241 réponses à ce sujet

[Tom Lehrer]

KotorEffect3 wrote..


I don't think you are understanding the symbolism of watching the center of a civilization going up in smoke. 

I understand the symbolism but I also understand that Thessia is only one world for a species that has atleast dozens of others and that most of their economic power, industrial capacity, military might, and most of their people do not live there.

Thessia is like the Amerian capital. It can get burned to the ground but everything that is needed to live and fight is some place else. 

[Zardoc]

sistersafetypin wrote...

Zardoc wrote...

sistersafetypin wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

sistersafetypin wrote...
Your reasons for disliking the Asari are either made up,

You know what's made up?
That mating with other species grants the asari more genetic diversity.
You know what's not made up? That any coupling of human/asari is just strenghtening a rival race.
But you actually think that the two aren't connected. Right.

or they are because of traits that are standard in every race.

I did not see every race hiding prothean technology while the galaxy burned. Did you?

Where. Do. You. Get. Your. Facts?

Also, I saw the Salarian Dalatross perfectly willing to watch Earth burn if we didn't help her maintain the Krogen Genocide. Also Batarians? Remember Jack's loyalty mission? Most of the children found their way their by way of Batarian Slavers. Turians? You played Tuchanka right? That massive bomb in the middle of a densely populated Krogen area?

The Asari government did what any other government in their position would have.

You mean they kept prothean technology hidden while creating laws that punish anyone who does the exact same thing harshly? Prothean technology that could have been used to prepare for the Reapers, only way earlier? Technology they weren't willing to share, even when all other races were in desperate need of help? Yes, all races commited all sorts of bad sh*t, it's just that what the asari did is far worse in comparison.

The council created laws. And yes, I do stand by the underlined. The head of governments almost always act in their people's best interest first. Look at the Turians not offering aid until you help solve their problems. Some of you are being naive. Also my comments? Tailored to the person I was going back and forth with. After all, I don't know your reasons. 

The difference between turians and asari of course being that the turian homeworld was under attack by the time you came and asked for help, while the Thessia wasn't. Keeping the beacon hidden wasn't for the best interest of the asari people, especially once the Reapers hit us. 

And guess who created the council in the first place and was pretty much in charge by the time those laws were created.

[sistersafetypin]

MisterJB wrote...

KotorEffect3 wrote...
"rival race" you sound like those guys that where white sheets on their heads and burn crosses

All Nations compete for power. It just so happens that the nations of the ME universe are also the species of the ME universe.
 It's not racism, it's a fact of life.

And yet you hate the Asari for competing 

[Zardoc]

Rolling Flame wrote...

Zardoc wrote...

sistersafetypin wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

sistersafetypin wrote...
Your reasons for disliking the Asari are either made up,

You know what's made up?
That mating with other species grants the asari more genetic diversity.
You know what's not made up? That any coupling of human/asari is just strenghtening a rival race.
But you actually think that the two aren't connected. Right.

or they are because of traits that are standard in every race.

I did not see every race hiding prothean technology while the galaxy burned. Did you?

Where. Do. You. Get. Your. Facts?

Also, I saw the Salarian Dalatross perfectly willing to watch Earth burn if we didn't help her maintain the Krogen Genocide. Also Batarians? Remember Jack's loyalty mission? Most of the children found their way their by way of Batarian Slavers. Turians? You played Tuchanka right? That massive bomb in the middle of a densely populated Krogen area?

The Asari government did what any other government in their position would have.

You mean they kept prothean technology hidden while creating laws that punish anyone who does the exact same thing harshly? Prothean technology that could have been used to prepare for the Reapers, only way earlier? Technology they weren't willing to share, even when all other races were in desperate need of help? Yes, all races commited all sorts of bad sh*t, it's just that what the asari did is far worse in comparison.

Except everyone who knew about the Reapers stuck fingers in ears and denied their existence until it was too late. Even if the asari had shared the beacon, it wouldn't have helped much. 

I mean before that. Before the whole Saren debacle. The asari had that beacon for millenia.

[mauro2222]

I like it, you screwed things? doesn't matter, others made the same mistakes, so... you're excused.
Oh! Others didn't do the same thing? well, probably they would have done given the time, so... you're excused again!

