539 réponses à ce sujet

[thunderhawk862002]

_aLucidMind_ wrote...

EJ107 wrote...

You're a fool if you think dlc that comes out day of or very close to release is "bonus" content.  Old school gamers would call that "what use to be included with the game".

The way some people here think they'd be ok with Chevy building the next camaro for the same price as last years, but having a $10k "bonus" chip that activates cylinders 5 through 8.

Precisely. I can understand if they cut or content-locked chunks and put it up for free day-one if there were anti-piracy checks like Origin does (doesn't it scan your files to make sure you're not using pirated DLC or base game?). That is understandable, but not if it is paid DLC when it is obviously on the disc.

Or you know, sell the game for $30 and buy the other parts extra.  Instead it's Pay $60, then another $20-$40 to get the rest, then oh in about a year we'll packag everything on disk for $49.99.  Sorry if you paid fifty dollars more or so.

[_aLucidMind_]

thunderhawk862002 wrote...

_aLucidMind_ wrote...

EJ107 wrote...

You're a fool if you think dlc that comes out day of or very close to release is "bonus" content.  Old school gamers would call that "what use to be included with the game".

The way some people here think they'd be ok with Chevy building the next camaro for the same price as last years, but having a $10k "bonus" chip that activates cylinders 5 through 8.

Precisely. I can understand if they cut or content-locked chunks and put it up for free day-one if there were anti-piracy checks like Origin does (doesn't it scan your files to make sure you're not using pirated DLC or base game?). That is understandable, but not if it is paid DLC when it is obviously on the disc.

Or you know, sell the game for $30 and buy the other parts extra.  Instead it's Pay $60, then another $20-$40 to get the rest, then oh in about a year we'll packag everything on disk for $49.99.  Sorry if you paid fifty dollars more or so.

The thing is, most games that do repackaging generally have a reputation of it. Every game Bethesda made (well, TES and FO3/NV) all have that repackaging a year later ever since Morrowind. Red Dead Redemption was a bit of a surprise, though but at least RockStar was pretty good about DLC. It is why I often don't buy games until at least a year and a half after their initial release with very few and far-between exceptions (like Assassin's Creed is and ME used to be).

[Yajuu Omoi]

_aLucidMind_ wrote...

Yajuu Omoi wrote...

Blc949 wrote...

And years ago countries didn't organize protests/rebellions via facebook to overthrow governments.  The information age is changing how the world works. 

Video games are now never truely 100% finished products with the possibility of dlc.  1 person can't change much, but 1 person can inspire the masses to bring change. 

Be it something as small as a video game, or be it something as big as a government.  If you think you can't do something, you can't. 

Lets just cut to the chase here...people like youy think they are entitled to getting everything they want. Where as people like me, realize the only way to get what you want is to earn it. period.

And thats what this "movement" was about, a bunch of childish, spoiled brats thinking they are entitled.
And the rest of reality saying "No"

Contrary to what you may think, there are many people wanting the same thing that also have stated that they are not entitled to anything. The fact of the matter is that this isn't a matter of being self-entitled, this is a matter of consumer rights and requesting them to make an ending that actually fits the trilogy, or at least one that makes sense. There is a difference between being self-entitled and trying to get a company to fix their mistake. Had people been demanding everything they wanted in-depth as opposed to just very broad and generalized statements, then maybe you would be able to correctly say that the entire group is self-entitled and not just a small number of them.

Her's the thing...if your paying attention to these posts, i've already stated i believe they made a HUGE mistake with the way that they ended the game, however, it is NOT my place to demand anything of them, I can voice my opinion, give feedback, but after that, it's THEIR game and THEIR choice to do something.

That is a consumers place, if you wish to demand a change? Become a franchise owner, or designer,  THEN you will have a say in what happens.

[Sero303]

Her's the thing...if your paying attention to these posts, i've already stated i believe they made a HUGE mistake with the way that they ended the game, however, it is NOT my place to demand anything of them, I can voice my opinion, give feedback, but after that, it's THEIR game and THEIR choice to do something.

That is a consumers place, if you wish to demand a change? Become a franchise owner, or designer,  THEN you will have a say in what happens.

Believe me, if I had the capitol, the financial means, I would at EA &/or BioWare's doorstep offering to buy the franchise. Then I would really let the fans choose what should happen next, based on whats best for the story/fans and not quarterly profits...

[deatharmonic]

Yajuu Omoi wrote...

_aLucidMind_ wrote...

Yajuu Omoi wrote...

Blc949 wrote...

