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The ending was perfect; no problems with it at all.


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#201
GiarcYekrub

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Aylyese wrote...

ckriley wrote...

 And that's not sarcasm either.  The ending I chose for my Sheperd made the most sense and wrapped up the series perfectly for me.  I should also mention that my EMS was something like 6100 and my galactic readiness was 90% by the time I got to the final battle due to doing a lot of multiplayer, so I'm not sure if that changed anything.  But I couldn't for the life of me understand what all the bickering was about.

I started a thread on here about a week ago saying I lost all my respect for this community because the ME3 I was playing see,Ed completely different than the one everyone was griping about.  You guys seemed to be hating for the sake of hating.  Everyone that posted in that thread kept saying, "get back to us after you've finished it".  Well, I finished it and I'm here to tell you the ending was outstandng.

I chose e synthesis ending and it was the precise thing mt Sheperd would have done: sacrificing herself for the greater good.  I can only assume those of you complaining never saw The Matrix trilogy, because that is EXACTLY what the synthesis ending was.  Almost to the letter.  

Now, I don't know how the destruction or control endings are, but synthesis made the most sense for me.  And having those last moments with Andersen nearly brought me to tears.  Seriously.  And that's embarrassing to admit. Yes, there was definitely some vagueness to it.  And yes, I would like to know what became of my companions and the universe at large, but that's what the EC is for.

So, I stand by what I said.  I've lost all respect for this community.  The amount of hatred being heaped on the game just doesn't match the game I played.  Was it perfect?  No.  We're there things that bugged me?  Yes.  But did I find the game fun, exciting, and emotionally moving?  Absolutely.  In fact I was hoping BW didn't try to wrap everything up all nice and tidy at the end.  There HADto be loss.  The reapers were too massive for there not to be.
2. So. Thank you BioWare for this experience. I'm on my second play through and I can't wait to play it again.  Bravo!


Glad you enjoyed it, however my Shepard would not mess around with the DNA of an entire galaxy, sacrificing diversity and individuality for as an easy out of a war. She would stand and fight. 

Sacraficing is not the problem. My Shepard would sit on harbingers head with a 30 kiloton nuke and happily detonate it strapped to their back so long as they were taking a reaper with them. 

But while you have no problem with basically forcing every species in the universe to give up that which makes them proudly taurian/asari/batarian/elcor/volus/human/geth/etc, then more power to you... But there I spent 2.9 games preaching about strength in diversity... 

Synthesis is just wholesale racism with green fireworks. That anyone can defend that makes me lose respect for the community.


There you go inferring synthisis  is akin to assimilation, inferring that it is harmonisation and end of individuality when for me it certainly looked like the crew retain their identity and the stargazer too seemed to me to be an individual with a child so reproduction still happens. I look at it as increasing diversity, enhancing the definition of life, its been said before in the ME universe memories and ideas can be stored in DNA, maybe some part of Shepards experience has been gifted to the galaxy.

#202
richard_rider

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Good for you, really, but color coded space magic, and Casper the deceptive ghost have no room in a sci fi series based on certain rules that have been established over the course of 2.9 games.

#203
Aylyese

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GiarcYekrub wrote...

There you go inferring synthisis  is akin to assimilation, inferring that it is harmonisation and end of individuality when for me it certainly looked like the crew retain their identity and the stargazer too seemed to me to be an individual with a child so reproduction still happens. I look at it as increasing diversity, enhancing the definition of life, its been said before in the ME universe memories and ideas can be stored in DNA, maybe some part of Shepards experience has been gifted to the galaxy.


You mean the same stargazer you get at the end of the control and destroy endings? The only thing he proves is the lack of diversity in the "Wildly different" endings.

In this galaxy, if a person had wanted synthetics, they got to choose to go get some. People who didn't, were not forced to accept it. Until Starchild convinced Shepard that s/he has any right to make that decision for everyone and everything. 

There is no proof of anything about synthesis, except that everyone gets changed against their will to satisfy the whims of Hitler starchild and his Third Reich of Reapers.

#204
GiarcYekrub

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Aylyese wrote...

GiarcYekrub wrote...

