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[Cheesesack]

I've seen this mentioned in lots of various forms, but I thought I'd condense and summarise. Perhaps one of the worst things with the ending currently, even if you accept the Starchild has to be there (which he shouldn't be because it's a retarded idea) is how utterly stupid Shepard is in the final moments.

Now, it's obvious that Shepard isn't a retard. Regardless of whether you play Paragon or Renegade, Shepard always eloquates well and is able to justify their actions or at least explain them. Think of all the heroic speeches, or the dialouge with a tech-shop assistant, or any of the other countless examples where Shepard proves they are a competant human being.

So why-oh-why does Shepard say/do so much idiotic stuff in the end? Let's make a list:

• Shepard doesn't question anything the Starchild says. You can tell it you'd 'preffer to keep your own form', but that's not really questioning and it's irrelevant because Shepard immediately accepts what it says afterwards.
• Shepard accepts the three options presented which are, to summarise again: kill yourself, kill yourself or kill yourself. Some random AI which for all Shepard knows could be a Reaper or the product of Indoctrination or just some random kids VI program which is malfunctioning tells him/her to either: electocute yourself so you dissolve, jump off a high ledge into a beam of energy which vaporises you, or shoot something which will make a massive explosion and blow up the space station you're standing on. And Shepard just goes "Yup, seems legit." and does it.
• Shepard does not search for any other way to solve the problem. For all Shepard knows, there's a button just abound the corner which turns off all the Reapers.
• Shepard doesn't contact anyone to ask anyone for help or explain what's going on. Sure, the situation's desperate, but Shepard has a working communicator. Surely he/she should at least talk to Hackett/some of the others for a few minutes before making such a massive decision.

In conclusion, the Crucible must emit an energy field that makes all organics nearby temporarily moronic.

Modifié par Cheesesack, 20 avril 2012 - 10:32 .

[MrHiGhToWeRr]

He wasn't being stupid. He was being artistic and integral. Learn the difference /sarcasm

[The Angry One]

Don't forget: "So the Illusive Man was right!".

I mean, really? WHY WOULD YOU EVER SAY THAT!?
I facepalmed so hard when I heard that. Little did I know that wasn't even the worst of it.

[Animositisomina]

"I... don't know."

[ChickenMan77]

Yeah mean these great Dialogues..."huh" "what", "the Illusive man was right".. Yeah you can literally interact wtih the Cook on the Sr-2 in ME2 more than the Starchild WTF?

Modifié par ChickenMan77, 19 avril 2012 - 06:23 .

[Animositisomina]

ChickenMan77 wrote...

Yeah mean these great Dialogues..."huh" "what", "the Illusive man was right".. Yeah you can literally interact to the Cook on the Sr-2 more than the Starchild WTF?

To be fair, Rupert was pretty awesome. I'd rather have more dialogue with him than the Starchild anyway.

[mechalynx]

Because there were not enough speculation from everyone.

[Galifreya]

This is where IT makes the most sense. Shepard is being influenced by her blood loss, lack of any major mobility (except walking slowly and lifting a gun), and the fact that s/he just lost his/her mentor, Anderson. She's weakened physically and mentally, and is in no condition to be making galaxy altering decisions.

Which is where the player is supposed to step in, and remind her of her goal:

DESTROY THE FRAKKING REAPERS.

[Dead_Meat357]

ChickenMan77 wrote...

Yeah mean these great Dialogues..."huh" "what", "the Illusive man was right".. Yeah you can literally interact wtih the Cook on the Sr-2 in ME2 more than the Starchild WTF?

The guy cleaning the toilets and cooking the meals was far more intereting than the Starchild.

[Tleining]

because Shepard was pretty much brainless for all of ME3?
"Why should i go to the Citadel, the fight is here."
"Cerberus is supposed to be the Sword protecting Humanity not the Dagger in the back."

let's not get started on the whole conversation with the Security Council.

[Subject9x]

"on my signal....fire" derp-derp!

[Spectre-00N7]

The Angry One wrote...

Don't forget: "So the Illusive Man was right!".

I mean, really? WHY WOULD YOU EVER SAY THAT!?
I facepalmed so hard when I heard that. Little did I know that wasn't even the worst of it.

My most hated line in the entire series without a doubt.  I even wanted to punch Shepard in the face more than the catalyst.

[balmyrian]

Shepard is broken at that point. There is no more "Shepard", just a soldier.

This much is made extensively clear in the writing and the entire game foreshadows that point where "too much is too much", even for Shepard. We get a much more emotional characters who's going through a lot more inner struggle while sticking to the "I'm just a soldier" line.

Now is it the toll of War or is it both War and struggle against indoctrination? Who knows. Same result either way.

I didn't like the ending either, but I feel that a bit too many people have been made obstuse and pigheaded by the ending debacle.

