317 réponses à ce sujet

[BellatrixLugosi]

Platysaur wrote...

translationninja wrote...

Platysaur wrote...

This community is ruining Bioware, don't you ignorant idiots see? It is actually YOU'RE fault, I'm sick of people banging on Bioware when they don't realize the brought it apon themselves.

Please do elaborate, there wasn't much point to your statement except vulgar insult. Maybe you want to talk about it?

Well, you are an example. You are trying to act all smug, which is one thing. I've not once met more than 5 good people on this forums. And by messing up the reputation of Bioware, I think any person could see:

Complaining about the ending (including filing it to some federal place)
Boycott
Complaining, so much complaining

You guys try to make a game that everyone will like, hm? Or write a good ending?

Well they are insatable, even if they get what they want they will do their best to punish Bioware for it as much as they can.

[MichaelSD]

Garlador wrote...

And especially don't tell me "hell yeah, we're proud of it", either. A commercial work is worthy of praise if your audience TELLS you it is.

And the ending isn't worth any praise.

You're still a great company with great ideas. You've had great successes, even in ME3. Be proud of those. But when it comes to a point of negativity, a point of criticism, a point of bitterness and heartache, resist the call to go on the defensive. The customer is always right; you blew it there.

And so what? Fix it. Rectify it. And then move on. You'll get a few bruises, but you'll have the knowledge to avoid those problems in the future. No work is perfect, but don't pretend that a universally hated part of your work IS perfect when it quite clearly, logically, and thematically is not.

It is said "hubris come before the fall".

[spirosz]

It's partly our fault and their fault. A lot of people had too high of an expectation for the last game and Bioware didn't do too well with certain aspects of the last game - you can obviously tell there are rushed segments throughout the game, the different approach with the dialogue is the biggest mistake I think Bioware took, but that's just my opinion. Overall, it was a great game, no doubt, but it didn't become what it was set out to be in my mind.

[Reanimated One]

BellatrixLugosi wrote...

Well they are insatable, even if they get what they want they will do their best to punish Bioware for it as much as they can.

I would love to know how you came to this conclusion considering they have done nothing for anyone. They have made announcements, statements and also ignored a lot of the problems the fans have brought up. So to say that the ones who didn't like it still wouldn't be happy if they did anything is a paradox. An announcement of a summer release dlc to clarify (we're sorry you were too stupid to figure it out/appreciate it) is hardly what the majority of the people who didn't like the end were asking for. 

But just like all the rest like you, you'll think everyone else is wrong and BW is right. It even says so in your signature.

[Blastback]

Platysaur wrote...

translationninja wrote...

Platysaur wrote...

This community is ruining Bioware, don't you ignorant idiots see? It is actually YOU'RE fault, I'm sick of people banging on Bioware when they don't realize the brought it apon themselves.

Please do elaborate, there wasn't much point to your statement except vulgar insult. Maybe you want to talk about it?

Well, you are an example. You are trying to act all smug, which is one thing. I've not once met more than 5 good people on this forums. And by messing up the reputation of Bioware, I think any person could see:

Complaining about the ending (including filing it to some federal place)
Boycott
Complaining, so much complaining

You guys try to make a game that everyone will like, hm? Or write a good ending?

And how does any of this make ME3's endings our fault?  If Bioware feels that the community is having a negative impact on their games, they can always not visit it. 

And honestly, while some fans are out trying to sabatoge Bioware's reputation, plenty of the negative wrap they are getting is a result of their own actions.   They knew when they released the ending that it would be controversial.  If they were not willing to deal with the potential fallout then they shouldn't have taken the risk. 

[BellatrixLugosi]

Reanimated One wrote...

BellatrixLugosi wrote...

Well they are insatable, even if they get what they want they will do their best to punish Bioware for it as much as they can.

I would love to know how you came to this conclusion considering they have done nothing for anyone. They have made announcements, statements and also ignored a lot of the problems the fans have brought up. So to say that the ones who didn't like it still wouldn't be happy if they did anything is a paradox. An announcement of a summer release dlc to clarify (we're sorry you were too stupid to figure it out/appreciate it) is hardly what the majority of the people who didn't like the end were asking for. 

But just like all the rest like you, you'll think everyone else is wrong and BW is right. It even says so in your signature.

