472 réponses à ce sujet

[Orumon]

ZIPO396 wrote...

Eain wrote...

Nyoka wrote...

Synthesis has no redeeming qualities. Scratch it out.

Control would have been good if you directly take the means to control the reapers from the illusive man's cold dead hands. You want control, you take it. Not just obey space kid.

Destruction must have side effects or else it would been the perfect choice, making picking control pointless. You don't like killing the geth, fine, kill the earth instead or whatever. Or destroy the mass relays. But there has to be a downside to the destruction of the reapers to make the other choice not pointless.

I agree that there should be a downside to destroying the Reapers. You don't walk away from a war like this without serious damage. Sure. I would've been cool with sacrificing an object rather than a species though. So yeah, the Earth instead of the Geth. Humanity's spread across the stars anyway, so while the loss of Earth would be painful it wouldn't destroy an entire species. It also relates more closely to the original theme of the game, ie take earth back.

I could go with the loss of Earth. As long as the people I know by name made it off in time. Preferably.

A TRIUMPH OF MORAL MYOPIA!!

Seriously, I share your sentiment.

[mauro2222]

Orumon wrote...

Samtheman63 wrote...

Being alive means you eventually die, machines don't die they are always destroyed/shutdown/broke in one way or another

You are aware that it's actually only one part in our genes (that controls cell replication) that prevents us from living forever barring accident, and it's actually foreseeably solvable. Granted, then the next major problem becomes cancer on a much grander scale than ever before, but hey, one step at a time.

Or That it's only the complexity of our brains that prevents us from resurrecting people with their minds intact (fixing or even replacing the heart is comparatively easy, since muscles actually keep very well.) Again, these problems will be solved in time.

Dying is just a failure of systems. You lungs fail, you die. Your liver fails, you die, PAINFULLY. You heart fails, you die. You kidneys fail, you die.

Human bodies (brains especially) are perhaps some of the most efficient machines parts in the known world, considering what they're made from.

Indeed, tell that to a Lobster or to the Turritopsis Nutricula. Racist bastard

Modifié par mauro2222, 25 avril 2012 - 03:01 .

[dreman9999]

The Angry One wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...
1. But EC clearifies th eending. I f he is trying to do so during the interview, that means he is working on EC.

Speculation.

2. That is not proof at all. Look up the defination of rebel.

Sigh. Listen to the damn Catalyst.
He says that the created will always rebel against the creators thus synthetics will exterminate all organic life, hence the need for the Reaper cycle.
Except that he's using an incredibly stupid leap in logic to get from A (synthetics rebelling) to B (synthetics killing everything, everywhere).

Also, note that he prothean may of attack the zha anyway even if the zha"till did not exsist based on the protheans nature. Also, consider what a galexy would be like if the older races from the past cycle were allowed to live.  I'm thinking small pond, big fishes eating little fishes.

So what? The Protheans did not practice genocide, they conquered.
The Council uplifted and welcomed new species as equals.

1. Dedcutive reasoning.
2.And it because of the nature of organics. Ask yourself this, why do people rebel? Is it not because of the acion of the people who are in charge of there government?People rebel because they dissagree with the choice the one who are in charge make. The quarian wanted the geth to die, the geth dissagreed....Thus they rebeled. You are confusing who attacked first with rebeled. In the meaning of rebel, who attacks first is irrelivent, all that is important to the meaning is that the one who are sapposed to be summisive rebell ageinst the ones in charge.

Also, yes the protheans did practice genocide. Remeber the commets by Javik about it...His commet  was"they were give the option to join us or be destroyed". I also remeber him sayiny they burn many worlds  just to kill off the all the richni when they lost control of them. And look up the meaing of subserviant first before say the other races that the protheans up lifted were made equals.

Modifié par dreman9999, 25 avril 2012 - 03:05 .

[Galifreya]

At first, I hated all three options. They all sounded like complete bullsh*t. Control and Synthesis still are.

