149 réponses à ce sujet

[Mev186]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

For myself, and I didn't run any official numbers, those upset with the ending tend to fit into one (or more) generalized categories:

- Those upset with the Catalyst and how he was presented
- Those upset with the lack of closure and immediate aftermath of what happened
- Those upset that the ending ends on a decidedly less than happy note.


Just my observations anyway.

Nope. You're not far off though.

1. Correct. The Catylist makes no sense, and there is no reason to believe him, yet Shepard does anyway.

2. No, People are upset becuse there is NO feeling of resolution or acomplishment when the game is done. The reason why a happy ending works is because it is the cheapest and easiest way to give that feeling. can you have a "sad" ending and still get that. yes. But the important thing is for there to be some sense of acomlishment, there is none in the ending.

3. See above. Punctuated further by the Shepard "breathing" ending, and the destruction of the mass relays. You can't have an entire DLC pack that is entirely about how catestrophic the destruction of the mass relays are then tell us that we have no other choise than to destroy them to stop the reapers, without clearly explaining that this is different somehow. . What are we supposed to think other than, "Isn't that going to destroy the Earth ?"  It feels like we're curing the disease by killing the patient.

Modifié par Mev186, 21 avril 2012 - 08:29 .

[Allan Schumacher]

They are generalizations, there's going to be people that don't just fit in perfectly.

I think your perspective is too dismissive to the large amount of fans upset that Shepard can't really win and that the ending is a downer. There's no shortage of people that have explicitly stated that they'd love an ending where Shepard reunites with his LI. People that want blue babies, to build the house on Rannoch, etc..


I think your post, however, is quite reflective of the idea that the people disappointed in the ending are only really united in the fact that they would like changes to the ending. There's a large fracture over WHY they want the endings changed, and HOW they'd like the endings changed too.

There's a lot of posts saying "All we really want is a happy ending" (well that ignores other factions) on top of "99% of are mad because of the Catalyst! (which ignores other factions in and of itself).

If I had the time and capacity I'd run the numbers, but I think that any person that feels their one issue is the most representative of why people are upset is being myopic to all the issues being presented.

[Bill Casey]

I'm upset that Commander Shepard can't take a moral stand...
Even if that means we die fighting the Reapers to the last man...

I won't let fear compromise who I am...

Modifié par Bill Casey, 22 avril 2012 - 02:46 .

[CINCTuchanka]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

They are generalizations, there's going to be people that don't just fit in perfectly.

I think your perspective is too dismissive to the large amount of fans upset that Shepard can't really win and that the ending is a downer. There's no shortage of people that have explicitly stated that they'd love an ending where Shepard reunites with his LI. People that want blue babies, to build the house on Rannoch, etc..


I think your post, however, is quite reflective of the idea that the people disappointed in the ending are only really united in the fact that they would like changes to the ending. There's a large fracture over WHY they want the endings changed, and HOW they'd like the endings changed too.

There's a lot of posts saying "All we really want is a happy ending" (well that ignores other factions) on top of "99% of are mad because of the Catalyst! (which ignores other factions in and of itself).

If I had the time and capacity I'd run the numbers, but I think that any person that feels their one issue is the most representative of why people are upset is being myopic to all the issues being presented.

Well said, and I think that videogames such as ME and Dragon Age have the ability to provide different endings which can cater to different perspectivces on how "their" story should end. 

For me, I would have preferred if the ending had a sort of "choose who lives/choose who dies" choice.  These sort of choices are far more meaningful in the end.  I think a "everyone lives happily ever after" ending would have certainly trivialized the sacrifices in the story, but perhaps players should have the option of saving their crew, but at the cost of those on Earth/destruction of mass relays etc etc.  

DA:O did this very well in that you were presented with WHAT the sacrifice would probably be (i.e. one of the Wardens), given a way out (have someone sleep with Morrigan) and then away you went. 

