238 réponses à ce sujet

[Stardusk]

I am kind of getting tired of answering this question, which has been posed to me for each video I make, as to why I choose the Graal over the GPS. It has been asked 1000x and I answered it in one of my audio commentaries. This is going to be the official thread to answer this question permanently.

Everyone loves the GPS and many people don't like the Graal but the reason why this is so is rather transparent. The GPS is, quite frankly, a beginner's weapon, easy to use, easy to handle and thus its wide spread appeal is explained. The Graal on the other hand, is hard to use, hard to handle and has a much steeper learning curve and it does not 'just work' like the autoaiming GPS does, foregone conclusion of many, the Graal is crap. To this I answer, bull****. That does not mean the GPS is crap either imo, but it noticeably requires less skill. But in its overall utility, in the hands of a skilled player the Graal is devasting and is better than the GPS for combat heavy classes. But I repeat, people do not like the Graal BECAUSE they cannot use it properly. Everyone I know who can use it will confirm alongside myself, that it is easily the king of shotguns and possibly all guns in overall utility and power.

Both the GPS reliably stagger (the Graal more so though) so that is one common point; they both can be charged, so another but that is where the similiarities end.

The Graal allows for consistent long ranged headshots (the deadliest of almost any weapon, because it ignores shield gate). On my Batarian Soldier I can one headshot any Cerberus type charged up from range except a phantom, with a Shotgun rail amp of at least one I can oneshot anything and this can be done from across the map. A charged Graal shot uses only one shot, the GPS uses two, so you effectively have the same number of charged shots. The Graal is effective at point blank, short range, long range and medium range and all of those ranges are good for headshots. The GPS stops being useful after medium range and OSOK headshots are very difficult to achieve. The Graal also seems to be somewhat more consistent in the stagger effect than the GPS, another added bonus. You have in total more charged up shots with the Graal than with the GPS, another added bonus. Finally, if you get semi-consistent headshots your DPS will be higher with the Graal than the GPS.

So, in conclusion, the GPS is 'nice' but a beginner's weapon, which why people like it, being easy to use. The Graal is an advanced player's weapon, but with practice anyone can become better with it and then become deadly. It really is the all in one gun/shotgun with almost no weaknesses if used properly. Watch my videos along with the one with Zenning and tell me you think the Graal sucks and stop asking me why I use it instead of the GPS!

[Zenning]

The only real issue people seem to have is that you have to lead the target, and how lagg makes it "Useless".   If he can consistantly headshot enemies on the other side of the map while hosting, and if I can use it exteremly effectivly while playing with somebody on the other side of the planet, that makes those arguements bull.

Seriously, the Graal might be difficult to use, but being able to headshot with it alone makes it a more effective weapon than the GPS.

Modifié par Zenning, 17 avril 2012 - 06:02 .

[Flamko]

Agreed. Graal, along with the Claymore, is the most effective shotgun in the game. Guaranteed stun and deadly accuracy. It is awesome in hands of batarians, it can one-shot almost anything. GPS, with it's lack of proper headshots and aiming help in the distance is a beginner weapon.

[Stardusk]

Zenning wrote...

The only real issue I can see is how lag can make it much more difficult to use, or how you have to host to hit things with it(Which is not true).. Butt (No not but).... If I can use the Graal effectively while playing with somebody in literally the opposite side of the world, than no, it does not suck when you don't host.

Seriously, the Graal might be difficult to use, but being able to headshot with it alone makes it a more effective weapon than the GPS.

Yeah, just got this question asked 100,000 times already. Enough I say.

[Peer of the Empire]

GPS staggers more for me.  You can charge it even with 1 shot in the clip.  Put Smart Choke to extend range of GPS; it does work even on GPS

[The_mango55]

I use the Graal with my Batarian because it's higher level than my GPS and it fits the character better (BLADES!). But yeah it does seem like an underrated weapon.

Only thing I don't like is the projectiles travel very slowly, seemingly even slower than the GPS (but it may just seem that way since the GPS tracks). I can hit a stationary target from a pretty long range but a target that's moving I have to be close.

[Stardusk]

The_mango55 wrote...

I use the Graal with my Batarian because it's higher level than my GPS and it fits the character better (BLADES!). But yeah it does seem like an underrated weapon.

