312 réponses à ce sujet

[Filanwizard]

Exclusives are a bad thing generally. Look how many people want the mobile apps but cant get it because they wanted to have an Android device which EA seems to ignore. Likely due to lots of bribe money from Apple.

[The Razman]

slimgrin wrote...

The Razman wrote...

The line between art and titillation is something very complicated .

Not really. But it's sure easy to throw this card out there, isn't it?

And not just for games..let's make everything 'appropriate' now, shall we?

1. Yes it is. I'll show you my writings on the topic if you like.

2. Who said I'm not ok with things being inappropriate? I'm all in favour of things being "inappropriate".

Just don't go claiming something that's doing as such to be "mature".

[AlanC9]

The Razman wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

The Razman wrote...
Witcher 2 is everything that we've been trying to fight against in gaming narratives for years now. It's ... truely, truely awful. And that's before you even get into the combat system.

Which "we" is that, anyway? And what exactly are"we" fighting against in game narratives?

(I haven't played TW2 yet, so I'm not playing defense. Just genuine curiosity)

"We" is gamers as a unified community. What we've been fighting against is people treating game narratives like the immature backwater of entertainment art, incapable of carrying anything serious or adult. Witcher and its sequel basically goes about systematically destroying those efforts. And that's just one of the problems with it.

Well, I asked.

So we're a unified community? Nobody invites me to the meetings.

I guess furhter discussion would be better suited to the TW2 thread over in OT.

[gmboy902]

The Razman wrote...

There is a small problem with your hypothesis.

The Witcher 2 is terrible.

The Witcher 2 is an incredible game, one from which BioWare could learn a whole lot. Like how to make an epic action game that is still an RPG, and how to make proper sex scenes, and how to make impacting moral choices.

To OP, I have noticed that PC exclusives, or PC-targeted games get a lot of love. Portal 2, Half-Life 2, and The Witcher 2 being some prime examples. But then you have the Battlefield 3, which was targeted towards PCs and sold more on consoles. So it isn't a universally true rule - likely, it is more due to the fact that PC exclusives are usually made by companies that aren't quite rich enough to mass market and not quite big enough to have to worry about pushing out deadlines.

[Dude_in_the_Room]

gmboy902 wrote...

The Razman wrote...

There is a small problem with your hypothesis.

The Witcher 2 is terrible.

The Witcher 2 is an incredible game, one from which BioWare could learn a whole lot. Like how to make an epic action game that is still an RPG, and how to make proper sex scenes, and how to make impacting moral choices.

To OP, I have noticed that PC exclusives, or PC-targeted games get a lot of love. Portal 2, Half-Life 2, and The Witcher 2 being some prime examples. But then you have the Battlefield 3, which was targeted towards PCs and sold more on consoles. So it isn't a universally true rule - likely, it is more due to the fact that PC exclusives are usually made by companies that aren't quite rich enough to mass market and not quite big enough to have to worry about pushing out deadlines.

ME3 action is second to none.  

Just had to say that.

[gmboy902]

BobSmith101 wrote...

abaris wrote...

BobSmith101 wrote...

The reason I quit PC gaming is there were not enough games worth getting. Shelling out 3k for something you only played 2 or 3 games a year on was a completely stupid to me.

Honestly, are you trying to troll or are you simply refusing to actually look at what a (very good) PC system really costs?

No offence but the difference between your definition of good and mine are probably wildly different. Go check out the prices of some of the ninjatastic PCs then say I'm trolling.

I have a machine, not built myself but I did some upgrades, that can run any game out there on the highest settings save a very select few (namely The Witcher 2, and that's about it, and even that can run on almost the highest settings). I originally bought it from Best Buy, and in total (original price + price of upgraded parts) it costed me no more than $1,200.

So is being able to run anything not "good"?

[gmboy902]

Dude_in_the_Room wrote...

gmboy902 wrote...

The Razman wrote...

There is a small problem with your hypothesis.

The Witcher 2 is terrible.

The Witcher 2 is an incredible game, one from which BioWare could learn a whole lot. Like how to make an epic action game that is still an RPG, and how to make proper sex scenes, and how to make impacting moral choices.

