48 réponses à ce sujet

[xsdob]

UnstableMongoose wrote...

Nope.

1. Polarizing anyone who disagrees with you as a detractor of Retake rather than a sovereign being with their own opinions shows how out of touch you are.

2. Both sides make the "vocal minority" argument, and neither has the proof. It's pointless to even bring it up, no one knows whether or not this a correct statement.

3. Follow your own advice. You literally used an antagonistic term to refer to people who don't agree with you in the same post as claiming that people who have differing opinions are not necessarily enemies.

This.

also, I believe the group of fans who have the largest majority are the fans who played the game, had fun, and moved on.

These forums, and all gaming forums, make up a small amount of the fanbase, the core, which is the most dedicated but also the most isolated and the tinest parts of the fandom.

This is where the passonate, the obssessed, the freakily obssessed, and the nutjob fringe all go to, with about 5% left to the normal people, this figure may be subject to change upon real facts.

So, we have a majority who don't really care either way or who simply had fun with this game and moved on, and the minority who come here and talk about all their experiences and multiple playthroughs and who have pretty much made the various game series a part of their lives rather than a small experience and footnote in them.

And within this minority, is another minority, and that's what the whole issues about, who's the minorities minority.

[CARL_DF90]

@ Dragoonlordz

Your pic is sooo CUTE!

Modifié par CARL_DF90, 16 avril 2012 - 06:51 .

[Dragoonlordz]

CARL_DF90 wrote...

@ Dragoonlordz

Your pic is sooo CUTE!

[Eire Icon]

MrSquits wrote...

I genuinely don't care about all of this anymore. .

[CARL_DF90]

Apathy serves no one my friend.

[Eire Icon]

CARL_DF90 wrote...

Apathy serves no one my friend.

I don't believe its apathy per say to be tired of watching the same thing happen over and over again.

People telling people what they "Must do", people demanding that others with a certain view "Justify this view"

Please its getting old, people need to get over themselves

Modifié par Eire Icon, 16 avril 2012 - 08:57 .

[Dragoonlordz]

Eire Icon wrote...

CARL_DF90 wrote...

Apathy serves no one my friend.

I don't believe its apathy per say to be tired of watching the same thing happen over and over again.

People telling people what they "Must do", people demanding that others with a certain view "Justify this view"

Please its getting old, people need to get over themselves

Agreed. Many feel the same way.

It is not just their (ones who hate endings) community, it's ours too. but they don't care for anything except getting what they want or anyone except themselves. They had my sympathy and was polite and nice towards them for first few weeks, it's been a month now and some still are ranting with very few being reasonable and to be quite honest it just annoys me now (they do) on the whole not some specific individuals who remain reasonable which are few and far between..

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 16 avril 2012 - 09:07 .

[Overule]

The vocally apathetic. An oxymoron if ever there was one...

Modifié par Overule, 17 avril 2012 - 01:39 .

[CARL_DF90]

Me? I'm getting just as weary as anyone for the continued presence of the endings debacle. I'm hoping like anyone it is corrected, but in a way that is true to the series and that pretty much everyone can live with.

@ Eire Icon

I only got the apathy impression from the statement you quoted. My bad if I was mistaken.

Modifié par CARL_DF90, 17 avril 2012 - 06:43 .

[Calbeb]

Overule wrote...

1. Bioware made disingenuous claims about the nature of the game before it was released.

Any time the whole "they lied!" line of dialogue opens up there's basically only 2 things being said in response by the people involved: "Yeah!" & "SO!?"

Nobody seems to be arguing that Mac/Casey/Etc. lied about the whole A/B/C ending thing, just whether or not lying about a video game is a big deal or not. This in turn usually devolves into the usual pointless argument about entitlement. And naturally the important point (the lies...) gets buried under a few pages of frustration and name calling...

2. The upset fanbase aren't a minority.

This was the go-to argument for detractors for a while. That the fans who weren't happy were the minority. Now it isn't. Largely because between the international facebook groups, the 80k drive, the mailing campaigns, the online polls, the flood of negative feedback on BSN and I'm sure about a half dozen other things I'm forgetting all stand in opposition to the idea.

3. Having an opposed opinions doesn't automatically make you enemies.

This is something I really want people to clue in to. Whenever there's a pro/anti ending thread freshly opened there's automatically 3-4 people from either side who rush in with something appropriately sarcastic or dismissive to say about OP or some point OP touched on. And almost the entirety of the time it's something along the lines of:

"Oh, look, how original. Did you think this up by yourself?" Trans: "I've heard a version of this discussion before! That means I win!"