Only thing I don't like is the projectiles travel very slowly, seemingly even slower than the GPS (but it may just seem that way since the GPS tracks). I can hit a stationary target from a pretty long range but a target that's moving I have to be close.

That is the skill involved. You need to lead it.

[squidney2k1]

Graal is great if you can land headshot after headshot.


But other than that, the GPS is just easier to use and more versatile. Not saying that the Graal is bad at all---I actually prefer the Graal in most cases---but just that the GPS is probably a "better overall weapon," with a grain of salt.

[xtorma]

me likes the claymore

[vivanto]

GPS is for varren, Graal is FOR TUCHANKA.

[TLK Spires]

the GPS is neat, but tbh, i do not like using it that much. i prefer graal's/claymore myself.

[Stardusk]

squidney2k1 wrote...

Graal is great if you can land headshot after headshot.


But other than that, the GPS is just easier to use and more versatile. Not saying that the Graal is bad at all---I actually prefer the Graal in most cases---but just that the GPS is probably a "better overall weapon," with a grain of salt.

...for unskilled players.

[The_mango55]

Stardusk wrote...

That is the skill involved. You need to lead it.

But if you aren't hosting then any attempt you make to lead your target will just be guesstimation.

I'm not saying "it's useless if you don't host" because I use it all the time and I never host. But clearly it's much better when you host, more so than most other weapons.

[peddroelm]

Stardusk wrote...

...
The Graal allows for consistent long ranged headshots (the deadliest of almost any weapon, because it ignores shield gate).
...

I know GPS & Kishok ignore shield gate because I have tested them specifically for this ...

I did not test to see if Graal ignores shield gate (I think it doesn't - normal shotguns do not ignore shield gate) - but as with the other shotguns at most only 1 projectile (from 6 in graal's case) gets wasted on the shield gate ... However 5 projectiles (spikes?) to the head from a charged shot are often enough to 1 shot kill even protected enemies on gold ....

[Zenning]

Stardusk wrote...

The_mango55 wrote...

I use the Graal with my Batarian because it's higher level than my GPS and it fits the character better (BLADES!). But yeah it does seem like an underrated weapon.

Only thing I don't like is the projectiles travel very slowly, seemingly even slower than the GPS (but it may just seem that way since the GPS tracks). I can hit a stationary target from a pretty long range but a target that's moving I have to be close.

That is the skill involved. You need to lead it.

So, the more lag you have, the more you have to lead your target.  With barely any lag, headshotting somebody on the other side of the map is stupidly easy, with the amount of lag I got with him, I'd have about a .3 second lag between my shot, and when it'd actually hit something.  With some practice, you'll see me headshotting Phantom's on the other side of the map in that video we had.

Like he said, there's skill invovled, and it takes time learn how to lead it effectivly,  but once you do, it works amazingly.

And yeah, it does seem to shield gate.  I got this because I can actually get a Centurian down to 9 bars of health from some shields, suggesting that there was some overflow (either that, or one pellet only does 1 bar, which is unlikely, since there's six of em).

Modifié par Zenning, 17 avril 2012 - 06:15 .

[Stardusk]

The_mango55 wrote...

Stardusk wrote...

That is the skill involved. You need to lead it.

But if you aren't hosting then any attempt you make to lead your target will just be guesstimation.

I'm not saying "it's useless if you don't host" because I use it all the time and I never host. But clearly it's much better when you host, more so than most other weapons.

Sure. But the idea that the GPS is just plain better is a fallacy.

[KainD]

I consider Graal to be completely on par with GPS. I actually started my infiltrator with Graal when I discovered how awesome chargeable weapons are on them, but then switched to GPS only because of one little thing - extra shot, which is imo VERY helpful. Today the second reason is that my Geth infiltrator has 10% bonus damage with GPS over Graal. Now here's the thing - if Graal had 4 shots in one clip instead of 3, I would switch to it with other infiltrator classes except the geth one.

[KroganSmash]

vivanto wrote...

GPS is for varren, Graal is FOR TUCHANKA.

This.
Thus ending this argument in the simple state of this. Graal>GPS

[Stardusk]

KainD wrote...