To OP, I have noticed that PC exclusives, or PC-targeted games get a lot of love. Portal 2, Half-Life 2, and The Witcher 2 being some prime examples. But then you have the Battlefield 3, which was targeted towards PCs and sold more on consoles. So it isn't a universally true rule - likely, it is more due to the fact that PC exclusives are usually made by companies that aren't quite rich enough to mass market and not quite big enough to have to worry about pushing out deadlines.

ME3 action is second to none.  

Just had to say that.

I won't argue that ME3 has good action, but it comes at the expense of roleplaying. It doesn't rely enough on our choices in our character's skills.

[Mildiner]

Geth_Prime wrote...

Aaaaaaah, why did I click on this thread? I just knew there'd be elitists here! >_<

(OP makes some interesting points, though.)

Thanks Geth. I never meant to restart the whole PC vs Console thing but it would appear that we just can't fight human nature.

EDIT: Also, I REALLY wish I'd never mentioned the chuffing Witcher in the OP.

Modifié par Mildiner, 28 avril 2012 - 07:08 .

[Mildiner]

mmm buddah23 wrote...

Mildiner wrote...

First off, I have nothing against consoles; please don't turn this into a console VS PC flame thread.

This is more about a cycle of logic that my brain has been working around to recently:

1) Developer spends time to make a good game that gets released and scores good reviews. 
2) Gamer enthusiasts buy the game based on reviews and said game becomes a "hit"
3) Publisher notes the success of first game and pushes for a sequel
4) Publisher pours money into the sequel in the form of advertising and promotion but share holders expect a quick return on their investment and so development time is cut
5) Sequel is released, goes mainstream due to advertising and, if good enough, escalates the franchise even further cycling back to 3) with even less time and more money on the line for the next version

So it seems to me that becoming a hit and gaining widespread acclaim is about the worst thing that can happen to a game series as has apparently happened to ME much to my dismay. The only way I can see to avoid this happening in future is to go with PC exclusives since most big publishers do not consider them worthy of massive ad compaigns due to the large drop in potential customers.

At the moment the best example of this is the Witcher 2 which has recently updated on Steam for me (a 10GB update which CD Projeckt released FREE) and has apparently turned a brilliant game into a nearly perfect one. Once I have finished my latest run of ME2 I plan to fire it back up and I may never come back to ME again.

PC gamers also have the small, independent developers releasing games on Steam which are the only source of truly original work I see these days. I worry about the console market because it has virtually none of this.

For these reasons I think I will be avoiding console ports from now on, but I hold no ill will toward the console market and will keep my fingers crossed that something comes along to break the cycle for them.

Xbox has small independant developers too, its called xbox live arcade. Mind blowing, I know. And we have Mo-Cap games, nothing against PC, but going just pc, you will miss LOADS of good games.

I hadn't forgotten about XBox Live Arcade but I understand that it is quite a bit smaller than Steam in terms of choice. In the interests of keeping things civil, I am basing this upon what I have heard so I am quite happy to be corrected here.

Modifié par Mildiner, 28 avril 2012 - 06:53 .

[Mildiner]

Smugglers Luck wrote...

OP, why did you think this was a good idea to post?

Hindsight's a wonderful thing isn't it?

It always amazes me how many people cannot just state their opinion and leave it at that. A good debate is educational and enlightening and should enrich both sides. 

What the internet seems to breed are arguments where both parties continuously try to convince each other that they are completely right in louder and ruder ways.

In my experience no-one is ever completely right or wrong, the answer normally lies in the middle.

[Mildiner]

Atakuma wrote...

How the hell is this thread still going? Is it sorcery?

I blame the incredibly handsome chap who started it all. That guy is a real charmer.

[Dude_in_the_Room]

Mildiner wrote...

Atakuma wrote...

How the hell is this thread still going? Is it sorcery?

I blame the incredibly handsome chap who started it all. That guy is a real charmer.

I hear he has the disease where he grows balls on his chin.

[Mildiner]

Chinballitis? I grew a bushy beard to deal with that.

[Mildiner]

I hope you are right Eternal. Maybe there's some hope for us yet.

[ObserverStatus]

Don't be ridiculous, StarCraft: Brood War is the greatest game of all time, but it is also available on the Nintendo 64.

