75 réponses à ce sujet

[Heals.like.Jesus]

First spell auto-turns off on the berserker principle - something nobody likes and many are annoyed. I hoped it would power spells by sacrificing life, instead it just replaces your mana with your life bar.

Well whoop-de-fricken-doo!

Now I risk dying if i cast a spell whilst being attacked, without seeing it coming AND i get to die with a full mana bar, to boot! To put the icing on the cake, I cant make use of my many points in magic to fully heal myself with a simple health potion.

Second spell is a sad attempt to fix 1 of blood magic mode downsides. The fact that you are only ever able to use it when a constantly self-turning off mode is active wins bonus points for me. Not only can you kill an ally with it, but the healing is pathetic. A 63 magic mage heals 85, while damaging the ally for 50. And you must have blood magic on, because  obviously such a powerful ability needs some limitations, lest it be called overpowered.

The third spell is the branch's saving grace, though it is hardly worth it, considering everything else. Blood magic having to be on is still a minus here. And if you get an unexpected critical whilst casting said spell, you risk being instantly killed in addition to not being able to heal yourself in a hurry.

The fourth spell is, well, nifty. An ability which requires level 16, a modal ability active, 3 abilities as prerequisites. And it manages to rank as "nifty". Taking control over an enemy. Goody gum-drops! You cant  use  the controlled creature's skills, and the spell mainly serves as temporarily taking out an enemy from the fight.
Which, to this point, was otherwise impossible, what with the lack of single target disable spells like paralysis, crushing prison, force field...and are accessible way before level 16.

Any rebuttals?

Modifié par Heals.like.Jesus, 08 décembre 2009 - 12:16 .

[tranj84cl]

Well, considering BM is widely regarded as overpowered, I'm sure I don't need to waste time contesting anything in your post.

[Bibdy]

Blood Mages aren't supposed to be unstoppable juggernauts of uber-power...compare the tree to Shapeshifter and Spirit Healer...just how powerful did you expect this thing to be?

[Rainen89]

You shouldn't have blood magic on all the time anyway...there is no point you switch it on cast blood wound switch out - repeat process on next fight. Staying in blood magic is just asking to get killed.

[Heals.like.Jesus]

You shouldn't have blood magic on all the time anyway...there is no
point you switch it on cast blood wound switch out - repeat process on
next fight. Staying in blood magic is just asking to get killed.

Having finished the game on nightmare, believe me when I say I can figure what the branch's appeal and the "trick" to use it effectively are, subtle though they may be.

My grief is that considering the alternative ways to spend your spell talents, the idea to start every fight in the same way, with 3 talents spent to use just 1, rings hollow.

Modifié par Heals.like.Jesus, 08 décembre 2009 - 12:30 .

[AntiChri5]

Rainen89 wrote...

You shouldn't have blood magic on all the time anyway...there is no point you switch it on cast blood wound switch out - repeat process on next fight. Staying in blood magic is just asking to get killed.

Agreed. Only have BM on when casting BM spells or out of mana and lyrium.

[Taleroth]

I loved my Blood Mage. Blood Wound was practically the best spell he had.

[Jordi B]

tranj84cl wrote...

Well, considering BM is widely regarded as overpowered, I'm sure I don't need to waste time contesting anything in your post.

That's the spirit! Arguments are for ******!

I'm also not very impressed with the BM line. The only useful spell is Blood Wound and with that last spell I always pray that the critter makes the save and gets the damage instead. I don't like using my health instead of mana. However, as someone pointed out, it is not really much worse than SH and SS, and if you want to play a caster, AW. I would have preferred if it was a little more powerful though, because blood mages are so feared everywhere. It seems to me like they should have been the most powerful. Using health to make spells more powerful might have worked nicely towards that end.

Modifié par Jordi B, 08 décembre 2009 - 12:38 .

[Heals.like.Jesus]

Spirit healer's first spell is a global heal that is dirt-cheap to cast, heals more than a regular heal and doesn't have pre-req spells. Combat revival is also awesome.

[tranj84cl]

Jordi B wrote...

tranj84cl wrote...

Well, considering BM is widely regarded as overpowered, I'm sure I don't need to waste time contesting anything in your post.

That's the spirit! Arguments are for ******!

It wasn't intended as a flame.  It's just not EVERY skill is going to be useful or awesome.  BM has a great *stand-alone* skill.  The first in the line seems useless alone, but used once you run out of mana, it can squeeze a few more heals, or last second damage.  Wynne activating blood magic once she runs out of mana prevents more party wipes than you could shake a stick at.  So no, BM does not bite. 

The game is about synergy.  You can't expect every skill to simply activate and win a battle for you.

[B33ker]

It's also a little bit about learning to make the most of what you've got and stop expecting everything handed to you to be "uber awesome".



Personally, I prefer the challenge.

[cheeseslayersmu]

OP - Try again. Blood wound is amazing.

