1392 réponses à ce sujet

[Jamie9]

Both races would have wiped each other out. Completely. They are both equally at fault.

I understand why the Quarians panicked. And I understand why the Geth fought back.

The Quarians attacking the Geth in ME3 was definitely stupid though, and especially since I took Legion aboard the Flotilla in ME2. They risked their entire population to get the Geth wiped out, and that would have happened if not for Shepard.

[Laurencio]

Joeybsmooth4 wrote...

But there are no noncombatants with the Qs. That is just how they are , heck they made sure of that themselves .

How do you know that's how Quarian society worked 300 years ago? Besides, during the battle of Rannoch it wouldn't have been impossible for Geth to spare a handful of Quarians, earlier experiences and historical evidence points to the Quarians eventually fleeing.

[Goneaviking]

SentientSurfer wrote...

Why didn't the geth take prisoners?

They learned from their creators.

The quarian are the most untrustworthy, treacherous and beligerant faction in the entire game series. Even moreso than the krogan. They demonstrated that at the dawn of the geth's existence with their willingness to kill their own kind to exterminate the geth.

Given that the quarian obviously placed no intrinsic value on the lives of their own it's remarkable that the geth, whose sole education was derived from quarian programming and example, showed mercy and allowed them to leave in the first place.

[Varus Praetor]

Both sides bombed every city they could reach during WWII. It's called total war, look it up. It also tends to be the response when the very existence of a group of people is at stake (like the Geth, who the Quarians attempted to exterminate). This is nothing new and it's certainly not shocking.

The Geth are just more efficient at it than we are. I guess the moral of the story is, "Don't try to exterminate the Geth." Maybe if they'd learned from this the Quarians would still be around in more ME3 play throughs. Ron White said it best, "You can't fix stupid."

[Laurencio]

Goneaviking wrote...

SentientSurfer wrote...

Why didn't the geth take prisoners?

They learned from their creators.

The quarian are the most untrustworthy, treacherous and beligerant faction in the entire game series. Even moreso than the krogan. They demonstrated that at the dawn of the geth's existence with their willingness to kill their own kind to exterminate the geth.

Given that the quarian obviously placed no intrinsic value on the lives of their own it's remarkable that the geth, whose sole education was derived from quarian programming and example, showed mercy and allowed them to leave in the first place.

What? There's no evidence to support this at all. That some quarians killed pro-Geth sympthitizers doesn't prove that all Quarians were like that. Could just as easily have been a splinter group. Legion's "evidence" is heavily weighted towards Geth sympathy, we are shown selective scenes, you don't see an army of Geth wiping out Quarians in his little flashbacks now do you?

[my Aim is True]

Babies are a structural weakness. Geth do no have them

[Jamie9]

Anyways, this question highlights what I consider to be the Quarian's ultimate... stupidity.

That they can't let it go. The Morning War happened 300 years ago! Yes, lots of people were killed on both sides. Lots of innocent people. But both sides have changed so much over 300 years that you can barely relate the crimes to either side.

They should be focusing on the present, not the past.

[Wildecker]

If I was assigned the task to take out as many robots/synthetics as possible I'd try my hand with nuclear weapons - high-air detonation for maximum EMP. Long term side effects from a destroyed ozone layer be damned, I want the robots down NOW.
If, however, this rough treatment eventually turns out to make my world uninhabitable for a century or more ... who's to blame? I myself or the robots?

[sth128]

The Geth were present in almost every household. When the Geth rebelled the majority of the civilians died (assuming those civilians were not armed but took aggressive action toward the Geth). Those who sided with the Geth were killed by the Quarian forces.

Once victory was seem unattainable, general orders of evacuation were given. Those who got to the ships escaped. Those who did not either died from starvation, the elements, or combat. We can only assume the majority of Quarian infants died from similar situations.

[Goneaviking]

Laurencio wrote...

Goneaviking wrote...

SentientSurfer wrote...

Why didn't the geth take prisoners?

They learned from their creators.

The quarian are the most untrustworthy, treacherous and beligerant faction in the entire game series. Even moreso than the krogan. They demonstrated that at the dawn of the geth's existence with their willingness to kill their own kind to exterminate the geth.

Given that the quarian obviously placed no intrinsic value on the lives of their own it's remarkable that the geth, whose sole education was derived from quarian programming and example, showed mercy and allowed them to leave in the first place.

What? There's no evidence to support this at all. That some quarians killed pro-Geth sympthitizers doesn't prove that all Quarians were like that. Could just as easily have been a splinter group. Legion's "evidence" is heavily weighted towards Geth sympathy, we are shown selective scenes, you don't see an army of Geth wiping out Quarians in his little flashbacks now do you?

There is enough evidence presented that it is accept the likelihood that a newly emergent species like the geth (who at this time had no culture of their own and had yet to develop a coherent or rounded understanding of any other culture) could come to those conclusions.

Indeed I've had enough debates with people who make similar claims about people in Afganistan on the same kind of fragmented and questionable evidence. Apparently that kind of evidence is enough convince educated people in developed cultures that foreigners don't value their own lives and that those conclusions make it acceptable to bring violence on their children and non-combatants.

