444 réponses à ce sujet

[Irishfafnir]

tractrpl wrote...

Irishfafnir wrote...

Actually judging the strictness of immigration law is disernable, or would you say that Arizona's new immigration laws are impossible to judge? 

You miss my point that anti-illegal immigration legislation is not drawn by party lines, my point was to refute your insuation that the Republican party is dominated by people who are for stricter legislation on illegal immigration. By pointing out the fact that Texas a historically conservative state had a more liberal( meaning progressive not party) policy towards illegal immigration then the State of California which has been historyically liberal ( in the party sense), refutes your assertion that illegal immigration politics are drawn by party affiliation. 

I think it is also important to note that the American rhetoric is largely directed at illegal immigrants rather then European rhetoric which is directed towards legal citizens.

I wasn't actually talking about immigration. I was talking about how my aunt said that people who voted for Obama should be kicked out of the USA, or shot. I was also talking about how my grandparents use racial epithets towards Chinese and blacks. Many of my family have similar attitudes towards Muslims as those Europeans. I do not think my family as a whole is backwards, it's actually a fairly typical attitude held by a sizeable portion of Oklahomans. If not the majority, then like 1/3 or more of Oklahomans think like my family does. Over half vote Republican even though not all Republicans think like that. However, Oklahoma is not an unusual state in that regard compared to most southern states. Many of the people I've met from the South think just the way my family and my former high school classmates do.

The difference is anti-muslim rhetoric in Europe turns into legislative action, that of the United States does not. 

[Irishfafnir]

tractrpl wrote...

Irishfafnir wrote...

Come on man, have you ever actually been to a third world country. Having been to India I can tell you that the poor here are vastly better off then the poor in third world countries

China's not a third world country now? I've also been to Hong Kong, Afghanistan (work there as a military contractor), Kuwait, UAE, Mexico, Colombia and Guatemala.

Please watch that video. I filmed it in Nanjing, China.

Yea the poor of Afghanistan are way better off then the poor in America, stupidest comment you have made tonight

[tractrpl]

I could have you tour my hometown, with ramshackle buildings with roofs made of tin, people living in run down trailer homes. Then I can take you to Mississippi and Arkansas where it's actually much worse. It gets better as you head through Georgia but not by much.

[tractrpl]

Irishfafnir wrote...

tractrpl wrote...

Irishfafnir wrote...

Come on man, have you ever actually been to a third world country. Having been to India I can tell you that the poor here are vastly better off then the poor in third world countries

China's not a third world country now? I've also been to Hong Kong, Afghanistan (work there as a military contractor), Kuwait, UAE, Mexico, Colombia and Guatemala.

Please watch that video. I filmed it in Nanjing, China.

Yea the poor of Afghanistan are way better off then the poor in America, stupidest comment you have made tonight

Did I say they're worse off? Afghanistan is unusually poor, but many parts of the US are as bad off as China, or worse.

[Irishfafnir]

tractrpl wrote...

I could have you tour my hometown, with ramshackle buildings with roofs made of tin, people living in run down trailer homes. Then I can take you to Mississippi and Arkansas where it's actually much worse. It gets better as you head through Georgia but not by much.

and those people have access to government funded programs, access to higher education and the ability to have socio- economic mobility that is absent in third world countries. 

I'm not denying that there are not poor people in the United States, but they are much better off then in a third world country. 


Some people people in China still essentially live in the 19th century. No one essentially in America does. 

Modifié par Irishfafnir, 27 avril 2012 - 03:14 .

[tractrpl]

Irishfafnir wrote...

The difference is anti-muslim rhetoric in Europe turns into legislative action, that of the United States does not. 

We don't have nearly as many Muslim immigrants as they do, but our Hispanic immigrations are similar, and it could be argued that in many states, our laws discriminating against hispanic immigration is comparable.

[Irishfafnir]

tractrpl wrote...

Irishfafnir wrote...

The difference is anti-muslim rhetoric in Europe turns into legislative action, that of the United States does not. 

We don't have nearly as many Muslim immigrants as they do, but our Hispanic immigrations are similar, and it could be argued that in many states, our laws discriminating against hispanic immigration is comparable.

Not true again, you really really need to stop making statements you know nothing about. For instance if you were to say China has a much better physics program then South Korea I wouldn't be able to offer any response, because I know essentially nothing about it, I wouldn't just make something up.

