317 réponses à ce sujet

[clarkusdarkus]

i would have preffered seeing more of samara in her outfit in ME2.

[Gill Kaiser]

grey_wind wrote...

Hypersexuality works if it fits with the character IMO. The problem is, it rarely does in most video games. Samara is a shining example of when it doesn't, while Jack is a great example of when it does.

What? Jack isn't remotely sexualised. Her toplessness is just... there. It's nothing to do with titillation, it's because she doesn't give a ****.

Samara's outfit was rather sexualised, but Samara herself wasn't at all. So yeah, I see your point there.

Modifié par Gill Kaiser, 22 avril 2012 - 10:16 .

[Zuka999]

Is anyone honestly going to complain about sexiness? Get out.

[Dark_Caduceus]

The idea that EDI would get a body was always ridiculous to me. I remember people on this very forum posting about it after ME2 came out and I though "Yeah sure, no offense but Bioware won't include something stupid like that in ME3". Then I got to the Mass Effect 3 endings and realized how wrong I was.

[Sgt Stryker]

Zuka999 wrote...

Is anyone honestly going to complain about sexiness? Get out.

If the "sexiness" undermines the setting and ruins suspension of disbelief? Yes, I'll complain about it.

[Thrazesul]

There's a few things in ME3 that pisses me off as a female gamer, but EDI's body is not one of them. As in fact it hasn't bothered me the slightest because she was seen as a female AI. So yeah, naturally she's gonna get a good looking body to match that fact, like most game characters do.

[Zuka999]

Sgt Stryker wrote...

Zuka999 wrote...

Is anyone honestly going to complain about sexiness? Get out.

If the "sexiness" undermines the setting and ruins suspension of disbelief? Yes, I'll complain about it.

Did it? No.

[Spectre Impersonator]

I'd advise anyone offended by EDI's vag lips to not play the Witcher 2.

[Bill Casey]

[Gill Kaiser]

Sleepdribble wrote...

Geomon19 wrote...

sasasasue wrote...
Though I didn't play with Ashley in ME3, I didn't like her redesign. In ME1 she looked like a normal person, (as did Kaidan). No fancy make up, nothing crazy, just an natural looking girl. However, when we got to ME3, this completely changed.

(Just taken from google.)

Looks the same to me (besides the hair of course).

Ugg. Then you need to pay more attention the the pictures you just posted, my friend. Blind Freddy can see the over-sexualisation of Ashley.

For starters, her eyes appear wider in ME3 (compare the space around the iris) which indicates youth/naivety/innocence and often triggers a protective instinct in males. Her skin has changed in tone from a pale gold colour indicative of an exotic and interesting heritage, to a blander, typically 'white' skin tone which is more mainstream and far less challenging to Bioware's perceived target audience. She wears heavier 'vanity' makeup, which signals her desire to appeal to people on a physical level. And her hair has gone from practical and earthy, to something reminiscent of a night out on the town, or an intimate night in.

Ashley is practically slapping male gamers in the face with her genitals. (OK, that was a little extreme, but I'm leaving it here anyway because it makes me sound crazy self-righteous and this is the BSN, right?)

Ashley has gone from: 'I fiercely protect my family, friends and beliefs' in ME1 and ME2,  to: 'I need help getting up from the floor because, silly me, I got drunk and isn't it hilariously adorable' in ME3.

That's what I reckon.

Except the picture of Ashley from ME3 posted above is from the leaked alpha, and the face in the final product is much, much closer to ME1 Ashley.

In fact, the disparity is so great that it seems to me like they originally tried to remake Ashley's face to be more detailed, but ended up screwing it up so drastically by the time of the leak that they they went back to the original model and just made a few tweaks.

[Zuka999]

I mean, who would build an UGLY robot?

