Aller au contenu

Photo

"All Were Thematically Revolting". My Lit Professor's take on the Endings. (UPDATED)


  • Veuillez vous connecter pour répondre
5087 réponses à ce sujet

#4551
drayfish

drayfish
  • Members
  • 1 211 messages

Sable Phoenix wrote...

(with lamentable snipping)

I reject their choices.  I reject the story they told.  I reject their claim upon my imagination.  Jessica Shepard is mine, and they shall never take her from me.

Jessica Shepard - 2154-2012
Semper Fi, Marine!
Godspeed.


@ Sable Phoenix: Phenomenal, heartbreaking post.
 
I respect the hell out of you for knowing the limitations of your character's mind – even knowing her well enough to foresee the tragedy of watching as she shattered her own moral code to do what (in those perverted circumstances) had be done. Damned compelling stuff, and beautifully described.
 
Thank you for that.
 
I have nothing so intelligent or insightful to add to the discussion, nor to any of the other compelling debate that has been going on elsewhere throughout the thread – I have only (as is frequently the case), Batman.
 
I couldn't help it. I mean, to be honest my brain is usually circling some kind of consideration of the Dark Knight around ninety percent of the day, but as I read your powerful account of Jessica Shepard and the alien figure with which she seemed to be replaced in the final game, I was reminded of the rather fractious relationship I have with many depictions of the Caped Crusader. No doubt this also is in large part a product of my playing too much Arkham City lately, but I'm starting to think of Shepard in Mass Effect 3 the way I think of the first Batman film. Not the Nolan Batmans that saved the character from filmic farce, and certainly not the Schumacher Batman... Schumacher's vision of the Dark Knight in Forever and Batman and Robin was ...bad.
 
(There we go: I appoint myself the award for Most Understatement Ever Made on the Interwebs! Thank you. Thank you all. I'd like to thank God, for inventing irony. And to my parents: thank you for showing me how to be flippant. This one's for you.)
 
No, I'm going right back to the Burton Batman, because – and this might be controversial – to me, despite that film's title, it wasn't actually a story about the character Batman at all. In fact, Batman didn't even appear in it.
 
See, there's a moment in that story when Batman is hunting the Joker and he follows him up into a church. On the way up he has to face your standard thug cardboard-cut-out villains – if memory serves me (it almost certainly doesn't) they were wearing matching sequined jackets or something. But as he fights them, Batman hurls them off the building. He sends them plummeting to their death. 

...Now, as anyone with a passing knowledge of the character Batman knows – he's not so much about the killing. Like, not ever. Even with a mass-murdering sociopath like the Joker – for Batman it's not his place to decide who dies, and he would certainly never take a life. But in Burton's Batman he's flinging dudes to their demise, haphazardly shooting a chain gun from his plane (again: guns! never never never with the guns!), and he even possibly (the moment is vague) lets Joker fall to his pancakey death on the pavement. ...Not so much the character established over decades of comic history.
 
But when I saw this film for the first time I had my moment of fan indignation (what the hell is this?; snuffle, rage, guffaw, etc.) but in doing so, realised what the movie was.  It wasn't actually a Batman movie (again, despite the name that would suggest otherwise). Sure it was a vigilante movie, and the main character was a guy in a weird bat costume; but that wasn't Batman. That was Burton's bat-shaped hero-cipher. And once I'd made that shift, I could like the movie well enough – it just wasn't the character or the narrative that I had expected, nor was it one I was going to ultimately love.
 
I suspect that in the months to come, as I look back on my experience of Mass Effect 3, it will be a similar sensation that I will be left with once the ache of disappointment has finally faded.
 
Like that alternate 'Burton-man', there were a number of elements within the span of Mass Effect 3's story that (even before the end) alienated this narrative's protagonist from the Shepard that I knew and loved, even though this woman was wearing her face.* 
 
The kid in the dreams, it must be said, was probably the most obvious. No doubt I've spoken of this before, but although my Shepard was a selfless, compassionate figure, even she didn't give any particular crap about that kid. There was simply too much else going on. All life was ending – friends, loved ones, civilisation itself was being annihilated – and if that kid represented anything at all (and he really didn't), it was what happens when people do stupid things and don't let themselves be helped – again, the complete opposite of everything my Shepard believed. To be told – against all reason – that she was haunted by this dead-eyed little zombie in dreams, and to have her lamenting his loss in deep-and-meaningfuls with her Bro, Garrus, was extremely jarring, and wholly character-inconsistent.
 