My first DA:O playthrough was gutwrenching, because I ignored Morrigan's ritual (didn't want to betray Leliana, my LI, and didn't want to force Alistair to do something he didn't want to do).  I wasn't best buds with Alistair in that playthrough and his earnest desire to sacrifice himself despite him admitting we weren't the best of chums was heartwrenching.  That's why I sacrificed myself initially, and seeing Leliana mourning the Warden was just devestating. 

I would have liked to see something similar in ME3's ending.  Clear cut sacrifice, deciding who lives or dies based on decisions you made prior and having to live and/or die with the consequences.  As it stands, the sacrifices were forced on us.  I don't think players are averse to having bittersweet endings insofar as they get to decide which parts are bitter and which are sweet. 

The best comparison would be if DA:O ended with the Archdemon exploding, everyone looking up from the battle and cheering, and then cut to a scene in the forest where some of your companions are smiling.  Just too many unknowns, you wouldn't know what to think or feel about it.  The problem with ME3's ending is consequently a complete lack of bearing for the player's emotions, we're too busy being confused...

Modifié par CINCTuchanka, 22 avril 2012 - 02:52 .

[Bill Casey]

Shepard: "It's not just about living 'till tomorrow. Sometimes you take a stand."

EDI: "But the probability of success was near zero. And ultimately, they failed. No prisoners escaped."

Shepard: "Are you saying submission is preferable to extinction?"
___________________________________________________________________

Shepard: No matter what kind of technology we might find, it’s not worth it.

Illusive Man: Shepard, you died fighting for what you believed. I brought you back so you could keep fighting. Some would say what we did to you was going too far, but look what you’ve accomplished. I didn’t discard you because I know your value. Don’t be so quick to discard this facility. Think of the potential.

Shepard: We’ll fight and win without it. I won’t let fear compromise who I am.

____________________________________________________________________


Saren: If organic life is to survive, we must also prove we are useful. We must work with The Reapers

Shepard: Sovereign’s manipulating you and you don’t even know it. You’re already under its power.

Saren: No! Sovereign needs me! If I find the conduit, I’ve been promised a reprieve from the inevitable. This is my only hope.

Shepard: Together we can stop Sovereign. We don’t have to submit to the Reapers, we can beat them.

_____________________________________________________________________

Saren: You saw the visions. You saw what happened to the Protheans. Surrender or Death. There are no other options.

Shepard: You could have resisted. You could have fought. Instead you surrendered. You quit.

_____________________________________________________________________

Shepard: You’re playing with things you don’t understand. With power you shouldn’t be able to use.
 _____________________________________________________________________

Anderson: There’s always another way
____________________________________________________

Eve: I found this. A simple crystal, but it became my chisel. Take it as a reminder, Commander. In the darkest hour, there’s always a way out.
____________________________________________________

Modifié par Bill Casey, 22 avril 2012 - 02:51 .

[OchreJelly]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

*Snip*

- Those upset with the Catalyst and how he was presented
- Those upset with the lack of closure and immediate aftermath of what happened
- Those upset that the ending ends on a decidedly less than happy note.

On a general level, I agree with that observation. I don't really think they are mutually exclusive opinions though... not that you were claiming that, anyways.

I think that's why some posters use terms like "all we want" and "everybody thinks" this or that without qualification, because people who find just one to be their main concern aren't neccessarily in conflict with the others if, somehow, one were to be addressed.

Modifié par OchreJelly, 22 avril 2012 - 03:00 .

[Cirreus]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

They are generalizations, there's going to be people that don't just fit in perfectly.

I think your perspective is too dismissive to the large amount of fans upset that Shepard can't really win and that the ending is a downer. There's no shortage of people that have explicitly stated that they'd love an ending where Shepard reunites with his LI. People that want blue babies, to build the house on Rannoch, etc..


I think your post, however, is quite reflective of the idea that the people disappointed in the ending are only really united in the fact that they would like changes to the ending. There's a large fracture over WHY they want the endings changed, and HOW they'd like the endings changed too.

