449 réponses à ce sujet

[crimzontearz]

lx_theo wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...lx_theo wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...you.....you do realize HOW DNA works right?Yes. Don't patronise me. This is under the assumption that synthesis works and does actually do as the starchild says... Make a single type of genetic coding that works for both syntheitics and organics.

Synthetics have no DNA because their bodies have no need to store a case to tell their cells how to build proteins or how to regulate double negative feedbacks or to pass on their traits to future generations...so NO you do NOT know how DNA works or you would know a synthetic has no use for it

You're an idiot. Of course I know how DNA works. I'm not in grade school.Ever think that a cross would be a combination of DNA and the synthetic method of existence that doesn't require DNA?I know that synthetics don't need DNA or have it... This argument is under the assumption that it puts together the best of both worlds from each method of sustaining life.

which is.....SPACE MAGIC unless you have an explanation for it that fits within the boundaries given by the universe in question. Also there is no sense in creating a new DNA if it is basically not needed at all. That also rises the issue of procreation amongst the remaining populace and so on and so forth....

[ArchDuck]

lx_theo wrote...

 Why do people think that Synthesis would make organics cyborgs or something along those lines? It makes no sense that people would be forced into a cyborg form. In fact, it makes so little sense that it also doesn't make sense that anyone would think that's what it meant. A bit... perplexing, I must say.

Cyborg: short for "cybernetic organism", is a being with both biological and artificial (e.g. electronic, mechanical or robotic) parts.

:blink:So yes, it makes everything into cyborgs. Otherwise how do you explain combining synthetic and organic?

Modifié par ArchDuck, 23 avril 2012 - 10:08 .

[lx_theo]

crimzontearz wrote...

lx_theo wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...lx_theo wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...you.....you do realize HOW DNA works right?Yes. Don't patronise me. This is under the assumption that synthesis works and does actually do as the starchild says... Make a single type of genetic coding that works for both syntheitics and organics.

Synthetics have no DNA because their bodies have no need to store a case to tell their cells how to build proteins or how to regulate double negative feedbacks or to pass on their traits to future generations...so NO you do NOT know how DNA works or you would know a synthetic has no use for it

You're an idiot. Of course I know how DNA works. I'm not in grade school.Ever think that a cross would be a combination of DNA and the synthetic method of existence that doesn't require DNA?I know that synthetics don't need DNA or have it... This argument is under the assumption that it puts together the best of both worlds from each method of sustaining life.

which is.....SPACE MAGIC unless you have an explanation for it that fits within the boundaries given by the universe in question. Also there is no sense in creating a new DNA if it is basically not needed at all. That also rises the issue of procreation amongst the remaining populace and so on and so forth....

Space Magic is a term stupid fans made up to try and make an excuse for their being technology beyond what the current galaxy has discovered and them not liking that it hasn't been discovered in univese yet.

[Cadeym]

OP, please do explain why everything is covered in glowing circuits and how that can be classified as dna. EDI remains a robot while everyone else continue to have their organic form, how does that make any sense.

The only way to alter dna strands into somthing "new" and different is to deconstruct it in the first place.

[M0keys]

MisterJB wrote...

malakim2099 wrote...
Obviously morals are of no concern to you, just as they were not to him. So I don't need to continue this conversation about someone apparently deciding what is best for trillions of sentient beings without any actual data.

Can you decide whats is, objectivelly, best for the galaxy? How can you know for sure that the StarChild isn't right and the Reapers are the solution to Chaos, hmm? In such a case, Destroy dooms the galaxy.

If they were really trying to save us, they would've at least made an attempt to make us side with them to fight only the other synthetics.

You know, if they're actually good guys. Good guys do certain things.

Cosmic-scale enslavement and mass genocide is not on the good guy list.

[Navasha]

Sorry, but forcing any change on individuals against their will or without their knowledge is pretty much my definition of evil.

Synthesis is by far the most immoral option there is for the endings.

Cyborg = short for cybernetic organism = a creature that is a mixture of organic and synthetic parts.

You realize that IS what the synthesis ending is creating right? Everything and everyone IS being changed into a cyborg whether they would welcome the change or not.

