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[BIO18]

 I was thinking...
Some people want to play their warden.
Some people want to play Hawk.
Some people want to play a new character.

Why not just give us the choice?
I fully understand people that want to play a new character and leave their wardens (or hawk) be, but why can't we just have the choice???

I think that at the start of the game, you should be able to do this.

1:Import save AND warden
2:Import save AND Hawk
3:Import save BUT make new character
4:Start game without import

For the voices now...

The warden is not a problem, he was mute in DAO so we never really knew what he sounded like (yes yes saying "where is the tavern" from time to time does not count"
So he can just have the same voice as the "new protagoniste" and if you don't like it, well, just don't import him then.
I don't see why just because some people don't like the idea it makes it impossible for others to like it.

The real problem is Hawk...
Unless they make "the new protagoniste" with Hawks voice (its a horrible idea) he will sound different and a lot of people would not like this. (I don't mind if he has a different voice I can use my imagination)

I know also a lot of you will just say "omg just leave the warden alone, leave Hawk alone. Its over dude, new character FTW"
Yes a new character is cool, but give the choice to import an old one to. I don't see why just having the possibility to do it is bad???

There I just wanted to know what you guys think. :innocent:

EDIT: 
PS: I know this thread has been talked about numerous times, but I really want to know what you think of just having the choice. 

Modifié par BIO18, 29 avril 2012 - 01:06 .

[Cutlasskiwi]

I imagine that it would be expensive and take quite a lot of time to create a game for three very different protagonist and then create a story that they would all fit into. How would old followers and relationships factor in? Would it require different starting points for the characters?


ETA: I like the idea of playing a new protagonist in every game. 

Modifié par Cutlasskiwi, 29 avril 2012 - 01:11 .

[whykikyouwhy]

BIO18 wrote...

Why not just give us the choice?
I fully understand people that want to play a new character and leave their wardens (or hawk) be, but why can't we just have the choice???

 
Cost/resources would probably be a major factor.

So too, there is a story being told. Having Hawke or the Warden for the next game may not (and probably won't) fit the direction for the story/narrative. Those protagonists have most likely done the major things that they needed to do for the future and fate of Thedas. I think they will still be intertwined, though.

 
PS: I know this thread has been talked about numerous times, but I really want to know what you think of just having the choice. 

I'm quite fine with having a new protagonist. That's the direction that Bioware seems to be going in, and if that's how the overall story is going to play out, I'm in for the ride.

[Ponendus]

I think the problem is narrative. BioWare's story for DA3 may not suit the Warden or Hawke? The character of the protagonist is so important to a game like this. What interest does the Warden or Hawke have in the story of DA3? If they don't have one, why would they do this?

I see what you are saying, but allowing the choice just because its what fans what is the definition of fan-service. BioWare needs to create a good story and a good game, the protagonist is whoever he/she is as a result of that.

[BIO18]

I would also like to add...

When you import the old character (Hawk or warden) it just imports the "skin" of that character.
Since the game is probably going to be in Orlais people won't know these characters.
I'm not asking that every 2 sec, someone walks up to me and says "hey warden I loved the part when you did this..."

By that I mean, the game takes the appearance of the character and acknowledges that its him, by putting maybe 1 or 2 cameos in the game that know Hawk or the Warden.

[BIO18]

Ponendus wrote...

I think the problem is narrative. BioWare's story for DA3 may not suit the Warden or Hawke? The character of the protagonist is so important to a game like this. What interest does the Warden or Hawke have in the story of DA3? If they don't have one, why would they do this?

I see what you are saying, but allowing the choice just because its what fans what is the definition of fan-service. BioWare needs to create a good story and a good game, the protagonist is whoever he/she is as a result of that.

Yes for you. But just leave the choice open.
Maybe for you the waren had nothing to do in DA3, but for me (personally) I don't mind coming up with something to justify this. (its a role playing game after all )
I YOU don't think he should be there, just don't import him or her.
See what I mean ? 

[bleetman]

I approve of any situation that results in more characters voiced by Jo Wyatt.

[BIO18]

Cutlasskiwi wrote...

I imagine that it would be expensive and take quite a lot of time to create a game for three very different protagonist and then create a story that they would all fit into. How would old followers and relationships factor in? Would it require different starting points for the characters?


ETA: I like the idea of playing a new protagonist in every game. 

That is why I say it should be just a choice.
There is no need to tell why the warden is here.
No need to tell us why Hawk is here.
No need to change the story.
No need to change anything.
Just let us import the character and maybe have just 1 character in the game say "hey I know you"
The game will probably be in Orlais so people don't really know the warden or Hawk. So no need to change anything.