We target illegal immigration in the United States, France and Belgium largely target CITIZENS of their country. There is a huge difference, one is there illegally and one are citizens. We do not have laws that specifically target just hispanics ( arugably the arizona law does but it is before the supreme court for that very purpose). We don't ban the wearing of hispanic garments in public, limit hispanic prayer, kick out hispanic leaders, and limit the size of hispanic churches. 

3 million muslims in the United States, 4 million in France, 700,000 in Belgium. We do have alot of muslims here. 

Modifié par Irishfafnir, 27 avril 2012 - 03:21 .

[Chuvvy]

Western dev, western audience, western characters. It's not a hard concept to grasp.

[tractrpl]

Irishfafnir wrote...

tractrpl wrote...

I could have you tour my hometown, with ramshackle buildings with roofs made of tin, people living in run down trailer homes. Then I can take you to Mississippi and Arkansas where it's actually much worse. It gets better as you head through Georgia but not by much.

and those people have access to government funded programs, access to higher education and the ability to have socio- economic mobility that is absent in third world countries. 

I'm not denying that there are not poor people in the United States, but they are much better off then in a third world country. 

I think it depends on which third world country you are referring to. In my opinion, some of these people are worse off than, say, a Taiwanese person.  China's perhaps a bad example because it's so huge. The poor person in Nanjing has guaranteed housing and medical care, which certainly is better than people in Mississippi. However, there are some very remote parts of China that the government can't even access, and those people are really poor. However, that doesn't invalidate my statement. I restricted not poor people nationwide, but certain parts of the country. Most of Mississippi is like a third world country, or a post apocalyptic hellhole, more like. My point is that states like that are so bad and a nation like ours shouldn't ever look like that. There's no excuse for that, given our wealth. 

[tractrpl]

Irishfafnir wrote...

Not true again, you really really need to stop making statements you know nothing about. For instance if you were to say China has a much better physics program then South Korea I wouldn't be able to offer any response, because I know essentially nothing about it, I wouldn't just make something up.

We target illegal immigration in the United States, France and Belgium largely target CITIZENS of their country. There is a huge difference, one is there illegally and one are citizens. We do not have laws that specifically target just hispanics ( arugably the arizona law does but it is before the supreme court for that very purpose). We don't ban the wearing of hispanic garments in public, limit hispanic prayer, kick out hispanic leaders, and limit the size of hispanic churches. 

3 million muslims in the United States, 4 million in France, 700,000 in Belgium. We do have alot of muslims here. 

When I say "alot more" I meant proportional to their population. 3 million Muslims is just a little less than the 4 million in France, but France has 65 million people compared to our 313 million. So proportionally, they have nearly ten times as many Muslims as we do. I'm not justifying their behavior, I'm just showing how bigotry crosses all boundaries. China's bigotry is no exception. Anyway's that's tangential to the topic, let's get back.

[Irishfafnir]

tractrpl wrote...

Irishfafnir wrote...

tractrpl wrote...

I could have you tour my hometown, with ramshackle buildings with roofs made of tin, people living in run down trailer homes. Then I can take you to Mississippi and Arkansas where it's actually much worse. It gets better as you head through Georgia but not by much.

and those people have access to government funded programs, access to higher education and the ability to have socio- economic mobility that is absent in third world countries. 

I'm not denying that there are not poor people in the United States, but they are much better off then in a third world country. 

I think it depends on which third world country you are referring to. In my opinion, some of these people are worse off than, say, a Taiwanese person.  China's perhaps a bad example because it's so huge. The poor person in Nanjing has guaranteed housing and medical care, which certainly is better than people in Mississippi. However, there are some very remote parts of China that the government can't even access, and those people are really poor. However, that doesn't invalidate my statement. I restricted not poor people nationwide, but certain parts of the country. Most of Mississippi is like a third world country, or a post apocalyptic hellhole, more like. My point is that states like that are so bad and a nation like ours shouldn't ever look like that. There's no excuse for that, given our wealth. 

In theory the poor in the United States have access to free healthcare through medicaid, and housing via welfare and other social programs.

Taiwan is hardly the third world, and to quote you said " some areas of the south are just as bad as many third world countries". Which is just blantantly false. 

The war on poverty was declared by the Johnson administration back in the 1960's, since then great strides have been made. We still have alot of work to do, but things are better. 

Regardless of their poverty they have the ability for their children to remove themsleves from poverty which is not nearly as accessable in a third world nation. You can be born dirt poor in the United States, go to college on the government's dime and remove yourself from poverty. That can't be done in many third world nations. 

[Irishfafnir]

tractrpl wrote...