[Oldbones2]

lx_theo wrote...

Oldbones2 wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

malakim2099 wrote...
Evolution is a natural process over millions of years.
Shepard is choosing to change everything in an instant flash of green light.

See? We're saving time and everything.

No being has the right to destroy diversity and make everything the same.

Again, evidence that everything will be the same?

Otherwise, you're just choosing to be pessimistic while I choose to be optimisitc about the hardest ending to get.

Otherwise why did you oppose Saren in the first place?

Because he was Indocrinated. The Reapers wouldn't allow us to mantain our freedom or individuality but I see no evidence of either being denied to us in the Synthesis ending.

Maybe you're indoctrinated?


And really, I don't remember my tree out in my lawn having glowing lines in it.  If the green light just made plants and all animals the highest form of evolution, I think I can safetly assume that their sentient.

So what the hell am I supposed to eat?

That's idiotic. Of course they're not sentient. At most the final evolution comment referred to genetic material adn life sustaining methods.

Is this guy for real?

He says that the stuff he synthesisizes will be forced to the final evolution of life.

After Joker gets out of the ship, we can clearly see the trees are partially synthetic. 

Trees are made of DNA.  (unlike synthetic life forms)

Ergo, the trees are now at their final evolved state. 

[viperabyss]

lx_theo wrote...

 Why do people think that Synthesis would make organics cyborgs or something along those lines? It makes no sense that people would be forced into a cyborg form. In fact, it makes so little sense that it also doesn't make sense that anyone would think that's what it meant. A bit... perplexing, I must say.

The Catalyst told of how synthesis would create a new DNA. He said nothing about how it would alter the physical forms of anyone. What does make sense is that if Synthesis only effects DNA and Sythetic's equivalent. They would be merged to create one fundamental building block of life rather than the two distinctly different ones that were there before. A Geth would simply be another species, like a Human is to a Turian. This is actually the only way it can make sense. If people were transformed into synthetics or cyborgs or something along those lines, it destroys the ability to write a future story coming after because of the huge variation it would force. People still have their free will. They still have their individuality. They are still who they are. The only logical interpretations of synthesis would be ones that change species at such a fundamental level that it can put them on the same playing field without changing the uniqueness of each species and individual. Any interpretation that does not take this in account will not make sense. I don't really understand why anyone would think those to be true. Maybe they are so bitter at the ending they choose to look for the interpretation they can hate on the most?

So please, stop making the silly threads attacking the Synthesis option.

Sense. This post has none.

[T-Raks]

lx_theo wrote...

Ryoten wrote...

I hate synthesis because you're pretty  much giving the reapers what they want.  It's been their goal the whole game.  You have been fighting against that.  Also, the catalyst says that synthesis is the "final evolution".  This is incorrect.  Darwinism has taught us that there is no final evolution.  Evolution is constant.  For their to be a apex or end, is completely contrary to the deffinition of evolution in general.

They have a similar goal, yes, but what you are fighting against is how they do it, not their goals, right? Their goals aren't really even known until the end. You are fighting against ebing harvested more than anything, imo.

As for evolution... I think it means more of a evolution of genetic material than evolution in general.

Man, you really live in your own ME world! Shepard states that he despises the goal of the reapers for example when he states that it's better for the protheans to be dead than collectors. He asks if there is still anything prothean besides the look left in them etc. 

Giving in to the reapers in the end because you think they will finally do this synthesis **** right if they can use Shepard's DNA instead of all the DNA they reaped over all the cycles before is a logical conclusion to Mass Effect. Right! Shepard is all about freedom and everyone making their own choices and not about merging to climb to the so called (by the reaper leader) highest step of evolution. Shepard says directly to Harbinger that he/she and all humanity will fight the reapers goal to dictate the evolution of organics until they succeed or die trying "because this is what humanity does"...

So he/she would never let them decide our fate. So no synthesis! 

Modifié par T-Raks, 23 avril 2012 - 10:12 .

[MisterJB]

M0keys wrote...
If they were really trying to save us, they would've at least made an attempt to make us side with them to fight only the other synthetics.

You know, if they're actually good guys. Good guys do certain things.

