622 réponses à ce sujet

[MegumiAzusa]

dreman9999 wrote...

Newnation wrote...

Dude, you're still not providing actual proof that Shepard was indoctrinated. All of the things you're pointing out is still circumstantial evidence and speculation.

Indoctrination is suble, no one will know till it's too late. If there is proof to question if Shep is indoctrinated then IT  has a solid  point, which is my point. I don't have to show undiniable proof because if indoctrination works the way it sould and stated to be there would be no undiniable proof.  The reapers would not leave undeniable proof pointing to it, just  thing  to suppect it. The ironic thing about this is that this is the same case with trying to prove the reapers were real . No proof, just things to suppect.

The only flaw in that statement is your teammates are quite obvious in it, hearing hums, or the line I linked in my other post. But as Shep doesn't respond to it it could be seen as Shep being indoctrinated so s/he doesn't notice. (There are a few things throughout ME3 that are Reaper tech that Shep just doesn't notice like the Indoctrination Booster in the monastery)

[FS3D]

dreman9999 wrote...

FS3D wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

lord_shift wrote...

Yes, because the world is black and white, either one extreme or another. I come here to discuss the ending. /sarcasm

Please do not try to paint me with the same limited palette you color your view of the world.

It not a black and white thing. It's human behavior. If you did not care you would not be here, point blank. Heck, you're not really dicussing the ending anyway. It human logic to not involve your self with something you no longer have feeling for.

You don't know that. To suggest otherwise is arrogance in the extreme.

I cannot sell my copy of ME3, or I would have done so. I still visit the boards in the slim chance that they might redeem themselves, but I'm not holding my breath.

I come here to see what else is going to go down next. It's like a train wreck, and people like you going on about this entitlement business like you did in previous posts is pretty amusing.

Don't tell other people how to conduct themselves and whether they have a right to post here or not. It's not your right.

I'm not. I'm just saying what human nature is. I said if they were done with BW they would not be here not should not be here. It human nature to do things for a reason. If a person is done with BW, what'sthe reaso to be here? That's my point.

But that's not right either. It might be human nature to you, but not everyone is like you. I already gave my own reasons for staying around here, and they have almost nothing to do with my believing that they'll actually redeem themselves.

Do you think people slow down to see a car crash on a highway because they want to be there? No. They slow down to see a crash on a highway because they're curious.

The same is true here. People who are done with BioWare and EA are still going to come here and see what other nonsense is going to come along next. They do not have to go just because you think it's "human nature".

[balance5050]

FS3D wrote...

But that's not right either. It might be human nature to you, but not everyone is like you. I already gave my own reasons for staying around here, and they have almost nothing to do with my believing that they'll actually redeem themselves.

Do you think people slow down to see a car crash on a highway because they want to be there? No. They slow down to see a crash on a highway because they're curious.

The same is true here. People who are done with BioWare and EA are still going to come here and see what other nonsense is going to come along next. They do not have to go just because you think it's "human nature".

All he said was it's human nature to do things for a reason. Do you not have any reason behind your actions?

[Lyrebon]

There is no "best" ending because they all sucked. Ergo, your theory is wrong. MIND BLOWN!!

[dreman9999]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Newnation wrote...

Dude, you're still not providing actual proof that Shepard was indoctrinated. All of the things you're pointing out is still circumstantial evidence and speculation.

Indoctrination is suble, no one will know till it's too late. If there is proof to question if Shep is indoctrinated then IT  has a solid  point, which is my point. I don't have to show undiniable proof because if indoctrination works the way it sould and stated to be there would be no undiniable proof.  The reapers would not leave undeniable proof pointing to it, just  thing  to suppect it. The ironic thing about this is that this is the same case with trying to prove the reapers were real . No proof, just things to suppect.

The only flaw in that statement is your teammates are quite obvious in it, hearing hums, or the line I linked in my other post. But as Shep doesn't respond to it it could be seen as Shep being indoctrinated so s/he doesn't notice. (There are a few things throughout ME3 that are Reaper tech that Shep just doesn't notice like the Indoctrination Booster in the monastery)

It really something to inply susppect of it. It reallyis not proof. As much as I am pro IT, I can admit there is no realy direct proof of it.

