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Romances in Dragon Age 3, need to make a roaring come back.


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#51
Melca36

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Malsumis wrote...

Actually, romances need to be cut back. Too many choices which spread the development budget too thin across all characters, or impact other areas of development.

As with all things, quality over quantity.

Allan Schumacher wrote...
I've actually always preferred the fade to black. I don't know why but I always feel weird watching it play out haha.


As do I. Anything else just seems awkward. And it's resources and time better spent elsewhere.


Um.....some of us enjoy it and would not buy the game. There are other games that don't have romances that might be better for you.

#52
Allan Schumacher

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It is, and they do don't they? I can't understand why other developers haven't followed BioWare's lead on this. It seems there is an audience of people who will just play for the romances/story. The ones that play for all the other reasons seem to enjoy it as enhancing the roleplay experience (myself included in this bunch). What is there to lose?


I see it from Obsidian as well, which does have close ties to the BioWare people due to the Black Isle days, so maybe that isn't so surprising.

Though I know Avellone has stated he finds a more standard, relatively happy romance less interesting (often with a too clearly defined resolution), so that may affect how he implements them. Although Obsidian's work with Arcade Gannon was such a phenomenally well done homosexual relationship that I had ZERO clue whatsoever that it was even an option because he was just like anyone else unless you got to know him more (which I think is fantastic and awesome way to represent a gay individual).

As an aside, I also like how Shepard is completely unphased by Steve mentioning that he lost his husband, indicating that in his time it's just not an issue. Which I also think is awesome. This coming from a heterosexual, so I can only hope that most of the LGBT community feel it's a good gesture too! (they seem to)

#53
Ponendus

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Maria Caliban wrote...

Skyrim, The Witcher, Kingdoms of Amalur, Fable, and Deus Ex all have romances. They don't have BioWare-style romances, but they're not BioWare-style games.


You are, of course, correct. I suppose I meant to say the 'Bioware-style' romance has surprisingly not caught on. Skyrim for example has two-line romances that then progress straight to marriage, if you are wearing an amulet. The Witcher has a noticeable lack of options, and the rest is prostitute hiring, Fable is similar to Skyrim in my opinion, and I haven't played Deus Ex so can't comment on that. Also, I haven't encountered romance options in KoA? Perhaps I missed something...

Yes, though I see your point, these aren't BioWare games, but nonetheless, studios learn and borrow from each other all the time, this style of romance seems to be one thing that has remained unborrowed.

#54
Ponendus

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Allan Schumacher wrote...

I see it from Obsidian as well, which does have close ties to the BioWare people due to the Black Isle days, so maybe that isn't so surprising.

Though I know Avellone has stated he finds a more standard, relatively happy romance less interesting (often with a too clearly defined resolution), so that may affect how he implements them. Although Obsidian's work with Arcade Gannon was such a phenomenally well done homosexual relationship that I had ZERO clue whatsoever that it was even an option because he was just like anyone else unless you got to know him more (which I think is fantastic and awesome way to represent a gay individual).

As an aside, I also like how Shepard is completely unphased by Steve mentioning that he lost his husband, indicating that in his time it's just not an issue. Which I also think is awesome. This coming from a heterosexual, so I can only hope that most of the LGBT community feel it's a good gesture too! (they seem to)


Yes Obsidian has done some good work around that, although I still don't think to the immersive and emotionally connecting standard of BioWare's. I too am exceedingly pleased at how BioWare and others are handling same-sex romances, I agree that Shepherds reaction was very well done, and I thought the same thing. Obviously in Shepherds time homosexuality just isn't an issue. The thing is it takes progressive studios like BioWare to make a difference in society, games are culture, culture influences society. BioWare are making a bigger impact to the LGBT community than possibly they even realise.

Good on them I say!

#55
Malsumis

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Allan Schumacher wrote...

Well, this thread may indicate that it's not actually a waste of resources haha.


:pinched:

Allan Schumacher wrote...

LI definitely seem to be a staple expectation for BioWare games now and many people seem to love it.


But I don't want them gone, I just don't see a need to have 4LI per gender.

Melca36 wrote...

Um.....some of us enjoy it and would not buy the game. There are other games that don't have romances that might be better for you.


Several things wrong here:

1. Never said I didn't like or didn't want romances, just that I don't see a need for there to be so many.

2. No one is not going to buy a bioware game, because it fewer LI.

3. So there are a lot of party based rpg makers out there? Oh wait.

Modifié par Malsumis, 25 avril 2012 - 07:46 .