There's a lot of posts saying "All we really want is a happy ending" (well that ignores other factions) on top of "99% of are mad because of the Catalyst! (which ignores other factions in and of itself).

If I had the time and capacity I'd run the numbers, but I think that any person that feels their one issue is the most representative of why people are upset is being myopic to all the issues being presented.

I'd like to see some numbers then. If that is perception BSN is giving to Bioware staff, I almost can't fathom it. I thought the message was "complete fustration" particularly with the ending. Also, what large fracture ? The universal consesus is the ending was a SNAFU (explained better than I could here) on top of a rushed game. (DA2 dungeon designs ring a bell ?). I seriously hope that the people working on the ExCut do not share the sentiment that a lack of a "happy ending" with my "love interest" is the reason we're fustrated.

[Dendio1]

If this is truly the end of the trilogy, I want my ending to have an exhaustive epilogue that puts speculations to rest and gives a clear and proper send off to every significant character. More time should be spent on the squad mates, with love interest getting the largest segment.

I would like the ending to be more than just flash cards reading off epilogues. Personally I would love a playable epilogue.

[lil_lene]

@Allan Schumacher, your posts are always so well thought out. And I love the save your LI, yourself of the Geth sort of decision. So thanks for taking the time to post.

[ChickenMan77]

Ultimately a happy ending would of solved a lot of peoples complaints about plot holes..No one really cares at the end Of Jedi when the death star debris should be reigning hot Apocalypse on the planet..Why? ewok dance party!!! Still after the choices the resolution confused the hell out of me ... mass relay chain reaction?...that bloody coward Javik popping out of the Normandy..he was right behind Shep? is shep alive or dead? just confusing especially after being handed 3 crap choices for "Victory"

[jazzking2001]

i dont give a DAM about a "happy" ending
i want a ending that MAKES SENSE

[zennyrpg]

Allan Schumacher wrote...
I think your post, however, is quite reflective of the idea that the people disappointed in the ending are only really united in the fact that they would like changes to the ending. There's a large fracture over WHY they want the endings changed, and HOW they'd like the endings changed too.

There's a lot of posts saying "All we really want is a happy ending" (well that ignores other factions) on top of "99% of are mad because of the Catalyst! (which ignores other factions in and of itself).

If I had the time and capacity I'd run the numbers, but I think that any person that feels their one issue is the most representative of why people are upset is being myopic to all the issues being presented.

I think there are trends though.  We're not completely in the dark about what issues matter most.  http://social.biowar.../index/11526308 .  Sadly, this poll did not include anything about having a "happy ending".  I would put that in the Narrative Problems: Lack of Closure category myself, probably also Narrative Problems: Major Themes Seem Forgotten- since most consider "hope" an important theme.  Heck, any ending with "hope" would have to be a little bit happy.

[indyracing]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

If I had the time and capacity I'd run the numbers, but I think that any person that feels their one issue is the most representative of why people are upset is being myopic to all the issues being presented.

Was the intention of the ending to satisfy as few people as possible?

I ask that because there are many things one could expect from the ending to this story.  Be it kill the reapers and live happily ever after, Shepard and/or many other key NPCs heroically sacrifice themselves to stop the reaper threat, and some live happily ever after, or anything in between.

One thing that I don't think anyone expected was to not know the fate of our companions.  Bioware just doesn't generally do that.

I also don't think anyone expected such and underwhelming battle for Earth.  Nor did they expect anything like the God Child, or the complete distruction of the mass relays (which we have been shown also destroys all life in their systems).  Plus, the choices offered make no sense with the narrative to that point (my Geth story, as well as EDI, prove that synthetics can obtain "life", synthesis is space magic, and control was, up until 5 minutes prior, completely shown to be absolutely the wrong thing to do - it's what the #2 bad guy wanted to do).