If YOU think your Warden or Hawk has nothing to do there and it makes more sense to play with a other character, well just don't import the warden.

I don't see why leaving us the choice changed anything. If you think it makes no sense storywise, then don't do it.

EDIT: Its just like importing a dead warden in awakening. I think it makes no sense and would never do it, but having the opion to do so did not change anything. It was cool for some.:innocent:

Modifié par BIO18, 29 avril 2012 - 01:22 .

[GreenSoda]

BIO18 wrote...

Ponendus wrote...

I think the problem is narrative. BioWare's story for DA3 may not suit the Warden or Hawke? The character of the protagonist is so important to a game like this. What interest does the Warden or Hawke have in the story of DA3? If they don't have one, why would they do this?

I see what you are saying, but allowing the choice just because its what fans what is the definition of fan-service. BioWare needs to create a good story and a good game, the protagonist is whoever he/she is as a result of that.

Yes for you. But just leave the choice open.
Maybe for you the waren had nothing to do in DA3, but for me (personally) I don't mind coming up with something to justify this. (its a role playing game after all )
I YOU don't think he should be there, just don't import him or her.
See what I mean ? 

Sure, let's just add a toggle for it. Should be no problem for the devs. /sarcasm

[whykikyouwhy]

BIO18 wrote...
If you think it makes no sense storywise, then don't do it.

 
Except we're not writing the story. We're playing in it.

 
EDIT: Its just like importing a dead warden in awakening. I think it makes no sense and would never do it, but having the opion to do so did not change anything. It was cool for some.:innocent:

DA:A was an extension of the Warden's story. The ability to import your DA:O Warden was contingent upon that character being alive or dead after the battle with the Archdemon.

I was unaware that you could import a "dead" Warden. Clearly, I missed the zombie Warden mod. <_<

[BIO18]

GreenSoda wrote...

Sure, let's just add a toggle for it. Should be no problem for the devs. /sarcasm

I don't mind sarcasm, but tell me... How is it hard for the devs to allow you to import the apperance and ad just one NPC say "omg you are the warden" ??? and not change anything else ?

[nightscrawl]

BIO18 wrote...

EDIT: 
PS: I know this thread has been talked about numerous times, but I really want to know what you think of just having the choice.

--- minor SPOILER for the end of DA2 ref. Anders ---



No. New game, new plot, new problems, new person.

I won't mind adding to previous games through references or cameos or whatever, but I'm looking forward to a new person. I'm saying this as someone who likes her Warden and Hawke equally.

Having a choice as you mention would take tremendous amounts of work in terms of resources that can go to developing a complete DA3 with all of the features and changes that people on these forums have been whining about (or suggesting helpfully) for months.

You have to think of all that implies...

If you import a Warden people will want to know where their Love Interest is, in addition to a slew of other plot related issues involving the ruler of Ferelden, Alistair who may or may not be your LI and/or king, Morrigan and the Old God baby, and any possible Calling related issues dependent on how far in the future DA3 is removed from DA2 (which itself ended 10 years after DAO, leaving your Warden having the taint for 10 years), in addition to any plot issues remaining from Awakening and sparing the Architect as Nathaniel Howe suggests during his Act 3 DA2 quest.

If you import a Hawke people will want to know where their Love Interest is, which includes huge problems if your LI was Anders and how that affects the mage/templar war, as well as the possibility of you being hunted at every turn because of Anders if you decided to go "on the run" with him as he suggests in your final romance dialogue. Anders also has his own Calling issues as mentioned for DAO, so time lapse is potentially problematic.

Both of these carry too much baggage and hampers their goal of hopping around Thedas, giving us fresh perspectives on the world and its problems.

Modifié par nightscrawl, 29 avril 2012 - 01:44 .

[BIO18]

nightscrawl wrote...

BIO18 wrote...

EDIT: 
PS: I know this thread has been talked about numerous times, but I really want to know what you think of just having the choice.

No. New game, new plot, new problems, new person.

I won't mind adding to previous games through references or cameos or whatever, but I'm looking forward to a new person. I'm saying this as someone who likes her Warden and Hawke equally.

Yes for you... but why should your opinion be better then mine? Why because YOU want to play a new character I can't play mine?
That is why the choice would be cool... nothing is forced this way...

[whykikyouwhy]

BIO18 wrote...

Yes for you... but why should your opinion be better then mine? Why because YOU want to play a new character I can't play mine?
That is why the choice would be cool... nothing is forced this way...

I believe you were asking for people to chime in with what they thought and what their opinion on the matter was. Folks are providing just that. 

[BIO18]

whykikyouwhy wrote...

BIO18 wrote...

