45 réponses à ce sujet

[brushyourteeth]

Maybe I'm the only person that is or has ever been bothered by this, but did anyone else feel like some of the visual changes that were made during DAII deserved some kind of explanation?

I'm not talking about the way the elves look or how genlocks move on four legs now -- there are some things that we'll have to just pretend weren't changed if we want to feel some kind of continuity. I'm talking about things that could have easily been explained, but weren't. And I think DAIII would be a great time to fix them.

Some examples:
DA:O Templar Armor                         DA:O Chantry Robes      
http://t2.gstatic.co...Hk8VZCMnQzbkXn0
 
    DAII Templar Armor                       DAII Chantry Robes
http://t3.gstatic.co...hDeql9zrTlMt1pE

Both designs look amazing, but did anyone else find it weird when you entered Kirkwall and the Chantry folk were wearing completely new duds? The whole thing could have been explained by one of the Hawkes saying something like "You don't look like any Templar/Sister I've ever met." But we didn't get that.

What I'd like to see is this: the old Chantry outfits making a reappearance when we visit Fereldan in DAIII. Maybe each country has their own Chantry apparel. Maybe Fereldan is behind the times, with the exception of Wesley who shouldn't have gotten new Free Marches-grade templar armor during the Blight without an explanation. I tend to ignore Wesley anyway, but I'd still like to see this explained.

Also this:

              Kossith in Da:O                                                        Kossith in DAII
http://t3.gstatic.co...NAiA              http://t0.gstatic.co...Nodwhn9L4GAZaLz

Okay, I realize that the team probably always intended the Kossith to have horns, and there were some problems with programming and whatnot. I've read on the forums that the team explained this by saying that sometimes a kossith is born without horns, and within the Qun that means they're destined for greatness and given a good position (like a Sten of the Beresaad).

Perfect. Awesome. Why, then, do we never see any other Kossith without horns in DAII, especially when the Arishok had the biggest horns of all?
Please, devs - give me one other hornless kossith in DAIII. My brain would love some resolution on this.

One last thing:

Blood magic
http://t3.gstatic.co...JsBWQbAPvUMn-oA

This is kind of an implied visual, but I still think it's notable.
In DA:O we had to actually learn blood magic from a demon (unless we bought a tome, which.. whatever).
In DAII we picked up blood magic where, exactly? We can just kind of unlock it whenever we want to, but according to DA canon blood magic is learned from demons. Was Hawke always a blood mage? If so, I feel like that's important information I would have liked to have about the character.  We could maybe have learned it from someone like Merrill or from a book, but if so I feel like it would be an improvement to show us. Spirit healers are born, but blood mages are made. I'd like to see that in DAIII.

I realize a lot of you will think this wasn't a big deal, and you're right -- it's easily gotten past and ignored. But I think there's something to be said for a series that makes a smooth transition visually instead of a choppy one without explanation.

Especially when the explanation (in all three of these cases) could so easily provide a chance  to explain more about Thedas and the cultures within it.

I'd love to hear your thoughts and ideas.

Modifié par brushyourteeth, 23 avril 2012 - 04:34 .

[the_one_54321]

I think that the body proportions in DAII were significantly better all across the board. That said, retcons are always bad. This applies to a number things that "had their art style changed."

As for the specific examples you've posted pics for, the only one that looks significantly worse is the blood magic. The Qunarri look cooler, but since it's a retcon nothing more need be said about that.

Modifié par the_one_54321, 23 avril 2012 - 04:49 .

[MichaelStuart]

I think it was just a retcon

I believe they changed the kossith and elves to make them less giant/small humans.
I think I read Sten was a special kossith, so I think the others in Dragon Age Origins are too.
I think they changed the armor and robes because they fought it looked better (I agree)
I cant think of any good reason why you just learn blood magic other than ran out of time to make a quest.

[Maria Caliban]

Don't waste player time explaining meta-details. It's a retcon when it comes to the elves and kossith, and likely regional differences when it comes to the chantry and templar vestments.

[brushyourteeth]

Maria Caliban wrote...

Don't waste player time explaining meta-details. It's a retcon when it comes to the elves and kossith, and likely regional differences when it comes to the chantry and templar vestments.

I completely agree with that.

What I'm advocating is that they keep the regional differences when it comes to the chantry and templar vestments. I think it's a nice touch, and it smooths out the choppy transition.

I also wouldn't consider it a waste of time to find out more about these special non-horned kossith and where they stand in Qunari society. Even just a codex entry would suffice.

[coles4971]

the_one_54321 wrote...

I think that the body proportions in DAII were significantly better all across the board. That said, retcons are always bad. This applies to a number things that "had their art style changed."

As for the specific examples you've posted pics for, the only one that looks significantly worse is the blood magic. The Qunarri look cooler, but since it's a retcon nothing more need be said about that.

lol, stick thin elves and all the women having massive racks? yeah, some pretty awesome body proportions there.

if the templar/chantry outfits are down to regional differences though, i'm kinda hoping we see some different outfits again in DA3.

[the_one_54321]

coles4971 wrote...
lol, stick thin elves and all the women having massive racks? yeah, some pretty awesome body proportions there.