Irishfafnir wrote...

Not true again, you really really need to stop making statements you know nothing about. For instance if you were to say China has a much better physics program then South Korea I wouldn't be able to offer any response, because I know essentially nothing about it, I wouldn't just make something up.

We target illegal immigration in the United States, France and Belgium largely target CITIZENS of their country. There is a huge difference, one is there illegally and one are citizens. We do not have laws that specifically target just hispanics ( arugably the arizona law does but it is before the supreme court for that very purpose). We don't ban the wearing of hispanic garments in public, limit hispanic prayer, kick out hispanic leaders, and limit the size of hispanic churches. 

3 million muslims in the United States, 4 million in France, 700,000 in Belgium. We do have alot of muslims here. 

When I say "alot more" I meant proportional to their population. 3 million Muslims is just a little less than the 4 million in France, but France has 65 million people compared to our 313 million. So proportionally, they have nearly ten times as many Muslims as we do. I'm not justifying their behavior, I'm just showing how bigotry crosses all boundaries. China's bigotry is no exception. Anyway's that's tangential to the topic, let's get back.

France has the largest muslim population in europe. But Belgium, Austria, Denmark have also all passed similiar legislation with populations that comprise of only something like 3-6% of their population. There is a sharp difference between how the US politcal parties treat muslims and the far right in some european countries. 

You can google around and find alot of information regarding Le Penns party in France because of their elections. For belgium google Vlamms Belang probably less information but just as scary. 

Modifié par Irishfafnir, 27 avril 2012 - 03:36 .

[tractrpl]

Irishfafnir wrote...

Taiwan is hardly the third world, and to quote you said " some areas of the south are just as bad as many third world countries". Which is just blantantly false. 

Did you watch my video? Please, I encourage you to do so. I think, short of actually visiting China, you won't be able to see where I'm coming from. Many people have this impression of China of people working in rice patties riding bicycles everywhere. I'm sure that happens, but not from what I saw.

[tractrpl]

Irishfafnir wrote...

France has the largest muslim population in europe. But Belgium, Austria, Denmark have also all passed similiar legislation with populations that comprise of only something like 3-6% of their population. There is a sharp difference between how the US politcal parties treat muslims and the far right in some european countries. 

You can google around and find alot of information regarding Le Penns party in France because of their elections. For belgium google Vlamms Belang probably less information but just as scary. 

I agree. The way they treat their citizens is somewhat hypocritical given how they chide they US. However, this is tangential to the topic.

Edit: I think you meant to compare how US political parties treat hispanics to how the far right in some european countries treat muslims, no?

Modifié par tractrpl, 27 avril 2012 - 03:43 .

[Drake_Hound]

There are no extremely poor people on the internet , for them to be considered really poor .
They wouldn't have access to internet and certainly do not have so much time to waste online.
To post about being poor in a games forum !

Pftt they need to make money farming gold !
What we have are the social spoiled who act poor , but know damn well they are lazy gits .

[Lamepro]

For the last time James Vega is Puerto Rican he almost looks like Ricky Martin but bulky.

[Irishfafnir]

tractrpl wrote...

Irishfafnir wrote...

Taiwan is hardly the third world, and to quote you said " some areas of the south are just as bad as many third world countries". Which is just blantantly false. 

Did you watch my video? Please, I encourage you to do so. I think, short of actually visiting China, you won't be able to see where I'm coming from. Many people have this impression of China of people working in rice patties riding bicycles everywhere. I'm sure that happens, but not from what I saw.

No, because it is not relevant. A few years ago National Geographic did an article on the Gaza strip of the west bank. One of the things it mentioned was a new luxourous mall that had just been built. While I am sure the mall was great it did not reflect the realities of the the daily lives of the people of the west bank. Just like my example of mass. does not reflect the economic condition of the United States as a whole. 

I Think you are getting your Chinese and Vietmanese steroptypes mixed up. Most poorly informed americans probably think all chinese work in ****ty factories for low income. 

[eternalnightmare13]

thehomeworld wrote...

Yeah and all the heroes in Japanese video games are Asian. So should we be pissed at that too OP? Really get a new hobby if it bothers you so.

+1

[tractrpl]

Irishfafnir wrote...

I Think you are getting your Chinese and Vietmanese steroptypes mixed up. Most poorly informed americans probably think all chinese work in ****ty factories for low income. 