There you go inferring synthisis  is akin to assimilation, inferring that it is harmonisation and end of individuality when for me it certainly looked like the crew retain their identity and the stargazer too seemed to me to be an individual with a child so reproduction still happens. I look at it as increasing diversity, enhancing the definition of life, its been said before in the ME universe memories and ideas can be stored in DNA, maybe some part of Shepards experience has been gifted to the galaxy.


You mean the same stargazer you get at the end of the control and destroy endings? The only thing he proves is the lack of diversity in the "Wildly different" endings.

In this galaxy, if a person had wanted synthetics, they got to choose to go get some. People who didn't, were not forced to accept it. Until Starchild convinced Shepard that s/he has any right to make that decision for everyone and everything. 

There is no proof of anything about synthesis, except that everyone gets changed against their will to satisfy the whims of Hitler starchild and his Third Reich of Reapers.


Wildly different solutions but in the end the universe needs to converge so the Mass Effect franchise can continue, it obvious the similarities are there so the universe is in a stable state for future stories. I'm never going to pick Genocide, regardless of the IDT nutjobs

#205
Elite Midget

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You sound like the Illusive Man.

Too bad we're all Shepard and can't see the beauty of genocide like you can, OP.

#206
Aylyese

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GiarcYekrub wrote...

Wildly different solutions but in the end the universe needs to converge so the Mass Effect franchise can continue, it obvious the similarities are there so the universe is in a stable state for future stories. I'm never going to pick Genocide, regardless of the IDT nutjobs


It "needs to converge" so it will be "in a stable state". So you are saying that despite the fact that Shepard rallied a huge fleet and fostered unity before synthesis, you need to merge everyone or it is a lost cause? 

You didn't need to "merge" everyone to make them get along.. you did it to make the Reapers leave... You made everyone get along before you ever encountered starbrat.

basically, you sold out the entire universe for an easy win.. Still feel like a hero?

Modifié par Aylyese, 30 avril 2012 - 10:09 .


#207
JXS nWp

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ckriley wrote...

 And that's not sarcasm either.  The ending I chose for my Sheperd made the most sense and wrapped up the series perfectly for me.  I should also mention that my EMS was something like 6100 and my galactic readiness was 90% by the time I got to the final battle due to doing a lot of multiplayer, so I'm not sure if that changed anything.  But I couldn't for the life of me understand what all the bickering was about.

I started a thread on here about a week ago saying I lost all my respect for this community because the ME3 I was playing see,Ed completely different than the one everyone was griping about.  You guys seemed to be hating for the sake of hating.  Everyone that posted in that thread kept saying, "get back to us after you've finished it".  Well, I finished it and I'm here to tell you the ending was outstandng.

I chose e synthesis ending and it was the precise thing mt Sheperd would have done: sacrificing herself for the greater good.  I can only assume those of you complaining never saw The Matrix trilogy, because that is EXACTLY what the synthesis ending was.  Almost to the letter.  

Now, I don't know how the destruction or control endings are, but synthesis made the most sense for me.  And having those last moments with Andersen nearly brought me to tears.  Seriously.  And that's embarrassing to admit. Yes, there was definitely some vagueness to it.  And yes, I would like to know what became of my companions and the universe at large, but that's what the EC is for.

So, I stand by what I said.  I've lost all respect for this community.  The amount of hatred being heaped on the game just doesn't match the game I played.  Was it perfect?  No.  We're there things that bugged me?  Yes.  But did I find the game fun, exciting, and emotionally moving?  Absolutely.  In fact I was hoping BW didn't try to wrap everything up all nice and tidy at the end.  There HADto be loss.  The reapers were too massive for there not to be.
2. So. Thank you BioWare for this experience. I'm on my second play through and I can't wait to play it again.  Bravo!


This sign might help illustrate what this thread is really doing

Posted Image


Rules of the Internet #14: "Do not argue with trolls - it means that they win."

Don't be a troll by insulting everyone who feel differently by saying things like "I've lost all respect for this community.".
Everyone in the community who have thoughts on the ending are just as valid as yours and have listed good reasons for liking or not liking it.

Personally, I feel that while it's true that some liked the ending, the majority who didn't, was because the central theme of choice was not represented as it has been for the previous games.