Cosmic-scale enslavement and mass genocide is not on the good guy list.

There's no good or evil. Only opinions.

[sth128]

Considering that Bioware was founded by two medical doctors (yes, Dr. Muzyka and Dr. Zeschuk are medical doctors), it is really surprising that they would allow such lunacy to exist in their products.

Evolution has no final end. It is a continuing process that adopts to its environment. Synthesis can no more grant the apex of evolution than "Art of War" can grant a victory to every conflict.

Forget speculation, it's stupidity for everyone.

[Oldbones2]

[/quote]You're an idiot. Of course I know how DNA works. I'm not in grade school.Ever think that a cross would be a combination of DNA and the synthetic method of existence that doesn't require DNA?I know that synthetics don't need DNA or have it... This argument is under the assumption that it puts together the best of both worlds from each method of sustaining life.[/quote]


Seriously OP,  what sad, sorry public school failed you?

I'll write to my congressman to have it looked into.  Promise.

[knightnblu]

Alright, without delving too much into science I will simply say that by changing the DNA you change the life form. Period. If the change in allelic frequencies over time allows for minor variations (mutations) and we call this evolution, what do you call it when a man stands in for nature and mutates the entire galaxy in one fell swoop? That's point 1.
 
Point 2, if the violation of the physical self is termed a rape, then what do you call the violation of the essence of the self? It seems to me that the violation of the essence of the self is a far worse offense than the mere violation of the physical self. This is because the genetic code is the essence of the individual and it is unique. By Shepard taking the liberty to change the essences of trillions of sentient individuals he violates each and every one of them because he has never asked for their opinion, he never asked for their permission, and he never even ruminates on the decision before he makes it. He just does it and moves on. That is a huge violation of the individuals that comprise the galaxy and it is possible that the human mind cannot even conceive of just how bad such a violation would turn out.
 
Suppose that you would rather have died than to have your DNA re-written? Because once that road is taken there is no turning back. It took a huge amount of energy to re-write both the DNA and the flesh to match the new DNA. Assuming that one could re-write the DNA back to the original and re-write the flesh to match (which is the only way that you could do so), where are you going to get the energy and computing power to pull it off?
 
Then there are also questions about the new DNA, does this mean that every race can now breed with every other race across the galaxy? If so, then the Asari are going to be hard hit because their entire reproduction process has been re-written and they will now have to rely on sexual intercourse to re-produce because they actually will take DNA from other species. In other words, the synthesis option has eliminated their entire species and that defines point 3.
 
That's why I view the synthesis option as the Frankenstein option. Shepard plays mad scientist with the catalyst and does something that creates trillions of abominations against their will and that is something that is far worse than Mengele ever did or even thought about doing. Essentially, Shepard steps into the Reapers shoes and becomes their slave in pursuing this option just as if he had been placed within the Reaper shell. But hey, what's ethics got to do with science fiction anyway?

[legion999]

Honestly the OP seems hellbent on insulting those who disagree with him/her. Discussions are futile.

[M0keys]

lx_theo wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

lx_theo wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...lx_theo wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...you.....you do realize HOW DNA works right?Yes. Don't patronise me. This is under the assumption that synthesis works and does actually do as the starchild says... Make a single type of genetic coding that works for both syntheitics and organics.

Synthetics have no DNA because their bodies have no need to store a case to tell their cells how to build proteins or how to regulate double negative feedbacks or to pass on their traits to future generations...so NO you do NOT know how DNA works or you would know a synthetic has no use for it

You're an idiot. Of course I know how DNA works. I'm not in grade school.Ever think that a cross would be a combination of DNA and the synthetic method of existence that doesn't require DNA?I know that synthetics don't need DNA or have it... This argument is under the assumption that it puts together the best of both worlds from each method of sustaining life.

which is.....SPACE MAGIC unless you have an explanation for it that fits within the boundaries given by the universe in question. Also there is no sense in creating a new DNA if it is basically not needed at all. That also rises the issue of procreation amongst the remaining populace and so on and so forth....

Space Magic is a term stupid fans made up to try and make an excuse for their being technology beyond what the current galaxy has discovered and them not liking that it hasn't been discovered in univese yet.