[Akranadas]

There is a conversation in the Human embassy on the citadel between a Human Soldier and an Asari information clerk about the Human's daughter who is an Asari. She goes through the pains to explain that she can under no condition go back to her Human parents due to the apparent social stigma that exists around Humans mating with other species (30 years is a short time to developer tolerance to other lifeforms) and effectively begs the Asari clerk to make sure she goes to her Asari Partners family.

[sistersafetypin]

Zardoc wrote...



The difference between turians and asari of course being that the turian homeworld was under attack by the time you came and asked for help, while the Thessia wasn't. Keeping the beacon hidden wasn't for the best interest of the asari people, especially once the Reapers hit us. 

And guess who created the council in the first place and was pretty much in charge by the time those laws were created.

But it was. The council states that ALL of their homeworlds were facing similar situations. The only difference being that it was not as bad as Earth was yet.

Also, France & Germany masterminded the creation of the European Union. And yet, they don't get final say on anything. I'm pretty sure the Asari don't have final say.

And once again I say, any race in a similar position would have reacted the same. The Asari created the council because they were the first to reach the Citadel. And instead of instantly subjegating everyone, they create the Council.  Sharing the Citadel and it's power with all that can find it.

However, you're surprised they didn't instantly share all their knowledge with every new race that managed Space flight?  Lastly, without access to the VI inside of the Beacon there's no way they could have known it held information about the Crucible. 

Modifié par sistersafetypin, 23 avril 2012 - 04:56 .

[mauro2222]

Akranadas wrote...

There is a conversation in the Human embassy on the citadel between a Human Soldier and an Asari information clerk about the Human's daughter who is an Asari. She goes through the pains to explain that she can under no condition go back to her Human parents due to the apparent social stigma that exists around Humans mating with other species (30 years is a short time for intolerant and hateful idiots to die) and effectively begs the Asari clerk to make sure she goes to her Asari Partners family.

Fixed.

Edit: more classy

Modifié par mauro2222, 23 avril 2012 - 04:59 .

[MisterJB]

sistersafetypin wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

KotorEffect3 wrote...
"rival race" you sound like those guys that where white sheets on their heads and burn crosses

All Nations compete for power. It just so happens that the nations of the ME universe are also the species of the ME universe.
 It's not racism, it's a fact of life.

And yet you hate the Asari for competing 

One thing is competing. Another completely different is rigging the game.
Also, I wonder what you'd say if humanity hoarded Thanix Cannons all for themselves rather than share with other species despite the fact we are all in this war together.

[Eugenious]

i wish i was an asari........*shifty eyes*

[Peranor]

 Seems like people has their mind set on hating everyone and everything these days.

[sistersafetypin]

MisterJB wrote...

sistersafetypin wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

KotorEffect3 wrote...
"rival race" you sound like those guys that where white sheets on their heads and burn crosses

All Nations compete for power. It just so happens that the nations of the ME universe are also the species of the ME universe.
 It's not racism, it's a fact of life.

And yet you hate the Asari for competing 

One thing is competing. Another completely different is rigging the game.
Also, I wonder what you'd say if humanity hoarded Thanix Cannons all for themselves rather than share with other species despite the fact we are all in this war together.

Thannix Cannons come from Turians. And I fully expect the Humans would have hoarded something if they had it to hoard. Sucks being late to the party.

[JesseLee202]

anorling wrote...

 Seems like people has their mind set on hating everyone and everything these days.

I know, can't we all just get along?

[MisterJB]

sistersafetypin wrote...
And once again I say, any race in a similar position would have reacted the same. The Asari created the council because they were the first to reach the Citadel. And instead of instantly subjegating everyone, they create the Council.  Sharing the Citadel and it's power with all that can find it.

First of all, the Council subjugates those they consider to be "lesser species". Or do they have any say in their decisions?
Second, the only reason there is a Council is because the asari did not feel confident in a war against the salarians.

However, you're surprised they didn't instantly share all their knowledge with every new race that managed Space flight?  Lastly, without access to the VI inside of the Beacon there's no way they could have known it held information about the Crucible. 

They knew it was prothean and that the Crucible was of prothean origin. That is all it should have taken for them to reveal their secret immediatelly.
Instead, the asari chose until the very last moment and to do it in secret still. Selfish cowards.

[JKuz]

All Nations compete for power. It just so happens that the nations of the ME universe are also the species of the ME universe.
 It's not racism, it's a fact of life.

