156 réponses à ce sujet

[cronshaw]

I think this is just a bad player problem. Bad players get tunnel vision w/ whatever skill a class is "good" at: Krogans try to melee everything and die; infiltrators spend so much time in scope the get flanked and die; vanguards charge everything and die. Good players know that there is more than one way to skin a banshee

Modifié par modok8, 23 avril 2012 - 03:40 .

[vivanto]

methodshaolin wrote...
seriously u mean they don't use weapons much ?

Hey! I always use a weapon on my kroguard, what you think I've got that big-ass blade on that shotgun for dammit?!

[Serkevan]

Fortack wrote...

Serkevan wrote...

The stagger provided by an area charge is enough to let you follow-up with a backhand to finish any non boss enemy, even on gold. Turn back and shoot, repeat charge.

The Kroguard cannot one-shot-melee anything with a shield - which is like 80-90% of the dudes you face on Gold.

Charge, heavy melee with shotgun blade, and you have a dead rocket trooper there. At most, you need an extra shotgun blast to the face for, say, a pyro. That is with the 25% extra melee damage from charge, of course.

[PrimeMN]

I have to say, if not to charge/melee/charge, what other purpose is there for the Kroguard?

It's amazingly effective. With the Disciple, you get 200% power cooldown.

It's also an incredible amount of fun. I haven't taken it on a Gold run, but even on silver, it's amazingly effective. I often times on data upload objectives take him slightly outside the area, draw enemies to me, and just charge/melee/shotgun and repeat. With 1600 shields, 1600 health and barrier, you can soak damage and let your other 3 complete the upload.

I consider myself a 'good' Vanguard, in that I'm not running around by myself unless on pure accident, stand guard over those doing objectives and absorb damage, revive as often as possible.

But really, the point of this character is to absorb and deal damage and kill stuff.

Right?

[CNevarezN]

modok8 wrote...

I think this is just a bad player problem. Bad players get tunnel vision w/ whatever skill a class is "good" at: Krogans try to melee everything and die; infiltrators spend so much time in scope the get flanked and die; vanguards charge everything and die. Good players know that there is more than one way to skin a banshee

**** yeah x10.

[Serkevan]

PrimeMN wrote...

I have to say, if not to charge/melee/charge, what other purpose is there for the Kroguard?

It's amazingly effective. With the Disciple, you get 200% power cooldown.

It's also an incredible amount of fun. I haven't taken it on a Gold run, but even on silver, it's amazingly effective. I often times on data upload objectives take him slightly outside the area, draw enemies to me, and just charge/melee/shotgun and repeat. With 1600 shields, 1600 health and barrier, you can soak damage and let your other 3 complete the upload.

I consider myself a 'good' Vanguard, in that I'm not running around by myself unless on pure accident, stand guard over those doing objectives and absorb damage, revive as often as possible.

But really, the point of this character is to absorb and deal damage and kill stuff.

Right?

Katana X also gives 200% if you take the weight perks, so I'm pretty sure wraith and eviscerator give it too. And Geth just can't kill you...

[Shampoohorn]

xX 7heGuy Xx wrote...

Well you can build the Krogaurd to be a heavy gunner and that works great too, but most choose the charge smash route. Idk either one i normally follow and melee with them with my Krogan soldier. What i don't like is Krogaurds with just a pistol or smg.......i mean your a krogan.....grow a pair.

Talon + stunner.  Blood on the streets, tears in the bathroom.

[xX 7heGuy Xx]

Shampoohorn wrote...

xX 7heGuy Xx wrote...

Well you can build the Krogaurd to be a heavy gunner and that works great too, but most choose the charge smash route. Idk either one i normally follow and melee with them with my Krogan soldier. What i don't like is Krogaurds with just a pistol or smg.......i mean your a krogan.....grow a pair.

Talon + stunner.  Blood on the streets, tears in the bathroom.

Oh the talon is a nasty little shotty pistol that i really really like, but your a krogan. Just saying

[Titus Thongger]

Good Kroguards shouldnt be dying on Silver

[PrimeMN]

Serkevan wrote...



.... And Geth just can't kill you...

This.

Kroguard is nearly invincible against the Geth, at least on Silver level. With charge refreshing your shields, you can go toe to toe with Primes, often against two.

I discovered this quite by accident. We were in Firebase Glacier, and had a hack objective down by the landing pad.  Saw a Prime coming up from the small lower level area and let team know 'I'm going to go draw this from here.'

