22 réponses à ce sujet

[Vendetta543]

 Did anybody else think it would've garnered less complaints if Tallis said something like "The Ariqun planted a fake list. The list doesn't have agents, it's a list of those who turned away from the Qun" or something to that effect? Even if we found out later on after the DLC or in a future installment that Tallis was lying, it would make the railroading at the end make more sense since you'd have little reason to fight over a Tal Vashoth list as compared to an SA list.

I'm not trying to bash or troll, I was just wondering since I expected this ever since the Arishok planted fake Gaatlok for the thieves to steal.

[thats1evildude]

The content of the list isn't the issue. The problem is that if you try to take the list, she waves you off.

Honestly, I couldn't care less. The list is useless. Even if what passes as "the authorities" in Thedas weren't taking an "Ah yes, Reapers" approach to the possibility of qunari sleeper agents, the continent of Thedas is in chaos right now, thanks to the Blight, the Mage/Templar war and the Orlesian civil war. No one is in a position to do anything about it.

Modifié par thats1evildude, 24 avril 2012 - 04:24 .

[LobselVith8]

Vendetta543 wrote...

Did anybody else think it would've garnered less complaints if Tallis said something like "The Ariqun planted a fake list. The list doesn't have agents, it's a list of those who turned away from the Qun" or something to that effect? Even if we found out later on after the DLC or in a future installment that Tallis was lying, it would make the railroading at the end make more sense since you'd have little reason to fight over a Tal Vashoth list as compared to an SA list.

I'm not trying to bash or troll, I was just wondering since I expected this ever since the Arishok planted fake Gaatlok for the thieves to steal.

I think there would have been less complaints if the writers allowed Hawke to stop acting like a statute and actually do something about the situation (in this case, the list), regardless of how Tallis felt about it. Being able to do something about the list would have been much better than the plot railroad of doing nothing.

[Vendetta543]

What exactly happens if you threaten to take the list from her? It's been a while since I played and I was playing a Hawke who became pretty much stupid good the minute the word "Innocents" gets mentioned (Sided with the mages), so I let her off with saying it was necessary.

[TEWR]

What happens is this:

Hawke: Gimme the list!
Tallis: You think I'll give it to you just because you demand it?
Hawke: Welp, I tried.

The problem is that Hawke didn't try.

[Vendetta543]

.....Really? Not even a glower as she walks away or telling her he/she doesn't want the stinkin jewel?

[TEWR]

Nope. Hawke doesn't even angrily shake his angry fist at her in an angry fashion that displays his angry anger.

[WhiteKnyght]

thats1evildude wrote...

The content of the list isn't the issue. The problem is that if you try to take the list, she waves you off.

Honestly, I couldn't care less. The list is useless. Even if what passes as "the authorities" in Thedas weren't taking an "Ah yes, Reapers" approach to the possibility of qunari sleeper agents, the continent of Thedas is in chaos right now, thanks to the Blight, the Mage/Templar war and the Orlesian civil war. No one is in a position to do anything about it.

Distributing that list meant persecution for a lot more than the Qunari sleepers. Everybody they know, including their families, would be killed just for ignorant association.

Besides, the Ariqun didn't even think the list was worth retrieving. The damage to their cause would be minimal at best. Prosper was probably right to be dissatisfied with the list.

The gunpowder formula would have been better, but apparently only the qunari are smart enough to mix sulfur, charcoal, and saltpeter and see what happens.

[Vendetta543]

Heh, I guess most Hawke's are too busy making out with her to care Merrill's response to Tallis being jealous was priceless.

[thats1evildude]

The Grey Nayr wrote...

The gunpowder formula would have been better, but apparently only the qunari are smart enough to mix sulfur, charcoal, and saltpeter and see what happens.

To be fair, we only figured out the formula for gunpowder in our own world by accident. And unlike Thedas, we didn't have magic capable of replicating the same effect.

Modifié par thats1evildude, 24 avril 2012 - 05:35 .

[Vendetta543]

What makes gunpowder stronger than magic? Is it because it can be mass produced?

[thats1evildude]

Vendetta543 wrote...

What makes gunpowder stronger than magic? Is it because it can be mass produced?

Not stronger, just more readily available. It's still ******-weak in comparison to actual magic.

Modifié par thats1evildude, 24 avril 2012 - 05:41 .