What the Heck Guy. That line of thinking was supposed to have died in the ashes of Berlin and Nagasaki seventy years ago. That thinking is directly responsible for First and Second world wars and all the fallout that we are still dealing with today.

Social Darwinism DOES. NOT. WORK. We have proven this. This is science, it was tried, and the last proponents of this that I can think of off hand are the bizzare Crytpo Commu-Fascists that live in North Korea and the darkest Ids of the first world.
Modern Realpolitik also DOES. NOT. WORK. It is a short term solution to long term problems. Militant Islam, Afganistan, the troubles of the Middle East and Latin America are all direct blowback from this type of thinking being applied in the real world. And Each and Every time that it has been tried, it has been a long term failiure

[MisterJB]

sistersafetypin wrote...
Thannix Cannons come from Turians. And I fully expect the Humans would have hoarded something if they had it to hoard. Sucks being late to the party.

Really? Let's see...Medigel is of human creation. Wait, we sell that.
Stealth Drives are also of human creation but other species now have them too.
And then there was that Prothean Beacon we found on Eden Prime and we actually offered to share it with the Council.
Right, nothing at all we could have kept for ourselves.

[MisterJB]

ryuasiu wrote...
6) No, we did not get out of sanctions completely. We got less severe sanctions after talking to the council. The first option the council wanted was COMPELTE over site and even wanted to view all files in the fleet. We were able to get it knocked down so only research stations and the like had to be monitored. But as I said earlier, even if they lifted by the time ME1 happens then it still made people think twice of hiding the beacon. If we were willing to hide AI research then I am sure we would hide a beacan also. We either gave it up becuase we would be cought or as you said to ease relations of the incident

Not true. Reread that part.
Humanity suffered monetary fees but our ambassor absolutely refused to accept foreign investigators on human bases. It was awesome!

[Zardoc]

sistersafetypin wrote...

Zardoc wrote...



The difference between turians and asari of course being that the turian homeworld was under attack by the time you came and asked for help, while the Thessia wasn't. Keeping the beacon hidden wasn't for the best interest of the asari people, especially once the Reapers hit us. 

And guess who created the council in the first place and was pretty much in charge by the time those laws were created.

But it was. The council states that ALL of their homeworlds were facing similar situations. The only difference being that it was not as bad as Earth was yet.

Also, France & Germany masterminded the creation of the European Union. And yet, they don't get final say on anything. I'm pretty sure the Asari don't have final say.

And once again I say, any race in a similar position would have reacted the same. The Asari created the council because they were the first to reach the Citadel. And instead of instantly subjegating everyone, they create the Council.  Sharing the Citadel and it's power with all that can find it.

However, you're surprised they didn't instantly share all their knowledge with every new race that managed Space flight?  Lastly, without access to the VI inside of the Beacon there's no way they could have known it held information about the Crucible. 

Oh, so that's why I never saw even the hint of a Reaper on Sur'kesh or anywhere near it. Fact in the matter is, the only two homeworlds directly involved in the fighting at the time were Earth and Palaven. There was nobody on Sur'kesh, and I'm pretty sure there was nobody Thessia either, seeing how the turians were barely holding out against the Reapers, and their military is alteast 10 times stronger and more capable than anything the asari have.

And the EU is a bit of a bad example here. The asari found the Citadel first, established their power there, 60 years later the salarians arrived and the council was founded. It is very likely that the asari were more dominant, seeing how they came first, and pushed the idea of creating the laws around withholding prothean artifacts.

And whether or not they knew if the Beacon was important to the Crucible is irrelevant in the end. It was prothean, there was a high chance it contained something of use in this fight. But they still only shared this secret with Shepard when their homeworld was on the fritz.

[Zardoc]

JKuz wrote...

All Nations compete for power. It just so happens that the nations of the ME universe are also the species of the ME universe.
 It's not racism, it's a fact of life.

What the Heck Guy. That line of thinking was supposed to have died in the ashes of Berlin and Nagasaki seventy years ago. That thinking is directly responsible for First and Second world wars and all the fallout that we are still dealing with today.

Social Darwinism DOES. NOT. WORK. We have proven this. This is science, it was tried, and the last proponents of this that I can think of off hand are the bizzare Crytpo Commu-Fascists that live in North Korea and the darkest Ids of the first world.
Modern Realpolitik also DOES. NOT. WORK. It is a short term solution to long term problems. Militant Islam, Afganistan, the troubles of the Middle East and Latin America are all direct blowback from this type of thinking being applied in the real world. And Each and Every time that it has been tried, it has been a long term failiure

All Nations compete for power. This is an indisputable fact, and there is nothing we can do about it.

