feel about the ending. Most of them are ultimatly silent on the issue. But of the ones that are talking about it, it seems to me that the majority are truely upset by the current ending. That said, there are a lot of reasons why people are upset and how they want it handled.

If the majority felt the game needed an ending and didn't have a life they would be here crying about the ending like the rest of Retake, and they are not here are they? its safe to say they either liked it, or didn't care enough to complain.

Mentioning "having a life"

Do you "have a life"? I mean hardly a "I hate the ending thread" goes by without you popping in within the first 6 or 7 posts.

So, do you?

[FlashedMyDrive]

LinksOcarina wrote...

FlashedMyDrive wrote...

I spread it because, in many cases, its true.

No, it's not. 

And if you honestly believe that, then you are just as foolish in the end to spread this around. It is **** like this that gives the good reviewers out there a bad name. 

It isn't a belief, it's a fact. Many review sources that people cling to as valid do not review the full product when they release reviews.

Besides, most "professional" reviewers these days are atrocious at what they do. They skim over vital details, inflate scores, and taint reviews with bias. Remember the days when an 7.5/10 was considered good? Now everything has to be a 10 or 9.5, else it is considered to suck.

Mass Effect 3 in no way, shape, or form deserved a 10/10. But I digress.

Modifié par FlashedMyDrive, 15 avril 2012 - 08:46 .

[Reanimated One]

AJRimmsey wrote...

dont worry

practically everything used so far to try and smear bioware or ME 3 has been speculation or opinion.

as soon as facts appear they are poo poo`d with more speculation and opinion.

The ending we were presnted with is speculation? Is this like the Matrix where there is no spoon? The PR slaps in the face to the consumers with the we're sorry that people are too stupid to understand what we are trying to convey? Obviously not in those words, but that was the point they were trying to make. 

I would also like to see the facts considering this ENTIRE discussion is opinion driven I.E. people like the ending, don't like it or are indeifferent. I can give you my facts as to why I don't like the ending, those being events from within the game. What facts are BW and EA providing to prove to me to prove I am wrong? None because its an opinion.

[LinksOcarina]

FlashedMyDrive wrote...

LinksOcarina wrote...

FlashedMyDrive wrote...

I spread it because, in many cases, its true.

No, it's not. 

And if you honestly believe that, then you are just as foolish in the end to spread this around. It is **** like this that gives the good reviewers out there a bad name. 

It isn't a belief, it's a fact. Many review sources that people cling to as valid do not review the full product when they release reviews.

Besides, most "professional" reviewers these days are atrocious at what they do. They skim over vital details, inflate scores, and taint reviews with bias. Remember the days when an 7.5/10 was considered good? Now everything has to be a 10 or 9.5, else it is considered to suck.

Mass Effect 3 in no way, shape, or form deserved a 10/10. But I digress.

Proof then of them not reviewing the full product. I would love to see this because I know if I ever pulled **** like that I would quit reviewing games then. 

[AJRimmsey]

FlashedMyDrive wrote...

LinksOcarina wrote...

FlashedMyDrive wrote...

I spread it because, in many cases, its true.

No, it's not. 

And if you honestly believe that, then you are just as foolish in the end to spread this around. It is **** like this that gives the good reviewers out there a bad name. 

It isn't a belief, it's a fact. Many review sources that people cling to as valid do not review the full product when they release reviews.

Besides, most "professional" reviewers these days are atrocious at what they do. They skim over vital details, inflate scores, and taint reviews with bias. Remember the days when an 7.5/10 was considered good? Now everything has to be a 10 or 9.5, else it is considered to suck.

Mass Effect 3 in no way, shape, or form deserved a 10/10. But I digress.

when the same sites were giivng lousy scores they were biblical in thier honesty

then they found out about same IP review bombing campaign and all of a sudden they are all lying ???

i is confused ?

[Rykoth]

Do you retakers think you're more special then people satisfied with the way the game ends? You're not.

You asked for closure, they're gonna give you the extended cut. You want brand new endings? I want a billion dollars and a job sitting on my computer all day, but you can't get what you want all the time.

Seriously.

Either support Bioware, or DON'T. If you don't support them, stop filling the forums with this BS.

[string3r]

Until Bioware comes out and admits that they made a mistake, I'm going to whine and complain.

[addiction21]

Rykoth wrote...

You asked for closure, they're gonna give you the extended cut. You want brand new endings? I want a billion dollars and a job sitting on my computer all day, but you can't get what you want all the time.

But if you had a billion dollars you could pay me a few million to do that job for you!

[AJRimmsey]

addiction21 wrote...

Rykoth wrote...

You asked for closure, they're gonna give you the extended cut. You want brand new endings? I want a billion dollars and a job sitting on my computer all day, but you can't get what you want all the time.

But if you had a billion dollars you could pay me a few million to do that job for you!

ignore this guy







i`ll do it for a million

[wolfstanus]

No review site ever mentioned a bad ending of any sort or any sort of plot holes. Nobody... These things in reviews piped up only after bsn community backlashed... Sorry "knee jerked" and attacked everybody who said it was good... 

LinksOcarina wrote...

FlashedMyDrive wrote...

LinksOcarina wrote...

FlashedMyDrive wrote...

I spread it because, in many cases, its true.

No, it's not. 

And if you honestly believe that, then you are just as foolish in the end to spread this around. It is **** like this that gives the good reviewers out there a bad name. 

It isn't a belief, it's a fact. Many review sources that people cling to as valid do not review the full product when they release reviews.

Besides, most "professional" reviewers these days are atrocious at what they do. They skim over vital details, inflate scores, and taint reviews with bias. Remember the days when an 7.5/10 was considered good? Now everything has to be a 10 or 9.5, else it is considered to suck.

Mass Effect 3 in no way, shape, or form deserved a 10/10. But I digress.

Proof then of them not reviewing the full product. I would love to see this because I know if I ever pulled **** like that I would quit reviewing games then. 

[Reanimated One]

AJRimmsey wrote...

addiction21 wrote...

Rykoth wrote...

You asked for closure, they're gonna give you the extended cut. You want brand new endings? I want a billion dollars and a job sitting on my computer all day, but you can't get what you want all the time.

But if you had a billion dollars you could pay me a few million to do that job for you!

ignore this guy







i`ll do it for a million

lol $500K

Modifié par Reanimated One, 15 avril 2012 - 08:57 .

[LinksOcarina]

 

wolfstanus wrote...

No review site ever mentioned a bad ending of any sort or any sort of plot holes. Nobody... These things in reviews piped up only after bsn community backlashed... Sorry "knee jerked" and attacked everybody who said it was good...

 

That is not proof. That is speculation under the presumption they felt the ending was bad.

Some of them may have actually liked it. Others probably said they didn't but failed to communicate it through the review, which is a flaw in most game reviews I see, a poor sense of communication as to what is good and what is bad, and an overuse of buzz words.

Modifié par LinksOcarina, 15 avril 2012 - 08:59 .