And years ago countries didn't organize protests/rebellions via facebook to overthrow governments.  The information age is changing how the world works. 

Video games are now never truely 100% finished products with the possibility of dlc.  1 person can't change much, but 1 person can inspire the masses to bring change. 

Be it something as small as a video game, or be it something as big as a government.  If you think you can't do something, you can't. 

Lets just cut to the chase here...people like youy think they are entitled to getting everything they want. Where as people like me, realize the only way to get what you want is to earn it. period.

And thats what this "movement" was about, a bunch of childish, spoiled brats thinking they are entitled.
And the rest of reality saying "No"

Contrary to what you may think, there are many people wanting the same thing that also have stated that they are not entitled to anything. The fact of the matter is that this isn't a matter of being self-entitled, this is a matter of consumer rights and requesting them to make an ending that actually fits the trilogy, or at least one that makes sense. There is a difference between being self-entitled and trying to get a company to fix their mistake. Had people been demanding everything they wanted in-depth as opposed to just very broad and generalized statements, then maybe you would be able to correctly say that the entire group is self-entitled and not just a small number of them.

Her's the thing...if your paying attention to these posts, i've already stated i believe they made a HUGE mistake with the way that they ended the game, however, it is NOT my place to demand anything of them, I can voice my opinion, give feedback, but after that, it's THEIR game and THEIR choice to do something.

That is a consumers place, if you wish to demand a change? Become a franchise owner, or designer,  THEN you will have a say in what happens.

I disagree with that mentality - i like the fact that in todays society you dont have to be a 'big wig' in order to bring about change. People can demand all they want but bioware dont have to give in or even compromise. A lot of people speak as though bioware are being held by the scruff of the neck and slapped into submission - they're not. They're not rewriting the endings but they themselves recognize offering clarity would be a good idea, ultimately they're making a decision they're comfortable with, or they would simply say no.

[Gatt9]

Yajuu Omoi wrote...

_aLucidMind_ wrote...

Yajuu Omoi wrote...

Blc949 wrote...

And years ago countries didn't organize protests/rebellions via facebook to overthrow governments.  The information age is changing how the world works. 

Video games are now never truely 100% finished products with the possibility of dlc.  1 person can't change much, but 1 person can inspire the masses to bring change. 

Be it something as small as a video game, or be it something as big as a government.  If you think you can't do something, you can't. 

Lets just cut to the chase here...people like youy think they are entitled to getting everything they want. Where as people like me, realize the only way to get what you want is to earn it. period.

And thats what this "movement" was about, a bunch of childish, spoiled brats thinking they are entitled.
And the rest of reality saying "No"

Contrary to what you may think, there are many people wanting the same thing that also have stated that they are not entitled to anything. The fact of the matter is that this isn't a matter of being self-entitled, this is a matter of consumer rights and requesting them to make an ending that actually fits the trilogy, or at least one that makes sense. There is a difference between being self-entitled and trying to get a company to fix their mistake. Had people been demanding everything they wanted in-depth as opposed to just very broad and generalized statements, then maybe you would be able to correctly say that the entire group is self-entitled and not just a small number of them.

Her's the thing...if your paying attention to these posts, i've already stated i believe they made a HUGE mistake with the way that they ended the game, however, it is NOT my place to demand anything of them, I can voice my opinion, give feedback, but after that, it's THEIR game and THEIR choice to do something.

That is a consumers place, if you wish to demand a change? Become a franchise owner, or designer,  THEN you will have a say in what happens.

Your assertion falls apart on the fact that the consumers bought the game on highly specific statements made by EA prior to the release of the game,  some of them made on the day of release,  that were factually incorrect.

All that's ever been demanded is that EA deliver the product they very specifically and unambiguously described.

Which is quite honestly,  a consumer's responsiblity. 

Sentiments like yours will just end up producing nothing but ever more expesive games with fewer and fewer features until EA's dream of charging you $1 every time you reload your clip becomes a reality.

[BiancoAngelo7]

I dont understand what OP and some others were expecting? Were you expecting us retakers to camp out in front of Bioware HQ a la "Wall street 99%" losers?

Bioware got the message, the message was "you screwed up 5 years of story telling in 5 minutes, if you don't fix it, we're gonna abandon you and your products"

Only after the EC is released will we see if they ACTUALLY got the message, if they didn't then they deserve to have Mass Effect fail as it has and is now.

[_aLucidMind_]

BiancoAngelo7 wrote...

I dont understand what OP and some others were expecting? Were you expecting us retakers to camp out in front of Bioware HQ a la "Wall street 99%" losers?

