131 réponses à ce sujet

[miracleofsound]

The EMS system is confusing me on both moral and practical levels.

The final choice in the game is presented as a moral choice: What do you believe is the best way forward for organic life?

However, due to a higher EMS unlocking certain options, it seems the game wants to tell you that certain choices are 'better' or 'more rewarding' than others. Why else would you spend all that time building assets? Gamers are trained into an 'effort = reward' mentality - why suddenly rip that away at the last second?

The most confusing part is that the 'worst', or 'least rewarding ending' (destroy & commit genocide) suddenly becomes the 'most rewarding' or 'best' ending when it passes an arbitrary number - (one which I can't get without playing a multiplayer mode, and I despise multiplayer gaming? So after all my grinding on planets I STILL can't get the 'best' ending???) 

How exactly does 'more ships against the Reapers' result in 'Shepard survives the red explosion after stupidly walking into it?'

I just... cannot fathom how this makes any sense. I love Mass Effect more than any other game ever but this just seems to contradict every idea and mechanic the entire series stood for. I want to love this ending. Someone help me to. 

Modifié par miracleofsound, 20 avril 2012 - 11:19 .

[Tietj]

I agree with you (except I find the green ending even more morally reprehensible than the red one). The EMS system is atrocious. And unfair to single player gamers.

[Allan Schumacher]

Based on the differences that can occur with the varying EMS thresholds, it seems that the EMS is more reflective of the ability to engineer and protect the crucible as opposed to directly attack the Reapers.

Note that I didn't fully realize that while playing through the first time either.


I don't feel that any of the choices are necessarily better than the others, just that they may require a better constructed Crucible in order to happen. I picked the Destroy ending even without knowing that Shepard survives, and I don't think that his survival necessarily makes it the best ending either.

[ShatterSh0t]

I feel your pain, im a minute away from posting about the problems with not being able to bring geth / quarian peace in priority rannoch.

[Akranadas]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

Based on the differences that can occur with the varying EMS thresholds, it seems that the EMS is more reflective of the ability to engineer and protect the crucible as opposed to directly attack the Reapers.

Note that I didn't fully realize that while playing through the first time either.


I don't feel that any of the choices are necessarily better than the others, just that they may require a better constructed Crucible in order to happen. I picked the Destroy ending even without knowing that Shepard survives, and I don't think that his survival necessarily makes it the best ending either.

Of course it makes the ending better, it means we can rebuild him... again! 

[DangerousPuddy]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

Based on the differences that can occur with the varying EMS thresholds, it seems that the EMS is more reflective of the ability to engineer and protect the crucible as opposed to directly attack the Reapers.

Note that I didn't fully realize that while playing through the first time either.


I don't feel that any of the choices are necessarily better than the others, just that they may require a better constructed Crucible in order to happen. I picked the Destroy ending even without knowing that Shepard survives, and I don't think that his survival necessarily makes it the best ending either.

Right, but when all you do boils down to a number, and in the end it really doens't matter...

I don't get what EMS has to do with Big Ben being blown up or not, unless as you say Assets are building the crucible to its ultimate blueprint...which seems off, because of the fact that its WAR assets, and those ships and fleets were mainly to help re-take Earth and  make a stand.

[ogj835]

What EMS more or less boils down to is helping you to feel like you, "TOOK BACK EARTH!" Whether it has any other uses like offensive or defensive purposes, it's all just really nullified by the current 3 color varying endings.

[SoldierGryphon]

ShatterSh0t wrote...

I feel your pain, im a minute away from posting about the problems with not being able to bring geth / quarian peace in priority rannoch.

You can. Look it up on youtube.

[TMA LIVE]

My theory is that what Shepard does influences the Catalyst, since based on low assets, it either gives you destroy or control based off the Collector Base choice. Even Anderson's death influences the Catalyst. All because putting the Crucible together, bring everyone together, and the effort Shepard puts into ending the cycle, is all a trial or test. And based off that test, equals the rewards. Which is the choices on the new solution.

Modifié par TMA LIVE, 20 avril 2012 - 11:28 .

[Velocithon]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

Based on the differences that can occur with the varying EMS thresholds, it seems that the EMS is more reflective of the ability to engineer and protect the crucible as opposed to directly attack the Reapers.