Modifié par JXS nWp, 30 avril 2012 - 10:28 .


#208
GiarcYekrub

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Aylyese wrote...

GiarcYekrub wrote...

Wildly different solutions but in the end the universe needs to converge so the Mass Effect franchise can continue, it obvious the similarities are there so the universe is in a stable state for future stories. I'm never going to pick Genocide, regardless of the IDT nutjobs


It "needs to converge" so it will be "in a stable state". So you are saying that despite the fact that Shepard rallied a huge fleet and fostered unity before synthesis, you need to merge everyone or it is a lost cause? 

You didn't need to "merge" everyone to make them get along.. you did it to make the Reapers leave... You made everyone get along before you ever encountered starbrat.

basically, you sold out the entire universe for an easy win.. Still feel like a hero?


No, What I'm saying is the Control/Synthsis/Genocide options have very similar outcomes so it leaves the mass effect universe in a stable state for the future.

Red = Genocide always bad, can't imagine picking it unless I'm playing some sort of renegade run through
Blue = Taking away the free will of synthetic is not an option for me as free will is important to me
Green = Everyone lives with freewill and peace, can't see much wrong with this option

#209
Aylyese

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GiarcYekrub wrote...

No, What I'm saying is the Control/Synthsis/Genocide options have very similar outcomes so it leaves the mass effect universe in a stable state for the future.

Red = Genocide always bad, can't imagine picking it unless I'm playing some sort of renegade run through
Blue = Taking away the free will of synthetic is not an option for me as free will is important to me
Green = Everyone lives with freewill and peace, can't see much wrong with this option


Except that they have had their genetic make up altered against their freewill. Why? So that everyone will be synthetic and organic to perhaps maybe stop a war that may or may not have ever happened in the first place.

It would be like changing everyone on earth so they have the same skin colour to 'prevent racism'. It is exactly what it claims it is preventing.

#210
Hanabii

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Talogrungi wrote...

Bill Casey wrote...

ckriley wrote...

I chose e synthesis ending and it was the precise thing mt Sheperd would have done: sacrificing herself for the greater good.


Raping the universe at the genetic level and asserting organics and synthetics can't learn to get along on their own is not the "Greater Good"...

It's ****ing disgusting and racist..


Not to mention fundamentally stupid.

"If we make organics and synthetics the same, they'll live in peace!"

Yeah, right .. Civil War is like, totally a myth.


Wait, wouldn't calling ascending EVERY live form to the pinnacle of evolution racist mean that evolution itself is a racist theory used to justify crime and irrisponcibility? If that's the case then isn't Shepard commiting the most Bizzare War-Crime in ... ever?

#211
ckriley

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Taboo-XX wrote...

 You've presented a rather poor case for yourself and have come across looking exatcly like Bioware has been treating you.

1. You assume for whatever reason that everyone's Shepard is the same.
2. You assume you know what Bioware wanted us to make out of their game.
3. You make disingenious assertions about things you cannot possibly have answers to.

What confuses me most is your lack of communication in this thread. You are either not interested in giving your opinion or are simply flame baiting.

I have yet to see one Pro-ender elcidate in clear detail the utter lack of perpicacity that the schizoid bull rush of the ending details. It makes me uncomfortable that people are so easily satiated when given something that insults their intelligence and they then use it to promote personal vanity.

I've seen this type of meta weirdness before. It's nothing new. It's been going on for well over forty years. I find your lack of knowledge in this area distrubing.




Sorry, I've been unable to post in this thread after I made it.  I was out all night and away from my computer.  I really wanted to have this debate with people, as I knew pretty much everyone would disagree with me and can't possibly understand how someone could have a differing opinion from the norm, which is to hate the game for everything its worth just because they didn't like the ending.

First things first:  the apparent contradictory nature of this thread.  The title says I thought the ending was perfect, then in the OP, I say, "Was it perfect?  No."  That looks like I'm trolling, but what I was saying was even though I thought the ending was perfect for me and my Shepard, the game itself - as a whole- was not without its flaws.  Such as the terrible journal and the fact that romances felt a little unfulfilling.  That's what I meant about the game not being perfect.  However, I found the ending that I chose to be perfect.