I'm under the impression, however, that the shiny little brat is lying through his shiny little teeth when he tells you that Destroy will absolutely kill all synthetic life. I don't believe it. I've seen EDI step out of the Normandy in the Destroy ending, and Shepard also survives, provided your EMS is high enough. I bet the Geth are just fine, as well.

There is no reason why I should trust anything that little brat says, ever. In fact, there is one glaring reason not to trust him. Ever. Massive, multi-cycle xenocide. The fact that they destroy all advanced organic life based on something that might happen, is a perfect reason not to trust him. So how can anyone, in good conscience, trust this thing's judgement? When Shepard says earlier in the game that "you cannot condemn an entire race based on something that might happen"? Really, Shepard? You're just going to forget all of that? Everything that happened with the Geth and the Krogan and....REALLY?

It just doesn't make any f*cking sense.

Destroy the damned Reapers. Because we know what will happen if they are allowed to continue to exist. You'll either have to morph the entire galaxy, against their will, into half-organic/half-synthetic Cylons (which is what the Reapers WANT), OR, you can just -tell- the Reapers to go away, hoping that they don't come back. All three options wreak of bullsh*t for a reason. Because the child? Is full of it.

One option just wreaks a little less, IF you assume that the little bastard is lying. Which I think is a pretty safe assumption at this point.

I just hate that kid so much.... SO MUCH. He's so...f*cking...evil.

Modifié par Gallifreya, 25 avril 2012 - 03:02 .

[mauro2222]

dreman9999 wrote...

mauro2222 wrote...

pistolols wrote...

GuitarShredUK wrote...

A) Control - never in a million years would any of my Shepards even consider this.

Your Shepard rewrote the geth.  Clearly you must not know him very well.

It's not the same, and what if the choose Destroy?

It is that same. It exactly the same thing. Rewriting the geth is the same as control. Destory is th same thing as destorying the geth.

Nope... rewriting means changing something. Control is to take their free will, by rewriting you're altering their free will, changing their views, their logic, not transforming them into puppets. And I was talking about destroy the geth, not the "Destroy ending".

Modifié par mauro2222, 25 avril 2012 - 03:04 .

[The_Other_M]

Catroi wrote...

1. I am not a genocidal maniac
2. I won't change the whole galaxy's DNA without asking anyone
3. I'm not TIM I know controlling the reapers is a bad idea

^^This

[Orumon]

Eain wrote...

TheOptimist wrote...

Eain wrote...

Nyoka wrote...

Synthesis has no redeeming qualities. Scratch it out.

Control would have been good if you directly take the means to control the reapers from the illusive man's cold dead hands. You want control, you take it. Not just obey space kid.

Destruction must have side effects or else it would been the perfect choice, making picking control pointless. You don't like killing the geth, fine, kill the earth instead or whatever. Or destroy the mass relays. But there has to be a downside to the destruction of the reapers to make the other choice not pointless.

I agree that there should be a downside to destroying the Reapers. You don't walk away from a war like this without serious damage. Sure. I would've been cool with sacrificing an object rather than a species though. So yeah, the Earth instead of the Geth. Humanity's spread across the stars anyway, so while the loss of Earth would be painful it wouldn't destroy an entire species. It also relates more closely to the original theme of the game, ie take earth back.

So instead of betraying the Geth you betray humanity AND all the groundforces of other species still on the planet, including Wrex, Major Kirrahe, and all the ME2 squaddies. NO. ****ING. THANKS.

Well it beats genociding a sentient lifeform. I mean replace the Geth with any species in the universe and ask me to pick the destroy option. I still won't do it. But replace that with sacrificing Earth, Thessia, Palaven, anything, and it's a better pick. Just how I see it.

People are important, not the land, right?

[Orumon]

nitefyre410 wrote...


Lets see down sides okay.. 