Bioware got the message, the message was "you screwed up 5 years of story telling in 5 minutes, if you don't fix it, we're gonna abandon you and your products"

Only after the EC is released will we see if they ACTUALLY got the message, if they didn't then they deserve to have Mass Effect fail as it has and is now.

I find it very amusing when some people seem to think that this (the bolded part, what all of us are saying) is bullying, like we're supposed to just buy their products and never question anything they do.

[thunderhawk862002]

_aLucidMind_ wrote...

BiancoAngelo7 wrote...

I dont understand what OP and some others were expecting? Were you expecting us retakers to camp out in front of Bioware HQ a la "Wall street 99%" losers?

Bioware got the message, the message was "you screwed up 5 years of story telling in 5 minutes, if you don't fix it, we're gonna abandon you and your products"

Only after the EC is released will we see if they ACTUALLY got the message, if they didn't then they deserve to have Mass Effect fail as it has and is now.

I find it very amusing when some people seem to think that this (the bolded part, what all of us are saying) is bullying, like we're supposed to just buy their products and never question anything they do.

Yeah it seems like people want to say, "I would humbly request you make some changes since I am not happy with the ending because of these reasons.  But you know if you don't change them that's fine.  It's your IP and you can do whatever you want with it.  Please don't make the same mistake for the next game, alright?  I completely trust you.  Let me know when I can pre order your next product!"

[_aLucidMind_]

Many just don't know the difference between being stern and being a complete ******, which proves just how excessive this PC culture are has gotten. I understand that more people ought to be more respectful but there is a difference between being considerate towards a person's feelings and coddling them.

There are simply far too many people who do not use common sense, much less their brain as a whole; hence my avatar lol.

[bleachorange]

Dridengx wrote...

slyguy200 wrote...

Yeah, like any of us can be of any significant help with any of those things. We will do this instead, a few donations is all we can really do, so don't go off and say that garbage really applies.

but you sure were proud touting those Child's Play charity donations you did though acting like it was so major collecting 80,000. Retake even bragged how CP would be nothing without them even though they made 3 million without you. it's not even worth arguing with you guys because you keep changing your stance funny how it was for the game not making sense and wanting closure.. then it was for turning your negative energy into something postive.. then the ending doesn't need clarification.. to now.. we're doing this for gaming!!

you're doing it because you are a bunch of sorry people with nothing better to do. Witcher 2 is out, Diablo 3 open beta is out. it's the weekend go out.. nah, you would rather whine on the forums KNOWING nothing will be done until Summer regardless how much you cry.. sad.

now if you'll excuse me I have better things to do.. How's your Mass Effect 3 ending you wanted? no luck? aww well maybe you need more threads lol

You seem to lump people together quite easily. Next time say, "Some people bragged CP would be nothing without Retake..."

As for the rest, vitriol and stereotyping do you no credit. Perhaps you should start a "I Hate Retake Mass Effect" thread or group to join those of a like mind.

Internet Rule #1 - Don't Be a Hater;)

[bleachorange]

Yajuu Omoi wrote...
Here's the thing...if your paying attention to these posts, i've already stated i believe they made a HUGE mistake with the way that they ended the game, however, it is NOT my place to demand anything of them, I can voice my opinion, give feedback, but after that, it's THEIR game and THEIR choice to do something.

That is a consumers place, if you wish to demand a change? Become a franchise owner, or designer,  THEN you will have a say in what happens.

Which is why I help developers out when one I like needs some $$$ on kickstarter and such. Really, most people are waiting for the DLC to come out. Not up to my expectations? Then peace out, I'm going to Activision and Zenimax.

Then it'll be bye-bye :wizard:Space Magic:wizard: and hello EA boycott. I'm not going too far here, EA's not getting any more of my money if they can't deliver the goods. I apply this to everything, not just EA. So don't think jumping on the "you're a whiny entitled teenage brat who has no perspective" bandwagon will get any traction here.



Peace.

[AJRimmsey]

Sero303 wrote...

Her's the thing...if your paying attention to these posts, i've already stated i believe they made a HUGE mistake with the way that they ended the game, however, it is NOT my place to demand anything of them, I can voice my opinion, give feedback, but after that, it's THEIR game and THEIR choice to do something.

That is a consumers place, if you wish to demand a change? Become a franchise owner, or designer,  THEN you will have a say in what happens.