[zarnk567]

Lyrebon wrote...

There is no "best" ending because they all sucked. Ergo, your theory is wrong. MIND BLOWN!!

(Head explodes)

[Bill Casey]

We know Bioware is this...

tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/LyingCreator

So we'll either get this...

tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Jossed

Or get to say this...

tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/IKnewIt

[FS3D]

I would like to respond to this part of the post on the last page:

balance5050 wrote...

 
The evidence is that he wakes up amongst concrete rubble after just being in the middle of this:
  
 
[SNIP!]

Also, look at Shepards eyes when he chooses either control or synthesize

 

I've no doubt that these aspects of the game were put in there for a reason, initially. But they didn't go through with it in the end, because they couldn't get the game mechanics to work properly with the idea, according to the Final Hours app.

So while there are tell-tales to the indoctrination IDEA, in the end, it's not canon until BioWare puts an explanation in game, either through the EC DLC, or some other DLC down the road.

And I see no point speculating otherwise until then, because to engage in this sort of speculation is to do precisely what EA wants, which is to talk about their pile of crap ending as if it's somehow deep and meaningful, when it's nothing of the kind.

This is exactly what they want... Speculation, and I say we should stop giving it to them... And FORCE them to give us a proper conclusion to the game instead of this... This... Whatever the hell they think it is.

[Jaron Oberyn]

Hey guys I brought new straws, the old ones were getting sweaty from all that grasping.




I find it surprising that people are still clinging to the indoctrination excuse. If you read the ending as written by Mac Walters, all on one sheet of paper, you'd see indoctrination is nowhere to be found move on guys...

-Polite

[dreman9999]

FS3D wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

FS3D wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

lord_shift wrote...

Yes, because the world is black and white, either one extreme or another. I come here to discuss the ending. /sarcasm

Please do not try to paint me with the same limited palette you color your view of the world.

It not a black and white thing. It's human behavior. If you did not care you would not be here, point blank. Heck, you're not really dicussing the ending anyway. It human logic to not involve your self with something you no longer have feeling for.

You don't know that. To suggest otherwise is arrogance in the extreme.

I cannot sell my copy of ME3, or I would have done so. I still visit the boards in the slim chance that they might redeem themselves, but I'm not holding my breath.

I come here to see what else is going to go down next. It's like a train wreck, and people like you going on about this entitlement business like you did in previous posts is pretty amusing.

Don't tell other people how to conduct themselves and whether they have a right to post here or not. It's not your right.

I'm not. I'm just saying what human nature is. I said if they were done with BW they would not be here not should not be here. It human nature to do things for a reason. If a person is done with BW, what'sthe reaso to be here? That's my point.

But that's not right either. It might be human nature to you, but not everyone is like you. I already gave my own reasons for staying around here, and they have almost nothing to do with my believing that they'll actually redeem themselves.

Do you think people slow down to see a car crash on a highway because they want to be there? No. They slow down to see a crash on a highway because they're curious.

The same is true here. People who are done with BioWare and EA are still going to come here and see what other nonsense is going to come along next. They do not have to go just because you think it's "human nature".

No, human nature is human nature. It's not belief or ideals that are based on socity rule but thing made up on are own. It's our animal nature. If scared we panic, if arrosed we are attracted to what we are arroused to. If we don't lie something, we stay away from it. If we are angry at something we want to confront it. This is true with everyperson, the difference is how we apply these feeling and control them. That is  what the difference of aperson applies.
If you done with BW, based on human nature you should not be here, unless you angry at bw. Be angry you want to confront them about what you're angry about...That mean you not done with BW.  My point is you're not done with BW being that you're still here.

[MegumiAzusa]

dreman9999 wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Newnation wrote...

Dude, you're still not providing actual proof that Shepard was indoctrinated. All of the things you're pointing out is still circumstantial evidence and speculation.

Indoctrination is suble, no one will know till it's too late. If there is proof to question if Shep is indoctrinated then IT  has a solid  point, which is my point. I don't have to show undiniable proof because if indoctrination works the way it sould and stated to be there would be no undiniable proof.  The reapers would not leave undeniable proof pointing to it, just  thing  to suppect it. The ironic thing about this is that this is the same case with trying to prove the reapers were real . No proof, just things to suppect.