[Sesshomaru47]

I don't care, mostly. I think it shows the mentality of the BioWare designers and what they consider sexy. It's a bit stereotypical I think. But when you have the mind of a 15 year old boy I guess you can't expect too much. Big boobs and close ups of well formed bums...ooooh *snicker* She said boobs!!!
What disappointed me was the amount of times I had to go and speak to EDI when I could have had more in-depth conversations with the crew-mate I hadn't seen or really spoken to for 2 years. But hey who am I to judge. EDI died in both my games I guess, or at least that see through kid said so.

[frostajulie]

Rane7685 wrote...

 


I think what Im trying to ask is did you like EDI getting a body? If yes did you find  the body hypersexualised (it is but I mean in a way that is alienating) and finally am I right in saying that the problem is with hypersexualised personalities as opposed to their appearance/suggestive camera angles (zooming in on breasts etc which they fortunately didnt do  with EDI (although they still did this with Miranda))

Also for this argument can we pretend that cameltoe thing never happened. Id like you to answer this as if that wasnt included if at all possible

EDIT: The high heels thing seems to be a miscommunication on my part I didnt mean EDI herself, its just I see a lot of women in combat roles in games wearing high heels and I find it a bit bizarre. Also when you answer if you dont mind disclosing it could you iidentify your gender just so I get a bit of perspective thanks

Hypersexualizing Miranda fit her storyline because she was genetically altered to be perfect and this includes attractiveness.

I loved that Edi got a body and it really drove home how my Shepard had changed toward AI since ME1.  I do hate heels on warrior women that does not work in any context so I pretend they are not there, I don't really mind hypersexualizing as long as its not in your face all the time, I myself always roll up the most attractive warden or Shepard I can because in the AU my PC is me and she is of course beautiful as well as deadly.  Guys like to look at the goods and as a female gamer I like to play a pC that has goods worth looking at.

[Sgt Stryker]

Zuka999 wrote...

Sgt Stryker wrote...

Zuka999 wrote...

Is anyone honestly going to complain about sexiness? Get out.

If the "sexiness" undermines the setting and ruins suspension of disbelief? Yes, I'll complain about it.

Did it? No.

Then I guess you and I have different opinions on the matter.

[Siansonea]

EDI was hypersexualized, but "in universe", it makes sense, since TIM is a male chauvinist pig and he created Dr. Eva, the Sex Robot. The problem with EDI is that as soon as she gets her sex robot body, she starts mooning over Joker and asking Shepard for advice on how to get him to commit. UGH. It's almost a parody of the 1950s housewife, who only wants to please her man. Regardless of the fact that she is many orders of magnitude more competent and powerful than Joker, she still makes herself smaller to accommodate her man. I don't like it when women in the real world do that, and I don't like it when fictional women do it. Likewise, I hate how Miranda totally loses it if ManShep breaks up with her or never romanced her in the first place, but is A-Okay in a FemShep playthrough. As Mordin would say, "implications unpleasant".

Samara, on the other hand, is visually hypersexualized, but her characterization couldn't be less so. She is an asari, a species with only one gender. Therefore it is less likely that her Justicar outfit is a sexual thing, but more of a cultural thing. Older asari tend to dress rather scandalously by human standards, and it's interesting to note that since humans only arrived on the scene a few decades prior, among the asari themselves dressing in the way that Samara and Benezia do might be considered "old fashioned" more than anything else. Samara's attitude toward Shepard is also noteworthy, in that no amount of cajoling on his/her part can make Samara jump Shepard's bones. You can look, but you can't touch. Samara is her own person and doesn't need a partner to complete her life, she has her mission, her daughters, and the Code. I like that she can't be another notch on Captain Kirk's Hot Alien Babe bedpost.

[Zuka999]

Sgt Stryker wrote...

Zuka999 wrote...

Sgt Stryker wrote...

Zuka999 wrote...

Is anyone honestly going to complain about sexiness? Get out.

If the "sexiness" undermines the setting and ruins suspension of disbelief? Yes, I'll complain about it.

Did it? No.

Then I guess you and I have different opinions on the matter.

