232 réponses à ce sujet

[RNG God]

marshalleck wrote...

 

scottster117 wrote...

The thing is, a lot of the buffs were needed. A lot of the nerfs weren't. THAT's why people are upset and are more vocal about the nerfs. It has nothing to do with being hypersensitive to your favorite guns and powers, it's that Bioware is doing a bad job at balancing the MP. 

 

Which nerfs do you feel were unnecessary? There haven't been that many nerfs in total, so it shouldn't be hard to name a few.

How about the falcon nerf? Without fixing the projectile bug, the RoF destroyed the weapon, turning it from a CC weapon to another form of character card.

Or Stasis, the cooldown increase didn't really affect anything but was unneeded nonetheless.

Mind you though, I'm not in 100% condition to debate, just enjoy a few laughs from this lame thread. No Console wars now!

Modifié par SalvationThroughDestruction, 17 avril 2012 - 05:10 .

[Father Alvito]

marshalleck wrote...

Which nerfs do you feel were unnecessary? There haven't been that many nerfs in total, so it shouldn't be hard to name a few.

I think the Paladin 'buff' is the one that stands out as having irritated a lot of people. Some people like the new Javelin, and others don't. A lot of people got upset about the Falcon, but something legitimately had to be done about that thing.

SalvationThroughDestruction wrote...

Or Stasis, the cooldown increase didn't really affect anything but was unneeded nonetheless.

Huh?  That was the single best change they've made to the game.  Stasis bubble was easy mode against trash.  Now you actually have to think about whether Stasis or Warp would be a better choice to prime a combo, given the situation.

Modifié par Father Alvito, 17 avril 2012 - 05:14 .

[RobotCriminal]

I would be amazed if the Striker doesn't get nerfed at some point.

There are really four negative things about it that I can think of;
-Recoil
-Shield Damage
-Clip Size (Indirectly affects damage since you are spending less time at full ROF)
-Ammo Capacity

For most races this is enough to keep it in check, but when you stick it on a Turian and mod for stability and clip size it basically becomes an unholy engine of destruction.

Mine is only level two and I can already pretty much find an ammo box with a long line of approach to camp and just annihilate enemies as they step into the kill box. On gold all the trash in the wave ends up getting wasted in the first clip or two, and the bigger stuff ends up significantly weakened for your teammates to pick off.

Silver is pretty much a joke, you are basically a one man artillery barrage, and against mostly armored enemies (Read: Brutes) I was actually giggling IRL, it wasn't even a fair fight for the poor bastards and I could just run around the level out of cover and waste them.

Modifié par RobotCriminal, 17 avril 2012 - 05:14 .

[marshalleck]

The Falcon nerf was definitely dramatic, but I'd hardly say it was unneeded. They also went back and buffed it, and it's still a leading CC weapon choice, for whatever that's worth.

The stasis nerf, in hindsight, seems questionable. Considering how stasis is of marginal utility against any but Cerberus.

[RNG God]

Father Alvito wrote...

marshalleck wrote...

Which nerfs do you feel were unnecessary? There haven't been that many nerfs in total, so it shouldn't be hard to name a few.

I think the Paladin 'buff' is the one that stands out as having irritated a lot of people. Some people like the new Javelin, and others don't. A lot of people got upset about the Falcon, but something legitimately had to be done about that thing.

SalvationThroughDestruction wrote...

Or Stasis, the cooldown increase didn't really affect anything but was unneeded nonetheless.

Huh?  That was the single best change they've made to the game.  Stasis bubble was easy mode against trash.  Now you actually have to think about whether Stasis or Warp would be a better choice to prime a combo, given the situation.

That wasn't the point. The point was when AAs are at 200% the cooldown difference didn't affect it all that much, thus making it an "Unneccesary" nerf. Aka, me trying to be a smart arse.

[YuenglingDragon]

I really hope there are some good weapon buffs in the pipeline, if not tonight then soon. My favorite classes take a Predator VII with them on Gold because it keeps my 200% recharge and I shoot it maybe 4 times. I tried my AA with the Carnifex but as long as I have that 200% recharge, I can Throw as fast as I can shoot the Carni. No point to a gun at all. Same with my Engineers.

There a a number of good rare weapons but only one good N7 (BW as others have noted). Why is my Wraith 1 markedly (even remarkably) worse than my GPS V or Graal III?

Bioware needs to spends some quality time looking at what's good and what's not and bumping the bad up to the good. Nerfing the good to the level of the bad just perpetuates the difference in quality between weapon- and power-based classes.