Whoops. THere were 2 primes and 3 Pyros all in the same area.

But here I found myself NOT DYING. Instead, they all tried to kill me, but with charge redoing shields, they couldn't.

When I was joined (from the circle) by an Engineer chain overloading, they had no chance.

And it was FUN. We got to the end and I just said 'Holy sh*t'.

So now, when 2 primes appear in the later rounds on Silver, yes, I take them on.

[Joe1962]

I love playing on Bronze with my Human Sentinel, specked to be a poor man's Adept, and getting into games with Krogans.

I was in a game with 2 Krogan Vanguards yesterday and it was awesome to see.

[Serkevan]

Exactly, to my surprise I found that a Prime's refire rate is slower than my charge CD, they just don't fire! And you can melee stagger them lol. Works on gold too, but there Pyros will melt you...

[tvih]

You know, if I'd go in an area with 2 primes and 3 pyros (meaning all three are relatively close and visible at the same time) in Silver, I'd die. While the Kroguard can take a fair deal of punishment (even with Rage being broken) that's just way too much. Three pyros will rape your 1600 shields in seconds. Add in the primes, and your Charge simply won't be off cooldown often enough so that one can survive solo.

[InfamousResult]

Serkevan wrote...

Exactly, to my surprise I found that a Prime's refire rate is slower than my charge CD, they just don't fire! And you can melee stagger them lol. Works on gold too, but there Pyros will melt you...

The problem I see on Gold is that the Kroguards keep targeting the Prime, when what they should be doing is staggering / killing the Pyros first. The Krogan's charge and heavy melee can put a group of Pyros into a consistent stunlock cycle, and the heavy melee lets the Krogan absorb more damage per second- although it SHOULD be used in conjunction with shotgun blasts, not just as a lone weapon, so you can use your Biotic Charge immediately when cooldown is finished.

Always remember: Little guys first, big guys last. Always.

An additional note, I forgot to mention, is spacial awareness. If you're fighting Pyros and Primes at the same time, put the Pyros between you and the Prime. You don't want the Prime at your back / next to you, because their melee will rip away your shields instantly. Their shots, while powerful, are still slow and can be absorbed by your heavy melee animation cycle, but the Prime's melee can open you up to a whole world of hurt. So, even if it takes a second of repositioning, you want to put the Pyros between you.

Modifié par InfamousResult, 23 avril 2012 - 04:29 .

[Faelyia]

Like pretty much any build, in the hands of a good player the Murdertrain as it has been affectionately nicknamed on reddit can be devastating. I've used it to great success on silver, but I'll admit I haven't tried in on gold yet.

It's far more sturdy and a bit more forgiving if you overextend yourself than the other vanguards. Having as close to a +200% recharge times works wonders, especially when grouped with a drell adept or asari justicar with the AoE reave.

[eye basher]

Stardusk wrote...

Based on public game observations, this is the trend. Is it instinct? or something else?

No the kroguards purpose is to try and melee a brute from the front so they can get grabed lifteed in the air and smashed in the ground like an egg that one is always fun to watch.

[Count Dante]

Agreed with the above, Primes are no issue at all. Pyros arent either as the charge and heavy melee will stop the stream of fire. Headbutt might stagger, but I never have tried it.

Where the Krogan vanguard is weak in my opinion is Atlas (not too bad if you keep circling) and Banshee. I dont feel like I can do enough damage to these two so I tend to just ignore them and keep killing the trash mobs so the rest of the team can work on these. Once the Atlas is aggro on someone else, you can easily ping-pong the aggro to dish out good damage. The Banshee, there just isnt a good way for the KV to issue out damage shot of a few shottie shots.

Brutes are pretty easy to avoid insta-kill and Phantoms, unless you get jumped, can be killed with charge (staggers), heavy melee (stagger), charge, shottie blast if needed. At least that is my pattern for em.

I run my KV with Martial Artist (Since the 15% decrease to shield regen is not needed) and the rest in pure survivial mode. It makes the melee worthwhile without losing any defense.

There is no other race/class that I have played that can survive as long and clear up "oh s**t" moments as well as KV. Just yesterday had 2 primes and 3 pyros that wiped the rest of team in Gold and I was able to live long enough to rez all three and keep them busy long enough for the team to recover and help out. (Not epeening, just giving an idea of what the KV can do). Bronze and Silver are pretty much a joke for the class and many times I will hold back so I am not the selfish a-hole.