Myself, I expected Shepard to die heroically, saving the galaxy from the reapers.  I don't feel any of the three choices offers that (they offer all kinds of plot and theme inconsistancies, though).  Would I have been surprised if Shepard lived?  Not really, but I expected the story to be written in a way that Shepard always dies, and that my legacy would live on in legend, and with my blue babies.  I also expected to know what happened to my companions, whether they end up alive or dead.

So to argue whether one group or another is larger (be it "happy ending", "anti-God Child", or any other group), the truth is all these groups are unhappy with the ending, because the ending is unsatisfying, and breaks so many basic rules of story-telling.

[GuardianAngel470]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

TMA LIVE wrote...

I feel like Bioware should have made a tag line:

"Want a happy ending with Shepard and your LI? Commit Genocide."

I know you're just poking some fun, but I think that the idea of Shepard making a decision that is less awesome for the entire galaxy in order to save himself and/or the people he cares about, is exceptionally powerful and interesting, so I don't think that the idea that you jokingly present is a bad idea in the slightest.

I would enjoy an ending that put me in a decision where, to do the most good for the galaxy, it would take some level of sacrifice from myself and/or my favourite party members (no sending Vega to be the hero because you don't like him type of stuff), whereas saving Shepard and/or the people Shepard cares most about would come at a cost for the rest of the galaxy.  Still winning, but less overtly winning.

It's a meaningful choice because no choice is clearly superior to the other, with meaningful consequences that will hit home with the player.  When I talk about games wanting "Choice and Consequences" this is the type of stuff that I really enjoy.  It doesn't come across too often though, unfortunately.

This is why I liked the ending to Deus Ex Human Revolution. Sure the only difference was the monologue and the choice presentation was sort of arbitrary, but it actually made me want to kill my Jensen because it was the right course of action.

I had three other options that wouldn't have killed off Jensen and everyone on the station but the one option that DID was so morally superior to the rest that I always pick it. No single man can choose the future for a species. No single man should have that power.

Which, consequently, is something that bothers me about ME3's endings. Not my biggest gripe(s) but certainly up there.

[UrdnotGrunty2]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

They are generalizations, there's going to be people that don't just fit in perfectly.

I think your perspective is too dismissive to the large amount of fans upset that Shepard can't really win and that the ending is a downer. There's no shortage of people that have explicitly stated that they'd love an ending where Shepard reunites with his LI. People that want blue babies, to build the house on Rannoch, etc..


I think your post, however, is quite reflective of the idea that the people disappointed in the ending are only really united in the fact that they would like changes to the ending. There's a large fracture over WHY they want the endings changed, and HOW they'd like the endings changed too.

There's a lot of posts saying "All we really want is a happy ending" (well that ignores other factions) on top of "99% of are mad because of the Catalyst! (which ignores other factions in and of itself).

If I had the time and capacity I'd run the numbers, but I think that any person that feels their one issue is the most representative of why people are upset is being myopic to all the issues being presented.

I'm not sure if everyone really just has one issue with the ending however, I had multiple, such as bringing up the Catalyst as a brand new character 15 minutes into the game, The endings doing a u-turn on the previous themes of mass effect.  The fact that the choices I made didn't matter (the only choice that arguably did was that very ending one).  The fact the ending choice is a Deus Ex Machina.  The fact that all the endings are practically the same endings and leave the galaxy in the same state.  The fact that I can't have my shepard have a semi PERSONAL happy ending (or happy ending at all arguably).

When people say their main gripe they mean the main thing to them wrong with it, it doesn't mean the only thing wrong with it.  Sure different people will have different main gripes but I believe ask them their main gripe and then ask them if one of the things that isn't their main gripe bothered them and they will most likely say yes.  There isn't anything redeemable about the ending in my eyes besides the music which just makes me dislike the endings even more because it takes such great music and links it with something terribly written (the endings as in the present state are very rushed, and saying they are not terribly written would be ignoring 90% of the people who say they are, which is like Rebecca Black ignoring the 90% of the people who said her song Friday was awful)

And just a note by a semi-personal happy ending I mean a way for Shepard to get a decent ending with his crew/LI, and this wouldn't have had to be put in a cliche save the world way.  I actually would have loved (and maybe even made it my canon Shepard'ss ending) to be able to near the end run away to an isolated world with your LI (maybe crew, I prefered just LI) and repopulate when the Reapers leave thinking everything is harvested giving 50,000 years to prepare for the next Reaper invasion.  (Yes I know depending on the LI this is not entirely possible, infact it is probably only possible with Liara, which is why you have the option of bringing the Normandy Crew)

[Jadebaby]

streamlock wrote...