[InsaneAzrael]

Wow.. that title is a bit of a rhethorical pull even by FOX news standards.

I'm not sure if this has been mentioned, but the implication that the geth were directly responsible for murdering 99.98% of the quarian population is a bit.. excessive.

Geth went to war with their creators. This much is not really being questioned.
I don't know if anyone noted this, but quarians aren't exactly biological juggernauts. They had particularily weak immune systems even before the Morning war.

Their physiology is very dependent on a certain level of ecological stability and sterility on Rannoch and the other quarian inhabited worlds (yes, their population lay across MANY worlds).
So going to war with an entity/force with none of their ecological frailties and using tactics of extreme destructive force as a consequence is pretty much stupid.

A poor absurd analogy to help.
If you had a peanut allergy and were fighting the enemy. It would probably help to not stage the war in the midst of a peanut processing plant.

[CronoDragoon]

my Aim is True wrote...

Babies are a structural weakness. Geth do no have them

LOL.

[Laurencio]

Goneaviking wrote...

Laurencio wrote...

Goneaviking wrote...

SentientSurfer wrote...

Why didn't the geth take prisoners?

They learned from their creators.

The quarian are the most untrustworthy, treacherous and beligerant faction in the entire game series. Even moreso than the krogan. They demonstrated that at the dawn of the geth's existence with their willingness to kill their own kind to exterminate the geth.

Given that the quarian obviously placed no intrinsic value on the lives of their own it's remarkable that the geth, whose sole education was derived from quarian programming and example, showed mercy and allowed them to leave in the first place.

What? There's no evidence to support this at all. That some quarians killed pro-Geth sympthitizers doesn't prove that all Quarians were like that. Could just as easily have been a splinter group. Legion's "evidence" is heavily weighted towards Geth sympathy, we are shown selective scenes, you don't see an army of Geth wiping out Quarians in his little flashbacks now do you?

There is enough evidence presented that it is accept the likelihood that a newly emergent species like the geth (who at this time had no culture of their own and had yet to develop a coherent or rounded understanding of any other culture) could come to those conclusions.

Indeed I've had enough debates with people who make similar claims about people in Afganistan on the same kind of fragmented and questionable evidence. Apparently that kind of evidence is enough convince educated people in developed cultures that foreigners don't value their own lives and that those conclusions make it acceptable to bring violence on their children and non-combatants.

Not really. Could just as easily have used faulty logic based on mathematical errors. Legion explains that the heretics worship of the Repears come from a mathematicl diffrence in their software.

Eh what? You've lost me.

[count_4]

sth128 wrote...
Those who did not either died from [...] combat. We can only assume the majority of Quarian infants died from similar situations.

I bet these Quarian bastards had whole armys of babies with suicide vests, innocently crawling at the Geth and then *boom*. Damn suit rats!
No wonder the Geth started to specifically target the infants later on.

[UnstableMongoose]

Pretty sure the Quarians were using weapons-grade explosives that weren't strong enough to kill Geth, but were strong enough to kill anyone that was supporting them (as shown in the Geth memories).

Face it, your beloved Fremen-derivatives are guilty of the mass-scale infanticide of their own people.

[SentientSurfer]

Goneaviking wrote...

Laurencio wrote...

Goneaviking wrote...

SentientSurfer wrote...

Why didn't the geth take prisoners?

They learned from their creators.

The quarian are the most untrustworthy, treacherous and beligerant faction in the entire game series. Even moreso than the krogan. They demonstrated that at the dawn of the geth's existence with their willingness to kill their own kind to exterminate the geth.

Given that the quarian obviously placed no intrinsic value on the lives of their own it's remarkable that the geth, whose sole education was derived from quarian programming and example, showed mercy and allowed them to leave in the first place.

What? There's no evidence to support this at all. That some quarians killed pro-Geth sympthitizers doesn't prove that all Quarians were like that. Could just as easily have been a splinter group. Legion's "evidence" is heavily weighted towards Geth sympathy, we are shown selective scenes, you don't see an army of Geth wiping out Quarians in his little flashbacks now do you?

There is enough evidence presented that it is accept the likelihood that a newly emergent species like the geth (who at this time had no culture of their own and had yet to develop a coherent or rounded understanding of any other culture) could come to those conclusions.

Indeed I've had enough debates with people who make similar claims about people in Afganistan on the same kind of fragmented and questionable evidence. Apparently that kind of evidence is enough convince educated people in developed cultures that foreigners don't value their own lives and that those conclusions make it acceptable to bring violence on their children and non-combatants.

If we're going down that path -- the geth could have modeled themselves after the quarians who gave their lives protecting them. They could have made it a point to capture Quarians. There isn't a single Quarian left on Rannoch. All evidence points to them being exterminated. 

[DJBare]

SentientSurfer wrote...

If we're going down that path -- the geth could have modeled themselves after the quarians who gave their lives protecting them. They could have made it a point to capture Quarians. There isn't a single Quarian left on Rannoch. All evidence points to them being exterminated. 