And that's just the tip of a number of curious personality shifts that all snowball their way into those endings – a conclusion where the only moment in which she still sounds like herself leads to devastation, ruin, and Liara condescendingly condemning her for having failed the every advanced creature in the universe.
 
Shepard, like Batman, was a larger than life hero that, until the final game, I recognised absolutely – could read and predict with an elegant, effortless symbiosis. But exactly as you described with Jessica, once I saw her slow-motion jogging toward some drone in a hoodie, all maudlin and broken and dulled, she ceased to be the character I knew. She'd been weighed down by the arbitrary lament of writers who had hijacked her spirit for an artless descent into their final nihilistic bargain. 
 
I suspect they had always intended to use this child as a symbol of the apocalypse (rough beast, slouching toward Bethlehem, and all that), but it seems a shame they decided to use Shepard as the first consumable item for the fire. Truly the best had to lose all conviction for the worst to be filled with such passionate intensity. 


* In the interests of full-disclosure I should mention that she was actually only wearing the closest facsimile of her face that I could manage after wrestling with the face-import bug. Shepard looked almost identical, but there was nonetheless a curious sensation of disassociation I couldn't shake, like when a television role gets swapped to a different actor.


EDIT: Bah!  Top of page.  Okay: 'Dead Flowers', by The Rolling Stones.

If you really want a sombre experience, listen to the Townes Van Zandt version:


Modifié par drayfish, 08 juillet 2012 - 02:23 .


#4552
edisnooM

edisnooM
  • Members
  • 748 messages
Been away for a bit, but a lot of good posts. :-)

@Sable Phoenix

To Jessica Shepard. A woman who never would. (+10 points to anyone who gets the reference.)


@drayfish

First off, there's no such thing as too much Arkham City. Playing as The GD Batman (Kevin Conroy), and taking on The Joker (Mark Hamill). It doesn't get much better than that. :-)

Also Good post and points, and yes even though I was young when I first saw Burton's Batman, I could tell there was something very wrong with the whole, you know, killing thing. To be fair though, Nolan's Batman did do something very similar with the whole "I don't have to save you either" thing. I did a bit of an eyebrow raise when I saw that in the theatre.

And Batman is down on guns, but seems to be a bit more amicable towards missiles I've noticed. :-)

Also Joel Schumacher made Batman movies? Hmm, that's not ringing any bells, seems like the sort of thing I would remember.


And I could not play ME3 until I worked my way past the import bug using a convoluted system of extracting save files from the Xbox onto a flash drive, opening it on my computer, getting out a file, uploading that to a site that then gave me a close approximation that I could get looking like my Shepard.

When I saw the misshapen gray faced abomination (slight hyperbole) that they wanted me to play with I just froze. It wasn't Shepard and after 2 games and whole lot of hours with this character, I couldn't imagine playing with a complete stranger.

#4553
delta_vee

delta_vee
  • Members
  • 393 messages
@drayfish

That's quite enough Yeats for you, young man.

@Sable

Nah, your textwall didn't kill the thread. Would've been a worthy headstone, though.

#4554
drayfish

drayfish
  • Members
  • 1 211 messages

delta_vee wrote...

@drayfish

That's quite enough Yeats for you, young man.

Never!  I'll 'Long-Legged Fly' everyone or die trying!

#4555
Captain Kibosh

Captain Kibosh
  • Members
  • 260 messages

drayfish wrote...

delta_vee wrote...

@drayfish

That's quite enough Yeats for you, young man.

Never!  I'll 'Long-Legged Fly' everyone or die trying!


You do that.  I'll just chill back here at the "bee-loud glade" on the Lake Isle of Innisfree.

Ironically, this is why I disliked Ashley--her penchant for dropping lines of poetry like a bard pedantic.  Ahhh, Ashley, what might have been back on Virmire if you hadn't shown such undue keenness for Tennyson's poetry.  KAIDAN knew how to keep it real.  :P

#4556
Guest_alleyd_*

Guest_alleyd_*
  • Guests
 
 Apologies for the wall of text.

I posted this on a thread of its own but would hope to hear the opinions of those on this thread


I believe that the Refusal ending could offer a solution to many of the issues that are the subject of fan's disappointment with the current ending structure.

TL;DR It involves the creative use of multiple s/p DLC.