The only flaw in that statement is your teammates are quite obvious in it, hearing hums, or the line I linked in my other post. But as Shep doesn't respond to it it could be seen as Shep being indoctrinated so s/he doesn't notice. (There are a few things throughout ME3 that are Reaper tech that Shep just doesn't notice like the Indoctrination Booster in the monastery)

It really something to inply susppect of it. It reallyis not proof. As much as I am pro IT, I can admit there is no realy direct proof of it.

Didn't say it's proof. I for one think Shep bested indoctrination after the scene with Anderson and TIM, but there is no denying that Shep is controlled at some point, and if it's TIM it's the Reapers that control Shep as the Reapers control TIM. Easy as that.

[Taboo]

PoliteAssasin wrote...

Hey guys I brought new straws, the old ones were getting sweaty from all that grasping.




I find it surprising that people are still clinging to the indoctrination excuse. If you read the ending as written by Mac Walters, all on one sheet of paper, you'd see indoctrination is nowhere to be found move on guys...

-Polite

[luzburg]

i like the indoc theory but i dont care if only shepard and CO is reunited in a destroy(shepard lives) ending

[lord_shift]

FS3D wrote...

I would like to respond to this part of the post on the last page:

balance5050 wrote...

 
The evidence is that he wakes up amongst concrete rubble after just being in the middle of this:
  
 
[SNIP!]

Also, look at Shepards eyes when he chooses either control or synthesize

 

I've no doubt that these aspects of the game were put in there for a reason, initially. But they didn't go through with it in the end, because they couldn't get the game mechanics to work properly with the idea, according to the Final Hours app.

So while there are tell-tales to the indoctrination IDEA, in the end, it's not canon until BioWare puts an explanation in game, either through the EC DLC, or some other DLC down the road.

And I see no point speculating otherwise until then, because to engage in this sort of speculation is to do precisely what EA wants, which is to talk about their pile of crap ending as if it's somehow deep and meaningful, when it's nothing of the kind.

This is exactly what they want... Speculation, and I say we should stop giving it to them... And FORCE them to give us a proper conclusion to the game instead of this... This... Whatever the hell they think it is.

This. Personally, if BioWare would just get off of their high horse and admit they screwed up the ending or their implementation of their idea, then hell, it's all good, dude. Everyone makes mistakes. Only the arrogant deny it or hide behind weak excuses. I would have so much more respect for BioWare if they just admit their fault.

But, their arrogance artistic integrity won't allow that.

[Unschuld]

 Funny thing is that Indoc theory is built on a litany of circumstantial evidence collected from clues given in all three games. Its opponents constantly claim that the theorists are grasping at straws, interpreting bugs and irrelevant information as proof for the theory that isn't really there. Whenever they find any tiny bit of circumstantial evidence that *might* contradict it, they vehemently claim that Indoc theory has been "blown out of the water" and "proven false" yet again. Yet, when some Bioware employee posts something that might support Indoctrination, they say that Bioware is just lying again. Does anyone else see the hypocrisy in this?

What Gamble said in the tweet is not concrete evidence either way. He stated an opinion. Depending on how you interpret it, Gamble himself might be "indoctrinated" and actually helping the theory. All of this, on both sides, is still just conjecture at this point and BOTH camps would be foolish to take it as otherwise.

Modifié par Unschuld, 26 avril 2012 - 06:07 .

[balance5050]

FS3D wrote...


I've no doubt that these aspects of the game were put in there for a reason, initially. But they didn't go through with it in the end, because they couldn't get the game mechanics to work properly with the idea, according to the Final Hours app.

So while there are tell-tales to the indoctrination IDEA, in the end, it's not canon until BioWare puts an explanation in game, either through the EC DLC, or some other DLC down the road.

And I see no point speculating otherwise until then, because to engage in this sort of speculation is to do precisely what EA wants, which is to talk about their pile of crap ending as if it's somehow deep and meaningful, when it's nothing of the kind.