Would you have preferred they made her ugly? Who would seriously build an ugly robot? What kind of escapist fiction even has ugly people unless they're bad guys or the joke is that they're ugly? Sorry, its human nature. You'd be complaining about it with the rest of us if people looked realistic, don't even try and kid yourself.

[LukeSkywhacker2]

 I'm not a female gamer. For what it's worth, I'm a male gamer dissatisfied with the hypersexualisation. This does a couple of bad things:

– reduces that specific female's worth or even generally the worth of women in the spectator's eyes—prolong exposure, accepted as a fact without reflection, could probably condition one to some extent to think or feel like that (just getting into one's brain by habit);
– just denigrates women, makes them feel bad, I guess, if they see it (although some women regrettably do have as low self-esteem as to see themselves through the perspective of a sex object);
– warps the vision of sexuality and human relationships: sexuality is part of something bigger, it's not about getting off on visual stimuli even, putting too much emphasis there is actually perverted (not talking about aesthetics, e.g. "what a pretty girl, I could loot at her for hours!" (which aesthetics, e.g. she has a pretty dress and long, flowing locks, smiles nicely etc.), I mean more along the lines of, "I could stare at that ass all day long [and I'll spare you further quotation]"... in fact, I was horribly disappointed when Ash made her "ass" comment to "her captain" before Ilos... she's female herself and my Shep was male but anyway;
– it reinforces the public's idea that nerds are perverts who enjoy getting off on pixels (from actual porn to RPG games with metal bikinis that are supposed to provide the same level of protection as full plate mail).

I really, really wish game developers finally stopped doing that. I want realistic females, including ugly females, I want armour or combat suits that don't make the wearer look like a hooker (and those ridiculous boots, come on...), I'm fed up with oversized breasts and gratuitous cleavage, at least there isn't so much fixation on rear ends, so there is still limit to how disgusting it is.

Sex sells and is mostly cheap in terms of monetary investment, so it may be hard to give up on it, but this is the right thing to do.

Modifié par LukeSkywhacker2, 22 avril 2012 - 10:37 .

[Flidget]

JohnShepard12 wrote...

I'd advise anyone offended by EDI's vag lips to not play the Witcher 2.

In all seriousness, constantly hearing "There's wet boobies in it!" is one of the main reasons I'm hesitant to buy that game.

[Nyila]

The OP was asking female gamers their opinion..

So I'll give mine. I like EDI, she's a useful and reliable part of the crew, giving her a body wasn't necessary but I didn't mind at all. It also somehow felt like a way to give some fans who were requesting Joker as an LI the finger, but that didn't bother me.

The one thing that bothers me about her body is the size of her boobs, it makes no sense. I know she's an infiltration unit, hence the cameltoe on her two alternate outfits, but she could have smaller boobs. I think her robotic body looks good all around, except for the boobs, because it just makes no sense and is thoroughly impractical because it would make the whole platform top heavy.

[Zuka999]

LukeSkywhacker2 wrote...

 I'm not a female gamer. For what it's worth, I'm a male gamer dissatisfied with the hypersexualisation. This does a couple of bad things:

– reduces that specific female's worth or even generally the worth of women in the spectator's eyes—prolong exposure, accepted as a fact without reflection, could probably condition one to some extent to think or feel like that (just getting into one's brain by habit);

Attractive women are worth less than average women? Wow, ok.

– just denigrates women, makes them feel bad, I guess, if they see it (although some women regrettably do have as low self-esteem as to see themselves through the perspective of a sex object);

Being attractive makes someone a sex object? Seriously, you believe this? The implications of this on reality are freaking scary. There are a lot of beautiful women out there.

– warps the vision of sexuality and human relationships: sexuality is part of something bigger, it's not about getting off on visual stimuli even, putting too much emphasis there is actually perverted (not talking about aesthetics, e.g. "what a pretty girl, I could loot at her for hours!", I mean more along the lines of, "I could stare at that ass all day long [and I'll spare you further quotation]"... in fact, I was horribly disappointed when Ash made her "ass" comment to "her captain" before Ilos... she's female herself and my Shep was male but anyway;

How dare beings who reproduce sexually be sexually attracted to other sexually reproductive beings! What are you, a puritan?