The first DLC is called The Trojan Horse and can use existing assets in FMV etc with a few extra changes

It is triggered by a High EMS refusal. Shepard has united the majority of the galaxy for the fight and has built the Crucible.

He meets with the Catalyst and hears the options available. If he selects any of the Catalysts compromises the game finishes with the relevant FMV for the choice, but with a couple of twists and changes.
  • Immediately before the Credits trail The Breath Scene is added to both Control and Synthesis choice.
  • The current slideshows are taken out and the credits roll
  • Immediatley after credits the Liara capsule FMV is added with a change to dialogue. Liara mentions that "We failed to stop the Reapers. The Crucible was a trap that Shepard fell for and activated one of the catalysts compromises, dooming the current cycle. The only solution is to destroy the Crucible
I believe this would offer an olive branch to Indoctrination Theory  believers. They were correct, the Catalyst was trying to Indoctrinate Shepard and if he selects any compromise RGB choice the Reapers have indoctrinated him.
Also it removes the disparate ending choices that make the writing of a sequel or extension into the future a much harder task IMO.

The only Valid choice remaining is a Refusal of the Catalyst, but "We can't win conventionally"

So use an "unconventional" tactic of the Trojan Horse. The Crucible has a self destruct mechanism built in that shepard tells Hackett to activate. The crucible destruction disables or disrupts the Reaper control mechanism and the Reapers are weakened, disorganised or Mad. The sword fleet returns and mops up theReapers in Sol and the Normandy rescues Shepard from the Crucible before it self destructs.

The Normandy, depiste being the fastest ship in the allied fleet is not fast enough to fully escape and crashes.

This DLC is essential to setting up the later campaigns. A series of smaller S/P campaigns that allow the player to fight the weakened Reapers in each race's home system. This is the Reaper War.

The first reaper War DLC is the Reclaim Earth DLC A 2 mission pack that has Mission 1 find and repair Normandy (You play as a new or ME2 human character) Then has a second mission that is a battle to free Earth from a Reaper Ground Force. Buying, playing and completing this is essential to unlock the rest of the campaign.

Reclaim Earth adds
  • Jack and/or new character (Major Coates) as new crew member
  • Loyalty bonus to each human crew member
  • Adds Hackett as an advisor (The advisor is an art asset placed in the Normandy War Room. Each advisor adds EMS and assets for the final assault DLC.
The other Reaper War DLC's cater for the major races in the series, but are not essential for victory. (I will explain in EMS breakdown later) 

Each council race has a similar 2-mission campaign to the Reclaim Earth format. The first mission has you recruit a crew member (Either New or ME2 character). The second mission is a battle to free each races homeworld. 
The completion of each DLC frees the relevant race and there is an EMS type payment, Assets and a crew loyalty bonus built for each race crew member.

Examples for council Races.
Asari
Mission 1 Rescue Samara and Felane from Ardhat Yakshi monastry. Success offers ME2 character (Samara) or New Character (Felane). 
Mission 2 Free Thessia. Adds Matriarch (Aethyta??) as an asset, Loyalty bonus on all Asari.

Salarian
Mission 1 Retake STG base on Surkesh from Reapers and/or Yahg. Success brings new character, STG Officer (Kirrahe)
Mission 2 Free Surkesh, advisor asset (Salarian Councillor or Dalatrass)

Turian
Mission 1 Prevent Reaper Assault on Kabal base. New Character (Kabal Agent)
Mission 2 Retake Palaven, advisor asset (Primark Victus)

Non Council Races

Krogan
The krogan campaign depends on ME3 playthrough choice. 
If you cured the Genophage you get additional EMS and the full campaign. 
Failure to Cure Genophage takes out the Mission 1 and has the fight to reclaim Tuchanka only. 
Cure Genophage
Mission 1 Defend Krogan Nursery from Reaper Attack. New Character (Krogan BroodMother)
Mission 2 Retake Tuchanka, Advisor Asset (Wrex/Eve)
Betray Krogan
Mission 2 Retake Tuchanka Advisor Asset (Krogan Warlord)

Geth/Quarian
These are of course dependant on ME3 choice and are offered as a reduced cost DLC consisting of 1 mission each to retake Rannoch (Quarian) and/or Geth Consensus. Both DLC are 50% of cost of the main 2-part council DLC. They add crewmember (Legion 2.0 & Quarian Marine) and advisor asset (Geth Prime/Quarian Admiral)

Cerberus
This campaign is to clear up Cerberus. Either to Destroy or to Recliam them for the Alliance
Mission 1 Retake Horizon from Reaper assault (Recruit Jacob and Miranda)
Mission 2 Infiltrate Secret Cerberus base and obtain TIM's secrets (Advisor TIM, or VI)

Other Races
The other races (Batarian, Vorcha, Rachni, Drell/Hanar, Volus and Elcor) have a set of battle maps to reclaim the relevant homeworld in a bonus DLC . They don't offer playable crew members, just advisor asset and EMS.