Well......they kinda are right.  There are techinical issues to be fixed in Me3 but thats pretty much it.   Patch fixed my import issue, then again 2 of my 3 characters has some slight changes but I chalk that up to updated face's and character customization, some times it happens you know.   And well........most of the hapless "Fans" have created paradox's allready with their reaction......its kinda evident.  Or do I need to come out with a DLC to explain the hissy fits you guys have been throwing?

Edit:Actually don't bother answering, I have to go to class and by the time I get back there will probably be a string of "I hate ending waaaaah" threads burying this one.

Modifié par BellatrixLugosi, 16 avril 2012 - 09:04 .

[Nightdragon8]

spiros9110 wrote...

It's partly our fault and their fault. A lot of people had too high of an expectation for the last game and Bioware didn't do too well with certain aspects of the last game - you can obviously tell there are rushed segments throughout the game, the different approach with the dialogue is the biggest mistake I think Bioware took, but that's just my opinion. Overall, it was a great game, no doubt, but it didn't become what it was set out to be in my mind.

had too high of expecttation.... so i guess we should not have beleaved what Hudson was saying in the news and stuff? "There will be no A,B,C type of endings"  which is exactly what we got, "No off switch try ending" Pretty sure the crucuble is a large off switch machine.

And the troll logic we got from the star kid about the reapers... "We kill organcis to protect organic life from snthitics" really?? that what the writers of ME3, which up to that point was wonderful writing, we get B-movie logic??

Honestly knowing when to scrap somthing and change it is the halmarks of a good director... Lets take Independence day, you know the movie AKA ID4, that turned out to be a good movie. In the first edit, Rusal didn't get drafted he was rejected, everything else played out, and int he climatic scene where they couldn't take down alien ship, he appers out of no where with a missle strapped to his bi plane... and while "flying along side the f-18" was talking the the pres, thats when he flys up into the beam and tada blows the ship up.

Now they removed it because it was "unrealistic" IMO if they would have kept it, it would have degraded the movie to a B movie status.  But they didn't and became one of the great movies.

They hyped us about what it wouldn't have, and ended p giving it to us anyway. They should have tested the star child ending to see if

[spirosz]

@Nightdragon You're correct and I'm not saying what they did was right, there's a difference between saying "You'll have a satisfying conclusion," compared to saying "There will be no A,B,C type of endings" and having the latter, but you have to admit that some folks have too high of an expectation for the ending.

For example, I wasn't expecting every squadmate to have equal treatment, which shows in ME3, but again; they want to sell to their game and I understand sticking to the popular route (but I don't agree with swaying towards that path) - so it ends up - Liara seems to have the most dedicated attention, Tali was put into a squadmate status because of "loud fans", Jacob seemed to have the worst because of the quietest fanbase, etc.

Hopefully they learn from their mistakes (which I doubt with the way they're continuing down their current road), they'll still make millions of people happy with their games and I'm happy for those customers, if it puts a smile on them, that's what matters.

[kbct]

Platysaur wrote...

I've not once met more than 5 good people on this forums.

I have met plenty of nice, smart, funny people on this forum.

You need to relax and stop complaining about the people that are trying to voice their opinion. Stop saying we've taken it too far, that we're entitled whiners, that we're a vocal minority, etc.

You can't stop us. Why try?

This is what Woo said about the community a few weeks ago:

"The community has been articulate, considerate, and for the most part extremely respectful and smart with how it is providing its feedback. And a large portion of those dissatisfied with the ME3 endings are cautioning others to keep the criticism constructive, to be respectful to the developers, and to remain civil in their arguments. I appreciate that a great deal, and I thank you and the rest of our community for that." -Woo

Just let the backlash over the ending take its natural course.

Modifié par kbct, 16 avril 2012 - 09:11 .

[Reanimated One]

BellatrixLugosi wrote...

Reanimated One wrote...

BellatrixLugosi wrote...

Well they are insatable, even if they get what they want they will do their best to punish Bioware for it as much as they can.

I would love to know how you came to this conclusion considering they have done nothing for anyone. They have made announcements, statements and also ignored a lot of the problems the fans have brought up. So to say that the ones who didn't like it still wouldn't be happy if they did anything is a paradox. An announcement of a summer release dlc to clarify (we're sorry you were too stupid to figure it out/appreciate it) is hardly what the majority of the people who didn't like the end were asking for. 

But just like all the rest like you, you'll think everyone else is wrong and BW is right. It even says so in your signature.