[Muhkida]

Shepard lacks a "Child at Heart" perk and couldn't challenge the Star Kid.

The Lone Wanderer would've told the Catalyst to bake a cake and blow himself up afterwards along with the Reapers.

[Galifreya]

Shepard makes derpy comments throughout the whole series for the benefit of the player, or "audience." The ending is a different matter, though. The conversation is far less than it should've been, if we're meant to take it t face value. Which I don't.

[The Angry One]

balmyrian wrote...

Shepard is broken at that point. There is no more "Shepard", just a soldier.

This much is made extensively clear in the writing and the entire game foreshadows that point where "too much is too much", even for Shepard. We get a much more emotional characters who's going through a lot more inner struggle while sticking to the "I'm just a soldier" line.

Now is it the toll of War or is it both War and struggle against indoctrination? Who knows. Same result either way.

I didn't like the ending either, but I feel that a bit too many people have been made obstuse and pigheaded by the ending debacle.

Even if that were true, you realise that's no way to end a trilogy right?
Defeating the protagonist and having them essentially give up is one step below "rocks fall everyone dies".

[aj2070]

"Artistic integrity" <sigh>.

[T-Raks]

Spectre-00N7 wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

Don't forget: "So the Illusive Man was right!".

I mean, really? WHY WOULD YOU EVER SAY THAT!?
I facepalmed so hard when I heard that. Little did I know that wasn't even the worst of it.

My most hated line in the entire series without a doubt.  I even wanted to punch Shepard in the face more than the catalyst.

Yeah, that was the line where I thought, "now the autoplay dialogs have gone too far"...

To the OP: Maybe this theory helps social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/355/index/11512173

[humes spork]

Smarter than you, apparently, if your cunning plan is to let Shepard bleed out arguing in circles with a billion-year-old AI and let the Reapers blow up the Crucible in the meantime.

[aj2070]

Muhkida wrote...

Shepard lacks a "Child at Heart" perk and couldn't challenge the Star Kid.

The Lone Wanderer would've told the Catalyst to bake a cake and blow himself up afterwards along with the Reapers.

I see what you did there...

[balmyrian]

The Angry One wrote...

Even if that were true, you realise that's no way to end a trilogy right?
Defeating the protagonist and having them essentially give up is one step below "rocks fall everyone dies".

Shepard doesn't give up though, Shepard loses him/herself in the obsessive idea "stop the Reapers". 

It's a way like any other to end a trilogy if it's done right. Clearly in this case it's definitely not done right, and it goes and contribute to a wider pool of problems that make the whole thing very bad.

I'm definitely not saying I enjoyed the stuff, because I sure as hell didn't. But it's definitely not as absurd and stupid and random as people make it out to be. It's just very poorly handled and with no regard whatsoever for player investment.

[Flidget]

Intoxication Theory

[The Angry One]

balmyrian wrote...

Shepard doesn't give up though, Shepard loses him/herself in the obsessive idea "stop the Reapers".

Shepard does not stop the Reapers. Shepard gives up and follows the commands of the Reaper king.

It's a way like any other to end a trilogy if it's done right. Clearly in this case it's definitely not done right, and it goes and contribute to a wider pool of problems that make the whole thing very bad.

Because while you can end certain stories with it, it doesn't fit THIS story, at all.

I'm definitely not saying I enjoyed the stuff, because I sure as hell didn't. But it's definitely not as absurd and stupid and random as people make it out to be. It's just very poorly handled and with no regard whatsoever for player investment.

Unfortunately it is. It is absurd for a character like Shepard who is essentially larger than life, and a story like Mass Effect, which has always been based on hope.

[Ytook]

(a re-post of one of my comments because it's relevant... and I'm lazy)

One of my problems with the catalyst is that this is Shepards nemesis, no matter how it appears or what it says that doesn't change the fact that this is the ultimate evil of the series, this being is the perpetrator of what is most likely the most horrific act of mass genocide possible for any being. It is the force you have fought against for over 100 hours made manifest, if it is the controller (let alone the creator) of the Reapers this being no matter what it is, is the devil incarnate. For Shepard to accept it's reasoning (particularly when it's such self contradictory nonsense, probably wrong by the events in the series itself which no amount of expansion can fix) so silently and passively is utterly ridiculous and will never work.

If I met a being I'd been fighting against for a significant portion of my life, who had planned and caried out the mass murder of countless trillions of beings over millions of years, who had been so deceitful, doing anything to achieve its goal of complete genocide, and it offered me three choices all of which will create effects so utterly preposterous as to be laughable, with the only guarantee being that I, the greatest threat to it, will die and never see the effects it promises, I would sure as hell not do what it said, I'd probably laugh that such a powerful being could try something so utterly pathetic to kill me.