A common theme I see reoccuring is the what if "happy/unhappy/bitter" argument on ME3's ending.  

From an overarching standpoint, I don't see the rational on this argument.

Lets say, for the sake of argument that the crucible was non-funtional and the allied fleets/sheppard defeats the reapers, somehow, someway.

Earth is trashed.  Every major city and industrial center is wrecked.  God knows how much of the population is dead, dying, or being rendered into reaper mush.  Her colonies are trashed.  Her fleets are shadow of thier former glory.  The amount of eezo released in the final battle would afflict the children of the survivors with horrific birth defects (some minor fraction would be biotic)

Thesia is wrecked.
Palavian is wrecked
Who knows about the Selarian homeworld.
The entire galactic infrastructure crushed.

Just about the entire galaxy is a post apocolyptic wasteland.  Billions, maybe trillions dead.

No matter what happened at the end, this is an undeniable reprecussion of the reaper invasion.  It's a war story.  War sucks.  Even in the most rainbow and unicorn filled ending fans have come up with would not change this.

In short, lay off the happy ending BS.  Wanting a couragous, heroic closure for the protoganist and thier team/LI, (living or dead) over the pseudo imagary interpretationalist Greek tradegedy crap that was delivered is not asking for a 'happy' ending. 

The happy ending debate is a non-issue.  Unless war torn wastelands is your idea of happy times.  In which case, stay the hell away from politics, and us.

I was under the impression everyone knew this already. That's more reason to make the ending brighter, everythings f'd anyway....

Sum it up with one quote..
"Oh look at that, I accidently burnt the edge of my book, Well.. better burn the whole thing now so I can't burn it again."

[In Exile]

The really ridiculous thing about all of this is that if the game just ended with Shepard closing his/her eyes with Anderson, and the cutscene of the Crucible docking with the Citadel, I'd be happy. Sure, there'd be a hell of a lot of loose ends, and people would be mad about closure...

... but at least the the the entire thematic foundation of the game would not be b0rked. I'd take a cut of the game that just ends right prior to the catalyst over anything else in the game.

[PeterG1]

Hey Allan this is good stuff thanks for your insight. Not to sound all self serving, but this is some of the best debate Ive seen on the forums. Its not anything completely new, but good rhetoric nonetheless.

I dont have a ton to add, and I would like to say that, emotionally, I found the endings very satisfying. But that doesnt mean that I necessarily enjoyed them. I think my biggest beef with the endings was the lack of final choice. I know many have argued this before, but in a meta- sense, theres significant disapointment because regardless of how emotionally moved we might have been from the diegesis of the story or life of the characters, theres going to animosity in a meta- sense due to well a number of things: misleading advertising, drastic change of concept in regards to character purpose, meaning, sacrifice, philosopies etc, what many refer to as illogical or 'rushed' ending-story, etc. If the devs created the most beautiful and enlightening ending ever concieved the fact that these meta 'problems' still exist are going to tarnish that no matter what.

So I fairly see 2 sides of the issue here. One, if Im guessing correctly, is that BioWare feels that by not changing, but even ADDING additional opportunities for alternate endings, theyre possibly cheapening or at least watering down the emotional and philosopical impact of what they created. And to them its perhaps very important that that stay.
Bit theres a very serious flaw with this reasoning. That is that, in a meta- sense, gamers feel too turned off and even 'betrayed' to allow the art to sweep them away and enlighten them. This is why so much debate centers around EA and biz politics and game distribution etc. Because the life of the game, gamers are very caught up in the above. Now how can you let the art take you away with that happening?