#56
Ponendus

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Malsumis wrote...

2. No one is not going to buy a bioware game, because it fewer LI.


I don't have the numbers on this, and neither do you, but I think you would be surprised to find out there may be more people that fit that description than you think.

#57
katiebour

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 Fenris, Anders, and Isabela all have non-standard builds.  Anders is skinnier than the default OMG!BUFF!Hawke body, Fenris's markings would have to be custom, and Izzy's assets do not match the somewhat slim default F!Hawke body.

Also, the companions were built with body and clothing being one asset, hence why we couldn't change their clothes.  If you took the clothes off, they'd simply have invisible bodies.  Of course modders have managed to fix this for PC players, somewhat, but the bodies/markings still don't match well.

For Merrill, they already had a corseted f!elf model from the Blooming Rose to reuse, and that's why she was the only LI to appear in lingerie.

So if you're wondering why they were still clothed, there's your answer.  Not enough time or resources to devote to custom models for each, especially if most players would only romance one or two of the LIs, making the return on the investment of time and money minimal.

DAO had the same problem- Zev, for example, had a huge build in his love scene that was not reflected when he was in armor.  Again, modders solved this (yay toolset!) but it isn't a new problem.  All members of the same race and gender have the same default body unless a custom body is specifically created for them.  Things that change the default body (i.e. a body hair mod for male humans) affects every male human in game.  Give a modded Anders red-gold chest hair?  Default Hawke has it too- the curtains don't match the drapes in that scenario. XD

Sadly without a toolset release for DA2, it's pretty much impossible to create and add custom body meshes to the game.

So that's the technical reason for the clothed sex scenes.

********

Anyway, for me, personally, I'd like to see more development on the love scenes + gifts/conversations/kisses throughout the game for LI.  And if they move in with you, you should be able to have conversations at home.  I would have dearly loved to have seen interaction between Leandra and Anders, or Bodahn, Sandal and Anders.  A tossed-off remark about the LOVE OF YOUR CHARACTER'S LIFE by YOUR CHARACTER'S MOTHER is woefully insufficient.  Seconded about companion responses too, although I felt there was a decent effort made to acknowledge the romance- but as with every comment by every fan on this board, "We want more and better."  XD  We're such demanding little brats, eh?

I felt in Act 3 that my Hawke's romances should have been growing more in-depth.  Fenris and Isabela come back, you can marry Seb (and how pissed was I that I could have a chaste marriage with him, but be completely unable to marry any other LI?) but Anders and Merrill all but drop off the planet, romance-wise.  The plot quests included endearments, which was nice, and that blackmail convo with Anders was EXCELLENT, but I would have liked more interactions that were exclusively for the purpose of developing the romance between two characters who've been living together for years.

And let me just say that I loved loved loved the endearments- they gave me warm and fuzzy feelings. :D

I like Anders' romance because it clearly demonstrates his constant conflict within himself, between duty and love, between the driven personality of an emotion-fueled spirit and his own fallible human self, between fear and desire.  The push-pull of "I love you but we shouldn't" is a very nice indicator of his own conflict and inner torment.  And it doesn't really matter what reassurances Hawke gives (and she does have the opportunity to do so; the aggro!reply to "I'll hurt you" in Act I is a confidently declared "I'm a big girl, I can make my own decisions.")  What matters is that Anders remembers killing and eating the Warden!Templars before his flight to Kirkwall, he remembers killing or almost killing a certain mage in Act II, and as a human being stuck in a situation over which he has no control and no way out, he's afraid of hurting the one person he loves most.  

Hawke can't magic that away with reason, because Anders clearly believes that he/she doesn't understand the situation, or how they should be running away screaming from him.  He says "I have no control around you," and for him, losing control is the most terrifying thing he could do.  The "You take a grave risk in trusting me" and "I don't know whether to cherish every moment at your side, or fear for your life to have me there" lines exist for a reason.

And I think it was really excellent of Bioware to have him continually protesting, allowing Hawke the choice to walk away, because in the endgame that's what the player who romances him remembers- every moment, every uttered "I'll hurt you, I'll lie to you, I'm a monster, there's no one in Kirkwall I wouldn't kill to see mages free" come back to haunt the player (who probably waved away his protestations as drama and not as the real warnings they were.)