Believe me, if I had the capitol, the financial means, I would at EA &/or BioWare's doorstep offering to buy the franchise. Then I would really let the fans choose what should happen next, based on whats best for the story/fans and not quarterly profits...

and you would have 100`s of thousands of people all demanding something different.

you would then decide to accomodate the majority

and go bust after the first game,if you ever got it released.

and the minority would then proceed to rant and attack you on the forums for promising to accomodate thier wishes.


soon after you would send a message to bioware saying you are sorry you ever tried to do it and what a bunch of gits the minority is for sim[ply not understanding you couldnt accomodate them all.

there you go,if you win the 100 million lottery next week i just saved you from flushing it all down the toilet.

[bleachorange]

AJRimmsey wrote...

Sero303 wrote...

Her's the thing...if your paying attention to these posts, i've already stated i believe they made a HUGE mistake with the way that they ended the game, however, it is NOT my place to demand anything of them, I can voice my opinion, give feedback, but after that, it's THEIR game and THEIR choice to do something.

That is a consumers place, if you wish to demand a change? Become a franchise owner, or designer,  THEN you will have a say in what happens.

Believe me, if I had the capitol, the financial means, I would at EA &/or BioWare's doorstep offering to buy the franchise. Then I would really let the fans choose what should happen next, based on whats best for the story/fans and not quarterly profits...

and you would have 100`s of thousands of people all demanding something different.

you would then decide to accomodate the majority

and go bust after the first game,if you ever got it released.

and the minority would then proceed to rant and attack you on the forums for promising to accomodate thier wishes.


soon after you would send a message to bioware saying you are sorry you ever tried to do it and what a bunch of gits the minority is for sim[ply not understanding you couldnt accomodate them all.

there you go,if you win the 100 million lottery next week i just saved you from flushing it all down the toilet.

...yeah. I had a similar reaction to that. It takes more than money and devotion to your fans to be successful. I'm not saying Bioware didn't screw up enough to potentially lose my business. But taking over a multimillion-dollar corporation is no walk in the park, and many experienced, successful executives don't last long at any one place.

Modifié par bleachorange, 21 avril 2012 - 07:25 .

[T1l]

Didn't take long for people to realise it's pointless. Changing the ending of Mass Effect 3 will be about as successful as writing to George R.R. Martin and asking him to re-write the ending of Ned Stark.

Good luck. You'll need it.

[SalsaDMA]

AJRimmsey wrote...

Sero303 wrote...

Her's the thing...if your paying attention to these posts, i've already stated i believe they made a HUGE mistake with the way that they ended the game, however, it is NOT my place to demand anything of them, I can voice my opinion, give feedback, but after that, it's THEIR game and THEIR choice to do something.

That is a consumers place, if you wish to demand a change? Become a franchise owner, or designer,  THEN you will have a say in what happens.

Believe me, if I had the capitol, the financial means, I would at EA &/or BioWare's doorstep offering to buy the franchise. Then I would really let the fans choose what should happen next, based on whats best for the story/fans and not quarterly profits...

and you would have 100`s of thousands of people all demanding something different.

you would then decide to accomodate the majority

and go bust after the first game,if you ever got it released.

and the minority would then proceed to rant and attack you on the forums for promising to accomodate thier wishes.


soon after you would send a message to bioware saying you are sorry you ever tried to do it and what a bunch of gits the minority is for sim[ply not understanding you couldnt accomodate them all.

there you go,if you win the 100 million lottery next week i just saved you from flushing it all down the toilet.

I think you are over-emphasizing the 'what people want' bit. In cases like this, nobody expects the dev to go out and ask each and every potential customer what they specifically want in the product.

However, there is a vast difference between churning out titles on the conveyerbelt solely for the sake of making money (the EA way), or lavishingly handcraft the finest product to show your pride in your fireld of expertise.

TBH, I don't think any of the ME games were those lavishingly pieces of love, for various reasons, but ME1 were the one that got closest to it. While ME2 where a good game too, it already then showed signs of the conveyer product for money syndrome, especially with the DLCs (and even more so with the utterly horrible "Arrival" DLC that should have given everyone a clear warning sign in neon letters about what was going to happen with ME3)

Games I personally think of when I consider products that show peoples pride in their work would prob be the likes of "Descent:Freespace", "Freespace 2", "Limbo" or "Planescape Torment".

From the looks of it, I feel like EA already got their usual plans in motion of how to deal with "franchises", so they might as well had slapped a "2012" next to the title instead of a "3" <_<

[CHALET]

I think most (or a lot) are quite content to sit back and wait for the Extended Cut. If that proves to be a load of tosh I reckon the fires will start again.

[Sero303]

bleachorange wrote...

AJRimmsey wrote...

Sero303 wrote...

