897 réponses à ce sujet

[matthewmi]

MisterJB wrote...

matthewmi wrote...
lol we're all humans and we have no qualms killing each other, this utopian idea is truly pie in the sky.  If there is still free will afterwards I could choose to go around and start killing everyone and get like minded individuals to do the same how does synthesis solve anything? 

But as humans, we are still divided into nations. There are, of course, people who have mental problems or simply enjoy kill and I imagine these will still exist after Synthesis. However, the main cause of wars is political differences, nations competing for power and such.
Synthesis could blur these differences, allow for more effective methods of communication like the geth share.
At its core, this idea is beautiful but it is simply far too complex to present only in the last 10 minutes of the game. Hopefully, it will be better explained in the EC.

I could make a new robot race if I felt like it and turn it loose on the galaxy, to reap and reap, synthesis is as dumb as it is unethical and immoral.

Maybe Synthesis simply makes it impossible to do. Even Joker's hat appears to have circuits in it.
Perhaps any attempt at creating Synthetic life will be pointless because it will, automatically, contain the Reaper Code.
That, evidently, begs the question. How will Synthesis decide what's an extremely advanced computer and what is Synthetic Life? But the same question can be made of the Destroy ending so, it's not exclusive to Synthesis.

We have very effective means of communicating called talking..  All of your assumptions assume a loss of individual thought or limiting choices, seems highly....problematic. I love the game don't get me wrong and I am not one who wants all new endings I just think synthesis is nonsensical and very very unethical and immoral especially considering you have two options that don't force you to change the whole galaxy.  I pick destroy I'd rather kill some robots and let organics evolve on their own then "uplift" all organic life (also seems to uplift fabrics since everyones clothes glow), sorta how like the Salarians uplifted the Krogan and we all know how well that turned out.

[MisterJB]

Taboo-XX wrote...

The causes of troubles are far worse than political leaders and divided nations.

I can't take you seriously if you believe that that is the cause of all of humanities problems.

Oh God, Why?

Fine, the cause of all humanity's problem are, in fact, humans, because we are, in our cores, selfish and greedy.

Or is that still not the right answer to an amazingly complex problem that we have tried to come up with a solution for since the dawn of our sentience?
Please, enlighten me. Seriously, I always take the opportunity to learn more.

[HinduCowGirl]

@Taboo-XX:
So what Bioware is saying is that they will NOT change anything, just add some crap to "clarify" their so called "artsy fartsy" ending, is that it?

Well, if the do NOT change it, or atleast add other endings, then I believe they can just pack it up and get in line at the unemployment office...

It's funny how the words of Sovereign now echoes in my head: "There is a realm of existence so far beyond your own you cannot even imagine it. I am beyond your comprehension. I am Sovereign". Seems like this is the angle of approach they have on us. We'll let me tell you: "you can be broken!"

[Taboo]

MisterJB wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

The causes of troubles are far worse than political leaders and divided nations.

I can't take you seriously if you believe that that is the cause of all of humanities problems.

Oh God, Why?

Fine, the cause of all humanity's problem are, in fact, humans, because we are, in our cores, selfish and greedy.

Or is that still not the right answer to an amazingly complex problem that we have tried to come up with a solution for since the dawn of our sentience?
Please, enlighten me. Seriously, I always take the opportunity to learn more.

It is. It is also what makes us who we are. There  is no foundation for one individual to make a choice to change the way the Universe works.

We are who we are because the Universe made us that way. There is no ethical reason to rewrite the way thing have worked since the dawn of time.

Species evolve and die out. They come and go. Humans will eventually die out as well. This is the way the Universe works.

Modifié par Taboo-XX, 26 avril 2012 - 07:21 .

[Taboo]

HinduCowGirl wrote...

@Taboo-XX:
So what Bioware is saying is that they will NOT change anything, just add some crap to "clarify" their so called "artsy fartsy" ending, is that it?

Well, if the do NOT change it, or atleast add other endings, then I believe they can just pack it up and get in line at the unemployment office...