I think poorly imformed Americans think that the Vietnamese stereotypes apply to Chinese. If they're poorly informed, what makes you think they won't generalize the entire continent? I certainly know people in my family have. However, my point is that you can't just assume that China will always be the way it is now, and that America will always be the way it is now. For the latter, I might forgive, we've been the most powerful for at least 3 generations. For the former, I couldn't forgive you. They've been changing so quickly that it's hard to predict where they might go. Certainly many economists don't see why their economy couldn't surpass ours, given our difficulty in recovering from this last financial crisis while they've been more or less steaming forwards.

Modifié par tractrpl, 27 avril 2012 - 03:48 .

[Irishfafnir]

tractrpl wrote...

Irishfafnir wrote...

I Think you are getting your Chinese and Vietmanese steroptypes mixed up. Most poorly informed americans probably think all chinese work in ****ty factories for low income. 

I think poorly imformed Americans think that the Vietnamese stereotypes apply to Chinese. However, my point is that you can't just assume that China will always be the way it is now, and that America will always be the way it is now. For the latter, I might forgive, we've been the most powerful for at least 3 generations. For the former, I couldn't forgive you. They've been changing so quickly that it's hard to predict where they might go. Certainly many economists don't see why their economy couldn't surpass ours, given our difficulty in recovering from this last financial crisis while they've been more or less steaming forwards.

Noone is saying china will always be the same it is now. 

I think you are largely arguging against what you percieve as sterotypes rather then anything anyone is saying in particular.

Modifié par Irishfafnir, 27 avril 2012 - 03:49 .

[tractrpl]

Irishfafnir wrote...

Noone is saying china will always be the same it is now. 

But you are saying America will be where it is now, right? Look, even if America doesn't backslide, China could overtake the size of our economy in absolute terms easily. They may not be per capita the richest, but we aren't either, yet we still dominate. If they do become economically dominant, then they could eventually become technologically and culturally dominant if they keep that position long enough.

Modifié par tractrpl, 27 avril 2012 - 03:51 .

[medcsu]

There is utterly no comparison between the poor in Afghanistan to ANY race of the poor in the US. Not even up for a discussion. Illegal Aliens in the US can cross the border, step into a hospital and receive top notch medical care because no hospital can turn someone away in need (which is something illegals tend to take advantage of waiting for a woman to be 9 months pregnant before crossing).
Have you been to Afghanistan? Well I have, served 2 tours there and also live(d) in the southern states and it isn't even close to being comparable.

[tractrpl]

In all, given enough time, I doubt American culture will be the dominant one at some point in the future. Perhaps when that happens, the world will have changed so much that there may not be anything recognizable as "western" culture, anyway.

[tractrpl]

medcsu wrote...

There is utterly no comparison between the poor in Afghanistan to ANY race of the poor in the US. Not even up for a discussion. Illegal Aliens in the US can cross the border, step into a hospital and receive top notch medical care because no hospital can turn someone away in need (which is something illegals tend to take advantage of waiting for a woman to be 9 months pregnant before crossing).
Have you been to Afghanistan? Well I have, served 2 tours there and also live(d) in the southern states and it isn't even close to being comparable.

I never compared. He asked if I've ever visited 3rd world countries. I threw that in there because it's a country I visited, not one I was comparing. I was mostly comparing a place like Mississippi to parts of China. I haven't seen all of China, but the parts I have visited are much nicer as a whole than any part of Mississipi I've ever been to.

[Irishfafnir]

tractrpl wrote...

Irishfafnir wrote...

Noone is saying china will always be the same it is now. 

But you are saying America will be where it is now, right? Look, even if America doesn't backslide, China could overtake the size of our economy in absolute terms easily. They may not be per capit the richest, but we aren't either, yet we still dominate. If they do become economically dominant, then they could eventually become technologically and culturally dominant if they keep that position long enough.

I am saying America will continue to remain an economic and military major power for the forseeable future. 

No one is saying China won't overtake the US economy. There are 4-5 times as many of them as us, it would be virtually impossible to outperform them forever.

The Western World dominates because its forms of government and economic systems have been proven to be superior to those of the rest of the world.

Is it possible that economic domination by china eventually leads to them having a technoligcal and cultural dominant position in the world? Sure, although the evidence right now favors Western domination in technology along with Japan ( who is arguably a western country).

Cultural domination is harder to argue. Because the size of ones economy or country does not have to reflect its culture impact on the world. Greece would probably be the best example. Or the Soviet Union largest country in the world second largest economy but its culture was not attractive to the rest of the world.

Modifié par Irishfafnir, 27 avril 2012 - 03:58 .