"Oh it's THIS guy." Trans: "I hate your guts, and think that it's a valid opinion worth arguing/sharing with strangers."

"Stop being so *insert adjective*!" Trans: "Shut up!"

All of which reads like by writing a thread the OP was out to personally attack the people responding. Which (usually anyway) isn't the case. So what gives? Petty bickering doesn't advance anyone's cause. And if you're sick of reading similar topics: STOP READING THEM. It's a voluntary action, nobody's gonna sympathize with you because you chose to be annoyed.

1. Not true actually. You could argue for instance that there are multiple permeations of the ending based on your EMS, which is defined by your choices. You could also argue that the game as a whole actually functions as a series of endings (which has been my interpratation) and that many o those major story finales ARE based on decisions throughout the game/games.

I would argue that the statements made by the team were probably misguided, and they should be more careful about only saying things in the future if they can show it, which seems like the Dragon Age 3 marketing strategy so good on them for realizing that weakness.

2. There is no way to determine how many people are actually upset about the ending. I think the majority of players are dissatisfied with the finale. I also think that a lot of people have been frustrated with the Ratakers. It's impossible to say how many either way. Unless someone who has nothing to do with this debate can give us good metrics, than it's not even worth arguing about.

3. Agreed. People don't need to be so oppositional, but I feel like the tone of the conversation has gotten increasingly acidic on all sides (Anti-Enders/Pro-Enders and people who think the conversation need to move on.) Even this thread has that, right in the title, when people who disagree with Retakers are actually referred to as detractors. How are people who enjoy the game and don't want to complain about the ending anymore "detractors".

It's likely to just get more acidic as the only people who are still talking about this at great length are the most passionate.

[RiouHotaru]

Overule wrote...
1. Bioware made disingenuous claims about the nature of the game before it was released.

Perhaps.  I think it's more that Bioware made claims, which the fanbase then took and interpreted freely.  Mass Effect 3 was a victim of it's own hype, which has happened to games before.  The fans get so excited and worked up that their standards become unrealistic or simply impossible.

Overule wrote... 
2. The upset fanbase aren't a minority.

They aren't a majority either.  We can only count the people who WANT to be counted.  Just because someone is upset doesn't mean anything if they don't want to be counted or noticed.  Also, I'm sure some of the folks here are also folks posting on the facebook, etc, so there's some crossover.

But it's still not a "majority"

Overule wrote... 
3. Having an opposed opinions doesn't automatically make you enemies.

I wish more folks thought this.  I lost friends over these silly, baseless arguments that often erupt when discussing the endings.

[TJX2045]

MrSquits wrote...

Funnily enough, after finishing ME3 I had an urge to replay DA2. I'm having a great time on it aswell.

Kinda ... strange.

Same here.  Once I beat ME3 I had a bigger appreciation for DA2s ending, which I already liked to an extent not including the scapegoat climax.

In regards to this thread....most Retakers/Detractors are so focused on their "herp derping" rather than actually debate and disagree respectfully so I doubt that'll happen.

Most pro-ending people will just say "Oh the company lied? Too bad shouldn't have trusted them ROFLMAO LOLerskates."  <_<

RiouHotaru wrote...

Overule wrote... 
3. Having an opposed opinions doesn't automatically make you enemies.

I wish more folks thought this.  I lost friends over these silly, baseless arguments that often erupt when discussing the endings.

 
Yeah, I don't understand why people feel the need to attack others just because they didn't or did like the ending.  What I've seen lately is people saying "Why did you like/hate the ending?" and then next was something similar to "Your opinion is BS and doesn't matter because I'm right and you're wrong!!! Nyah."

Ah what the internet does to people.  Turning grown men and women into children.

Modifié par TJX2045, 17 avril 2012 - 07:26 .

[kumquats]

Overule wrote...

All of which reads like by writing a thread the OP was out to personally attack the people responding. Which (usually anyway) isn't the case. So what gives? Petty bickering doesn't advance anyone's cause. And if you're sick of reading similar topics: STOP READING THEM. It's a voluntary action, nobody's gonna sympathize with you because you chose to be annoyed.

The problem is, that every person on this planet, NEEDS to open a new thread every 3 seconds to let everyone know:

A: Will never buy anything from BW again.
B: Hated the ending.
C: Feels like BW is their girlfriend and has to defend them.