And if a player is upset that they can't have a "nice, normal" romance with the possessed mage, waving away his fears and crushing him to her loving bosom, well, methinks they might have missed the point.  That was the same with any Warden other than a Cousland romancing Alistair, too.  That was the point of King Alistair and his Warden wife never being able to have children- the romance survives, but the line of succession is in dire peril, and civil war imminent with the King and Queen's death.  Heck, the Word of God stated in an interview that the Warden might only live for fifteen years instead of the maximum of thirty due to Archdemon proximity and the Blight, and Al's in the same boat.  And how gut-wrenching that the only child he might ever have is a witch's son with the soul of an Old God, to be raised far away from him and never to inherit the throne.  I'm not even an Al-mancer and I LOVE how his romances have massive pluses and minuses. :D

Some romances hurt so good, and that's what makes them memorable, heart-wrenching and cathartic.  How amazing to be filled with emotion over a video game!

YMMV, but that's my .02. :)

#58
nightscrawl

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katiebour wrote...

I like Anders' romance because it clearly demonstrates his constant conflict within himself, between duty and love, between the driven personality of an emotion-fueled spirit and his own fallible human self, between fear and desire. The push-pull of "I love you but we shouldn't" is a very nice indicator of his own conflict and inner torment. And it doesn't really matter what reassurances Hawke gives (and she does have the opportunity to do so; the aggro!reply to "I'll hurt you" in Act I is a confidently declared "I'm a big girl, I can make my own decisions.") What matters is that Anders remembers killing and eating the Warden!Templars before his flight to Kirkwall, he remembers killing or almost killing a certain mage in Act II, and as a human being stuck in a situation over which he has no control and no way out, he's afraid of hurting the one person he loves most.

Hawke can't magic that away with reason, because Anders clearly believes that he/she doesn't understand the situation, or how they should be running away screaming from him. He says "I have no control around you," and for him, losing control is the most terrifying thing he could do. The "You take a grave risk in trusting me" and "I don't know whether to cherish every moment at your side, or fear for your life to have me there" lines exist for a reason.

And I think it was really excellent of Bioware to have him continually protesting, allowing Hawke the choice to walk away, because in the endgame that's what the player who romances him remembers- every moment, every uttered "I'll hurt you, I'll lie to you, I'm a monster, there's no one in Kirkwall I wouldn't kill to see mages free" come back to haunt the player (who probably waved away his protestations as drama and not as the real warnings they were.)

And here is the perfect explanation of why rival Anders is the only way for me to play, romance or not. The terrible conflict and lack of control pisses me off as non-romance Hawke, and scares me as romance Hawke. It's fantastic!

I'm almost at the end of my first Anders rivalmance. I normally romance Fenris (m/m, m/f, friend and rival), but reading some fun forum stuff persuaded me to try the rival for Anders once. I'm quite looking forward to The Choice scene.

#59
katiebour

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nightscrawl wrote...

And here is the perfect explanation of why rival Anders is the only way for me to play, romance or not. The terrible conflict and lack of control pisses me off as non-romance Hawke, and scares me as romance Hawke. It's fantastic!

I'm almost at the end of my first Anders rivalmance. I normally romance Fenris (m/m, m/f, friend and rival), but reading some fun forum stuff persuaded me to try the rival for Anders once. I'm quite looking forward to The Choice scene.


Rivalmance breaks my heart.  I've never done it, although I've watched the vids on YouTube.  I find the friendmance absolutely tragic, actually, because my poor Diplo!Hawke goes into the blackmail scene with reasonable arguments and pleading "You're wrong- there's nothing more important than love."  It plays out more like a doomed Shakespearean romance to me, whereas rivalmance feels like "I love the person I want you to be, not the person you are" kind of abusive relationship.

But I guess I prefer the determined and strong revolutionary to the broken and suicidal abomination.  He feels like he retains control of what he's doing, is fully aware and takes responsibility in a friendmance, where in a rivalmance he just loses himself to Justice and can't do anything but weep and apologize for not being in control.  In a friendmance, he masters Justice; in a rivalmance Justice masters him.

But then again my views on the events of the Last Straw aren't exactly mainstream.  XD

Modifié par katiebour, 25 avril 2012 - 09:29 .


#60
AkiKishi

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Allan Schumacher wrote...

I've actually always preferred the fade to black. I don't know why but I always feel weird watching it play out haha.

Maybe it harkens back to the less acutely visual days of BG2 and PST.