EMS Breakdown
These DLC (Except the Earth campaign) are optional to the final assault. If a player doesn't want to save a race then they have the choice not to buy the relevant race DLC
  • The Trojan Horse DLC adds a maximum of 20% EMS
  • Reclaim Earth and Each Council Race offer 10% EMS each. Total available 40%
  • If Cured G/P Krogan campaign adds a plus 10% EMS (Betray Krogan offers a max EMS of 5%)
  • Quarian/ Geth offer a plus 5% EMS for each Race. Save both and its plus 10%
  • Cerberus Campaign offers an additional 10% EMS
  • The Bonus Secondary race DLC offers a max EMS of 10%
The Final Assault DLC

The final Assault DLC is a suicide mission type assault on the Citadel and Harbinger (Who is attached to the Citadel). This has a 3 mission structure, 1 being a default mission and the other additional missions unlock depending on EMS tota

The Citadel opens to the assault at 30% EMS 
  • The Default mission is destroy the Catalyst forever and this is available at 30%EMS (ie directly after Reclaim Earth) but success is questionable. Only Humans are in the final assault (Except the Crew). Casualties will be high and success unlikely.
  • The Second mission option (Free the Citadel Captives) opens at 60% EMS. A new crewmember is added (Zaeed)
  • The third mission option (Free/Kill Harbinger) opens at 75% EMS. A new crewmember is added (Kasumi), the Reaper secrets are revealed and a choice to free Harbinger or Kill him exists.
The End Battle is of course another confrontation with the Catalyst. Boss Battle, or conversation ending structure. But the ending assault would be an ME2 suicide mission and success depends on EMS and crew loyalty.

Summary

I think this strategy would be a fitting end to the series for both fans and Bioware EA if offered and supported. 
  • It offers all fans the chance of a Reaper war and the chance for more relevant and valuable DLC purchase
  • It keeps the controversial RGB ending but adds the Indoctrination twist
  • Builds in a choice element that the player has the choice of which race to save for the next cycle
  • Provides an easier out for the writing of a sequel.
  • Supports the franchise and generates revenue using coherent and obvious DLC transactions in a S/P format
  • Fans can choose to buy into the series at a level that matches their investment in the series. Total purchase of all DLC is not obligatory, but maybe preferable in the end game
  • Leaves the option open for repeated and varied replay of the game and series.
  • Reconciles the themes of possible victory through HOPE, TEAMWORK, DIVERSITY and DEFIANCE against impossible odds.


#4557
Strange Aeons

Strange Aeons
  • Members
  • 247 messages

alleyd wrote...

 
 TL;DR It involves the creative use of multiple s/p DLC.

[snip]


I like the spirit of your suggestions!  What you describe would be a much more satisfying implementation of the EMS mechanic. 

My main problem with this idea is that it sets an even worse precedent than Day 1 DLC that turned out to be critical to the story.   Anyone else remember back in the horse armor days of yore, when DLC was young?  Developers assured us that never, nuh uh, no way would they ever do anything so crass and mercenary as witholding vital, game-changing content to sell it to us separately as DLC.  We all knew better, of course, but because the changes were slow and insidious we just sat dumbly and watched like the proverbial frogs in the pot of water. 

Now we've arrived at a point where it seems perfectly realistic for the developer to charge us full price for a game while holding its real ending hostage and ransoming it to us in parts.  It might be more palatable if they were to sell the whole game in smaller, episodic chunks, but that's not very likely.  EA wants their $65 up front after spending the amount of money it takes to produce a title like ME3. 

Modifié par Strange Aeons, 08 juillet 2012 - 07:12 .


#4558
BigTuna82

BigTuna82
  • Members
  • 249 messages

Strange Aeons wrote...

alleyd wrote...

 
 TL;DR It involves the creative use of multiple s/p DLC.