Billions dead 
Billions more in displaced refugees  in places where supplies are already very limited. 
Massive, food, water and medical supply shortages. 
Riots do supply shortages.  
entire economies  in shambles.  
increase in piracy because  decimated  militaries  and supply shortages.
Enitire governents in  disorder..  
A break down of law and order because the these.  Things get nasty when people can't get food and water and start getting desperate.
all this across the entire  galaxy,Yeah the  Reapers are dead but its not sunshine and rainbows here.. 
 

They only thing they needed to do is show the devastion that  was left in the wake of the war and we the players would see the price that was paid.  

And that's disregarding the crappy ending choice. Seriously, the cut down endings enough.

[dreman9999]

mauro2222 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

mauro2222 wrote...

pistolols wrote...

GuitarShredUK wrote...

A) Control - never in a million years would any of my Shepards even consider this.

Your Shepard rewrote the geth.  Clearly you must not know him very well.

It's not the same, and what if the choose Destroy?

It is that same. It exactly the same thing. Rewriting the geth is the same as control. Destory is th same thing as destorying the geth.

Nope... rewriting means changing something. Control is to take their free will, by rewriting you're altering their free will, changing their views, their logic, not transforming them into puppets. And I was talking about destroy the geth, not the "Destroy ending".

I'm sorry but rewriting someones thoughts to the way you want them to be is controling....It's also called indoctrination.

Modifié par dreman9999, 25 avril 2012 - 03:08 .

[The Angry One]

Shaigunjoe wrote...

How do we know its the same result?

Synthetic and organic bonded together as one.

I never said geth had DNA, you seem to think the catalyst is just taking the standard double helix and wraps it around them, but that isn't what happens at all.  There is no single explanation, you can draw influence from the Hamiliton books as the biteks can reproduce (using a form of DNA) and are linked to humanity, but thats just one example, feel free to use your imagination.

How about no. How about BioWare tell me just what the hell happened. Or, you know, even just hint at it.
The fact that you have to refer to external sources just shows that you have no idea what it means too.
As countless people have been quick to point out, it's their story. If it's their story, then they can tell it.

Modifié par The Angry One, 25 avril 2012 - 03:08 .

[Orumon]

ZIPO396 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Eain wrote...

TheOptimist wrote...

Eain wrote...

Nyoka wrote...

Synthesis has no redeeming qualities. Scratch it out.

Control would have been good if you directly take the means to control the reapers from the illusive man's cold dead hands. You want control, you take it. Not just obey space kid.

Destruction must have side effects or else it would been the perfect choice, making picking control pointless. You don't like killing the geth, fine, kill the earth instead or whatever. Or destroy the mass relays. But there has to be a downside to the destruction of the reapers to make the other choice not pointless.

I agree that there should be a downside to destroying the Reapers. You don't walk away from a war like this without serious damage. Sure. I would've been cool with sacrificing an object rather than a species though. So yeah, the Earth instead of the Geth. Humanity's spread across the stars anyway, so while the loss of Earth would be painful it wouldn't destroy an entire species. It also relates more closely to the original theme of the game, ie take earth back.

So instead of betraying the Geth you betray humanity AND all the groundforces of other species still on the planet, including Wrex, Major Kirrahe, and all the ME2 squaddies. NO. ****ING. THANKS.

Well it beats genociding a sentient lifeform. I mean replace the Geth with any species in the universe and ask me to pick the destroy option. I still won't do it. But replace that with sacrificing Earth, Thessia, Palaven, anything, and it's a better pick. Just how I see it.

Can anyone prove the star child is telling the truth?

Can anyone prove he ain't?

Yes, the Geth prove what he says in incorrect. Therefore, what he says is an untruth. It may not be a lie, but it's an untruth due to the fact that his words are WRONG!

[mauro2222]

dreman9999 wrote...

I'm sorry but rewriting someones thoughts to the way you want them to be is controling....It's also called indoctrination.

And?... read again.

They still have their free will, and... the geth actually sided again with the Reapers. The control option doesn't allow that.

Modifié par mauro2222, 25 avril 2012 - 03:11 .

[dreman9999]

Orumon wrote...

ZIPO396 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Eain wrote...

TheOptimist wrote...

Eain wrote...