No, it isn't. The writers always made an effort to expain the technology in their universe to some degree because it has elements of hard science-fiction.

There's always effort put into the mechanics of how the universe works. But not the catalyst.

[lx_theo]

ArchDuck wrote...

lx_theo wrote...

 Why do people think that Synthesis would make organics cyborgs or something along those lines? It makes no sense that people would be forced into a cyborg form. In fact, it makes so little sense that it also doesn't make sense that anyone would think that's what it meant. A bit... perplexing, I must say.

Cyborg: short for "cybernetic organism", is a being with both biological and artificial (e.g. electronic, mechanical or robotic) parts.

:blink:So yes, it makes everything into cyborgs. Otherwise how do you explain combining synthetic and organic?

Cyborg distinctly implies that the biological and artificial parts are distinctly separate, even if they work together. 

You use cyborg to describe it, you'll have a bunch of rabid people clamoring about how life is like ... This

[M0keys]

MisterJB wrote...

M0keys wrote...
If they were really trying to save us, they would've at least made an attempt to make us side with them to fight only the other synthetics.

You know, if they're actually good guys. Good guys do certain things.

Cosmic-scale enslavement and mass genocide is not on the good guy list.

There's no good or evil. Only opinions.

That's just your opinion.

[legion999]

M0keys wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

M0keys wrote...
If they were really trying to save us, they would've at least made an attempt to make us side with them to fight only the other synthetics.

You know, if they're actually good guys. Good guys do certain things.

Cosmic-scale enslavement and mass genocide is not on the good guy list.

There's no good or evil. Only opinions.

That's just your opinion.

Agreed^.

[lx_theo]

T-Raks wrote...

lx_theo wrote...

Ryoten wrote...

I hate synthesis because you're pretty  much giving the reapers what they want.  It's been their goal the whole game.  You have been fighting against that.  Also, the catalyst says that synthesis is the "final evolution".  This is incorrect.  Darwinism has taught us that there is no final evolution.  Evolution is constant.  For their to be a apex or end, is completely contrary to the deffinition of evolution in general.

They have a similar goal, yes, but what you are fighting against is how they do it, not their goals, right? Their goals aren't really even known until the end. You are fighting against ebing harvested more than anything, imo.

As for evolution... I think it means more of a evolution of genetic material than evolution in general.

Man, you really live in your own ME world! Shepard states that he despises the goal of the reapers for example when he states that it's better for the protheans to be dead than collectors. He asks if there is still anything prothean besides the look left in them etc. 

Giving in to the reapers in the end because you think they will finally do this synthesis **** right if they can use Shepard's DNA instead of all the DNA they reaped over all the cycles before is a logical conclusion to Mass Effect. Right! Shepard is all about freedom and everyone making their own choices and not about merging to climb to the so called (by the reaper leader) highest step of evolution. Shepard says directly to Harbinger that he/she and all humanity will fight the reapers goal to dictate the evolution of organics until they succeed or die trying "because this is what humanity does"...

So he/she would never let them decide our fate. So no synthesis! 

No... Synthesis is nothing like the Collectors. Synthesis doesn't take away free will and systematically create a species solely their for enslavement.

Synthesis is deciding the galaxy's fate just as much as the other two... so if you really have a problem with it, you shouldn't have played a game based on choice and expect the end to not do that itself.

[Redwing198403]

Synthesis is yet another quick fix to evolution and technological advancement, just like the mass relays. The game tells us repeatedly that using the relays causes evolution along a path the reapers desire... but synthesis is fine?

[eddieoctane]

lx_theo wrote...

 Why do people think that Synthesis would make organics cyborgs or something along those lines? It makes no sense that people would be forced into a cyborg form. In fact, it makes so little sense that it also doesn't make sense that anyone would think that's what it meant. A bit... perplexing, I must say.