[snip]


I like the spirit of your suggestions!  What you describe would be a much more satisfying implementation of the EMS mechanic. 

My main problem with this idea is that it sets an even worse precedent than Day 1 DLC that turned out to be critical to the story.   Anyone else remember back in the horse armor days of yore, when DLC was young?  Developers assured us that never, nuh uh, no way would they ever do anything so crass and mercenary as witholding vital, game-changing content to sell it to us separately as DLC.  We all knew better, of course, but because the changes were slow and insidious we just sat dumbly and watched like the proverbial frogs in the pot of water. 

Now we've arrived at a point where it seems perfectly realistic for the developer to charge us full price for a game while holding its real ending hostage and ransoming it to us in parts.  It might be more palatable if they were to sell the whole game in smaller, episodic chunks, but that's not very likely.  EA wants their $65 up front after spending the amount of money it takes to produce a title like ME3. 


I can see this coming.

"Have an attachment to Adm Anderson?  Buy the DLC that includes him getting better armor so that Shepard doesn't wound him."

"Your fondness of Edi and the Geth holding you back from Destroy?  Here's a DLC that protects them in some way from the blast."

#4559
TheMarshal

TheMarshal
  • Members
  • 2 339 messages

Strange Aeons wrote...

I like the spirit of your suggestions!  What you describe would be a much more satisfying implementation of the EMS mechanic. 

My main problem with this idea is that it sets an even worse precedent than Day 1 DLC that turned out to be critical to the story.   Anyone else remember back in the horse armor days of yore, when DLC was young?  Developers assured us that never, nuh uh, no way would they ever do anything so crass and mercenary as witholding vital, game-changing content to sell it to us separately as DLC.  We all knew better, of course, but because the changes were slow and insidious we just sat dumbly and watched like the proverbial frogs in the pot of water. 

Now we've arrived at a point where it seems perfectly realistic for the developer to charge us full price for a game while holding its real ending hostage and ransoming it to us in parts.  It might be more palatable if they were to sell the whole game in smaller, episodic chunks, but that's not very likely.  EA wants their $65 up front after spending the amount of money it takes to produce a title like ME3. 


I might be alone in that I would prefer a "complete" game to span multiple releases rather than having an abridged version of the story crammed into a single release.  I believe I've said it before, but by splitting the game up they could have focused on core mechanics, multiplayer, and universe introduction in the first launch, and the second launch could have received far more resources to show us the epic battles and epic conclusion so many of us wanted.

I know that there are financial reasons to not do such a thing.  It's bad for business to put out an incomplete story and ask people to make not one but two purchases to get the entire story.  But I ask how Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows did at the box office?  Or (shudder) Twilight: Breaking Dawn?  Or Lord of the Rings?  Can you imagine what kind of crap story we would have gotten had Lord of the Rings been treated as a single film instead of masterfully being broken up the way it was?  Granted that's the way the book broke down, but Peter Jackson fought to make each subsequent film a direct sequel to the prior one without a "previously on Lord of the Rings" bringing-newbies-up-to-speed montage.

#4560
Guest_alleyd_*

Guest_alleyd_*
  • Guests

TheMarshal wrote...

I might be alone in that I would prefer a "complete" game to span multiple releases rather than having an abridged version of the story crammed into a single release.  I believe I've said it before, but by splitting the game up they could have focused on core mechanics, multiplayer, and universe introduction in the first launch, and the second launch could have received far more resources to show us the epic battles and epic conclusion so many of us wanted.


I always hoped that ME3was going to follow that episodic model. The ME3 campaign stands up well as a Game until the last mission. The scope of the Reaper war was too huge to portray in a couple of hours.

The multiple DLC solution I suggest offers a compromise of sorts. Instead of a whole campaign there are the essentially unlocking elements that a player can choose to purchase. 

The other race packs are optional and up to the players choice of wether to buy or not. 

I think that this is less of an abuse of DLC than the current M/P mechanism or some other ideas that are cosmetic or don't alter the game significantly. DLC plans like Omega Leviathan or any other prequel content ar null and void in my opinion unless they significantly alter the actual endings. 

. It gives a real reason to play the game and rewards player loyalty if the DLC are of quality. If each campaign was of say 5 hours/race I would think it worth say 800 - 1200 BW points

Also the sales of these DLC could give accurate feedback on the market potential of S/P DLC and also provide feedback on which races are popular with players.