If for whatever reason you can't do Witcher2 style then please FADE TO BLACK. Underwear sex scenes have no place outside of PG13.

#61
AkiKishi

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Ponendus wrote...

Malsumis wrote...

2. No one is not going to buy a bioware game, because it fewer LI.


I don't have the numbers on this, and neither do you, but I think you would be surprised to find out there may be more people that fit that description than you think.


While they might say it it's likely nothing more than an empty threat. Dating sims have never been big in the west. Relationships in the likes of Persona, Harvest Moon,Star Ocean etc. But never true dating sims.

If the whole romance thing was really that big, you would think that dating sims would actually have at least a niche market.

#62
nightscrawl

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katiebour wrote...

But I guess I prefer the determined and strong revolutionary to the broken and suicidal abomination.  He feels like he retains control of what he's doing, is fully aware and takes responsibility in a friendmance, where in a rivalmance he just loses himself to Justice and can't do anything but weep and apologize for not being in control.  In a friendmance, he masters Justice; in a rivalmance Justice masters him.

While I could probably talk about this all day long, I think this is a good example of how the friend/rival system in DA2 really adds to the relationship dynamics and (the all important) replayability. Fenris is somewhat the same, though he just seems angrier as a rivalmance -- I only friendmanced Isabela once, and have never romanced Merrill at all. Anders specifically, with his unique circumstances, really changes from friend to rival, to such an extent that that portion of the game involving him seems entirely different depending on which path you take. I really enjoyed this aspect of it, and hope that they continue in a similar vein.

#63
AkiKishi

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Ponendus wrote...

Allan Schumacher wrote...

I see it from Obsidian as well, which does have close ties to the BioWare people due to the Black Isle days, so maybe that isn't so surprising.

Though I know Avellone has stated he finds a more standard, relatively happy romance less interesting (often with a too clearly defined resolution), so that may affect how he implements them. Although Obsidian's work with Arcade Gannon was such a phenomenally well done homosexual relationship that I had ZERO clue whatsoever that it was even an option because he was just like anyone else unless you got to know him more (which I think is fantastic and awesome way to represent a gay individual).

As an aside, I also like how Shepard is completely unphased by Steve mentioning that he lost his husband, indicating that in his time it's just not an issue. Which I also think is awesome. This coming from a heterosexual, so I can only hope that most of the LGBT community feel it's a good gesture too! (they seem to)


Yes Obsidian has done some good work around that, although I still don't think to the immersive and emotionally connecting standard of BioWare's. I too am exceedingly pleased at how BioWare and others are handling same-sex romances, I agree that Shepherds reaction was very well done, and I thought the same thing. Obviously in Shepherds time homosexuality just isn't an issue. The thing is it takes progressive studios like BioWare to make a difference in society, games are culture, culture influences society. BioWare are making a bigger impact to the LGBT community than possibly they even realise.

Good on them I say!


Alpha Protocols are especially good and varied. Gives the game a very Bond vibe.

Warning semi explicit content

#64
Ponendus

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BobSmith101 wrote...

While they might say it it's likely nothing more than an empty threat. Dating sims have never been big in the west. Relationships in the likes of Persona, Harvest Moon,Star Ocean etc. But never true dating sims.

If the whole romance thing was really that big, you would think that dating sims would actually have at least a niche market.


I'm not entirely sure that's a fair comparison. Has the appeal of a strictly 'dating' game been compared to the appeal of romance within the fantasy RPG setting, within a larger and more dynamic story? Where romance plays a part but is not all that can be experienced?

I am not sure any statistics about dating sims in western cultures are relevant to the situation within BioWare's games. However, I would be interested to see just how many western dating sims there are. I always assumed they were asia-developed games with an anime art style. Is there even an example of a western dating sim that wasn't imported?

Modifié par Ponendus, 25 avril 2012 - 10:13 .


#65
AkiKishi

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Ponendus wrote...
I'm not entirely sure that's a fair comparison. Has the appeal of a strictly 'dating' game been compared to the appeal of romance within the fantasy RPG setting, within a larger and more dynamic story? Where romance plays a part but is not all that can be experienced?

I am not sure any statistics about dating sims in western cultures are relevant to the situation within BioWare's games. However, I would be interested to see just how many western dating sims there are. I always assumed they were asia-developed games with an anime art style. Is there even an example of a western dating sim that wasn't imported?