– it reinforces the public's idea that nerds are perverts who enjoy getting off on pixels (from actual porn to RPG games with metal bikinis that are supposed to provide the same level of protection as full plate mail).

Oh, please. EVERYONE is perverted. Its in our genes.

Modifié par Zuka999, 22 avril 2012 - 10:39 .

[Sgt Stryker]

Zuka999 wrote...

Sgt Stryker wrote...

Zuka999 wrote...

Sgt Stryker wrote...

Zuka999 wrote...

Is anyone honestly going to complain about sexiness? Get out.

If the "sexiness" undermines the setting and ruins suspension of disbelief? Yes, I'll complain about it.

Did it? No.

Then I guess you and I have different opinions on the matter.

Would you have preferred they made her ugly? Who would seriously build an ugly robot? What kind of escapist fiction even has ugly people unless they're bad guys or the joke is that they're ugly? Sorry, its human nature. You'd be complaining about it with the rest of us if people looked realistic, don't even try and kid yourself.

Sorry, but that is a false dilemma. I'm not asking for Mass Effect's characters to look ugly/unattractive. However, it is possible to design a visually-appealing character with a unique look, without undermining previously established lore (half the ME2 crew) or resorting to unnecessary sexualization. Sexy/attractive and sexualized are two completely different concepts.

[LukeSkywhacker2]

Nyila wrote...

The OP was asking female gamers their opinion..

So I'll give mine. I like EDI, she's a useful and reliable part of the crew, giving her a body wasn't necessary but I didn't mind at all. It also somehow felt like a way to give some fans who were requesting Joker as an LI the finger, but that didn't bother me.

The one thing that bothers me about her body is the size of her boobs, it makes no sense. I know she's an infiltration unit, hence the cameltoe on her two alternate outfits, but she could have smaller boobs. I think her robotic body looks good all around, except for the boobs, because it just makes no sense and is thoroughly impractical because it would make the whole platform top heavy.

Breasts of characters are the cheapest marketing device in the video game industry, I guess. It's like those ludicrous openings in combat armour in the more mediaeval-style games.

[Powerpetzi]

Female. Not bothered by it, except for the cameltoe. That wasn't alienating or misogynetic, though, rather just silly.

[Zuka999]

Sgt Stryker wrote...

Zuka999 wrote...

Sgt Stryker wrote...

Zuka999 wrote...

Sgt Stryker wrote...

Zuka999 wrote...

Is anyone honestly going to complain about sexiness? Get out.

If the "sexiness" undermines the setting and ruins suspension of disbelief? Yes, I'll complain about it.

Did it? No.

Then I guess you and I have different opinions on the matter.

Would you have preferred they made her ugly? Who would seriously build an ugly robot? What kind of escapist fiction even has ugly people unless they're bad guys or the joke is that they're ugly? Sorry, its human nature. You'd be complaining about it with the rest of us if people looked realistic, don't even try and kid yourself.

Sorry, but that is a false dilemma. I'm not asking for Mass Effect's characters to look ugly/unattractive. However, it is possible to design a visually-appealing character with a unique look, without undermining previously established lore (half the ME2 crew) or resorting to unnecessary sexualization. Sexy/attractive and sexualized are two completely different concepts.

You think none of them are unique? EDI stands as an avatar for peacefully unshackled AIs, but I guess showing the humanization of a machine is not enough character development because she also has boobs?

Anyways, how does this undermine the lore? One of the first things we're introduced to is a race of supposedly promiscuous, all female blue aliens who can have sex with anyone from any species. Why didn't you just walk away in disgust at that? But EDI, oh man, EDI crosses the line! How could a robot of all things have an attractive body!

Modifié par Zuka999, 22 avril 2012 - 10:50 .

[Shajar]

Body looks lame. Stupid way to try get young teenager boys for this game