If the vanguard, ANY vanguard is foresaking his team and charging across the map with reckless abandon, it is the player, not the class. He deserves to die and I wouldnt rez him. By the same token, I have centainly make poor choices in charging and if I die in a stupid charge? It is MY job to rez myself and get myself out of the position.

[Count Dante]

[quote]Serkevan wrote...

Exactly, to my surprise I found that a Prime's refire rate is slower than my charge CD, they just don't fire! And you can melee stagger them lol. Works on gold too, but there Pyros will melt you...[/quote]

The problem I see on Gold is that the Kroguards keep targeting the Prime, when what they should be doing is staggering / killing the Pyros first. The Krogan's charge and heavy melee can put a group of Pyros into a consistent stunlock cycle, and the heavy melee lets the Krogan absorb more damage per second- although it SHOULD be used in conjunction with shotgun blasts, not just as a lone weapon, so you can use your Biotic Charge immediately when cooldown is finished.

Always remember: Little guys first, big guys last. Always.

[/quote]

QFT

[Lenimph]

Well I do mostly melee but that's only because I got my battle master on me first pack (saved up for a resurgence) so I don't have any other shotguns other then the Katana but mostly so I can start rage and try to keep it going.  I find that the only things that you really shouldnt charge is Banshees... the other instakill enemies have melee attacks are are easier to avoid.

Modifié par Lenimph, 23 avril 2012 - 04:41 .

[mrcanada]

Amazingly effective and practically unkillable until that first charge misfire after I hammer the triangle button 10 times and nothing happens. I love my Kroguard, but I still find Vanguards so random when I'm not the host that I don't like using them. I don't mean to sound egotistical, but anytime I have died with my Vanguards, it's due to charge not firing, that is it. This has to be fixed.

Even with 1400/1400 health and shields, you will still go down from two Pyros sizzling you and your charge not firing.

[AreleX]

the krogan vanguard is the only true tank in the game

note: rage is bugged on krogan vanguard and does not give bonuses properly

i have headbutted banshees to death on gold

KNEEL BEFORE YOUR MASTER, BSN

[Lenimph]

AreleX wrote...

the krogan vanguard is the only true tank in the game

note: rage is bugged on krogan vanguard and does not give bonuses properly

i have headbutted banshees to death on gold

KNEEL BEFORE YOUR MASTER, BSN

Bugged? It was working for me lastnight.  Or atleast the bonus damage perk isn't broken....

Modifié par Lenimph, 23 avril 2012 - 04:49 .

[InfamousResult]

mrcanada wrote...

Amazingly effective and practically unkillable until that first charge misfire after I hammer the triangle button 10 times and nothing happens. I love my Kroguard, but I still find Vanguards so random when I'm not the host that I don't like using them. I don't mean to sound egotistical, but anytime I have died with my Vanguards, it's due to charge not firing, that is it. This has to be fixed.

Even with 1400/1400 health and shields, you will still go down from two Pyros sizzling you and your charge not firing.

This is an unfortunate problem that you can POSSIBLY face- even when you are the Host. I always Host games when I'm playing Kroguard, and still, sometimes the Charge just doesn't fire. I will hit the button three, five times, and it just won't go. Sometimes it's fixed if you fire your gun and THEN try to charge, but it's an unfortunate glitch that can make or break your game.

Before anybody says "well don't play Vanguard then", I should point out this EXACT problem has happened on other classes- namely, my Salarian Infiltrator, who sometimes chooses simply not to cloak when I want him to. It just seems to be a game-wide problem of powers not activating when you press the button.

[Count Dante]

On Gold,

I never attempt to melee: Banshee

I occassionally melee: Atlas, Brute, Phantom if I can get a few in safely, never more then one heavy without movement. With Phantom it is just a part of the "chain" and I have never been insta-killed unless I am jumped and never saw it.

I always melee: Primes and Ravagers, and everything else.

My basic go to chain: Charge, (charge up heavy melee during charge and aim it), Heavy Melee, Shottie blast or run away/circle, rinse repeat. I build with weapon dmg + after charge and Martial Artist to increase melee dmg after heavy for 30 sec. This way I have all the bases covered. I use GPS, Graal, Disciple, Carnie, or GSub depending on the rest of the team make up.

[Stardusk]

I have been having great success with a chargeless krogan, damage from weapons and powers mostly.