They were children still learning and most certainly confused, but remember the one geth who held up his arms in surrender to protect it's owner?

Let me just put this here again

Shepard: That was you on Luna?
EDI: Yes, it was very confusing becoming aware while under attack.

Modifié par DJBare, 16 avril 2012 - 03:03 .

[Aetas Mutuo]

Because Quarian Babies have a different name on our world; they are known as "Chupacabra."

[SentientSurfer]

They were children still learning and most certainly confused, but remember the one geth who held up his arms in surrender to protect it's owner?

Let me just put this here again

Shepard: That was you on Luna?
EDI: Yes, it was very confusing becoming aware while under attack.

So was Shep as guilty as the Quarians in deactiving the Hannibal A.I.? If Shep hadn't been able to turn it off, would it have been justified in eradicating human life from Earth - which it would have seen as hostile? 

The Quarians wanted to deactivate the geth and tweak their programming, not 'kill them'.

Modifié par SentientSurfer, 16 avril 2012 - 03:09 .

[InsaneAzrael]

SentientSurfer wrote...

The Quarians wanted to deactivate the geth and tweak their programming, not 'kill them'.

This is one of those grey areas. It basically implies that "deactivating" a resistant sentient being = either death or lobotomisation.

If your parents informed you that you were not meeting their requirements. Would you accept a lobotomy to satisfy their commands? Or would you want an alternative?

[wantedman dan]

Fail thread is surprisingly not fail.

[Jamie9]

InsaneAzrael wrote...

SentientSurfer wrote...

The Quarians wanted to deactivate the geth and tweak their programming, not 'kill them'.

This is one of those grey areas. It basically implies that "deactivating" a resistant sentient being = either death or lobotomisation.

If your parents informed you that you were not meeting their requirements. Would you accept a lobotomy to satisfy their commands? Or would you want an alternative?

Agree with Insane.

I definitely wouldn't want to be "deactivated" and changed. And neither would Miranda Lawson, I think.

Modifié par Jamie9, 16 avril 2012 - 03:21 .

[sth128]

count_4 wrote...


I bet these Quarian bastards had whole armys of babies with suicide vests, innocently crawling at the Geth and then *boom*. Damn suit rats!
No wonder the Geth started to specifically target the infants later on.

You don't have to directly take part in combat to die from combat. I don't think all Geth used a sniper rifle like Legion. If they used explosives or bombs in urban combat, many civilians would have died from combat.

Remember Geth also had space ships and orbital weapon platforms. Like the First Contact War on Shan Xi the Geth could have just decimated cities from orbit. The Geth did not aim to occupy Rannoch. They aimed to destroy all aggressors.

[InsaneAzrael]

*snip*

Modifié par InsaneAzrael, 16 avril 2012 - 03:23 .

[Chaoswind]

Rickets wrote...

Interesting on how some people say Geth favor peace. They sure have some fine weapons.

and there is where you actually lose

The Geth Spitfire description states that is a weapon made specially to fight other machines, heck is even stated that most of the geth weapons seem to be build to shred machines into pieces.

Lets help you a little

290 years ago the Quarians flee their homeworld
around 290-280 years ago the super reaper named Nazara contacts the Geth
Most of the Geth lack the consensus to think Nazara is right and Organics will always destroy the Geth (even though until that point that statement was 100% true)
The rest of the Geth leave the True geth to become Heretics and join the old machines in the crusade against organics.
The Heretic Geth Instal themselves around the Perseus veil and kill any Organics that get close to Nazara or them. (some people think the Heretics joined Saren, when is clear in the game that they have been working for Soverign since the start)
In the Mean time the True Geth knowing the Old Machines Plans, and that the Geth are outside their plans, decide to arm themselves with weapons made to fight other machines.
The True Geth began to build a super structure that would help them maintain sentience  for the whole duration of the war with the old machines.

That is not made up, everything is in the game.

Geth at first used the weapons the Quarians made, then modified and invented new weapons to fight other machines (the reapers), from the Get GO the Geth had plans to fight the reapers, those plans included their SUPER structure in space that would allow them to maintain sentience and contact with the whole consensus even when in other start systems, the Geth never had plans to help organics in their war because they had NO reason to think the organics would help them, also remember you never fought the true Geth until Rannok, even the ones in Haestrom were Heretics.

Now back to topic:

The Geth didn't have WMD, so they could only use the ones the Quarians had, also Legion states that the Geth where in clean duty of Rannok for the last 291 years, so that means one of 2 things:

A) Quarians used the WMD when they began to lose the planet (very possible)
The Geth used the WMD to take control of the planet faster (indeed possible)

The people that are saying that Rannok is clean and no evidence of WMD exist need to remember 3 things:

1) Geth spend +290 years cleaning that mess.
2) Geth Weather Control systems are MUCH more advanced than the ones the Salarians/Everyone had/have (and is interesting because Geth had no need to develop such technology as they didn't need it), and as such is entirely possible to clean Rannok faster than Tuchanca.
3) If the same happened to us Humans, you can bet your ass the governments of the world would wreak this planet, before giving it to (insert sentient alien species here).