Romance within a setting has been around for a long time. FF VI onwards, Dragon Quest (various) etc. Persona even lets you choose who you date and honestly it's done a lot better than any Bioware game, aside from the production values. More recently you have the likes of Aragest which not only allows you to choose a partner, but to procreate and create the character for the next chapter of the game with attributes based on the mother and father. Harvest Moon does something similiar in later versions.

I'm all for romance to drive a story. FFVIII/X for example, but just including LIs for the sake of them being there, not really a high priority.

A few western style dating sims have been tried and sunk like a stone. There were a couple in the early DS days, can't recall names though. It's just not sometning that seems to cross cultural boundries to any great degree. Maybe the western outlet is fanfiction.

A good place to look would be Xenoblade. That game does so much right. In the case of romance you have Heart-to-Heart points scattered over the maps. Click one of those with the characters at an appropriate relationship level (and the right time of day) and you get an interactive scene which can further improve, or worsen the relationship.
Relationships are built by having them in your party and by actions in combat (not as complex as Binary Domain but better suited for Dragon Age probably).Part of the problem with Biowares romances are they are just too easy, pick from a list and thats all there is to it.

#66
Cantina

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I find it very interesting seeing people’s responses to this thread.

One of the top reasons I grew attached to the Dragon Age world is how you could romance someone and it plays into the story, makes it more interesting. I do not feel the resources were wasted on this and honestly, if Bioware chose not to incorporate romances in future Dragon Age games, I probably would not buy it.


You know after some much needed sleep I awoke to realizing there was another issue I forgot to mention with Anders romance.

If you are a male Hawke, Anders mentions his previous relationship with Karl, but the female Hawke does not know about it. So if you are a female Hawke either you never know about Karl and Anders relationship or it never happened. I personally got the feeling that it never happened. I feel as though that information could have been directed towards both sexes and not so one-sided.

Zev in Origins was rather open about his sexuality no matter what sex your character is. Would I have been bothered with knowing about Anders relationship with Karl? Nope, I feel it would have added more to getting to know him on a personal level. I just hope in Dragon Age 3 my female character is not cheated out of similar information.

Oh and one more thing, sorry, I cannot rival romance Anders, I have seen how it plays out on YouTube. In some ways, I understand why Anders merged with Justice. The bigger issue is I am a huge mage supporter. If the game were to recognize me supporting the mages but disagreeing with Anders choice on his merger with Justice, then yes, I would do a rivalry romance for the hell of it. However, no matter if, you support the mages, the game assumes you are a Templar supporter. I could not bare the thought of being chastised by Anders for supporting the Templars when I do not. Ugh, just the thought of supporting the Templars makes my skin crawl. Moreover, from my perspective Anders seems well happier if I support him and I like seeing him happy.

**********************************************************************


I am wondering if anyone else here would like to see their romance option take precedence over other people’s opinion in the group.

Let us say you are going to speak to someone about a quest and if you are in a romance, he/she will make a comment. If you are not in a romance, whoever is in the party will default to whoever.

An example of this would be Aveline’s quest “The Long Road.” Sure Isabella’s comments are funny, but I preferred Anders stepping up and saying something. To me his opinion mattered more than Isabella’s humor. In order for me to hear Anders opinion, I had to make sure he was the only person in-group with me through the whole quest.

However, if you go to an NPC about a quest and one of your companions (romance or not) has vital information to bring up or share about the quest they would take precedence.

Am I the only one who would like to see this?

Modifié par Cantina, 25 avril 2012 - 12:06 .


#67
LolaLei

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I think the LI should take precedence if it came to something like, for example, your character gets gravely injured and someone has to run in and save him/her, the LI should be the one to run to your characters side or pull him/her out of the rubble etc. but I don't think the LI should take top priority over random banter/comments during quests because then we'd miss out everyone else's comments that might be more suited to that given scene... If that makes sense?

#68
MichaelStuart

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Cantina wrote...
I am wondering if anyone else here would like to see their romance option take precedence over other people’s opinion in the group.

Let us say you are going to speak to someone about a quest and if you are in a romance, he/she will make a comment. If you are not in a romance, whoever is in the party will default to whoever.

An example of this would be Aveline’s quest “The Long Road.” Sure Isabella’s comments are funny, but I preferred Anders stepping up and saying something. To me his opinion mattered more than Isabella’s humor. In order for me to hear Anders opinion, I had to make sure he was the only person in-group with me through the whole quest.