Nyoka wrote...

Synthesis has no redeeming qualities. Scratch it out.

Control would have been good if you directly take the means to control the reapers from the illusive man's cold dead hands. You want control, you take it. Not just obey space kid.

Destruction must have side effects or else it would been the perfect choice, making picking control pointless. You don't like killing the geth, fine, kill the earth instead or whatever. Or destroy the mass relays. But there has to be a downside to the destruction of the reapers to make the other choice not pointless.

I agree that there should be a downside to destroying the Reapers. You don't walk away from a war like this without serious damage. Sure. I would've been cool with sacrificing an object rather than a species though. So yeah, the Earth instead of the Geth. Humanity's spread across the stars anyway, so while the loss of Earth would be painful it wouldn't destroy an entire species. It also relates more closely to the original theme of the game, ie take earth back.

So instead of betraying the Geth you betray humanity AND all the groundforces of other species still on the planet, including Wrex, Major Kirrahe, and all the ME2 squaddies. NO. ****ING. THANKS.

Well it beats genociding a sentient lifeform. I mean replace the Geth with any species in the universe and ask me to pick the destroy option. I still won't do it. But replace that with sacrificing Earth, Thessia, Palaven, anything, and it's a better pick. Just how I see it.

Can anyone prove the star child is telling the truth?

Can anyone prove he ain't?

Yes, the Geth prove what he says in incorrect. Therefore, what he says is an untruth. It may not be a lie, but it's an untruth due to the fact that his words are WRONG!

No, they don't....The reapers point is long term if you're refering to the quarian /geth peace.
If you're refering to the geth up rising...Look up the meaning of rebel....the geth up rising is exactly it.

[Orumon]

ZIPO396 wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

ZIPO396 wrote...

Can anyone prove he ain't?

Geth say hi.

Nah he thinks in infinite time. Meaning it's still possible for it to happen over a long standing future. Or he's thinking we make a self replicating nano-machine that eats everything a grey goo scenario.

Actually, using the infinite time always brings the worst case scenario argument (probability calculations) is a poor way to predict the future.

He uses circular logic to attempt to push his side of the argument, but that's basically saying he uses the same proof that any priest does.

No offence to any professional priests here.

[dreman9999]

mauro2222 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

I'm sorry but rewriting someones thoughts to the way you want them to be is controling....It's also called indoctrination.

And?... read again.

They still have their free will, and... the geth actually sided again with the Reapers. The control option doesn't allow that.

Yes, Seran still had free will and everything as long as he did everything the reapers wanted.

What can be rewrited can be rewritten agein. The point being, If they rewrite someone thoughts you are controling them. 
Beside, we can change their minds agein or destory them. Nothing diffent then before.

Modifié par dreman9999, 25 avril 2012 - 03:17 .

[CapnManx]

Orumon wrote...


Yes, the Geth prove what he says in incorrect. Therefore, what he says is an untruth. It may not be a lie, but it's an untruth due to the fact that his words are WRONG!

Well, not really.  The fact that the Geth aren't killing people right now doesn't prove that they won't end up destroying organic life.  It's not like StarBrat lays out a timetable for this stuff.

[nitefyre410]

Orumon wrote...

nitefyre410 wrote...


Lets see down sides okay.. 

Billions dead 
Billions more in displaced refugees  in places where supplies are already very limited. 
Massive, food, water and medical supply shortages. 
Riots do supply shortages.  
entire economies  in shambles.  
increase in piracy because  decimated  militaries  and supply shortages.
Enitire governents in  disorder..  
A break down of law and order because the these.  Things get nasty when people can't get food and water and start getting desperate.
all this across the entire  galaxy,Yeah the  Reapers are dead but its not sunshine and rainbows here.. 
 

They only thing they needed to do is show the devastion that  was left in the wake of the war and we the players would see the price that was paid.  

And that's disregarding the crappy ending choice. Seriously, the cut down endings enough.

 

Which is my whole point - If they want  to so how much of a sacrifice had been made, they could have just shown everything that I listed.    