Note that I didn't fully realize that while playing through the first time either.


I don't feel that any of the choices are necessarily better than the others, just that they may require a better constructed Crucible in order to happen. I picked the Destroy ending even without knowing that Shepard survives, and I don't think that his survival necessarily makes it the best ending either.

But the problem is how does having a higher EMS, which allows for better construction of the Crucible, somehow allow Shepard to survive in the end? The same explosion happens every time, it isn't like in the "best" ending no explosion happens where you could draw the conclusion that Shepard lives because of this.

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

I tried all the endings. I didn't really think any of them particularly ended well. Even with the gasp of air -- what was your quality of life after that? Were even able to function at all?

The other two? you died. Control? I've written before about it. You play galaxy cop and end up doing the same thing as the AI kid at some point. Synthesis? not great either. Why destroy the relays for this one? What was the point?

[Zix13]

EMS was a giant cop-out by bioware. That is all.

[Iakus]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

Based on the differences that can occur with the varying EMS thresholds, it seems that the EMS is more reflective of the ability to engineer and protect the crucible as opposed to directly attack the Reapers.

Note that I didn't fully realize that while playing through the first time either.


I don't feel that any of the choices are necessarily better than the others, just that they may require a better constructed Crucible in order to happen. I picked the Destroy ending even without knowing that Shepard survives, and I don't think that his survival necessarily makes it the best ending either.

Well, endings are generally considered "better" when the hero gets to live to talk about it.

Operative:  Are you willing to die for those beliefs?
Mal:  I am...
::gunfire erupts::
Mal: ...'Course, that's not exactly "Plan A"

Modifié par iakus, 20 avril 2012 - 11:35 .

[Drake-Shepard]

They should of split EMS up into sections. Crucible construction, fleet strength and ground forces.
So when it came to choosing between the salarians and krogan you had a more tactical decision to make..salarian scientists...or krogan ground forces.

That would be the most obvious thing to do,,,but then having a high or low figure in each section would mean more variations in the cutscenes nearer to the climax and BW couldn't keep up with one EMS Bar.

[sdfgdsfsdfsfs]

I didn't realize I "unlocked" the synthesis ending anyway, because it seemed like a bad choice, and would never pick it. What this means is that my effort was basically wasted, since I ended up picking control, and afaik control is always the same.

Modifié par sdfgdsfsdfsfs, 20 avril 2012 - 11:45 .

[Allan Schumacher]

Velocithon wrote...

But the problem is how does having a higher EMS, which allows for better construction of the Crucible, somehow allow Shepard to survive in the end? The same explosion happens every time, it isn't like in the "best" ending no explosion happens where you could draw the conclusion that Shepard lives because of this.

There is a conversation (I think with Hackett but it's been a while now so it might be with someone else) discussing concerns about how we aren't even sure if the beam will only attack the reapers.  So the idea that the crucible might target more than just the reapers is present.

On top of that, if you look at the lower EMS destroy endings, you'll get some where the buildings are destroyed (but humanity survives... they don't cheer though), as well as one where the soldiers on the battlefield are literally vaporized.  So the differences in the EMS will lead to a pulse that has very different effects on people, buildings, etc..  Presumably with a much higher EMS, Shepard is spared because the pulse doesn't affect him as strongly as he would otherwise.

[mesmerizedish]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

Velocithon wrote...

But the problem is how does having a higher EMS, which allows for better construction of the Crucible, somehow allow Shepard to survive in the end? The same explosion happens every time, it isn't like in the "best" ending no explosion happens where you could draw the conclusion that Shepard lives because of this.

There is a conversation (I think with Hackett but it's been a while now so it might be with someone else) discussing concerns about how we aren't even sure if the beam will only attack the reapers.  So the idea that the crucible might target more than just the reapers is present.

On top of that, if you look at the lower EMS destroy endings, you'll get some where the buildings are destroyed (but humanity survives... they don't cheer though), as well as one where the soldiers on the battlefield are literally vaporized.  So the differences in the EMS will lead to a pulse that has very different effects on people, buildings, etc..  Presumably with a much higher EMS, Shepard is spared because the pulse doesn't affect him as strongly as he would otherwise.

Which raises the question: how in the hell does EMS have that effect on the Crucible? I get it from a gamey-wamey standpoint, but it (along with a lot of the ending) makes absolutely no logical sense.