Arms, hands, feet, and shoulders. Elves don't looke like slightly thinner humans. And all women having big racks is meaningless to me.

[brushyourteeth]

I knew this thread was doomed to get off-topic.

I'm not talking about all the retcon in general. I'm talking about retcon that can be explained and integrated into the lore for DAIII.

In other words, I guess I'm against anything being "just retcon." Developers should shy away from making changes without explaining them.

Some of them: like muscular kossith (which I like), new elves (which I tolerate), and visual brands on the Tranquil (which I wish they'd have shown from the beginning or hadn't shown at all) are really more like visual upgrades than actual changes, and require no explanation/integration.

But I think the ones I listed above could use one.
It could make the story richer.

[MarauderESP]

well the problem i really had with the retcons was the mangirafedogs and the darkspawn

uhh....

http://t0.gstatic.co...IqK8ZFMwsxgWBSO

[the_one_54321]

brushyourteeth wrote...
I knew this thread was doomed to get off-topic.

I'm not talking about all the retcon in general.

But the artistic retcon is kind of central to the topic of visual changes.

[brushyourteeth]

Avejajed wrote...

lol, stick thin elves and all the women having massive racks? yeah, some pretty awesome body proportions there.

It's a video game fantasy created by men for men. I know I'm generalizing, but as a woman, I'm okay with that. There's MUCH more gender equality in Bioware games than in most games. I'm just  happy this is one of the few games that even allow me to play as a woman. And they portray their women as strong and independent. I'll take it, massive racks and all.

Well as long as we're talking about it, I thought Merrill had the weirdest boobs ever.
True story. First thing I noticed. They sit too low and stick out to the sides too much.

LOOK ---> 

Better boobs for Merrill if she makes an appearance in DAIII, please.

Modifié par brushyourteeth, 23 avril 2012 - 05:53 .

[brushyourteeth]

the_one_54321 wrote...

brushyourteeth wrote...
I knew this thread was doomed to get off-topic.

I'm not talking about all the retcon in general.

But the artistic retcon is kind of central to the topic of visual changes.

I'm ok with us talking about that, as long as I know you know that wasn't what I was actually getting at.

[the_one_54321]

I know what real boobs look like...

[coles4971]

Avejajed wrote...

Haha. I don't mind the huge boobs, but they don't look very...um..perky. If you know what I mean. Going every which way. But it's not a DA2 issue, it's a DA issue in general. Like poor Leliana. Hehe. But it's not a gamebreaker. I just hate that these poor little boys playing this game think that's how boobs really are.

I cringed.

Thanks for reminding me of how much I disliked the Origins sex scenes 

[the_one_54321]

All real boobs look like this, right?

[TEWR]

brushyourteeth wrote...

Perfect. Awesome. Why, then, do we never see any other Kossith without horns in DAII, especially when the Arishok had the biggest horns of all?
Please, devs - give me one other hornless kossith in DAIII. My brain would love some resolution on this.

Why don't we see any female Dwarves? Or female Tal-Vashoth? Why do all Kossith, save for the important ones, have the exact same model?

It's just time constraints really. Much of what's wrong with DAII falls into that category.

I can't really consider the Kossith design a retcon, since we were told that the hornless ones do exist.

It'd be a retcon if we were told that all Kossith were horned. Thankfully, that's not the case.

brushyourteeth wrote...

Both designs look amazing, but did anyone else find it weird when you entered Kirkwall and the Chantry folk were wearing completely new duds? The whole thing could have been explained by one of the Hawkes saying something like "You don't look like any Templar/Sister I've ever met." But we didn't get that.

I actually think Gaider said it was due to regional differences somewhere on the forums before.

brushyourteeth wrote...

Well as long as we're talking about it, I thought Merrill had the weirdest boobs ever.
True story. First thing I noticed. They sit too low and stick out to the sides too much.

I think that's just due to the angle of the shot and not really indicative of where her boobs rest and point.

Or her robes are just making them look like that. Wouldn't be the first issue with armor on people that DA has had.

Modifié par The Ethereal Writer Redux, 23 avril 2012 - 06:33 .

[MarauderESP]

Avejajed wrote...

the_one_54321 wrote...

All real boobs look like this, right?

*facepalm*

*double facepalm*

take what suit u most

[the_one_54321]

MarauderESP wrote...

Avejajed wrote...

the_one_54321 wrote...
All real boobs look like this, right?

*facepalm*

*double facepalm*

take what suit u most

It's not nice to crush a man's boyhood dreams...

(also, those are totally real)

Modifié par the_one_54321, 23 avril 2012 - 06:40 .

[brushyourteeth]

the_one_54321 wrote...

All real boobs look like this, right?

With the right support? *shrugs*

maybe it's the lady-elf undercorset that's to blame.

[brushyourteeth]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

I think that's just due to the angle of the shot and not really indicative of where her boobs rest and point.

Or her robes are just making them look like that. Wouldn't be the first issue with armor on people that DA has had.

It could be an armor issue, but they look like that all the time, in every shot. trust me.