[Vendetta543]

I'm surprised the Qunari is that much advanced compared to the other races. I mean, the fact that they made gunpowder early makes sense since they don't rely on magic, but the fact that they have dreadnoughts and ships that can hold hunderd's of Qunari along with their equipment and supplies is very impressive.

[thats1evildude]

Bah. For all their much-vaunted technological advances, the qunari are still pretty reliant on their saarebas to do any real damage. They only conquered Kirkwall in the Storm Age when their mages knocked down the walls of the city.

Also, they're a seafaring race, so I'm not surprised their navy is very capable.

Modifié par thats1evildude, 24 avril 2012 - 05:55 .

[Vendetta543]

What about their supposedly awesome metal armor?

One more thing: Talliss' mention of the Ariqun deeming Salit not worthy of following confused me. When Seamus, a Bas Human convert, was killed in the chantry, he was avenged and the Qunari said "We protect those of the Qun. We do not abandon our own!". So why then did they abandon their own by deeming Salit not worthy of stopping?

[Vendetta543]

What about their supposedly awesome metal armor?

One more thing: Talliss' mention of the Ariqun deeming Salit not worthy of following confused me. When Seamus, a Bas Human convert, was killed in the chantry, he was avenged and the Qunari said "We protect those of the Qun. We do not abandon our own!". So why then did they abandon their own by deeming Salit not worthy of stopping?

[LobselVith8]

Vendetta543 wrote...

What about their supposedly awesome metal armor?

One more thing: Talliss' mention of the Ariqun deeming Salit not worthy of following confused me. When Seamus, a Bas Human convert, was killed in the chantry, he was avenged and the Qunari said "We protect those of the Qun. We do not abandon our own!". So why then did they abandon their own by deeming Salit not worthy of stopping?

The same reason Hawke warning Cullen about Anders' plans for the Chantry (with Anders standing right next him) only merited an acknowledgement from Cullen, and nothing more. Because the Plot said so.

[Silfren]

Vendetta543 wrote...

What makes gunpowder stronger than magic? Is it because it can be mass produced?

Also presumably safer in being more reliable and predictable.  Remember, Qunari fear mages to an extreme that makes Meredith Stannard look downright reasonable.  

[TEWR]

Vendetta543 wrote...

What about their supposedly awesome metal armor?

One more thing: Talliss' mention of the Ariqun deeming Salit not worthy of following confused me. When Seamus, a Bas Human convert, was killed in the chantry, he was avenged and the Qunari said "We protect those of the Qun. We do not abandon our own!". So why then did they abandon their own by deeming Salit not worthy of stopping?

Saemus was Qunari. Salit was Tal-Vashoth.

Gaider's gone on record to say that the Qunari apply very rigid definitions to many things. Who they deem worthy of following is probably one of them, but when the Qunari say they don't abandon their own they mean they don't abandon those that still follow the way of the Qun.

Salit abandoned that way, so we're led to believe. Some people have theorized that it was a Qunari mission that Tallis wasn't made aware of -- perhaps because she wasn't high enough up the chain of command to be privy to such information -- and that's why they didn't pursue him.

Either belief is valid if one is asking "Why didn't they pursue Salit?"

Modifié par The Ethereal Writer Redux, 24 avril 2012 - 10:28 .

[Vendetta543]

^

That's the thing: Salit himself may not have been worthy of following, being a Tal vashoth and all, but the list itself was filled with people who still follow the Qun and actively sill help them. I was confused that they think not to chase him to protect their own.

Then there's the thing the Arishok says about Tal Vashoth being hunted not for what they do but for what they are. I thought it meant all Tal Vashoth are hunted the minute they defected. Maybe it's because the Arishok is a military leader, not the civilian one.

Either that or the "Qunari scheme Talliss wasn't made aware of" plan people have theorized.

[Gervaise]

Tallis states that several (possibly the majority) of the people on the list have left the Qunari, so the Ariqun was probably happy for the Orlesians to wipe them out. Talis also states that the Ariqun says they knew the risk when they became spies for the Qunari, so they would be willing to be sacrificed for the greater good (if still faithful to the Qun).
However Salit's reaction to being confronted by Tallis did seem to me to suggest that perhaps he was a double agent - trying to gain their trust so he could infiltrate their inner circle of command.

[Vendetta543]

I guess I'll leave it at that. Hopefully it was a double agent thing and we just royally screwed the Qunari's plans. Nothing against them or anything ( Their religion is fascinating), but their conversion process could use a lot of work.