Could possibly give testing for a future MMO or other release.

#4561
edisnooM

edisnooM
  • Members
  • 748 messages
@alleyd

I like the ideas, and honestly if they did it I would be sorely tempted to buy them.

Unfortunately they have stressed repeatedly that they won't be doing anything past the endgame, and anything they release now will be during or before ME3.

And if they did do this it would open up a whole can of worms with the people who were satisfied with the way the game played out, not to mention the flak they would take for apparently shipping a incomplete game.

Also I can just imagine the media jumping all over this and how they're "compromising artistic integrity".

#4562
SHARXTREME

SHARXTREME
  • Members
  • 162 messages

Strange Aeons wrote...

alleyd wrote...

 
 TL;DR It involves the creative use of multiple s/p DLC.

[snip]


I like the spirit of your suggestions!  What you describe would be a much more satisfying implementation of the EMS mechanic. 

My main problem with this idea is that it sets an even worse precedent than Day 1 DLC that turned out to be critical to the story.   Anyone else remember back in the horse armor days of yore, when DLC was young?  Developers assured us that never, nuh uh, no way would they ever do anything so crass and mercenary as witholding vital, game-changing content to sell it to us separately as DLC.  We all knew better, of course, but because the changes were slow and insidious we just sat dumbly and watched like the proverbial frogs in the pot of water. 

Now we've arrived at a point where it seems perfectly realistic for the developer to charge us full price for a game while holding its real ending hostage and ransoming it to us in parts.  It might be more palatable if they were to sell the whole game in smaller, episodic chunks, but that's not very likely.  EA wants their $65 up front after spending the amount of money it takes to produce a title like ME3. 


Yeah, we're at that point where see this formula unfolding:
a) make a good game
B) end it in logic cluster****
c) clarify that it is really cluster**** with free EC
d) charge for better ending and DLCs that will make new ending possible, separately. 
e) profit

I'm not against DLC that brings some mission or something(Shadow broker and the Arrival were great), but to charge for new ending, hmmm


I can see this coming.

"Have an attachment to Adm Anderson?  Buy the DLC that includes him getting better armor so that Shepard doesn't wound him."

"Your fondness of Edi and the Geth holding you back from Destroy?  Here's a DLC that protects them in some way from the blast." 


That would be making ritualistic death stab at the ME story.
As far as I can tell, 99% of the people who have the problem with the ending, and 99,9% of the problems with the ending are because of the catalyst. Not the, "lack of closure, not the lack of happy ending, or anything similar"
WHY THE **** KEEP IT, BUILD UPON IT, EXPLAIN IT, CLARIFY IT; WASTE MONEY AND TIME ON IT, GAMBLE WITH CUSTOMER LOYALTY? WTF is wrong here? Why not simply rewrite that mistake. It's not like it's carved in stone. It's the 21st century, where written word is becoming more and more relative.

CAPS LOCK was for artistic reasons.
And the next part is about making some **** up, how Kirk and Spock have solved the Starbrat ultimatum in the episode: "The Ideal solution"

"We were stranded on the space station,just me and Spock.
We met the nasty alien that locked our asses up.
We found the hunk of crystal and a metal piece of bed-
we made the laser-phaser gun and shot him in the head."

"And I say-
Bounce the graviton particle beam
off the main deflector dish,
That's the way we do things, lad,
We're making **** up as we wish"

All credits go to Voltaire(not that Voltaire but this one)
www.youtube.com/watch?v=4bBD5yyT-s0


And one more from same author for the spirit of ME characters, Reject ending for the win
www.youtube.com/watch?v=h5f3-jB0-do


  

 
 

Modifié par SHARXTREME, 08 juillet 2012 - 11:49 .


#4563
Redbelle

Redbelle
  • Members
  • 5 399 messages

edisnooM wrote...

Been away for a bit, but a lot of good posts. :-)

@Sable Phoenix

To Jessica Shepard. A woman who never would. (+10 points to anyone who gets the reference.)


@drayfish

First off, there's no such thing as too much Arkham City. Playing as The GD Batman (Kevin Conroy), and taking on The Joker (Mark Hamill). It doesn't get much better than that. :-)

Also Good post and points, and yes even though I was young when I first saw Burton's Batman, I could tell there was something very wrong with the whole, you know, killing thing. To be fair though, Nolan's Batman did do something very similar with the whole "I don't have to save you either" thing. I did a bit of an eyebrow raise when I saw that in the theatre.