Now, let me address head on why I chose the synthesis ending.  A lot of folks in this thread are saying how atrocious and barbaric synthesis is.  How it is the forced homogenization of all organic life in the galaxy.  How is that a good thing?  I should also point out that a buddy of mine who like all of you also hated the ending and couldn't POSSIBLY understand how someone could have a different opinion,  said that the synthesis ending was not only a solution it was essentially "The Final Solution."

But instead of offering a full on defense of synthesis, I'm going to explain why I DIDN'T chose the other two.  Let's start with Destroy.  Going back to ME2, my paragon Shepard worked very hard to talk the quarians out of going to war with the geth, how devastating that would be for the quarians.  Then, after meeting Legion, she begins to see the geth in a different light.  The geth become three dimensional people that, as is later revealed in ME3, never wanted a war with their creators.  It was the quarians that brought war to them, and even forced the geth into reaper hands.

Not to mention that on a very personal level, Shepard now saw Legion as a member of her crew and a friend.   So, finally having achieved peace between both the geth and the quarians, coupled with the fact that choosing to destroy the reapers would also wipe out the geth and all other synthetic life - including EDI - was something that my Shepard would NEVER choose.  Ever.  It's genocide.  Synthetics had now evolved to be self aware, sentient beings.  They had all the rights that any other organic lifeform had.  So, choosing Destroy was 100% not an option.

Next is Control.  Again, no way in hell would my Shepard choose that option.  She spent the entire game fighting Cerberus and TIM who were trying to do that very thing.  Right up until that final scene on the Citadel.  After talking to the Catalyst, it is revealed that TIM was right but that he was indeed indoctrinated.  He would not have succeeded.  Though Shepard was not under reaper control, the old saying that absolute power corrupts absolutely IMMEDIATELY sprung to mind when presented with that option.

Just because Shepard was not indoctrinated doesn't mean that she (or he) would not succumb to the corruption that such power would bring.  Shepard is after all, only human.  Plus, it was never fully explained if Shepard's consciousness lives on forever within the reaper framework, kind of like within the Geth Consensus.  After Shepard dies, what happens to the reapers?  This option presented far more questions than answers, and the possiblity for there to be more danger in the future was just too high.  I even thought a lot about what happened to Anders when he bonded with Justice in DA2, how his lust for vengeance ended up twising Justice's spriit.  It drove them both mad.  I can see something like that happening to Shepard by joining - or controlling - the reapers.  So, once again, not a realistic option for my Shepard.

That leaves us with synthesis.  The lesser of all three evils.  The Catalyst explains that it is the next natural step of evolution, a meshing of organic and synthetic life to form a new species.  The only real problem I had with this option is that BioWare didn't delve into what this truly meant.  They probably didn't have time.  But again, it mirrors the Matrix Revolutions or even 2001: A Space Odyssey (Star Child, anyone?).  Arthur C. Clarke and Philip K. Dick ("Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep?" aka "Blade Runner") would have been proud of this option.  That doesn't mean that you had to like the Matrix, just that if you had seen it you would understand EXACTLY where BW was coming from with this option, whether you liked it or not, agreed with it or disagreed with it.  As stated by Agent Smith in the FIRST Matrix film:

"I'd like to share a revelation that I've had during my time here. It
came to me when I tried to classify your species and I realized that
you're not actually mammals. Every mammal on this planet instinctively
develops a natural equilibrium with the surrounding environment but you
humans do not. You move to an area and you multiply and multiply until
every natural resource is consumed and the only way you can survive is
to spread to another area. There is another organism on this planet that
follows the same pattern. Do you know what it is? A virus. Human beings
are a disease, a cancer of this planet. You're a plague and we are the
cure.
"

That is exactly what the Catalyst says just in different words.  But the definition is identical.  That is the purpose of the harvesting of organic life.