This is exactly what they want... Speculation, and I say we should stop giving it to them... And FORCE them to give us a proper conclusion to the game instead of this... This... Whatever the hell they think it is.

But.. but.. speculating is exactly what you're doing right here is it not?

It's not the fist time a game has been sold with out an ending (Prince of Persia, FF13-2, Asura's Wrath) they just wanted us to meta game with what we think the twist will be.

Modifié par balance5050, 26 avril 2012 - 06:08 .

[dreman9999]

PoliteAssasin wrote...

Hey guys I brought new straws, the old ones were getting sweaty from all that grasping.




I find it surprising that people are still clinging to the indoctrination excuse. If you read the ending as written by Mac Walters, all on one sheet of paper, you'd see indoctrination is nowhere to be found move on guys...

-Polite

I find it funny that you have yet proved that the old straws were false...http://social.biowar...75/blog/212630/

Modifié par dreman9999, 26 avril 2012 - 06:10 .

[clarkusdarkus]

look man i just wanted to kill the reapers and move on in life, why the hell confuse everything with control and synthesis.

[Jaron Oberyn]

On Mac Walters ending paper, he states speculation, not indoctrination mr. Dreman9999. I encourage you to seek out the sheet of paper from the final hours app. Could change your life. Just the sheer grandness of the writing skills exhibited on that piece of paper is enough to blow you away.

-Polite

[balance5050]

PoliteAssasin wrote...

Hey guys I brought new straws, the old ones were getting sweaty from all that grasping.




I find it surprising that people are still clinging to the indoctrination excuse. If you read the ending as written by Mac Walters, all on one sheet of paper, you'd see indoctrination is nowhere to be found move on guys...

-Polite

Your'e forgetting everything else that was on that paper; like The end of The Matrix, A Brave New World. Both of these things have to do with "using technology to control the mind".

Also, that piece of paper was written early in production, BEFORE November when they were working on the inodctrination gameplay sequence.

[dreman9999]

PoliteAssasin wrote...

On Mac Walters ending paper, he states speculation, not indoctrination mr. Dreman9999. I encourage you to seek out the sheet of paper from the final hours app. Could change your life. Just the sheer grandness of the writing skills exhibited on that piece of paper is enough to blow you away.

-Polite

Right, because dev  would put up spoilers for up coming dlc in doc just because. /srcasum ..
Also,that paper hs been posted in this topic many times over...It proves nothing and already been countered many time on in this topic and other topics. So please try something else like real proof that shows IT is false.
I'll post his again if you mised my points...
http://social.biowar...75/blog/212630/ 

Modifié par dreman9999, 26 avril 2012 - 06:18 .

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

Indoctrination Theory has been the fans' masterful attempt at polishing a turd of an ending. They got something really shiny, but it still stinks (until the ending gets completely rewritten, which it never will be). Hence, IT is finished. Shepard should just have been given a line to tell James to put a tinfoil hat on if the noise is bothering him. And you know that's been the entire problem. Everyone who has been indoctrinated has not worn a tinfoil hat.

Haven't you all figured out that Green is the canon ending for the next Mass Effect series? That's why its the most difficult to reach. It's the union of organics with the Reapers. So what if it violates every law of physics. It's space magic because Starbrat is really god and you're really the catalyst. They're just going to retcon the mass relays exploding out of it. Eugenics: Prepare for the future!

In this EC that's coming out I think they're going to leave the RED ending with the mass relays becoming destroyed by exploding into the next relay , then into the next relay, and into the next relay, and so on instead of blowing up to minimize the damage to the star systems. This will leave all the fleets stranded except via their standard FTLs which returning home is going to be cumbersome and slow if at all possible. The galaxy will be in a local cluster space exploration stage. Team dex is f***ed. The Geth are ****ed. And I'm guessing they will strand your LI and co on planet Gilligan just to be mean.

Blue is the other possible canon, and that might be more palatable. The cinematics are going to have to be cut here, just because there was no mention of the relays being destroyed. Basically the reapers just leave. Shepard is now chief of galactic police. But I'm thinking they didn't want to rob the Blue choosers the glory of the explosions which in this case make no sense at all since all that's needed is a signal broadcast to all the reapers saying "I have control. Stop. Return to dark space, except for Harbinger. You go sit in the corner."