And Batman is down on guns, but seems to be a bit more amicable towards missiles I've noticed. :-)

Also Joel Schumacher made Batman movies? Hmm, that's not ringing any bells, seems like the sort of thing I would remember.


And I could not play ME3 until I worked my way past the import bug using a convoluted system of extracting save files from the Xbox onto a flash drive, opening it on my computer, getting out a file, uploading that to a site that then gave me a close approximation that I could get looking like my Shepard.

When I saw the misshapen gray faced abomination (slight hyperbole) that they wanted me to play with I just froze. It wasn't Shepard and after 2 games and whole lot of hours with this character, I couldn't imagine playing with a complete stranger.


Kevin Conroy and Mark Hamill. Seeing those two as the agents of justice and vengence in Batman: The Brave and the Bold was a highlight while Batman dealt with his Joe Chill issues.

On the topic of guns........ well batman has broken that rule twice. That I know of. Once obviously for Darkseid, and the other in the Dark Knight returns where Batman references his rifle 'That's why I brought the gun'. It shot a grappel iron but it was in shape and function a gun. Just one that wouldn't kill anybody. It's an important distinction as Batman has been seen using a grappel gun in both comic and TV incarnations.

Have you not seen Batman Forever? Think back to Two-Face as played by Tommy Lee Jones and Jim Carrey's the Riddler. Just don't go see Batman and Robin. You'll never that time of your life back and I promise........... even the intro of Batgirl isn't worth it. And Bane?!? The man who destroyed Batman physically, psychologically, emotionally.......... spiritually? Anyway, Bane broke Batman down and to see him reduced to only muscle is a travesty of depication to who ane is.  I will though tip my hat to the actor who played Alfred who I believe sadly died thereafter.

Modifié par Redbelle, 08 juillet 2012 - 11:19 .


#4564
Guest_alleyd_*

Guest_alleyd_*
  • Guests
 delete please

Modifié par alleyd, 08 juillet 2012 - 11:36 .


#4565
edisnooM

edisnooM
  • Members
  • 748 messages
@Redbelle

Sorry, I have seen Forever and Batman & Robin. Sarcasm is hard to convey across the series of tubes that is the internet. :-)

Forever had moments I liked, but it was the start of the over the top gaudy Gotham that Schumacher apparently loved (although, Returns did have DeVito in a onesie, and DJ Wayne).

I think if Jones and Carrey had played the roles a little more serious instead of over the top Adam West era, the movie could have been fantastic. Oh and if Schumacher had toned it back a bit as well. And Bruce Wayne "adopting" a full grown man was a bit odd too. And nipples on the Batsuit.

As for Batman & Robin. Oi. Bat-skates? Bat-cards? The incredible adversary that was Bane reduced to little more than a mindless thug (Tom Hardy's portrayal looks to be great however). Alfred was good though I agree.

And I suppose it's more bullets that Batman is against (though still, Darkseid), as opposed to projectiles in general. It's more the lethal side of things he tries to avoid.


@alleyd

Yeah, I mean if they asked me outright I would probably pay for a new ending, for some chance to salvage the greatness that might have been.

As it stands now if the DLCs don't affect anything I really have no interest in buying/playing them. My attachment to the series has been pretty badly damaged, and it would take something pretty spectacular to get me to reinvest emotionally and monetarily

Edit: Whoops, sorry alleyd. Looks like I'm kind of talking to myself now. :-)

Though these comments could sort of relate back to your original one so I'll leave them up if that's ok. :-)

Modifié par edisnooM, 09 juillet 2012 - 12:09 .


#4566
Guest_alleyd_*

Guest_alleyd_*
  • Guests

edisnooM wrote...

@alleyd

Yeah, I mean if they asked me outright I would probably pay for a new ending, for some chance to salvage the greatness that might have been.

As it stands now if the DLCs don't affect anything I really have no interest in buying/playing them. My attachment to the series has been pretty badly damaged, and it would take something pretty spectacular to get me to reinvest emotionally and monetarily

Edit: Whoops, sorry alleyd. Looks like I'm kind of talking to myself now. :-)

Though these comments could sort of relate back to your original one so I'll leave them up if that's ok. :-)


Sorry SdisnooM I lost my post due to buttons on my mouse causing the page to go back on an edit

I'm of exactly the same mind as you @edisnooM. I was proposing a new campaign, not only an ending fix.