Well......they kinda are right.  There are techinical issues to be fixed in Me3 but thats pretty much it.   Patch fixed my import issue, then again 2 of my 3 characters has some slight changes but I chalk that up to updated face's and character customization, some times it happens you know.   And well........most of the hapless "Fans" have created paradox's allready with their reaction......its kinda evident.  Or do I need to come out with a DLC to explain the hissy fits you guys have been throwing?

Edit:Actually don't bother answering, I have to go to class and by the time I get back there will probably be a string of "I hate ending waaaaah" threads burying this one.

Well I'll respond, if you read it you do, and if you don't its still out there. You are confusing the 2 groups. There are the retakers that pound fists, stomp feet and attack anyone who has an opinion different from theirs, and there are the others who couldn't stand the ending, but have no problem actually articulating what they didn't like about it and can appreciate the fans who actually do like, or at the very least don't have as big a problem with the ending. 


I agree with the tech issues that need to be fixed and the patch that was provided. For both of thos issues I point to the fact that if more testing had been done, which this release obviously still needed, then at the very least we'd be looking at a more polished game with less glitches/bugs even if some of us still didn't like the ending. 

I don't really understand how hapless (in this case I'm assuming you mean factless) created anything except making asses of themselves. If all they do is spout meaningless, factless, unfounded crap, then that's exactly what their argument is. However, if some of us can sit down, like the OP has done and clearly articulate what the issues/problems are that we have with ME3, whether it be the ending, or in general, I do not feel that creates a paradox at all.

As for the hissy fits, I'll direct you to the above point.

Finally, the fact of BW being right. How are they right? This ENTIRE firestorm is based solely on OPINION and not fact. It is our opinion that we do not like the ending, and it is BW's opinion that they should not have to change it. The only concrete facts that can really be pointed out are there are groups who liked it, hated it and are indifferent. And I know I am by no means saying any particular one is right because they are all entitled to their own opinion. This game is commercial art, to be enjoyed, viewed and interpreted by a wide deomgraphic around the world. So for any one group of opinion holders to stand up and say, this is how I feel and I'm right is ludcrous. (Which we obviously know is a pipedream.)

I commend the OP for taking the time to create such a well thought out post. Whether it is read by anyone at BW at this point really doesn't matter. He can be at peace with himself because he got it out of his head and at least posted somewhere. It was a far better read than a lot of crap being posted lately and deserves to be aknowledged. 

[Oldbones2]

Dridengx wrote...

Degs29 wrote...
you can easily say disappointed fans outway satisfied fans by an enormous margin, and that sample can be applied to the larger fanbase population.

You can easily say it just I could easily say I'm A  Prime Minister of England but it doesn't make it true. You have no facts, you have no numbers good enoough to prove you are nothing but the size of Retake itself a mere few thousand who btw didn't like the ending, not that they wanted it changed

And yet you use the same polls to 'prove' that Obviously since some people didn't vote in the polls at all, they must like the ending.

That's not proof. 

It's not even a guess backed by a statistic.  It's just your opinion, which if memory serves me correctly, isn't unbiased.

[translationninja]

[quote]Platysaur wrote...

[quote]translationninja wrote...

[quote]Platysaur wrote...
-snip-
quote]
I've not once met more than 5 good people on this forums.
-snip-
[/quote]

Hm not even 5 good people, huh? Yet you see fit to mingle. Makes one wonder...

[Platysaur]

[quote]translationninja wrote...

[quote]Platysaur wrote...

[quote]translationninja wrote...

[quote]Platysaur wrote...
-snip-
quote]
I've not once met more than 5 good people on this forums.
-snip-
[/quote]

Hm not even 5 good people, huh? Yet you see fit to mingle. Makes one wonder...
[/quote]
You aren't helping your case. Dude, you are the epitome of a straight up dick. If you don't think some people on these forums are ass holes, look at yourself man.

[AlanC9]

Reanimated One wrote...
Well I'll respond, if you read it you do, and if you don't its still out there. You are confusing the 2 groups. There are the retakers that pound fists, stomp feet and attack anyone who has an opinion different from theirs, and there are the others who couldn't stand the ending, but have no problem actually articulating what they didn't like about it and can appreciate the fans who actually do like, or at the very least don't have as big a problem with the ending. 

Did the second group actually ever achieve consensus as to what specific things they didn't like about the ending?

[Documental]

Naw, they're fine.

[Benjiprice]

The ones that accept the ME3 are the ones that dont understand the game, those cant be voiced!

[Chuvvy]

Dridengx wrote...