I consider Graal to be completely on par with GPS. I actually started my infiltrator with Graal when I discovered how awesome chargeable weapons are on them, but then switched to GPS only because of one little thing - extra shot, which is imo VERY helpful. Today the second reason is that my Geth infiltrator has 10% bonus damage with GPS over Graal. Now here's the thing - if Graal had 4 shots in one clip instead of 3, I would switch to it with other infiltrator classes except the geth one.

I actually find the Graal awful on the Geth Infiltrator and much prefer the Claymore.

[Mabari Owns High Dragon The 2nd]

I used the Graal constantly until I got my Geth Plasma Shotgun, and I probably will never use it again. While everything you said is valid, I simply cannot play this game with a weapon that requires no latency, as I very rarely have no latency (Minus hosted games). The GPS also has a five round normal shot clip verses the three in the Graal. Making emergency reloads much better, because you have more rounds to single fire with. Regardless, though, its useless most of the time because of my crappy internet...

The GPS is amazing, though, as I can wreck with this thing. Immediately changing from the Graal to the GPS (Graal was rank IV and GPS I) I just murdered the crap out of everything on Bronze and Silver. I can't ever see myself using the Graal again, honestly.

Modifié par Mabari Owns High Dragon The 2nd, 17 avril 2012 - 06:17 .

[coinop25]

Big fan of BOTH the GPS and the Graal, personally. Can't they both be good for different things without one being a weapon for silly noobs and the other being the hardcore player's weapon?

I mean, yeah, I totally get how frustrating it is for people to keep questioning your class and weapon choices. But I think the game is better balanced than we typically give it credit for around here. Great news: Turns out there are a lot of different ways to play and win!

[Stardusk]

Mabari Owns High Dragon The 2nd wrote...

I used the Graal constantly until I got my Geth Plasma Shotgun, and I probably will never use it again. While everything you said is valid, I simply cannot play this game with a weapon that requires no latency, as I very rarely have no latency (Minus hosted games). The GPS also has a five round normal shot clip verses the three in the Graal. Making emergency reloads much better, because you have more rounds to single fire with.

The GPS is amazing, though, as I can wreck with this thing. Immediately changing from the Graal to the GPS (Graal was rank IV and GPS I) I just murdered the crap out of everything on Bronze and Silver. I can't ever see myself using the Graal again, honestly.

The Predator does a good job there too.

[Mabari Owns High Dragon The 2nd]

^ That made no sense... Why would I switch to the Pred which takes significantly more shots to kill with? I don't have the Pistol Melee Stunner, and the Pred can't be charged either. Only puny Krogan use Pistols anyway, lol.

Modifié par Mabari Owns High Dragon The 2nd, 17 avril 2012 - 06:20 .

[KainD]

Stardusk wrote...

KainD wrote...

I consider Graal to be completely on par with GPS. I actually started my infiltrator with Graal when I discovered how awesome chargeable weapons are on them, but then switched to GPS only because of one little thing - extra shot, which is imo VERY helpful. Today the second reason is that my Geth infiltrator has 10% bonus damage with GPS over Graal. Now here's the thing - if Graal had 4 shots in one clip instead of 3, I would switch to it with other infiltrator classes except the geth one.

I actually find the Graal awful on the Geth Infiltrator and much prefer the Claymore.

If claymore was a chargable weapon I would consider using it, but it is not. I use ONLY chargable weapons on my infiltrator - GPS/Graal/Kishok. Non-chargable weapons don't compete.

[Zenning]

Mabari Owns High Dragon The 2nd wrote...

I used the Graal constantly until I got my Geth Plasma Shotgun, and I probably will never use it again. While everything you said is valid, I simply cannot play this game with a weapon that requires no latency, as I very rarely have no latency (Minus hosted games). The GPS also has a five round normal shot clip verses the three in the Graal. Making emergency reloads much better, because you have more rounds to single fire with. Regardless, though, its useless most of the time because of my crappy internet...

The GPS is amazing, though, as I can wreck with this thing. Immediately changing from the Graal to the GPS (Graal was rank IV and GPS I) I just murdered the crap out of everything on Bronze and Silver. I can't ever see myself using the Graal again, honestly.

Once you go Gold, you might change your mind.  Especially since the GPS doesn't guarentee a stagger on Phantom's, or regular enemies.


And err, Stardusk was saying that on Bronze and Silver, any weapon will killerate everything.

Modifié par Zenning, 17 avril 2012 - 06:19 .