However, if you go to an NPC about a quest and one of your companions (romance or not) has vital information to bring up or share about the quest they would take precedence.

Am I the only one who would like to see this?


I suppose this would be ok, still I think someone with Isabella personality would always try to speak first.

also why does only one person speak?

Modifié par MichaelStuart, 25 avril 2012 - 12:20 .


#69
Darth Death

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Never really took delight in the romance feature. I found most of them to be tasteless. I just want a better game that lives up to BioWare's old standards.

#70
whykikyouwhy

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MichaelStuart wrote...

Cantina wrote...
I am wondering if anyone else here would like to see their romance option take precedence over other people’s opinion in the group.

Let us say you are going to speak to someone about a quest and if you are in a romance, he/she will make a comment. If you are not in a romance, whoever is in the party will default to whoever.

An example of this would be Aveline’s quest “The Long Road.” Sure Isabella’s comments are funny, but I preferred Anders stepping up and saying something. To me his opinion mattered more than Isabella’s humor. In order for me to hear Anders opinion, I had to make sure he was the only person in-group with me through the whole quest.

However, if you go to an NPC about a quest and one of your companions (romance or not) has vital information to bring up or share about the quest they would take precedence.

Am I the only one who would like to see this?


I suppose this would be ok, still I think someone with Isabella personality would always try to speak first.

also why does only one person speak?

I think who speaks may be contingent on the relationship between the focus of the dialogue (in this case, Aveline) and the other party members. So, building upon what MichaelStuart has noted, Isabela had perhaps a closer relationship with Aveline than the other companions do, even if it is, at that point in the game, mildly antagonistic. Therefore, she plays well into the humor level of that moment - and the teasing of the already anxious guard captain. She has the most to gain (for lack of a better word) to comment at that time.

I wasn't really bothered by instances when a LI did not have any insight or dialogue to share. I really can't think of a moment when the person triggered to comment in a scene seemed to do so awkwardly, or the dialogue was out of place. That was the important thing for me - that the dialogue (the banter, the retorts, the commentary or snarky asides) matched the situation and the character who delivered it.

#71
Sacred_Fantasy

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Cantina wrote...
You know after some much needed sleep I awoke to realizing there was another issue I forgot to mention with Anders romance. 

If you are a male Hawke, Anders mentions his previous relationship with Karl, but the female Hawke does not know about it. So if you are a female Hawke either you never know about Karl and Anders relationship or it never happened. I personally got the feeling that it never happened. I feel as though that information could have been directed towards both sexes and not so one-sided.

I played female Hawke and I always thought Anders was straight.... Until I play male Hawke. But it's not a big deal to me. I took it as none of my business. I never completed playing male Hawke anyway ( since I tend to associate male character as myself which didn't work in DA 2 due to screwed perspective of frame narrative/third person   storytelling, paraphrasing and auto-dialogue or lack of player agency  ) 


Cantina wrote..

Oh and one more thing, sorry, I cannot rival romance Anders, I have seen how it plays out on YouTube. In some ways, I understand why Anders merged with Justice. The bigger issue is I am a huge mage supporter. If the game were to recognize me supporting the mages but disagreeing with Anders choice on his merger with Justice, then yes, I would do a rivalry romance for the hell of it. However, no matter if, you support the mages, the game assumes you are a Templar supporter. I could not bare the thought of being chastised by Anders for supporting the Templars when I do not. Ugh, just the thought of supporting the Templars makes my skin crawl. Moreover, from my perspective Anders seems well happier if I support him and I like seeing him happy.

His biggest problem, however, he did not trust you enough with his plan to bomb the Chantry. He didn't think you'll support him for that matter and he never discussed it with you -          which resulted my female Hawke stabbed him. That was the only and last romance path I took. After that I stop caring for all the companions and completely lost any interest with romance/rivalry options. But it's wasn't Anders who kill my interest for romance option. It's was restricted one dimensional interaction. I used to enjoy talking privately with Morrigan for hours under the moon at campsite in DAO. I found it romantic. Now such experience is gone.




Cantina wrote..


I am wondering if anyone else here would like to see their romance option take precedence over other people’s opinion in the group. 

Let us say you are going to speak to someone about a quest and if you are in a romance, he/she will make a comment. If you are not in a romance, whoever is in the party will default to whoever.

An example of this would be Aveline’s quest “The Long Road.” Sure Isabella’s comments are funny, but I preferred Anders stepping up and saying something. To me his opinion mattered more than Isabella’s humor. In order for me to hear Anders opinion, I had to make sure he was the only person in-group with me through the whole quest.