[Catalyst777]

i think GPS.its pretty powerfull

[marshalleck]

RobotCriminal wrote...

For most races this is enough to keep it in check, but when you stick it on a Turian and mod for stability and clip size it basically becomes an unholy engine of destruction.

Seems to me like that's merely an incentive for more people to play turians. /shrug

I'm okay with anything that means fewer people spamming lobbies with infiltrators.

Modifié par marshalleck, 17 avril 2012 - 05:18 .

[Father Alvito]

RobotCriminal wrote...

Mine is only level two and I can already pretty much find an ammo box with a long line of approach to camp and just annihilate enemies as they step into the kill box. On gold all the trash in the wave ends up getting wasted in the first clip or two, and the bigger stuff ends up significantly weakened for your teammates to pick off.

It sucks against armor on Gold unless you slap mods on it.  That puts it in the Hornet category - amazing with the right consumables, underpowered otherwise.  You won't hear people complaining that the Hornet needs a nerf either.

Most of the game's balance problems could be resolved by the simple change of making armor deduct a percentage of the weapon's damage up to the current caps, rather than a flat amount.  That simple change would instantly make most of the rapid fire guns worthwhile without having to burn consumables on them.

[Major Durza]

I didn't see that many nerfs on the multiplayer balance thread.... These people are not DICE.

[datako12]

BraveLToaster wrote...

Lolb4udiez wrote...

GPS is already useless and you people say its going to get nerfed? Lol! Bugfed instead. Its like a watergun in Gold

You're either talking about GPR or have no idea what you're doing.

he just think GPS is geth ****** shooter and applies to either the geth pulse rifle or the geth SMG. he seems to not understand that the GPS is actually the geth plasma shotgun and is highly useful

[Najarati]

Arkley wrote...

That argument would be perfectly valid if Sabre/Paladin were of the same rarity as the Carnifex, but they are not. There's a good chance players will have a Carnifex at level X long before they see their second Sabre/Paladin, if not before they see their first....

I'm one of those poor fools who's managed to obtain a Paladin II and Sabre II while still only having a Carnifex IV (the weapon I use the most).  For the life of me, I cannot get upgrades to that pistol.  I have a Falcon X, GPS X, Revenant X and a number of other rares at or close to X, but no Carnifex X.

Modifié par Najarati, 17 avril 2012 - 05:20 .

[Xyrm]

Purple People Eater wrote...

Nothing needs to be nerfed, but a lot of guns need serious improvement, and weight deductions.

I agree.  The ratio of weapon weight to recharge penalty is too steep.  You should not be able to go from 4 to 20 seconds cooldown depending on what you carry... maybe 4 to 8.  The claymore should be a viable shotgun for a vanguard, but as it stands it is far too heavy for them.  In fact, most of the higher-tier shotguns are too heavy, and some of the better pistols are as well (why does a talon weigh more than some assault rifles?).

[TSCIGAR]

Eventually, Yuengling, you'll get a Phalanx X and discard that Predator X. I don't think any of the common weapons will ever see either a buff or nerf- they're all useable for their roles at X on Gold, and they're the base weapons everyone can level easily.

If anything gets nerfed, it will probably be the GPS. I love the gun to death, but I feel like it's unfair, especially with the new Geth Characters with Hunter Mode. Probably nothing will get nerfed, though- they're far more likely to toss out buffs.

[tvih]

Arkley wrote...

That is not the case for the Carnifex/Paladin, though. The Carnifex is simply a superior weapon, unless they're of equal level - and even then, that only makes them comparable. Someone with both pistols at level X would likely still choose the Carnifex simply due to its greater capacity and lower weight.

While I agree with the rest of your post, this I don't fully agree on. Paladin I is superior to Carnifex X in damage - it's only worse in weight (certainly problematic for power-spamming classes) and ammo capacity. Although the ammo capacity really is a problem if you want to use the Paladin as your primary weapon - 20 shots are gone faster than you can say "uh oh!".

[Father Alvito]

marshalleck wrote...

The stasis nerf, in hindsight, seems questionable. Considering how stasis is of marginal utility against any but Cerberus.

It's less than great against the Reapers, but it's enormously helpful against Hunters as well. As a player that likes to stay put, I can assure you that I would maintain a perma-bubble in a chokepoint if not for the recharge hit.

tvih wrote...

While I agree with the rest of your post, this I don't fully agree on. Paladin I is superior to Carnifex X in damage - it's only worse in weight (certainly problematic for power-spamming classes) and ammo capacity. Although the ammo capacity really is a problem if you want to use the Paladin as your primary weapon - 20 shots are gone faster than you can say "uh oh!".