Yes for you... but why should your opinion be better then mine? Why because YOU want to play a new character I can't play mine?
That is why the choice would be cool... nothing is forced this way...

I believe you were asking for people to chime in with what they thought and what their opinion on the matter was. Folks are providing just that. 

Yes that is what I'm saying.
You guys want to play a new character, thats awsome. And you should be able to!
I want to play the warden, and I should be just as able to get what I want then you.

[GreenSoda]

BIO18 wrote...

GreenSoda wrote...

Sure, let's just add a toggle for it. Should be no problem for the devs. /sarcasm

I don't mind sarcasm, but tell me... How is it hard for the devs to allow you to import the apperance and ad just one NPC say "omg you are the warden" ??? and not change anything else ?

Because the protagonist of DA3 might have a backstory that just doesn't work with the Warden's or Hawke's story ?

[mousestalker]

If you did the ultimate sacrifice with your warden, the in game lore makes it quite clear that you are not just merely dead, but really quite sincerely dead. That presents a problem for those of us who chose that option in terms of importing the warden to a new game.

In Awakening, you get to play an Orlesian Warden if you snuffed it in Origins.

It's probably a lot easier from a game design, development and accounting viewpoint to start DA3 afresh with a new PC. Not to mention, the graphics of animating a zombie PC would be fairly daunting. The PC would be leaving bits all over the place. The gore settings already challenge most video cards. Gore plus zombie mess could result in graphics cards overcooking all around the world.

[Fast Jimmy]

BIO18 wrote...

GreenSoda wrote...

Sure, let's just add a toggle for it. Should be no problem for the devs. /sarcasm

I don't mind sarcasm, but tell me... How is it hard for the devs to allow you to import the apperance and ad just one NPC say "omg you are the warden" ??? and not change anything else ?

But, if the only difference is that one NPC at the very beginning says 'wow, you are Hawke, derp!' and the story, events, voice and characters are all the same otherwise, then what is the difference, other than how the character looks? You won't be able to import the Warden or Hawke's level, as that would completely break the game. 

To make the choice real, where many characters reference the fact, then that would be a logistical nightmare for the devs. It would cost a ton of thought, effort, time and money to plan all of the interactions that any given character or NPC could have with three incredibly different characters. So, I'd say it's not impossible, but really unlikely. 

[whykikyouwhy]

BIO18 wrote...

Yes that is what I'm saying.
You guys want to play a new character, thats awsome. And you should be able to!
I want to play the warden, and I should be just as able to get what I want then you.

And players want a myriad of things. Some things will make sense for the narrative. Some things will make sense as far as resources go. And, unfortunately, some things will not fall in line with either the story or the resources available.

I'm not a dev. I don't work in the industry. But I would imagine that what you propose would present quite a strain on resources.

And as several have stated, it may not make sense for the story that Bioware is telling.

[BIO18]

 ... 

Okay, okay I get it... <_<

Either I'm really not expressing myself clearly or people are not reading correctly...
I get it, you want a new character, that is cool. And you will get what you want.
I thought that having the choice at the start of the game would have made everyone happy, but I must be mistaken.

Subject closed just let this one sink. I don't need more creative comments like "new character FTW"

Have fun with your brand new characters (that you would have had anyway even if given the choice), I'll try too.

Modifié par BIO18, 29 avril 2012 - 01:48 .

[Realmzmaster]

If all you are adding is the skin or appearance of the Warden or Hawke and not the level or abilities what is the point? Make the new protagonist look like the warden or Hawke.

[nightscrawl]

BIO18 wrote...

Yes that is what I'm saying.
You guys want to play a new character, thats awsome. And you should be able to!
I want to play the warden, and I should be just as able to get what I want then you.

After posting I realized that you wouldn't be satisfied with an opinion and have edited my post with some reasons.

[mousestalker]

I want a boys band, a monorail, and a cider making machine.

Those are probably not going to happen.

I've really wanted horses for a very long time. I've asked nicely for every Bioware game. Still no horses.

I've wanted singing and dancing numbers featuring the PC.

That's likely not to happen either.

[Apollo Starflare]

I do not think you truly appreciate how much time and resources it would take to make what you want a reality. It is not a question of whether people feel up to the challenge of using their imagination, it would simply either cost a great deal or make absolutely no sense within the game's narrative. And if you don't care about the latter part then why not just use your imagination to pretend the new protagonist is the Warden anyway.

Now if it could be devised so that the new game would feature all three protagonists, focusing on a new one but allowing us to import or re-customise a Warden and a Hawke as well, that would be interesting. It would still be very expensive and tricky to pull off, but I would love to see their three stories all come together over the course of the game.