It's funny how the words of Sovereign now echoes in my head: "There is a realm of existence so far beyond your own you cannot even imagine it. I am beyond your comprehension. I am Sovereign". Seems like this is the angle of approach they have on us. We'll let me tell you: "you can be broken!"

I have no idea. Michael Gamble is well aware now what people think of his opinion. And the popular opinion on the site is Destroy. People don't care for Synthesis and I thought I would take the liberty to tell Bioware that.

[Wulfram]

MisterJB wrote...

To remove boundaries between species. No longer will words like "human" or "turian" or "geth" will set walls between us. Equality, peace.
I think it's beautiful.

But the differences are what make us what we are.

[Taboo]

Wulfram wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

To remove boundaries between species. No longer will words like "human" or "turian" or "geth" will set walls between us. Equality, peace.
I think it's beautiful.

But the differences are what make us what we are.

I'm still in awe that Bioware doesn't realize this.

Do you honestly expect us to lap it up?

[Muhkida]

Taboo-XX wrote...

HinduCowGirl wrote...

@Taboo-XX:
So what Bioware is saying is that they will NOT change anything, just add some crap to "clarify" their so called "artsy fartsy" ending, is that it?

Well, if the do NOT change it, or atleast add other endings, then I believe they can just pack it up and get in line at the unemployment office...

It's funny how the words of Sovereign now echoes in my head: "There is a realm of existence so far beyond your own you cannot even imagine it. I am beyond your comprehension. I am Sovereign". Seems like this is the angle of approach they have on us. We'll let me tell you: "you can be broken!"

I have no idea. Michael Gamble is well aware now what people think of his opinion. And the popular opinion on the site is Destroy. People don't care for Synthesis and I thought I would take the liberty to tell Bioware that.

Has he even stated that he'd prefer synthesis over the other two endings?  I know he said he thought destroy wasn't the best ending, but that doesn't imply that he favors synthesis overall.  Unless I missed a tweet....

Modifié par Muhkida, 26 avril 2012 - 07:25 .

[Taboo]

Muhkida wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

HinduCowGirl wrote...

@Taboo-XX:
So what Bioware is saying is that they will NOT change anything, just add some crap to "clarify" their so called "artsy fartsy" ending, is that it?

Well, if the do NOT change it, or atleast add other endings, then I believe they can just pack it up and get in line at the unemployment office...

It's funny how the words of Sovereign now echoes in my head: "There is a realm of existence so far beyond your own you cannot even imagine it. I am beyond your comprehension. I am Sovereign". Seems like this is the angle of approach they have on us. We'll let me tell you: "you can be broken!"

I have no idea. Michael Gamble is well aware now what people think of his opinion. And the popular opinion on the site is Destroy. People don't care for Synthesis and I thought I would take the liberty to tell Bioware that.

Has he even stated that he'd prefer synthesis over the other two endings?  I know he said he thought destroy wasn't the best ending, but that doesn't imply that he favors synthesis overall.  Unless I missed a tweat....

That was the inference I made. Bioware has also stated that it was intended to be the best ending.

Awe. Pure awe at the miscalculation.

[Redwing198403]

What I don't get is how can the series say using reaper tech like the relays is bad for evolution and technological advancement, uplifting species like the krogan and forcing their evolution is bad... But go ahead and skip to the "end of evolution" with synthesis through unearned tech. They drive home the idea that whether good or bad we must earn our future on our own terms only to chuck that idea right out the window.

[MisterJB]

Taboo-XX wrote...
It is. It is also what makes us who we are. There  is no foundation for one individual to make a choice to change the way the Universe works.

We are who we are because the Universe made us that way. There is no ethical reason to rewrite the way thing have worked since the dawn of time.

Species evolve and die out. They come and go. Humans will eventually die out as well. This is the way the Universe works.

Funny, Reapers would tell you that the Cyce is the way the Universe works and it can't be stopped.
If any change brings improvement to the life of sentients, there is no reason we should refuse that change.

[CmnDwnWrkn]

It's starting to look more and more like the ending was intended to be entirely metaphorical.  I was afraid of this.