There isnt an easy solution to this. I dont think the EC can solve it. Maybe, but itll be very tough. Additional endings also have repercussions too so I dunno. I cant with certainy say...
I know this isnt new thoughts, but I feel its important to bring up here because its so hard to get through to the endings themselves within the story when you have all the meta things lingering over it. sorry for the length and typos, i look forward to hearing respomses.

Modifié par PeterG1, 22 avril 2012 - 06:55 .

[Kajan451]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

There's a lot of posts saying "All we really want is a happy ending" (well that ignores other factions) on top of "99% of are mad because of the Catalyst! (which ignores other factions in and of itself).

Honestly, i don't think one excludes the other. If we revisit your example, and add the promosed extension by myself, of our decisions changing the course of how it is playing out in the end. Meaning that our choices aren't just some numbers in some pool of numbers to determine which "ending" we get, but actually effect the choices in the end of the game, the responses you can give to the Catalyst or even who you can save and you you can't.

If you incorporate that into the ending, you could very well have an ending which require you to do X, Y and Z.. in order to reach an ending in which Shepard actually gets to sit on a beach with a cool beer, next to Garrus or their Victory sex with Jack.. or little blue Babies or whatever.

I don't think people would mind if they had to reach a 6000 EMS score, doing basically everything right to get the "Medal Ceremony" at the end, riding off into the sunset to retire on whatever planet they have chosen.

If there would be before that X other branches that always ultimately lead to a sacrifice of Shepards life, i don't think people would have complained. They might have been upset, but then someone would have remarked "Look i got that ending".. and so those that complained would probably turn around and play the game again, just to get that one ending they wanted.

I mean i don't know about others, but i had my prime game, which i left unaltered, it was always the first save i'd play in ME2 and then ME3.. its what i consider my own canon story. And then i have a couple saves on which i am gunning for certain things, so i would see how it played out in the end.

As it is right now, i don't really have that, but if there had been really all the diverse endings your PR usually said there would be, i mean we don't want to start going back over that again, but if it really had been in there and the hardest possible to get Ending... like the secret ending, would have been Shepard riding off into the sunset.. i don't think anyone had complained about it for long.

I think in the end its the lack of choice in a game that was supposedly all about choice in the game that spoiled the cake. There just isn't a get out of jail free card in this game, nor do you have a choice to challenge the logic presented by the catalyst. Nor is there a choice which doesn't destroy the Mass Relays. I think in the end it really boils down to lack of options and that everyone basically gets the same thing, no matter what they did.

[Elite Midget]

Pshaw, a happy ending would be actually winning and moving forward to pick up the pieces and strive to be better.

All we got was wannabe grimdark endings with an Adam and Eve reference, not someing any fan wanted.

[zarnk567]

Dendio1 wrote...

If this is truly the end of the trilogy, I want my ending to have an exhaustive epilogue that puts speculations to rest and gives a clear and proper send off to every significant character. More time should be spent on the squad mates, with love interest getting the largest segment.

I would like the ending to be more than just flash cards reading off epilogues. Personally I would love a playable epilogue.

^this^ It seems really messed up that in such a character driven story we know nothing about what happened to any of our characters.... except they ended up on gillagans planet..... and SPECULATION....

p.s.  thank you for talking to us allan.

Modifié par zarnk567, 22 avril 2012 - 11:32 .

[UniqueNickname]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

They are generalizations, there's going to be people that don't just fit in perfectly.

I think your perspective is too dismissive to the large amount of fans upset that Shepard can't really win and that the ending is a downer. There's no shortage of people that have explicitly stated that they'd love an ending where Shepard reunites with his LI. People that want blue babies, to build the house on Rannoch, etc..


I think your post, however, is quite reflective of the idea that the people disappointed in the ending are only really united in the fact that they would like changes to the ending. There's a large fracture over WHY they want the endings changed, and HOW they'd like the endings changed too.