Modifié par Zardoc, 23 avril 2012 - 05:12 .

[sistersafetypin]

MisterJB wrote...

sistersafetypin wrote...
And once again I say, any race in a similar position would have reacted the same. The Asari created the council because they were the first to reach the Citadel. And instead of instantly subjegating everyone, they create the Council.  Sharing the Citadel and it's power with all that can find it.

First of all, the Council subjugates those they consider to be "lesser species". Or do they have any say in their decisions?
Second, the only reason there is a Council is because the asari did not feel confident in a war against the salarians.

However, you're surprised they didn't instantly share all their knowledge with every new race that managed Space flight?  Lastly, without access to the VI inside of the Beacon there's no way they could have known it held information about the Crucible. 

They knew it was prothean and that the Crucible was of prothean origin. That is all it should have taken for them to reveal their secret immediatelly.
Instead, the asari chose until the very last moment and to do it in secret still. Selfish cowards.

lol. Ok. You don't operate in the real world. That's fine. I hope it's nice where you are though.

That was mean. What I meant was, enjoy your double standards. "Asari are selfish cause they didn't share all they knew! Damn them!!!"

"All nations compete, it's what they do! Duh! lolwut?"

Modifié par sistersafetypin, 23 avril 2012 - 05:18 .

[mauro2222]

Zardoc wrote...

All Nations compete for power. This is an indisputable fact, and there is nothing we can do about it.

I disagree, that thinking is the problem, like always.

[MakeMineMako]

What I would like to know is how the Prothean beacon was kept secret for so long. The Asari have no strong central governing authority (they run things by consensus and open policy debates, with the public participating) and no central military authority. Sure, the Matriarchs have a lot of clout. But they don't rule absolutely.

Before the loose-knit global legislature, they were divided into what amounted to autonomous city-states rather than true nation-states like exists on Earth. They traded openly and shared ideas. That culture of sharing, openess, and understanding is still strong today amongst the Asari. Hell, when the Council was formed, this Asari cultural mindset was probably part of why the Salarian Union sold out the ultra-secretive League of One to appease the Asari.

A Prothean beacon being kept hidden from allies (and their own people) for so long, to maintain a strategic advantage, goes against what we know about Asari cultural values and their loose knit political structure. The more open a society is, the harder it is to keep secrets of a huge magnitude.  

[MisterJB]

sistersafetypin wrote...
lol. Ok. You don't operate in the real world. That's fine. I hope it's nice where you are though

Do you actually have anything constructive to say or are you just going to pretend you do?

[Shock n Awe]

I don't really have anything against them, but as has been said they don't really seem invested into the war effort until bad things begin happening to the Asari. A lot of the other species see their own kind being killed/transformed into husks and don't say much of it, but when it begins happening to the Asari all of a sudden it's an absolute atrocity and they can't believe that it's happening to them, because they're grand and should be immune to it.

[sistersafetypin]

MisterJB wrote...

sistersafetypin wrote...
Thannix Cannons come from Turians. And I fully expect the Humans would have hoarded something if they had it to hoard. Sucks being late to the party.

Really? Let's see...Medigel is of human creation. Wait, we sell that.
Stealth Drives are also of human creation but other species now have them too.
And then there was that Prothean Beacon we found on Eden Prime and we actually offered to share it with the Council.
Right, nothing at all we could have kept for ourselves.

Wow, humans are awesome. We should have just killed the Reapers with that!

Our awesome.

[in other words, I can't take you seriously. When I was asking you to back up your outlandish claims I never get a fact from you.]

Speaking of facts.... Medigel is of human creation? I don't recall hearing this... Source? [For the stealth drives as well.]

Also, medigel & stealth drives [if you are telling the truth, which is iffy] not the kind of thing a government keeps on the dl. However a big shiny that they think came from their Goddess?

That's something

MisterJB wrote...

Do you actually have anything constructive to say or are you just going to pretend you do?

 

Please refer to the above. And as far as I'm concerned... What's the point of attempting to further this discussion when you apply double standards everywhere and make up facts when you're not doing that?

Do you have anything of value that didn't originate in headcannon?

Modifié par sistersafetypin, 23 avril 2012 - 05:26 .