[Drummernate]

Synthesis FOR THE WIN!

Combining Geth and Organics to make Gethganics?

Yes please.

[Reptilian Rob]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

Based on the DIFFERENCES that can occur with the VARYING EMS thresholds...

Actually when it boils down to it, there are only meaningless numbers. 

You never once see any of your assets participating in any way. 

[Cucobr]

Allan Schumacher wrote... 


Presumably with a much higher EMS, Shepard is spared because the pulse doesn't affect him as strongly as he would otherwise.

or

Space Magic

or

The Catalyst protected him when the Citadel exploded

or

This sequence was the process of indoctrination by Harbinger

or

Shepard managed to survive without armor, entering the earth's atmosphere because he can.

or

The citadel, partially destroyed, protected Shepard when both fell on the earth.

or

Shepard was teleported back to earth by Catalyst

or


(insert your theory here... anything is possible, since the end not has sense anyway.)

Modifié par Cucobr, 21 avril 2012 - 02:44 .

[Allan Schumacher]

ishmaeltheforsaken wrote...

Which raises the question: how in the hell does EMS have that effect on the Crucible? I get it from a gamey-wamey standpoint, but it (along with a lot of the ending) makes absolutely no logical sense.

If you look at your war assets, a lot of them discuss teams that research and build the crucible.


As for the war assets, I was expecting it to be more about the pew pew at the end too, but that isn't the case unfortunately.  Though, it isn't technically illogical because the military strength of the fleet helps protect the crucible during both construction and during deployment.  Whether or not it was what people expected is a different question (and based on the forums, and even my own experiences, it's not really expected).

Actually when it boils down to it, there are only meaningless numbers. 

You never once see any of your assets participating in any way.

I never said otherwise.  But you DO see the effects the Crucible has change, which is what I said.  This effect is directly related to the EMS value.

[Ericus]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

Based on the differences that can occur with the varying EMS thresholds, it seems that the EMS is more reflective of the ability to engineer and protect the crucible as opposed to directly attack the Reapers.

Note that I didn't fully realize that while playing through the first time either.


I don't feel that any of the choices are necessarily better than the others, just that they may require a better constructed Crucible in order to happen. I picked the Destroy ending even without knowing that Shepard survives, and I don't think that his survival necessarily makes it the best ending either.

In order to have the game mechanic relfect a 'better constructed Cruicible', it would have made more sense for Shepard to spend ME3 scouring the galaxy for Crucible components rather than war assets.  Then it would make a lot of sense that the functionality of the Crucible was a direct outcome of the components you were able to collect.

Ultimately the game mechanic is okay, but the way it was implemented doesn't allow for much narrative logic.

[PsyrenY]

Velocithon wrote...

But the problem is how does having a higher EMS, which allows for better construction of the Crucible, somehow allow Shepard to survive in the end? The same explosion happens every time, it isn't like in the "best" ending no explosion happens where you could draw the conclusion that Shepard lives because of this.

Two theories here:

1) Higher EMS = more protection/better construction for the Crucible  = it takes less damage. This would then allow it to either release a more controlled blast, or more accurately target Reapers while sparing other forms of life (including Shepard.)

2) Higher EMS = weaker Reaper forces = less energy output needed from Crucible to destroy the remainder. If the blast from the Crucible doesn't need to be as strong, there will be less collateral damage - no vaporized soldiers, no carbonized planet, and no dead Shep.


I personally prefer the second, but you can even combine the two.

Modifié par Optimystic_X, 21 avril 2012 - 02:55 .

[Cucobr]

Allan Schumacher wrote...


I never said otherwise.  But you DO see the effects the Crucible has change, which is what I said.  This effect is directly related to the EMS value.

you can say it

but

you will have to assume that Indoctrination Theory is true to make sense.

otherwise, Ships fighting in Space changes the power of Catalyst?


> ?????????? <<<<<<<<<

[III_wAR]

They could have tacked on a "shepard lives" scene at the end of synthesis and control endings both of which would require you to play multiplayer to get you're ems high enough. What it all boils down to is EA wants you to play multiplayer and buy spectre packs.

Modifié par III_wAR, 21 avril 2012 - 03:04 .