Well for one.. there isn't millions of fans who didn't like the ending, it wasn't even a quarter of a million. Many people are happy with ME3. So your argument is broken. If a few thousand get mad, move on, you can't force their hands and demand a company to do what you want.. you take it or leave it.

150% of people hate babies. See? I can make claims with nothing to back it up too!

You want real math? 66,000 people disliked the ending, as shown by a poll. Other polls, like the CVG and Facebook poll have a similar rating (IE dissapointment being the strong majority) though there are less votes. It's generally accepted that only one out of twenty six unsatisfied customers complain. What's 26 x 66,000? 1,716,000, which keeps the disapproval rating at the same we've seen in the three polls I've mentioned.

http://www.customers...rvice-facts.htm 

Sorce on the 1/26, third bulletpoint.

[chevyguy87]

Some "fans" (using that term to be polite) seriously need to calm down and have a beer or something.

[AJRimmsey]

AlanC9 wrote...

Reanimated One wrote...
Well I'll respond, if you read it you do, and if you don't its still out there. You are confusing the 2 groups. There are the retakers that pound fists, stomp feet and attack anyone who has an opinion different from theirs, and there are the others who couldn't stand the ending, but have no problem actually articulating what they didn't like about it and can appreciate the fans who actually do like, or at the very least don't have as big a problem with the ending. 

Did the second group actually ever achieve consensus as to what specific things they didn't like about the ending?

i sat there reading page after page after page of different opinions and demands for what the haters wanted as an ending.

but at the end all they came to a consensus about is that they wanted to stay here demanding it all.

a few quoted "statistics" based on proven sabotaged polls
a few quoted complete twaddle that it was thier right to demand anything they wanted
a few even went down the path of "i am right you are wrong" because the tooth fairy told me.

but the actual only truth is that so many people want the game tailored to thier own selfish cravings that no consensus will ever be reached.

the phrase "haters gonna hate" was about the only conclusion i could see,and i really wanted to understand EXACTLY what people wanted.

the real retake members did come out of it well though,as they simply said "we have won something with the dlc,lets wait till we see what it is"

Modifié par AJRimmsey, 16 avril 2012 - 10:13 .

[Kenshen]

kbct wrote.

Where are all the posts describing how all their friends liked the ending? It would be nice to occasionally hear stories from people that don't post here often to say all their friends liked the ending. And no, I'm not talking about the ten pro-enders here and their friends. I'm talking about people that don't post here often. Point to posts like I just did.

This doesn't really answer your post but thought I would share what I have seen with my own eyes.  I have 4 work friends that have finished ME3 and all but one has played all 3 games.  My wife, sister-in-law, family friend and his wife have all finished ME3 and played all 3 games.  7 of them have opinions that range from dislike to hate the ending.  The other 1 told me he didn't like nor dislike the ending but that RPG's are not his thing but FPS are and that was the reason to play ME3.  Also he was the one that didn't play ME1 though not sure that really matters.  This is my gamer peer group and counting me that is 8 out of 9 that are not happy with the ending. 

I will say this that the reasons for disliking the ending varied.  Some did want and expected the rainbows and bunnies kind of happy ending.  A few of us saw the vast amount of plotholes and sudden shift in the story and the others just bought into all the "promises" that were made to us fans (me).  The final question I asked each of them is would they recommend ME3 to another and 4 said they would but only if it can be got for cheap.  The other 4 was a quick and strong no.  I do know of 3 people who were on the fence too buy or not to buy before that have turned away from the game.  I don't know anyone that is bought the game after day 1.

[AJRimmsey]

aryon69 wrote...

kbct wrote.

Where are all the posts describing how all their friends liked the ending? It would be nice to occasionally hear stories from people that don't post here often to say all their friends liked the ending. And no, I'm not talking about the ten pro-enders here and their friends. I'm talking about people that don't post here often. Point to posts like I just did.

This doesn't really answer your post but thought I would share what I have seen with my own eyes.  I have 4 work friends that have finished ME3 and all but one has played all 3 games.  My wife, sister-in-law, family friend and his wife have all finished ME3 and played all 3 games.  7 of them have opinions that range from dislike to hate the ending.  The other 1 told me he didn't like nor dislike the ending but that RPG's are not his thing but FPS are and that was the reason to play ME3.  Also he was the one that didn't play ME1 though not sure that really matters.  This is my gamer peer group and counting me that is 8 out of 9 that are not happy with the ending. 