Her's the thing...if your paying attention to these posts, i've already stated i believe they made a HUGE mistake with the way that they ended the game, however, it is NOT my place to demand anything of them, I can voice my opinion, give feedback, but after that, it's THEIR game and THEIR choice to do something.

That is a consumers place, if you wish to demand a change? Become a franchise owner, or designer,  THEN you will have a say in what happens.

Believe me, if I had the capitol, the financial means, I would at EA &/or BioWare's doorstep offering to buy the franchise. Then I would really let the fans choose what should happen next, based on whats best for the story/fans and not quarterly profits...

and you would have 100`s of thousands of people all demanding something different.

you would then decide to accomodate the majority

and go bust after the first game,if you ever got it released.

and the minority would then proceed to rant and attack you on the forums for promising to accomodate thier wishes.


soon after you would send a message to bioware saying you are sorry you ever tried to do it and what a bunch of gits the minority is for sim[ply not understanding you couldnt accomodate them all.

there you go,if you win the 100 million lottery next week i just saved you from flushing it all down the toilet.

...yeah. I had a similar reaction to that. It takes more than money and devotion to your fans to be successful. I'm not saying Bioware didn't screw up enough to potentially lose my business. But taking over a multimillion-dollar corporation is no walk in the park, and many experienced, successful executives don't last long at any one place.

You're right, it does take more than a butt load of cash and devotion to ones fans to create a successful product ( game ). A decent, plot hole free story structure is a great place to start! I'm not saying what I would create would be the best ever, but it would certainly have been better than what we got!
But now you are getting more into the business ( corporate greed ) part.
If I do win 100 million next week, you bet your ass I would look into taking over Mass Effect, and bring back actual sci-fi to TV.
Not that it will ever happen, I'm afraid we are stuck with whatever they give us, and even if I could again you're right I may or may not be successful, but I would still try.

[BomberJR]

T1l wrote...

Didn't take long for people to realise it's pointless. Changing the ending of Mass Effect 3 will be about as successful as writing to George R.R. Martin and asking him to re-write the ending of Ned Stark.

Good luck. You'll need it.

True. Although THAT ending actually made sense.  

[AJRimmsey]

Sero303 wrote...

If I do win 100 million next week, you bet your ass I would look into taking over Mass Effect, and bring back actual sci-fi to TV.
Not that it will ever happen, I'm afraid we are stuck with whatever they give us, and even if I could again you're right I may or may not be successful, but I would still try.

liar

you would buy thousands of mario plushies and lollies

[XTR3M3]

BiancoAngelo7 wrote...

I dont understand what OP and some others were expecting? Were you expecting us retakers to camp out in front of Bioware HQ a la "Wall street 99%" losers?

Bioware got the message, the message was "you screwed up 5 years of story telling in 5 minutes, if you don't fix it, we're gonna abandon you and your products"

Only after the EC is released will we see if they ACTUALLY got the message, if they didn't then they deserve to have Mass Effect fail as it has and is now.

yea, pretty much my take on it. I am already out there looking for a new developer to love in case the EC is as bad or worse than the current ending. We don't need the turd polished, we need it flushed.

[aftermath_diogo]

Mass Effect 1 and 2's facebook page is the new facebook for the retake mass effect 3 movement, in case you have not noticed. The owner of those pages has stopped responding to stuff and only posts things like new hoodies or t-shirst once every week. 90% of posts there are about the ending and probably from members of the movement.
We are alive and kicking, in fact, i just created a small protest of my own about 10mina go, check it here. http://social.biowar.../index/11586344

[AlanC9]

BomberJR wrote...

T1l wrote...

Didn't take long for people to realise it's pointless. Changing the ending of Mass Effect 3 will be about as successful as writing to George R.R. Martin and asking him to re-write the ending of Ned Stark.

Good luck. You'll need it.

True. Although THAT ending actually made sense.  

I think a better example would be asking Dan Simmons to not blow up the farcaster network at the end of The Fall of Hyperion. Better because this is obviously what Bio was ripping off, except that Simmons did much more damage to his universe than Bioware did to theirs.

[lillitheris]

T1l wrote...

Didn't take long for people to realise it's pointless. Changing the ending of Mass Effect 3 will be about as successful as writing to George R.R. Martin and asking him to re-write the ending of Ned Stark.

You know how a lot of people were quite upset that Ned died, but – and this is the important part – there weren't widespread demands to change it?

Can you think of any reasons why that might be?

Hint: it's because the ME3 ending is nonsensical garbage, and Ned's fate was a well-written dramatic and emotional arc that even managed to include a twist that's still completely within the lore of his world, and made horrible sense.