However, if you go to an NPC about a quest and one of your companions (romance or not) has vital information to bring up or share about the quest they would take precedence.

Am I the only one who would like to see this?

I think Varric did very well stepping up as diplomat. I recalled he saved me from slaugtering some thugs and cheat a templar for easy access into a cave. If LI for example Merril's opinion  take precedence over Varric's opinion, then it would be awkward since Merril was known to be naive and clumsy. 

#72
mousestalker

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I'm content with both tragic and happy romances. The romances need to flow out of who the characters are and what choices they make. If that leads to a happy resolution, that's good, if not, then that's good as well. Ideally, there ought to be a nice mix of possibilities.

What romances shouldn't feel is forced or rushed.

Some of us like to linger a while and proceed deliberately.

#73
LolaLei

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So long as the romances are varied and personal to each LI then over all I won't be too bothered about the sex scenes.

#74
Cyberstrike nTo

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Maria Caliban wrote...

Romance Anders in Dragon Anders 3, need to Anders make a roAndersring come back. PS: Anders.

I liked the Merrill and Isabela romances, but would like to be able to kiss my LI at any time. I liked that the sex scenes were tailored to the character but would like more skin.


I agree with that 100%, and I will explain further.

Every LI in DA II has issues. For example Isabela, (now I interpret this from her dialogue when she talks about her husband and maybe I'm wrong but just bear with me), it's about how she isn't going to be hurt both physically and mentally. In the first sex scenes with her, it should be hot and steamy, but I think she would have to be in control of it, and I don't think she would ever let Hawke be on top of her. Now if you stay loyal to her, after her final loyalty quest in Act 3, in which she finally says she's falling for Hawke you should be rewarded with another sex scene, this one slow and erotic, in this one shows Isabela on her back and Hawke on top of her. This is her showing that she trusts Hawke 100% and she will stay with Hawke. 


If you romance Merrill on the other hand it should be a little awkward, because it's her first time with a human, and maybe she doesn't know much about sex. So it should have been gentle and a little funny. After you finish her loyalty quest in Act 3 you should be rewarded with a sensual sex scene that Merrill starts and controls. This shows that she has learned about sex and she wants to be with Hawke.


I could go but since I have never romanced Fenris or Anders I don't think I should talk about something I know very little about.

My point is: that if done right a combination of dialogue and more than one and different sex scenes for the various different LIs can give player some insight into the LIs and how they grown and changed through the story, and etc.   

#75
Pasquale1234

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Sidney wrote...

DA2 upgraded the romance situation a great deal because in DAO you could blow through the whole romance option in very rapid fashion - if you hit the Mage Tower first thing after Lothering you could actually "complete" the Morrigan romance in one conversation. The pacing was off because, well, there was no pacing.


I'd say the pacing was controlled by the player, not the game - which I vastly prefer.

katiebour wrote...

Fenris, Anders, and Isabela all have non-standard builds. Anders is skinnier than the default OMG!BUFF!Hawke body, Fenris's markings would have to be custom, and Izzy's assets do not match the somewhat slim default F!Hawke body.

Also, the companions were built with body and clothing being one asset, hence why we couldn't change their clothes. If you took the clothes off, they'd simply have invisible bodies. Of course modders have managed to fix this for PC players, somewhat, but the bodies/markings still don't match well.

For Merrill, they already had a corseted f!elf model from the Blooming Rose to reuse, and that's why she was the only LI to appear in lingerie.

So if you're wondering why they were still clothed, there's your answer. Not enough time or resources to devote to custom models for each, especially if most players would only romance one or two of the LIs, making the return on the investment of time and money minimal.


Among the many reasons why I prefer standard body models for companions - the tradeoff, including lack of armor customization, is too costly.

mousestalker wrote...

I'm content with both tragic and happy romances. The romances need to flow out of who the characters are and what choices they make. If that leads to a happy resolution, that's good, if not, then that's good as well. Ideally, there ought to be a nice mix of possibilities.

What romances shouldn't feel is forced or rushed.

Some of us like to linger a while and proceed deliberately.


This - although I would also say that DA2's 3 year time skips felt odd.

I liked the balance in DAO, the fact that some LIs (Leliana) would not be intimate with the Warden unless she was at 100%, whereas Morrigan would end intimacy if her affection grew to that level.