The fix I see to set it up would be simple editing.
  • Take out the Next cycle Slideshow and cutscene from refuse and tag it after the end credits of all the RGB ending choices. I expect a matter of few resources to enable a fix
  • Move the audio for the Hackett line "Shepard The Crucible's not firing" to the Refus speech when When Shepard is walking away from the Catalyst
  • Attach The Destroy ending FMV
Black Screen, Breath sound

Ending Notice

Shepard has found Enlightenment (Discovering the Catalyst and the Reapers Secrets) 
He has resisted Temptation (RGB Ending choice are Catalyst's Indoctrination attempts)
He has discovered the Reaper's Trap and turned it against them. (Self Destruct Crucible)
He has passed his Trial and weakened his foes. (The Destruction Wave)

Now it is up to you to find him and his crew and take the fight to the Reapers.
The Reaper War , the War to end all Wars. 

[*]I'd Buy it

Modifié par alleyd, 09 juillet 2012 - 12:52 .


#4567
UniversalCypher

UniversalCypher
  • Members
  • 75 messages
am i the only one who found this boring and typical?

#4568
edisnooM

edisnooM
  • Members
  • 748 messages
@alleyd

I'd buy it too.

And if they've already got two Scots willing to part with their money that's a pretty strong vote of confidence. :-)

#4569
Guest_alleyd_*

Guest_alleyd_*
  • Guests
 @edisnooM

You've got a point :))

#4570
TrevorHill

TrevorHill
  • Members
  • 27 messages
Regarding the previous posts about the ending DLC's, that would be ridiculous. You say that you would pay for that, but in the price range you suggested, 800-1200 microsoft points each, with, correct me if I'm wrong, 7 DLC's, that would be $70-$105 for a "complete ending". If they ever tried something like that, which I'm fairly certain (and hopeful) they won't, I would never buy anything from them again.

#4571
SHARXTREME

SHARXTREME
  • Members
  • 162 messages

TrevorHill wrote...

Regarding the previous posts about the ending DLC's, that would be ridiculous. You say that you would pay for that, but in the price range you suggested, 800-1200 microsoft points each, with, correct me if I'm wrong, 7 DLC's, that would be $70-$105 for a "complete ending". If they ever tried something like that, which I'm fairly certain (and hopeful) they won't, I would never buy anything from them again.


I agree, that's...outrageous, to make 7DLCs to correct 5minutes of ending. And to charge double price of the core game for it. It would cause giant ****storm.
What is plausible, is to make one DLC(leviathan) that would be basis for expanded ending. Other DLC to add some missions(even after the ending). 

#4572
NobodyofConsequence

NobodyofConsequence
  • Members
  • 597 messages
Quick note - I'm retiring from further contributions to this thread, as I've started a new job which is going to be soaking up some serious time. Plus, I think I've just run out of things to say. Thank you very much to everyone who took the time to respond to my posts, and thank you exactly as much to everyone who posted their thoughts and ideas. I'm sure you all understand how awesome this little corner of the little corner of the internet that is BSN is, but just know, I too think it is awesome. Cheers :D

#4573
What a Succulent Ass

What a Succulent Ass
  • Banned
  • 5 568 messages
...The endings are quite wack--don't get me wrong--but I feel as if we should be handing out Oscars seeing how dramatic it is in here.

#4574
Guest_alleyd_*

Guest_alleyd_*
  • Guests
 The Extended campaign DLC idea I posted is NOT an ending fix. It's a way of producing a campaign to actually provide the gamer with the chance to fight the Reapers across the galaxy in an extended campaign that may be larger than a stand alone game.
If the DLC each was a quality product (Like LOTSB) with say 5 hrs campaign time I think it a worthwhile investment. I built in the optional model for the seperate races because you wouldn't be forced to buy the whole series to have a chance of completing the campaign. Only the human campaign and the final Reaper Assault would be essential if you wanted to participate

I have seen many posts about S/P DLC. This strategy could provide data to indicate a genuine level of  fan support for DLC while genertaing a money stream to take the series forward.  It would be a better use than the M/P DLC format currently in operation. or for some of the other ways DLC is used (Cosmetic packs etc) IMO.

Yes it would be controversial and would anger fans, but I saw it as a possible remedy to many of the complaints about the game while still supporting the franchise.

#4575
Torxen

Torxen
  • Members
  • 47 messages
Blorp.