The Catalyst told of how synthesis would create a new DNA. He said nothing about how it would alter the physical forms of anyone. What does make sense is that if Synthesis only effects DNA and Sythetic's equivalent. They would be merged to create one fundamental building block of life rather than the two distinctly different ones that were there before. A Geth would simply be another species, like a Human is to a Turian. This is actually the only way it can make sense. If people were transformed into synthetics or cyborgs or something along those lines, it destroys the ability to write a future story coming after because of the huge variation it would force. People still have their free will. They still have their individuality. They are still who they are. The only logical interpretations of synthesis would be ones that change species at such a fundamental level that it can put them on the same playing field without changing the uniqueness of each species and individual. Any interpretation that does not take this in account will not make sense. I don't really understand why anyone would think those to be true. Maybe they are so bitter at the ending they choose to look for the interpretation they can hate on the most?

So please, stop making the silly threads attacking the Synthesis option.

The choice to be something other than synthetic or organic is not left to the individual. It was forced upon the entire galaxy. Forcing such a fundamental change on anyone is a terrible crime deserving of the 9th ring of Hell. It would be the equivalent of releasing an engineered virus that turns your skin purple, your eyes orange, and leave you with the altered facial features so that you look the exact same as the other 7 billion victims...I mean humans exposed to the virus. Because skin color is why everyone on Earth wants to kill each other.

See how retarded that sounds? That is exactly what synthesis does. Hence, it is a retarded option, written by a couple of complete freaking morons. If you think there is an upside to it, you;re kidding yourself. The Reapers are still around. Purely synthetic beings can still be created, unless the green wave somehow animated sub-atomic particles the same way it altered basic physiology on a galactic scale. Yep, that's right. The problem of us vs the robots still occurs, unless electrons are now alive. And the Reapers are still around, so who knows what they are going to do in another 50,000 years.

[Saul Iscariot]

I share 75% of my DNA with every living thing on the planet yet if I tried to mate with a mushroom I'm not likely to produce some dancing fungi that wouldn't look out of place in Fantasia.

[Zix13]

lx_theo wrote...

 Why do people think that Synthesis would make organics cyborgs or something along those lines? It makes no sense that people would be forced into a cyborg form. In fact, it makes so little sense that it also doesn't make sense that anyone would think that's what it meant. A bit... perplexing, I must say.

The Catalyst told of how synthesis would create a new DNA. He said nothing about how it would alter the physical forms of anyone. What does make sense is that if Synthesis only effects DNA and Sythetic's equivalent. They would be merged to create one fundamental building block of life rather than the two distinctly different ones that were there before. A Geth would simply be another species, like a Human is to a Turian. This is actually the only way it can make sense. If people were transformed into synthetics or cyborgs or something along those lines, it destroys the ability to write a future story coming after because of the huge variation it would force. People still have their free will. They still have their individuality. They are still who they are. The only logical interpretations of synthesis would be ones that change species at such a fundamental level that it can put them on the same playing field without changing the uniqueness of each species and individual. Any interpretation that does not take this in account will not make sense. I don't really understand why anyone would think those to be true. Maybe they are so bitter at the ending they choose to look for the interpretation they can hate on the most?

So please, stop making the silly threads attacking the Synthesis option.

Incoherent as ****. 

[stevefox1200]

Can someone tell me how this works?

Grass is organic, is it now part synthetic? if so how has it changed?

Are geth now not "robots" and if so how does that work?

If its all life, that includes animals. plants, and even smallest of microscopic organisms? HOW DOES THAT WORK?

Do you just wake up with some type of metallic implant that has been surgically grafted into your body by a green wave while you slept?

I might like this ending more IF I KNEW WHAT IT EVEN DID

There are "extremely advanced machines" and then there are machines that can completely rewrites the DNA of the entire universe in seconds

WHY WOULD YOU EVEN MAKE THAT MACHINE?

Modifié par stevefox1200, 23 avril 2012 - 10:19 .

[lx_theo]

Oldbones2 wrote...


Is this guy for real?

He says that the stuff he synthesisizes will be forced to the final evolution of life.

After Joker gets out of the ship, we can clearly see the trees are partially synthetic. 

Trees are made of DNA.  (unlike synthetic life forms)

Ergo, the trees are now at their final evolved state. 

Are you trolling? Or do you lack common sense? 

Probably trolling. 

Modifié par lx_theo, 23 avril 2012 - 10:18 .