But sci-fi writers such as Clarke, Philip or Asimov would have presented more ambiguous questions that would have been open to interpretation by the reader or viewer.  Questions that I just don't think BioWare had the time to ask the gamer.  Was the synthesis option without its consequences?  No.  It not only would cost Shepard his or her life, but as you all pointed out, it involuntarily forces EVERYONE in the galaxy to be the same.  This is a great topic to debate.  And had BW done more fleshing out of this point, I'm not sure everyone would revile it so much.  You would still have haters or people that simply disagreed with it, which is fine and even healthy, but probably not the sheer amount of negativity surrounding it.

The writers of this game warned you REPEATEDLY throughout ME3 that you were going to have make an incredibly difficult decision at the end that you may not like.  That whatever lies ahead will come with great consequence.  I guess you guys just didn't think they actually meant it.  By the way, I will admit that the "space magic" was a little odd.  Like this green light shooting out in all directions somehow combined all organic and synthetic life in one fell swoop.  That actually reminded more of The Dark Crystal than the Matrix Revolutions.:P
But I knew what the intent was.

Finally, my point of saying I've lost all respect for this community is highlighting the fact that though EVERYONE is entitled to their own opinion and some people just simply wouldn't like the game, the sheer amount of hate and negativity just seems so disproportionate to the reality of the game itself.  It comes off as just hate for hate's sake.  As in, for hate's sake I spit my last breath at thee.  It's fine not to like something.  But to hate like what we're seeing on BSN?  It just comes off as juvenile.  So to wrap this up bluntly, I'm going to say that for everyone of you that says those of us that like the game don't understand what's wrong with it or are just trolling or whatever, that you yourselves are quite simply, lemmings.  Incapable of independent thought and just following the mob mentality perpetuated by the internet, also known as nerdrage.

#212
Sainta117

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ckriley wrote...

(snip)


Given the Matrix-worship and weak logic of your arguments, I think we can all live without your respect.

#213
ckriley

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Sainta117 wrote...

ckriley wrote...

(snip)


Given the Matrix-worship and weak logic of your arguments, I think we can all live without your respect.

Given your lack of independent though, I won't lose any sleep over what you think.

#214
Sargaz

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 haha look the lil noob wants some attention

if ur satisfied with the ending its because u are too intelectually inferior to most people and content with anything that`s shiny haha

like ur a dog who thinks it`s perfectly fine to play with dog toys and won`t know why its so primitive haha

Modifié par Sargaz, 30 avril 2012 - 04:05 .


#215
Unit-Alpha

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Lol, you really didn't like literature in elementary school, did you?

Modifié par Unit-Alpha, 30 avril 2012 - 04:07 .


#216
aftermath_diogo

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JXS nWp wrote...

ckriley wrote...

 And that's not sarcasm either.  The ending I chose for my Sheperd made the most sense and wrapped up the series perfectly for me.  I should also mention that my EMS was something like 6100 and my galactic readiness was 90% by the time I got to the final battle due to doing a lot of multiplayer, so I'm not sure if that changed anything.  But I couldn't for the life of me understand what all the bickering was about.

I started a thread on here about a week ago saying I lost all my respect for this community because the ME3 I was playing see,Ed completely different than the one everyone was griping about.  You guys seemed to be hating for the sake of hating.  Everyone that posted in that thread kept saying, "get back to us after you've finished it".  Well, I finished it and I'm here to tell you the ending was outstandng.

I chose e synthesis ending and it was the precise thing mt Sheperd would have done: sacrificing herself for the greater good.  I can only assume those of you complaining never saw The Matrix trilogy, because that is EXACTLY what the synthesis ending was.  Almost to the letter.  

Now, I don't know how the destruction or control endings are, but synthesis made the most sense for me.  And having those last moments with Andersen nearly brought me to tears.  Seriously.  And that's embarrassing to admit. Yes, there was definitely some vagueness to it.  And yes, I would like to know what became of my companions and the universe at large, but that's what the EC is for.

So, I stand by what I said.  I've lost all respect for this community.  The amount of hatred being heaped on the game just doesn't match the game I played.  Was it perfect?  No.  We're there things that bugged me?  Yes.  But did I find the game fun, exciting, and emotionally moving?  Absolutely.  In fact I was hoping BW didn't try to wrap everything up all nice and tidy at the end.  There HADto be loss.  The reapers were too massive for there not to be.
2. So. Thank you BioWare for this experience. I'm on my second play through and I can't wait to play it again.  Bravo!