[balance5050]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

Indoctrination Theory has been the fans' masterful attempt at polishing a turd of an ending. They got something really shiny, but it still stinks (until the ending gets completely rewritten, which it never will be). Hence, IT is finished. Shepard should just have been given a line to tell James to put a tinfoil hat on if the noise is bothering him. And you know that's been the entire problem. Everyone who has been indoctrinated has not worn a tinfoil hat.

Haven't you all figured out that Green is the canon ending for the next Mass Effect series? That's why its the most difficult to reach. It's the union of organics with the Reapers. So what if it violates every law of physics. It's space magic because Starbrat is really god and you're really the catalyst. They're just going to retcon the mass relays exploding out of it. Eugenics: Prepare for the future!

In this EC that's coming out I think they're going to leave the RED ending with the mass relays becoming destroyed by exploding into the next relay , then into the next relay, and into the next relay, and so on instead of blowing up to minimize the damage to the star systems. This will leave all the fleets stranded except via their standard FTLs which returning home is going to be cumbersome and slow if at all possible. The galaxy will be in a local cluster space exploration stage. Team dex is f***ed. The Geth are ****ed. And I'm guessing they will strand your LI and co on planet Gilligan just to be mean.

Blue is the other possible canon, and that might be more palatable. The cinematics are going to have to be cut here, just because there was no mention of the relays being destroyed. Basically the reapers just leave. Shepard is now chief of galactic police. But I'm thinking they didn't want to rob the Blue choosers the glory of the explosions which in this case make no sense at all since all that's needed is a signal broadcast to all the reapers saying "I have control. Stop. Return to dark space, except for Harbinger. You go sit in the corner."

Ending at face value = garbage.

I.T. ending = Super meta, fourth wall breaking, masterful use of "Chekhovs Gun". 

[dreman9999]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

Indoctrination Theory has been the fans' masterful attempt at polishing a turd of an ending. They got something really shiny, but it still stinks (until the ending gets completely rewritten, which it never will be). Hence, IT is finished. Shepard should just have been given a line to tell James to put a tinfoil hat on if the noise is bothering him. And you know that's been the entire problem. Everyone who has been indoctrinated has not worn a tinfoil hat.

Haven't you all figured out that Green is the canon ending for the next Mass Effect series? That's why its the most difficult to reach. It's the union of organics with the Reapers. So what if it violates every law of physics. It's space magic because Starbrat is really god and you're really the catalyst. They're just going to retcon the mass relays exploding out of it. Eugenics: Prepare for the future!

In this EC that's coming out I think they're going to leave the RED ending with the mass relays becoming destroyed by exploding into the next relay , then into the next relay, and into the next relay, and so on instead of blowing up to minimize the damage to the star systems. This will leave all the fleets stranded except via their standard FTLs which returning home is going to be cumbersome and slow if at all possible. The galaxy will be in a local cluster space exploration stage. Team dex is f***ed. The Geth are ****ed. And I'm guessing they will strand your LI and co on planet Gilligan just to be mean.

Blue is the other possible canon, and that might be more palatable. The cinematics are going to have to be cut here, just because there was no mention of the relays being destroyed. Basically the reapers just leave. Shepard is now chief of galactic police. But I'm thinking they didn't want to rob the Blue choosers the glory of the explosions which in this case make no sense at all since all that's needed is a signal broadcast to all the reapers saying "I have control. Stop. Return to dark space, except for Harbinger. You go sit in the corner."

1. If you think we are polishing a turd,t hen you don't understand what we want with IT. Look up one of the of the three IT  theories and you'll understand we don't want to polish a turd. Wanting to have he ending stay at face value is polishing a turd. Like what you want.
2. You do know that control solve nothing of the problem. Thinkof what the meaning of "You will control the reapers but everything you are dies" mean. If every thing you are dies, what is the guarrrentee that you would want to stop the reapers after you control them?

Modifié par dreman9999, 26 avril 2012 - 06:24 .

[IronSabbath88]

I still believe IT.

Problem?