There's a lot of posts saying "All we really want is a happy ending" (well that ignores other factions) on top of "99% of are mad because of the Catalyst! (which ignores other factions in and of itself).

If I had the time and capacity I'd run the numbers, but I think that any person that feels their one issue is the most representative of why people are upset is being myopic to all the issues being presented.

You can't or most likely you won't (or don't want to) remove the Catalyst starbrat. 

You have three choices already and each of those can represent a ending each fan-faction actually wants in terms of happy/neutral/sad. It is better than nothing. 

And since I am responding to Bioware employee I would like to say you did much better in DA2 and I loved the game.

[the red boon]

ReggarBlane wrote...

There's no happy ending to all-out-war with a superior force ... just less unhappy ones.

also

It was rushed.

The happy ending is rebuilding and thanking that it's over. 

[tschamp]

streamlock wrote...

A common theme I see reoccuring is the what if "happy/unhappy/bitter" argument on ME3's ending.  

From an overarching standpoint, I don't see the rational on this argument.

Lets say, for the sake of argument that the crucible was non-funtional and the allied fleets/sheppard defeats the reapers, somehow, someway.

Earth is trashed.  Every major city and industrial center is wrecked.  God knows how much of the population is dead, dying, or being rendered into reaper mush.  Her colonies are trashed.  Her fleets are shadow of thier former glory.  The amount of eezo released in the final battle would afflict the children of the survivors with horrific birth defects (some minor fraction would be biotic)

Thesia is wrecked.
Palavian is wrecked
Who knows about the Selarian homeworld.
The entire galactic infrastructure crushed.

Just about the entire galaxy is a post apocolyptic wasteland.  Billions, maybe trillions dead.

No matter what happened at the end, this is an undeniable reprecussion of the reaper invasion.  It's a war story.  War sucks.  Even in the most rainbow and unicorn filled ending fans have come up with would not change this.

In short, lay off the happy ending BS.  Wanting a couragous, heroic closure for the protoganist and thier team/LI, (living or dead) over the pseudo imagary interpretationalist Greek tradegedy crap that was delivered is not asking for a 'happy' ending. 

The happy ending debate is a non-issue.  Unless war torn wastelands is your idea of happy times.  In which case, stay the hell away from politics, and us.

I don't think I ever used the words "happy ending" when I talked about the ending of Mass Effect 3. I will define it for you in my case.

Happy Ending-(tschamp) I am happy that I brought and played this game to it's final conculsion.

There you go, if you see me use that words happy ending, that is what it means. No, I don't like the ending because it is silly and amaturish writing for a series that was excellent up to that point.

[Wildhide]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

They are generalizations, there's going to be people that don't just fit in perfectly.

I think your perspective is too dismissive to the large amount of fans upset that Shepard can't really win and that the ending is a downer. There's no shortage of people that have explicitly stated that they'd love an ending where Shepard reunites with his LI. People that want blue babies, to build the house on Rannoch, etc..


I think your post, however, is quite reflective of the idea that the people disappointed in the ending are only really united in the fact that they would like changes to the ending. There's a large fracture over WHY they want the endings changed, and HOW they'd like the endings changed too.

There's a lot of posts saying "All we really want is a happy ending" (well that ignores other factions) on top of "99% of are mad because of the Catalyst! (which ignores other factions in and of itself).

If I had the time and capacity I'd run the numbers, but I think that any person that feels their one issue is the most representative of why people are upset is being myopic to all the issues being presented.

I think in the end this highlights WHY people were expecting "16 entirely unique endings" which we didn't get at all.  Because for this trilogy a lot of people had different ideas and expectations of how it should end.  The ME team then sold people on the idea that there would be a lot of differences so everyone would have a unique ending, or be able to find the ending that fit how they thought the story should close.

The fact that it turned into a pick-your-color choice didn't really provide in that regard.  And that's ignoring all the other issues I have with the ending.