This sign might help illustrate what this thread is really doing

Posted Image


Rules of the Internet #14: "Do not argue with trolls - it means that they win."

Don't be a troll by insulting everyone who feel differently by saying things like "I've lost all respect for this community.".
Everyone in the community who have thoughts on the ending are just as valid as yours and have listed good reasons for liking or not liking it.

Personally, I feel that while it's true that some liked the ending, the majority who didn't, was because the central theme of choice was not represented as it has been for the previous games.








Trolls gonna troll, i +1 to what this guy said. And imho it is very hard to like the ending after 20/30min of looking up in the internet the absurd, absurddddddd amount of plot-holes it contains... and dont get me started on the "yawh dog, i created synthetics to kill organics so that organics dont create synthetics, that are gonna kill organics...."<_<
<_<

#217
b2smooth

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Even if you like the idea of the current ending you can't possibly like the way it was done. Poorly written, and all were basically the same. It was rushed and unimaginative at best.

#218
harrier25699

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ckriley wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

*snip*


So, choosing Destroy was 100% not an option.


Yet it is the only way that shephard survives, assuming you have enough EMS through multiplayer, do you get see the deep breath clip.  Not under blue or green, but red.  That's a weird choice of placement if want to save ALL of your friends.  So, I choose to sacrifice the geth and my synthetic friends in order to save my own skin.  I have no problem with that, however the manner of presentation of this choice as speculation I cannot stand.  There is a massive war waging here between BioWare's speculated canon and player experience canon, and it's a cluster**** of contradicting plotholes and uncertainties.

It was shephards sudden indecision "I.. don't know.." while being grilled by the godchild that repulsed me.  An apparent moment of weakness actually leads to the conclusion!   You don't get to reject the catalyst, you have to obey like a good little organic.

Modifié par harrier25699, 30 avril 2012 - 04:23 .


#219
Peranor

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I've come to terms with not being as intelligent and educated as the intellectual elite who has, unlike me, understood the ending. I'm ... at peace... now that I've given up hope for a better ending.

Modifié par anorling, 30 avril 2012 - 04:19 .


#220
Fnork

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How can you sit there and call the ending perfect when there's teachers, writers and academics posting to point out the flaws in the ending ? If you like the ending that's fine by me. I don't. But to call it perfect ? I've even seen someone call it a masterpiece. I can't understand how you can (by calling the ending perfect) not only dismiss the opinions of your average run of the mill pleb (like me) but also those of people that actually dedicate their life to literature. Just to reiterate, I object to the word "perfect", not to you liking the ending.

#221
Wraith8957

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[quote]ckriley wrote...

  You guys seemed to be hating for the sake of hating.  
[/quote

HA.  Yeah 90% of the fanbase according to bioware's own polls are hating just for the sake of hating.  Dude seriously you need to check what you write.

#222
Unit-Alpha

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anorling wrote...

I've come to terms with not being as intelligent and educated as the intellectual elite who has, unlike me, understood the ending. I'm ... at peace... now that I've given up hope for a better ending.


The intellectual elite are the people attacking the ending for blantantly copying other storylines, being filled with plotholes, having no thematic relation to the rest of the storyline, etc.

#223
chester013

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ckriley wrote...

 Was it perfect?  No. 


Wait what? Doesn't quite match what you said in the title, make your mind up.

Oh and I did see the Matrix trilogy. Self-indulgent, arty nonsense in a series where it was neither wanted nor needed.

Modifié par chester013, 30 avril 2012 - 04:26 .


#224
ckriley

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Wraith8957 wrote...

ckriley wrote...

  You guys seemed to be hating for the sake of hating.  


HA.  Yeah 90% of the fanbase according to bioware's own polls are hating just for the sake of hating.  Dude seriously you need to check what you write.


It's called a mob mentality.

Modifié par ckriley, 30 avril 2012 - 04:26 .


#225
ckriley

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chester013 wrote...

ckriley wrote...

 Was it perfect?  No. 


Wait what? Doesn't quite match what you said in the title, make your mind up.

Read my follow up post only a few posts above yours.  I addressed that directly.