Modifié par cheeseslayersmu, 08 décembre 2009 - 01:12 .

[Heals.like.Jesus]

tranj84cl wrote...

Jordi B wrote...

tranj84cl wrote...

Well, considering BM is widely regarded as overpowered, I'm sure I don't need to waste time contesting anything in your post.

That's the spirit! Arguments are for ******!

It wasn't intended as a flame.  It's just not EVERY skill is going to be useful or awesome.  BM has a great *stand-alone* skill.  The first in the line seems useless alone, but used once you run out of mana, it can squeeze a few more heals, or last second damage.  Wynne activating blood magic once she runs out of mana prevents more party wipes than you could shake a stick at.  So no, BM does not bite. 

The game is about synergy.  You can't expect every skill to simply activate and win a battle for you.

Seems you found it worthwhile to contest something, at least..

If you run out of mana you simply us one of the unlimited dirt-cheap mana potions you have at your disposal after a certain point in the game. So why bother doing anything else. Activating the mode and then using the spell wastes time which you might not have, considering by your post you only seem to use it as a desperate "borrow time" spell.

And why are you all discussing one spell? My topic was directed at the branch. And that focusing an entire section of magic around a single spell is shallow.

Modifié par Heals.like.Jesus, 08 décembre 2009 - 01:15 .

[tranj84cl]

Heals.like.Jesus wrote...

Seems you found it worthwhile to contest something, at least..

If you run out of mana you simply us one of the unlimited dirt-cheap mana potions you have at your disposal after a certain point in the game. So why bother doing anything else. Activating the mode and then using the spell wastes time which you might not have, considering by your post you only seem to use it as a desperate "borrow time" spell.

Yes, I appreciate the irony of it all   Well, yes, you have unlimited potions rather early in the game.  But, that would mean I'd have to grind out prepare, say, 200 mana pots before venturing forth.  I, for one, hate doing that, so I just travel the world with what I have.  I'd rather activate one skill than spend 30 minutes grinding out potions.  Thus, BM suits my playstyle a bit more...

Now if I actually used mages....

*EDIT*

At what point does a tree go from "biting" to being "good"? One skill is useful? Two?

The only skill trees I've maxed for usefulness are sword and shield talents.  Even then, toward the end game a few of those skills become obsolete.

Modifié par tranj84cl, 08 décembre 2009 - 01:26 .

[BCBUDS]

Where do you actually learn/aquire the blood mage attribute?

[trashmonk]

BCBUDS wrote...

Where do you actually learn/aquire the blood mage attribute?

http://dragonage.wik...wiki/Blood_Mage

Scroll to the bottom.

[Heals.like.Jesus]

tranj84cl wrote...

Heals.like.Jesus wrote...

Seems you found it worthwhile to contest something, at least..

If you run out of mana you simply us one of the unlimited dirt-cheap mana potions you have at your disposal after a certain point in the game. So why bother doing anything else. Activating the mode and then using the spell wastes time which you might not have, considering by your post you only seem to use it as a desperate "borrow time" spell.

Yes, I appreciate the irony of it all   Well, yes, you have unlimited potions rather early in the game.  But, that would mean I'd have to grind out prepare, say, 200 mana pots before venturing forth.  I, for one, hate doing that, so I just travel the world with what I have.  I'd rather activate one skill than spend 30 minutes grinding out potions.  Thus, BM suits my playstyle a bit more...

Now if I actually used mages....

*EDIT*

At what point does a tree go from "biting" to being "good"? One skill is useful? Two?

The only skill trees I've maxed for usefulness are sword and shield talents.  Even then, toward the end game a few of those skills become obsolete.

You make use of gross exaggeration to get your point across. Thats poor debating. Even with 2 mages in the party,I have never struggled with mana potions at the start. Farm 200? Where are you getting this from. You find/buy lowest quality lyrium pots for next to nothing in a sizeble quantity untill the point where you can create them  en masse.

[TheMadCat]

Considering all the hype and lore surrounding Blood Magic I was a tad disappointed. I don't think the tree itself is all that bad, the teir 3 spell is one of the best in the game and the teir 4 is quite fun and fairly useful in certain situations, on top of that you pretty much double your mana pool.



Would have loved a spell that would let you summon a demon since that seems to be a common tie in with Blood Magic, perhaps with a certain chance the demon would spawn as an enemy.

[Ibian]

tranj84cl wrote...

Well, considering BM is widely regarded as overpowered, I'm sure I don't need to waste time contesting anything in your post.

Ah, well. The AW/BM combo, before the SS bug was fixed, was considered overpowered. Now... who knows, give it a week.

Blood magic, by itself, does not seem all that impressive to me. I confess to some slight disappointment. Not because its bad, as such, but because its nowhere close to being what the game itself describes it as. It does not actually make your spellcasting more powerful, as the ingame lore and... cutscenes claim. A blood mage does just as well by pumping mana as health. On top of that, if i have another healer in my party, i either need to accept that she wastes mana healing me when i have blood magic active, or spend a bad amount of tactic slots on having her heal everyone but me.