------------

Bottom of line is, I'm part of this community. It's impossible for me to find interesting discussions, because you are all spaming the forums.
I haven't stopped reading this threads, I have stopped reading whole forums at some point.

But what am I talking about... this thread will be gone in 10 minutes tops, buried under spam of AB and C.

[CARL_DF90]

Yeah, I hear ya' on the spam part. That does get annoying. Still, buried under this mountain some good points are made as well. Like this vid right here.



Good points are made and in an entertaining fashion.

[Eire Icon]

kumquats wrote...

The problem is, that every person on this planet, NEEDS to open a new thread every 3 seconds to let everyone know:

A: Will never buy anything from BW again.
B: Hated the ending.
C: Feels like BW is their girlfriend and has to defend them.

------------

Bottom of line is, I'm part of this community. It's impossible for me to find interesting discussions, because you are all spaming the forums.
I haven't stopped reading this threads, I have stopped reading whole forums at some point.

But what am I talking about... this thread will be gone in 10 minutes tops, buried under spam of AB and C.

Couldn't agree more

[CARL_DF90]

slyguy200 wrote...

True.
But on the internet opposing opinions is enough to make many people ENEMIES.

Which is kind of sad. Whatever happened to civil discussion, meeting half-way, or just plain old agree to disagee if you do not want to or can't acknowledge facts and info presented? It's really sad when people don't even try to understand each other, or are so prideful that maybe they can't even admit when they are in the wrong. Me? If I am proven wrong about something I am more than open to admit it. *sighs* Guess if I want civil interesting convo I must look elsewhere, huh?

[Swimming Ferret]

I'm kinda numb to the whole thing at the moment. Sure, I was incredibly angry and felt betrayed when I finished the game first time around.

I mean, I preorded the Collector's Edition (first time I ever preordered something), expecting an awesome ending where every decision I made had impact, after seeing all the races right side by side on Earth.

It didn't, got a stupid Godchild that made sh!t all sense, I died, the whole galaxy gets nuked, my squad leaves me to die and the ending words are "Downloadable Content"

The attitude of Bioware towards the fans isn't helping, as they either ignoring us or acting as if we are too mentally retarded to get the artistic integrity of the end.

I'm kinda indifferent at the moment. Though the Indotronation Theory fans are starting to ****** me off.

[CARL_DF90]

Perhaps, although the I have to admit that the I.T. alternative makes a heck of a lot more sense and can even help to restart the Prioty: Earth mission and give us what Bioware said we would get: a satisfying conclusion. We'll see what happens come summer time.

[Exeider]

AtreiyaN7 wrote...

Ffeel free to produce a decent, non-biased scientific poll.

I love how when people find a poll that doesn't agree with their point of view that it MUST be wrong, or that its Biased.

Also, a quick search of google will give you the information you requested. I have linked it for you.

Google Search Results

I think it's just funny that there have been poll after poll, even done by so called "unbiased" media, and yet THEIR polls reflect the ones here on BSN. and if you know how polling works, you only need a min of 1000 people to get a 3% margin of error.

10,000 will result in a 1% margin of error.

also non response bias is factored as a function of those who did respond.

Yes, the people who hate the ending are a majority, an overwhelming majority the lowest poll I've seen is 80%, most are cooking around the 87%-89% range, with some spikes up to the 91% range.

I mean seriously, if you can't see the writing on the wall, I don't know what to tell you. I'm talking to a brick wall.

EDIT: btw, in regards to the "disingenous claims" statement, Oh yeah, they frickin' lied, i mean i think we've seen the whole "There won't be 'ABC' endings" statement to death. SO yeah, they frickin' lied....Big Time!!

-AE

Modifié par Exeider, 18 avril 2012 - 03:57 .

[Otaku Hanzo]

The theme to "Love Boat" pops in my head every time I see one of these threads.

[Saint Op]

Ooooh look at this thread...I loves it soooo much...

It's like shooting someone right before preaching about nonviolence...hip...
I was all ready to go get some ice cream then blam...sweetness...
I always sing Jackson 5 when the stupid ending comment is brought up....
Bubble man you live in a bubble...

[AlanC9]

Exeider wrote...
I think it's just funny that there have been poll after poll, even done by so called "unbiased" media, and yet THEIR polls reflect the ones here on BSN. and if you know how polling works, you only need a min of 1000 people to get a 3% margin of error.

Right. If they're randomly selected. If they're self-selected... garbage in, garbage out.

[Saint Op]

@alanc9 knows how to work the polls...I'm going to go ask a bunch of KKK members what they think about Obama...this will be totally acurate