After you factor in reload time, a Carnifex X is going to put out greater DPS than a Paladin I at a third of the weight.

This is a problem since the Paladin is an N7 and cannot reasonably be leveled.

Modifié par Father Alvito, 17 avril 2012 - 05:23 .

[TexasToast712]

Carnifex won't be nerfed. No need for a nerf to it.

[marshalleck]

tvih wrote...

Arkley wrote...

That is not the case for the Carnifex/Paladin, though. The Carnifex is simply a superior weapon, unless they're of equal level - and even then, that only makes them comparable. Someone with both pistols at level X would likely still choose the Carnifex simply due to its greater capacity and lower weight.

While I agree with the rest of your post, this I don't fully agree on. Paladin I is superior to Carnifex X in damage - it's only worse in weight (certainly problematic for power-spamming classes) and ammo capacity. Although the ammo capacity really is a problem if you want to use the Paladin as your primary weapon - 20 shots are gone faster than you can say "uh oh!".

Which makes it a sidearm. A sidearm, which weighs as much a brute. Why? Who would use that? Based on my own observation--nobody. And I have a Paladin IV.

Modifié par marshalleck, 17 avril 2012 - 05:28 .

[YuenglingDragon]

TSCIGAR wrote...

Eventually, Yuengling, you'll get a Phalanx X and discard that Predator X. I don't think any of the common weapons will ever see either a buff or nerf- they're all useable for their roles at X on Gold, and they're the base weapons everyone can level easily.

 
But it won't matter.  I still won't ever shoot it.  I'd take no weapon if it let me.  As long as I get 200% I'm good to go.  My point is that Adepts and Engineers can do that.  Just spam good powers and never shoot.  When so many of the weapons suck, it makes weapon dependent classes like the Soldier suck, too.

 If anything gets nerfed, it will probably be the GPS. I love the gun to death, but I feel like it's unfair, especially with the new Geth Characters with Hunter Mode. Probably nothing will get nerfed, though- they're far more likely to toss out buffs.

No sense in nerfing one of the few weapons that makes me feel like I'm as good as my AA.  Other rare guns need to be brought up to this level of utility.

[marshalleck]

YuenglingDragon wrote...

But it won't matter.  I still won't ever shoot it.  I'd take no weapon if it let me.  As long as I get 200% I'm good to go.  My point is that Adepts and Engineers can do that.  Just spam good powers and never shoot.  

Why spam powers and never shoot, when you can spam powers and shoot at the same time? 

[BraveLToaster]

SalvationThroughDestruction wrote...

That wasn't the point. The point was when AAs are at 200% the cooldown difference didn't affect it all that much, thus making it an "Unneccesary" nerf. Aka, me trying to be a smart arse.

It's a percentage change, altering the base by 4s was a huge difference regardless of of recharge modifiers.

Coming from 'I'm an untouchable god in the demo' to 'Now I have to use other powers?' in the retail release was a big change.

[HayesC]

Carnifex is easily my favourite gun in the game. I honestly believe it's slightly too good, and expect it to get a slight/noticeable move down in dps.

[RNG God]

BraveLToaster wrote...

SalvationThroughDestruction wrote...

That wasn't the point. The point was when AAs are at 200% the cooldown difference didn't affect it all that much, thus making it an "Unneccesary" nerf. Aka, me trying to be a smart arse.

It's a percentage change, altering the base by 4s was a huge difference regardless of of recharge modifiers.

Coming from 'I'm an untouchable god in the demo' to 'Now I have to use other powers?' in the retail release was a big change.

2s difference at 200%, considering the duration of the effect, It doesn't effect you that much unless you're out of cover which isn't what you want to do as an adept anyway.

Modifié par SalvationThroughDestruction, 17 avril 2012 - 05:37 .

[squidney2k1]

Carnifex.....and I wouldn't complain that much.


But what I'd prefer is that mostly everything gets a buff, instead of a few things getting a nerf.

[YuenglingDragon]

marshalleck wrote...
Why spam powers and never shoot, when you can spam powers and shoot at the same time? 

Because my Asari Adept is made of papier mache and taking the time to aim a gun with her is asking to die.  On Gold anyway.  Actually, even on Bronze, Throw pretty much kills everything so I don't bother with my gun there either.

I hate Silver.  It seems to be where packs of retards roam.  Gold is getting there.  I need Platinum difficulty to open up.