There is, however, one possible use for it: Cast from health, then heal yourself by casting from mana. You can essentially double or even quadruple your mana reserves this way, though it is risky and requires some attention. And pot chuggers wont care about this, obviously.

Still, at least its not shapeshifting. And it is (to me, at least) less boring than AW.

Come to think of it the game lacks a compelling specialization for me. Oh well. To sum up, blood magic is the best specialization for me, but ultimately unsatisfying.

[Heals.like.Jesus]

Im addressing the branch itself. For all the fuss about blood mages, their fearsome reputation and supposed power, it turns out that the forbidden magic revolves around suicidal lamers who spam 1 spell and die with full mana. That is so awesome

Modifié par Heals.like.Jesus, 08 décembre 2009 - 02:37 .

[Blue_dodo]

blood magic is not great by itself but when you have a ton of buffs on your mana pool is going to be well a puddle, limiting the amount of spells you can cast.

blood magic remedies this, I also personally have no quarrel sucking life out of my allies and why should I ? since I only do it when I  need to

Modifié par Blue_dodo, 08 décembre 2009 - 02:43 .

[Deathstyk85]

to every positive, there is a negative reprocution.

some of the spells are awesome and help alot

some help somewhat. but can kill you! its a give and take. you cant expect them to hand you an "i win" button every class/class spec has its ups and downs to even it out.

[addiction21]

Deathstyk85 wrote...

to every positive, there is a negative reprocution.
some of the spells are awesome and help alot
some help somewhat. but can kill you! its a give and take. you cant expect them to hand you an "i win" button every class/class spec has its ups and downs to even it out.

No everything must be super fun cool awesome uber 1 shot HEADSHOT bam dead I win buttons with bright seizure inducing colors and explosions.  Think I left out some commas...

[corporate-slave]

Heals.like.Jesus wrote...

... I never figured out how to effectively use blood magic, so now I am going to assume that it is terrible and run to the forums to trash it ...

Any rebuttals?

Yes. To put it bluntly, it is clear from your post you are not using blood magic effectively.

Blood magic is not something you just turn on at the beginning of a fight and go crazy with. It should be used sparingly until the battle is under control.

For large groups of opponents (who aren't undead or demons), nothing beats starting a fight by activating Blood Magic and casting Blood Wound. Crowd control *and* ridiculous damage that almost never gets resisted? Yes please! Once your opponents are incapacitated and hemhorraging hit points, it is time to turn off Blood Magic, unleash your other AOE spells, and heal if needed. When you run out of mana, turn it back on and continue casting. By then, most of your opponents should be dead so the health loss is not as dangerous.

Facing several powerful foes? No problem. Turn on Blood Magic, use Blood Control to turn one of them into a temporary ally, and then disable Blood Magic until it is needed again. This is superior to the single target 'disable' spells you mention because: 1) the target of the spell fights for you, and 2) you can use Blood Sacrifice to steal that target's health and make it your own. Yes, it would be swell if we got to control the abilities of the foe under our control, but we don't always get everything we want. The ability is still extremely useful, and its utility justifies not getting it until later in the game.

But isn't it dangerous to start a fight by enabling Blood Magic? Yes, it is, but there are numerous ways to provide yourself with the breathing room you need to use it safely. Use line of sight, or open with a crowd control or AOE knockback spell. This will generally give you enough time to safely enable Blood Magic, use Blood Wound or Blood Control, and then disable Blood Magic until it is needed again.

Blood Sacrifice is also quite useful when used correctly. Out of mana? Turn on Blood Magic and keep casting. Running low on HPs? No problem, use Blood Sacrifice to transfer hit points from party members who aren't being attacked to yourself. You get to keep casting, and they are no worse for the wear (as long as they don't pull aggro). Blood Sacrifice also works on enemies who are under the effects of Blood Control. This allows you to simultaneously control and damage an opponent, while healing yourself. Pretty amazing.

Finally, it should be noted that spells cast using blood magic are ridiculously cheap from a resource perspective. This summary from the unofficial Dragon Age wiki is instructive:

"The health cost of a spell is ~22% lower than the mana cost. Equipping the Blood Ring or Avernus's Robes lowers that cost by 25%. So if a spell would cost 41 mana, under Blood Magic it is 32 health, and with Blood Ring it is 24 health (41*0.78*0.75)."

Blood magic is one of the most powerful mage trees in the game, but using it effectively requires some finesse. You can't just turn it on at the beginning of every fight and go nuts. You need to know when to use it, and when to turn it off.

Modifié par corporate-slave, 08 décembre 2009 - 03:15 .

[Damar Stiehl]

Blood Wound is all you need, really. Everything else is just gravy.