[Foxhound2121]

The only thing that prevents me from playing console is a monthly fee. I just don't like the idea of paying for internet and xbox live.

Plus, the service is nothing more than a walled garden that puts AOL to shame. Walled Garden's are just bad business.

Now, I am hearing rumors that a lot of Microsoft's shady business practices will change with the next console, so maybe I'll switch if that happens.

[Kaiser Arian XVII]

Long live PC elitists!

Death to the Console peasants!

Also don't forget to shot your xbox and put its trailer on YT!

[Mildiner]

As a side note, I have been tempted to get a PS3 simply for the Tiger Woods Series. I love golf games and EA Sports seems to have stubbornly refused to release for PC for the last 5 years.

They released Tiger Woods 2011 but it wasn't the same game that the Consoles got.

If anyone knows of a high budget golf game for PC that's within 2 years old I'd love to know about it!

[Inquisitor Recon]

Glorious PC gaming master race!

But seriously, I own both a 360 and PC. Why? Sometimes it's a bit more comfortable to play the 360 on a couch in front of a big TV, plus exclusives.

For games that aren't exclusive to any one system, my choice tends to vary depending on the game, developer, etc. I bought the 360 versions of Mass Effect for example, but the PC versions of Fallout and Skyrim.

Modifié par ReconTeam, 28 avril 2012 - 07:47 .

[0x30A88]

I play mostly on PC, but decided to play ME3 on PS3 because ME2 seemed like a console game -- menus especially -- and I don't like Origin (not open for discussion, I didn't say I hate it). The graphics were actually good, and catering to only PC gamers would not be profitable as AAA games' development costs are in the tens of millions -- explains all the neccesary evils needed to gain something out of this.

There's also something about discussing the game's content with my brothers as I play -- some choices might be less pleasant / more fun to make with 4 eyes watching though.

I wish ME1 were on PS3, because Bioware knows how to make (up) the worst default choices.

Foxhound2121 wrote...

The only thing that prevents me from
playing console is a monthly fee. I just don't like the idea of paying
for internet and xbox live.

Plus, the service is nothing more than a walled garden that puts AOL to shame. Walled Garden's are just bad business.

Now,
I am hearing rumors that a lot of Microsoft's shady business practices
will change with the next console, so maybe I'll switch if that happens.

This is true, but only for XBox, but the PS3 service is more bare bones -- which is good, I  only need DLCs and multiplay anyways --, and getting out of an XBL subscription is unpleasant, there's no big green flashy "End Subscription" button, which it should be, instead one have to call MS and have it done manually.

Modifié par Gisle Aune, 28 avril 2012 - 09:13 .

[abaris]

Gisle Aune wrote...

I play mostly on PC, but decided to play ME3 on PS3 because ME2 seemed like a console game -- menus especially -- and I don't like Origin (not open for discussion, I didn't say I hate it). The graphics were actually good, and catering to only PC gamers would not be profitable as AAA games' development costs are in the tens of millions -- explains all the neccesary evils needed to gain something out of this.

I agree that exclusives are usually a bad idea. Everyone should get the same experience, regardless of platform.

What I can't agree with is the fact that ports are usually sloppy to say the least. I understand that less animations were a necessity to meet the requirements of the least powerful system, but I don't agree with the fact that the more powerful ones (not only the PC) had to tag along with the slowest ship in the convoy.

Same goes for the textures that, in their vanilla state, look extremely blurry in certain instances. That can be fixed on the PC, but it really shouldn't be up to the users to do that.

[mmm buddah23]

slimgrin wrote...

iVitriol wrote...

slimgrin wrote...

Just takes a little brain exercise to see that buying a funbox is not only bad for the industry but more espensive in the long run.

Uh huh. I'd rather spend money on a console and then have money left over for games, not spending money on continuous upgrades and a blisteringly expensive rig.

Or maybe you'd rather play Mario Bro's and C.O.D for the next 5 years cause that's all the innovation consoles have to offer...and another platformer or two.

Console devs are stil doing the same sh*t after 20 yrs.

Halo 4 would have to disagree with you and Gears of War, which they abandoned on the PC, and the new resident evil ORC, and resident evil 6,  , and many of the independant games. COD is also on PC smart ass. You don't even know your exclusives, so you might want to stop making youself look like an elitist ass.