There is simply no basis for "synthesis", if taken literally, to create the type of Shangri-La that Gamble is implying.

His interpretation only makes sense if you take "organic" & "synthetic" & "synthesis" to be metaphors for something.

My take on what he's trying to say...

Organic = Group A
Synthetic = Group B
Synthesis = "Come on people now, smile on your brother, everybody get together, and try to love one another right now."

[MisterJB]

Wulfram wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

To remove boundaries between species. No longer will words like "human" or "turian" or "geth" will set walls between us. Equality, peace.
I think it's beautiful.

But the differences are what make us what we are.

Creatures whose first tought when we encouter a different life form is: "Let's kill it."? (First Contact War, The Morning War)
I think we can afford some changes

Modifié par MisterJB, 26 avril 2012 - 07:28 .

[HinduCowGirl]

Taboo-XX wrote...

I have no idea. Michael Gamble is well aware now what people think of his opinion. And the popular opinion on the site is Destroy. People don't care for Synthesis and I thought I would take the liberty to tell Bioware that.

If you have means to reach in, I think you should. They really need to address this. They need to get this fixed not just clarified.

At the moment the game it self is getting ripped into pieces. And the longer they wait before they come with any sort of announcement on how they're going to meet the demands, the more the fact that they need to redo the whole game is getting inevitable

[Taboo]

MisterJB wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...
It is. It is also what makes us who we are. There  is no foundation for one individual to make a choice to change the way the Universe works.

We are who we are because the Universe made us that way. There is no ethical reason to rewrite the way thing have worked since the dawn of time.

Species evolve and die out. They come and go. Humans will eventually die out as well. This is the way the Universe works.

Funny, Reapers would tell you that the Cyce is the way the Universe works and it can't be stopped.
If any change brings improvement to the life of sentients, there is no reason we should refuse that change.

Uh...uh. 

Are you....are you suggesting that the Reapers know more about how the Universe works? Were they there at the Big Bang? The Universe functions on a cycle and will until the ultimate fate occurs. Have you ever read anything by Stephen Hawking or Carl Sagan? Do you know that the Universe functions? Hawking has argued that the Universe is indeed geared toward life, but only for a while. Eventually problems will arise and life will be wiped out regardless.

As for improvements..........you believe that losing what we are in a literal sense is a good thing? You are no longer human in Synthesis. Or Asari, or turian. You are the offspring of the descision of ONE person. Who has that right to make that descision. Do I? Do you? This is were the political implications set in. Do one being have the right to enforce his will on others? How can you justify this?

[matthewmi]

MisterJB wrote...

Wulfram wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

To remove boundaries between species. No longer will words like "human" or "turian" or "geth" will set walls between us. Equality, peace.
I think it's beautiful.

But the differences are what make us what we are.

Creatures whose first tought when we encouter a different life form is: "Let's kill it."? (First Contact War, The Morning War)
I think we can afford some changes

Since we've never encountered another truly sentient species...as of now aliens are only make believe I don't know where you're getting this. 

Modifié par matthewmi, 26 avril 2012 - 07:33 .

[Reidbynature]

Taboo-XX wrote...

Wulfram wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

To remove boundaries between species. No longer will words like "human" or "turian" or "geth" will set walls between us. Equality, peace.
I think it's beautiful.

But the differences are what make us what we are.

I'm still in awe that Bioware doesn't realize this.

Do you honestly expect us to lap it up?

Maybe it's worse than that.  What if they don't realise they are taking away that diversity?  Maybe they believe that because everything looks largely the same cosmetically that it's perfectly ok that everyone is forcibly made transhuman and that somehow that itself inherently stops any real fighting (because everyone being the same mix of tech/organics and just being different was the real issue in all of the conflicts that happened ).

[Faded-Myth]

I'm more surprised than anything that BioWare's doctors, of all people, could find this idea appealing. Even on a science-fiction level, (which shouldn't matter anyway since good science-fiction deals with real scientific implications, specifically those that affect us as a species), it's just an appalling idea.