I will say this that the reasons for disliking the ending varied.  Some did want and expected the rainbows and bunnies kind of happy ending.  A few of us saw the vast amount of plotholes and sudden shift in the story and the others just bought into all the "promises" that were made to us fans (me).  The final question I asked each of them is would they recommend ME3 to another and 4 said they would but only if it can be got for cheap.  The other 4 was a quick and strong no.  I do know of 3 people who were on the fence too buy or not to buy before that have turned away from the game.  I don't know anyone that is bought the game after day 1.

great to see a family involved in something together.

as i am the only one playing it in my family i can only quote a store result.

where my sis convinced in the region of 100 people to buy ME 3 for the first time,who had never played it before.

none returned the game,and none came back complaining about the ending.
but many did come back asking if they had i stock ME 1 and 2 and if it was possible to play them after playing 3.

but to a man all loved the game,and none have ever used a game forum.

now thats one store out of hundreds in her chain
pretty impressive results considering they were all new customers to bioware products.

maybe reading forums before playing is a bad thing for actually enjoying a game as a game.

[bleachorange]

Dridengx wrote...

Degs29 wrote...
you can easily say disappointed fans outway satisfied fans by an enormous margin, and that sample can be applied to the larger fanbase population.

You can easily say it just I could easily say I'm A  Prime Minister of England but it doesn't make it true. You have no facts, you have no numbers good enoough to prove you are nothing but the size of Retake itself a mere few thousand who btw didn't like the ending, not that they wanted it changed

Dude, open your brain and learn stuff. The retake movement's goal was to change the ending - it wasn't some group people made to complain about how much it sucked.

wow, the rifraff they let on the interwebz these days...

[bleachorange]

AJRimmsey wrote...

aryon69 wrote...

kbct wrote.

Where are all the posts describing how all their friends liked the ending? It would be nice to occasionally hear stories from people that don't post here often to say all their friends liked the ending. And no, I'm not talking about the ten pro-enders here and their friends. I'm talking about people that don't post here often. Point to posts like I just did.

This doesn't really answer your post but thought I would share what I have seen with my own eyes.  I have 4 work friends that have finished ME3 and all but one has played all 3 games.  My wife, sister-in-law, family friend and his wife have all finished ME3 and played all 3 games.  7 of them have opinions that range from dislike to hate the ending.  The other 1 told me he didn't like nor dislike the ending but that RPG's are not his thing but FPS are and that was the reason to play ME3.  Also he was the one that didn't play ME1 though not sure that really matters.  This is my gamer peer group and counting me that is 8 out of 9 that are not happy with the ending. 

I will say this that the reasons for disliking the ending varied.  Some did want and expected the rainbows and bunnies kind of happy ending.  A few of us saw the vast amount of plotholes and sudden shift in the story and the others just bought into all the "promises" that were made to us fans (me).  The final question I asked each of them is would they recommend ME3 to another and 4 said they would but only if it can be got for cheap.  The other 4 was a quick and strong no.  I do know of 3 people who were on the fence too buy or not to buy before that have turned away from the game.  I don't know anyone that is bought the game after day 1.

great to see a family involved in something together.

as i am the only one playing it in my family i can only quote a store result.

where my sis convinced in the region of 100 people to buy ME 3 for the first time,who had never played it before.

none returned the game,and none came back complaining about the ending.
but many did come back asking if they had i stock ME 1 and 2 and if it was possible to play them after playing 3.

but to a man all loved the game,and none have ever used a game forum.

now thats one store out of hundreds in her chain
pretty impressive results considering they were all new customers to bioware products.

maybe reading forums before playing is a bad thing for actually enjoying a game as a game.

well, that says to me that they probably didn't really get the issues here. the themes of mass effect 1 and 2 are completely different. if they were convinced, they probably didnt see all the advertising and promises about the ending either. I'm not saying you're wrong. I'm just taking that info with a sack of salt.

[chevyguy87]

AJRimmsey wrote...

maybe reading forums before playing is a bad thing for actually enjoying a game as a game.

Agreed since well over half of the threads have people butchering the game and other complaints and grievances that have really gotten quite dull and others have simply gotten too out of hand.

I played the game in it's entirety before even thinking about coming to take a peek at the forums. Glad I did that because if I came here BEFORE I played the game, the amount of b*tching and moaning about the same thing would've ruined the game for me (not the endings mind you) the malicious comments about the game would've done me in.