The endings are really that pointless in getting anything across of than just writers inflated egos.

[dreman9999]

Orumon wrote...

ZIPO396 wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

ZIPO396 wrote...

Can anyone prove he ain't?

Geth say hi.

Nah he thinks in infinite time. Meaning it's still possible for it to happen over a long standing future. Or he's thinking we make a self replicating nano-machine that eats everything a grey goo scenario.

Actually, using the infinite time always brings the worst case scenario argument (probability calculations) is a poor way to predict the future.

He uses circular logic to attempt to push his side of the argument, but that's basically saying he uses the same proof that any priest does.

No offence to any professional priests here.

As stated by someone in this topic before, what if the reaper saw what they were refering to before? What if they did see all life inthe galexy die off before?

[Shaigunjoe]

The Angry One wrote...
Synthetic and organic bonded together as one.

But with an entirely new DNA framework, which is unprecedented in the ME world.

How about no. How about BioWare tell me just what the hell happened. Or, you know, even just hint at it.
The fact that you have to refer to external sources just shows that you have no idea what it means too.
As countless people have been quick to point out, it's their story. If it's their story, then they can tell it.

The fact that I have to refer to other sources just shows that I am tired of explaning my interpretation at this point, and prefer to point to things that I think are similar.

I was under the impression that this was the player's story.  Leaving an ending open to interpretation kind of drives home that point.

[Kunari801]

pistolols wrote...

GuitarShredUK wrote...

A) Control - never in a million years would any of my Shepards even consider this.

Your Shepard rewrote the geth.  Clearly you must not know him very well.

The Reapers took the Geth's free will away, you're just restoring (freeing) them so they can choose for themselves. 

[Langeman]

A short note on economics (and I'm sorry for being very vague...);

It is said/read somewhere in the game (ME3) that a certain state (or many more likely, as in all Council-worlds) have had so large expenses in fighting the Reapers that they are on the brink of financial bankruptcy, and this as I've said is a very likely end-state for most worlds involved in the war and since almost all worlds are involved in the war there ain't many states willing or capable of giving massive loans to fix financial crisis, and I doubt that there are enough private actors (corporations/mass-billionaires etc.) to give loans of that size.

This should mean that after ME3 ending the galaxy is in complete galactic bankruptcy, which makes it kinda hard to fund research for better FTL-drives and so on, for as long as the new Galactic Depression is in event.

Am I just being nihilistic or doesn't this question make some sense/contain logic?

[mauro2222]

dreman9999 wrote...

mauro2222 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

I'm sorry but rewriting someones thoughts to the way you want them to be is controling....It's also called indoctrination.

And?... read again.

They still have their free will, and... the geth actually sided again with the Reapers. The control option doesn't allow that.

Yes, Seran still had free will and everything as long as he did everything the reapers wanted.

What can be rewrited can be rewritten agein. The point being, If they rewrite someone thoughts you are controling them. 
Beside, we can change their minds agein or destory them. Nothing diffent then before.

Saren? we are talking about rewriting the geth not indoctrination.

And you are still missing the point, "Control ending" takes their free will, "Rewriting" does not, it's an alteration.

[dreman9999]

Kunari801 wrote...

pistolols wrote...

GuitarShredUK wrote...

A) Control - never in a million years would any of my Shepards even consider this.

Your Shepard rewrote the geth.  Clearly you must not know him very well.

The Reapers took the Geth's free will away, you're just restoring (freeing) them so they can choose for themselves. 

The reapers did not take the geth's free will away. The geht. the portion of the geth, chosed to be with the reaper of their own free will. You the only one indoctrinating ony one in this case.

[AtlasMickey]

I feel like the fleet is still out there fighting the Reapers above Earth, that the ending really hasn't been finished yet.

Right, the selection of ending choices is intentionally provocative. No one is supposed to want them, it seems. But when the ending DLC comes and we get more clarification and closure, we'll know better what is meant by the endings and we'll be able to decide.