Modifié par Faded-Myth, 26 avril 2012 - 07:34 .

[Taboo]

HinduCowGirl wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

I have no idea. Michael Gamble is well aware now what people think of his opinion. And the popular opinion on the site is Destroy. People don't care for Synthesis and I thought I would take the liberty to tell Bioware that.

If you have means to reach in, I think you should. They really need to address this. They need to get this fixed not just clarified.

At the moment the game it self is getting ripped into pieces. And the longer they wait before they come with any sort of announcement on how they're going to meet the demands, the more the fact that they need to redo the whole game is getting inevitable

I've already rustled Mr. Gamble before. I got him to post in a thread I created. If I reach futher in I'm afraid of what might happen. Mr Gamble can come and comment if he wishes. I would never force him to do so. I do want him to be aware however.

[BouncyCaitian]

The Catalyst: "We will bring Order To Chaos."

Shepard: "Let there be....Disharmony."

[MisterJB]

matthewmi wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

Wulfram wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

To remove boundaries between species. No longer will words like "human" or "turian" or "geth" will set walls between us. Equality, peace.
I think it's beautiful.

But the differences are what make us what we are.

Creatures whose first tought when we encouter a different life form is: "Let's kill it."? (First Contact War, The Morning War)
I think we can afford some changes

Since we've never encountered another truly sentient species...don't know where you're getting this. 

Aren't we discussing the ME Universe here?

[ShepnTali]

CmnDwnWrkn wrote...

It's starting to look more and more like the ending was intended to be entirely metaphorical.  I was afraid of this.

There is simply no basis for "synthesis", if taken literally, to create the type of Shangri-La that Gamble is implying.

His interpretation only makes sense if you take "organic" & "synthetic" & "synthesis" to be metaphors for something.

My take on what he's trying to say...

Organic = Group A
Synthetic = Group B
Synthesis = "Come on people now, smile on your brother, everybody get together, and try to love one another right now."

Like, hey man, synthesis is groovy. Can you dig that?

[Taboo]

matthewmi wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

Wulfram wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

To remove boundaries between species. No longer will words like "human" or "turian" or "geth" will set walls between us. Equality, peace.
I think it's beautiful.

But the differences are what make us what we are.

Creatures whose first tought when we encouter a different life form is: "Let's kill it."? (First Contact War, The Morning War)
I think we can afford some changes

Since we've never encountered another truly sentient species...don't know where you're getting this. 

I haven't understood much of his reasoning before. He sounds like one of those crazed anime villains I watched on Toonami when I was a kid.

[HinduCowGirl]

Taboo-XX wrote...

HinduCowGirl wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

I have no idea. Michael Gamble is well aware now what people think of his opinion. And the popular opinion on the site is Destroy. People don't care for Synthesis and I thought I would take the liberty to tell Bioware that.

If you have means to reach in, I think you should. They really need to address this. They need to get this fixed not just clarified.

At the moment the game it self is getting ripped into pieces. And the longer they wait before they come with any sort of announcement on how they're going to meet the demands, the more the fact that they need to redo the whole game is getting inevitable

I've already rustled Mr. Gamble before. I got him to post in a thread I created. If I reach futher in I'm afraid of what might happen. Mr Gamble can come and comment if he wishes. I would never force him to do so. I do want him to be aware however.

Then I sure hope he sees this :happy:

[Taboo]

ShepnTali wrote...

CmnDwnWrkn wrote...

It's starting to look more and more like the ending was intended to be entirely metaphorical.  I was afraid of this.

There is simply no basis for "synthesis", if taken literally, to create the type of Shangri-La that Gamble is implying.

His interpretation only makes sense if you take "organic" & "synthetic" & "synthesis" to be metaphors for something.

My take on what he's trying to say...

Organic = Group A
Synthetic = Group B
Synthesis = "Come on people now, smile on your brother, everybody get together, and try to love one another right now."

Like, hey man, synthesis is groovy. Can you dig that?

Wait, if plant life is sentient now. No more weed.

Not groovy for the hippies.